Why does Guardian need high sig?

Is it for the bonus block profiency? Or the bleed resistance utility? I know everyone says it’s really helpful for him, but...why?

Comments

Eb0ny-O-M4w

He gets higher stats and numbers. You will know when you read it

SpideyFunko

survivability

Silver_Goose

It just doesn’t seem THAT necessary for offense. I feel like people make a bigger deal about it that makes sense. Like, isn’t he still really good unawakened?

unknown

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Rouger4

It’s a very big deal. People seem to underestimate the amount of unavoidable energy damage in the game.

DualityCope

It just doesn’t seem THAT necessary for offense. I feel like people make a bigger deal about it that makes sense. Like, isn’t he still really good unawakened?

For late act 6 content he can do so much more. Lots of energy based nodes he won't be viable on unawakened. Also he can't take down electro, magik, iceman unawakened. He need high sig bcuz for some reason at first his sig scales decently but towards the very end of his sig process its ridiculous how much higher it starts to scale with the energy resistance.

Yodabolt21

It just doesn’t seem THAT necessary for offense. I feel like people make a bigger deal about it that makes sense. Like, isn’t he still really good unawakened?

He doesn’t “need” it, but trust me, he is so much better with a high sig. He is my main attacker for AQ (map 5) and when I get to Apoc, he is at worst at 80% health. He is so sustainable with a high sig. Mine is at 180 and I don’t regret dumping 90+ Sig stones in him over Ghost one bit.

Pintzz

Doesn’t do much for offense. Makes him a massiv tank when he’s awakened and high sig

Pintzz

Can counter energy damage like limbo and critical failure which normally is just taking the damage. Max sig reduces it by quite a bit

DNA3000

Is it for the bonus block profiency? Or the bleed resistance utility? I know everyone says it’s really helpful for him, but...why?

It is a few things, but let's take a look at just one of them: block proficiency. Guardian's intrinsic block proficiency stat is, for a 5* rank 5 (it varies, but not by a huge amount) 3734. That means against CR100 opponents Guardian has about 65% block proficiency. Awakened at sig 1 he gains about 535 additional block proficiency (when he has an armor up). That increases his block to 68%. At sig 200 he gains about 2563, which increases his block to about 76%.

The difference between 65% and 68% and 76% doesn't seem like a lot, but it actually is for two reasons. First, the important thing is not how much damage you block, it is how much damage you take. 65% block means you take 35% of the damage from blocked hits. 68% block means you take 32%, and 76% means you take 24%. At max sig you're taking only (24/35) = 69% of the damage you'd take unawakened. Or alternatively, at max sig Guardian takes 31% less damage from blocked hits. That's not a small improvement.

But secondly it gets even more interesting when you consider those are normal blocked hits and not well-timed blocked hits. If you have the Parry mastery you can get an additional +25% block proficiency from well-timed hits. This is a flat improvement over and above the DR stat. So those same block proficiency numbers above become 90%, 93%, and 101%. Which means the difference between unawakened r5 Guardian and max sig Guardian is the difference between taking 10% damage from well-timed blocked hits and taking zero.

The bleed resistance is also nice to have because you can buy up to 30% additional bleed resistance with Coagulate. Not only does that help in terms of survivability, it also makes Guardian more suicide friendly because he can actually heal from Double Edge (via Willpower) which indirectly helps Guardian offensively.

80% energy resistance is also nice to have. Gladiator Hulk is considered a strong counter to passive DoT with a lower amount of effective mitigation.

Guardian probably has one of the better designed signature abilities in terms of game balance, in that on the one hand you don't need it for the champ to be useful, but on the other hand you do notice it when you have it and you also notice when you sig it up.

SpideyFunko

Is it for the bonus block profiency? Or the bleed resistance utility? I know everyone says it’s really helpful for him, but...why?
It is a few things, but let's take a look at just one of them: block proficiency. Guardian's intrinsic block proficiency stat is, for a 5* rank 5 (it varies, but not by a huge amount) 3734. That means against CR100 opponents Guardian has about 65% block proficiency. Awakened at sig 1 he gains about 535 additional block proficiency (when he has an armor up). That increases his block to 68%. At sig 200 he gains about 2563, which increases his block to about 76%.

The difference between 65% and 68% and 76% doesn't seem like a lot, but it actually is for two reasons. First, the important thing is not how much damage you block, it is how much damage you take. 65% block means you take 35% of the damage from blocked hits. 68% block means you take 32%, and 76% means you take 24%. At max sig you're taking only (24/35) = 69% of the damage you'd take unawakened. Or alternatively, at max sig Guardian takes 31% less damage from blocked hits. That's not a small improvement.

But secondly it gets even more interesting when you consider those are normal blocked hits and not well-timed blocked hits. If you have the Parry mastery you can get an additional +25% block proficiency from well-timed hits. This is a flat improvement over and above the DR stat. So those same block proficiency numbers above become 90%, 93%, and 101%. Which means the difference between unawakened r5 Guardian and max sig Guardian is the difference between taking 10% damage from well-timed blocked hits and taking zero.

The bleed resistance is also nice to have because you can buy up to 30% additional bleed resistance with Coagulate. Not only does that help in terms of survivability, it also makes Guardian more suicide friendly because he can actually heal from Double Edge (via Willpower) which indirectly helps Guardian offensively.

80% energy resistance is also nice to have. Gladiator Hulk is considered a strong counter to passive DoT with a lower amount of effective mitigation.

Guardian probably has one of the better designed signature abilities in terms of game balance, in that on the one hand you don't need it for the champ to be useful, but on the other hand you do notice it when you have it and you also notice when you sig it up.

that last paragraph is my favorite kind of sig.

LeoZed

Is it for the bonus block profiency? Or the bleed resistance utility? I know everyone says it’s really helpful for him, but...why?

It is for his tankiness.. almost nill limbo damage and other stuff... dude just doesn't die

Sungj

Sometimes I think people forget that energy resistance to an extent is almost as good as having immunities. 8590 energy resistance is MASSIVE. It makes guardian at max sig viable for difficult, Magiks, electros, Icemen, Energy adoption, 100% incinerate/frostbite nodes, the guage node that places incinerates on you when you reach ten guage, etc. That utility alone makes high sig a huge benefit for the character on offense. Bleed resistance is good enough especially if its as high as 80% making him useable for biohazard, morningstars, 100% bleed.

Block proficiency is also kinda underrated. Makes him a lot easier to use in stun immune matchups, mighty charge, if you need to hold block to stop opponents from using a specific special attack, etc.

Crit damage is the only part of the sig that isn't a big benefit on offense.

The difference between an unawakened Guardian and a sig 200 guardian is comparable to a unawakened Cap IW and a sig 200 Cap IW. Yeah he's still good but the awakened ability just adds layer upon layers of utility and you need the sig as high as possible for the utility to be consistent

Nameless_IW

He is one of the best Tech champs, he is so good i have one at R5 5^ but would love to collect at least 100 sig stones before i use my tech awakening gem to unlock most of his incredible utility and resistances.

Bashlord

Guardian at max sig takes 0 damage on parry and then pair him with CapIW and Doom, then they also start taking 0 damage on Parry.

Think CapIW can by himself reduce damage to 0 on parry, not sure about this!!!

This 1 thing alone makes him great in high level content.

Afraid of losing chunk of health on parrying opponent with high attack(above 12-13k), not an issue with Guardian.

Squirrelguy

Because it increases his stats. Simple as that.

Sarvanga1_

Guardian at max sig takes 0 damage on parry and then pair him with CapIW and Doom, then they also start taking 0 damage on Parry.

Think CapIW can by himself reduce damage to 0 on parry, not sure about this!!!

This 1 thing alone makes him great in high level content.

Afraid of losing chunk of health on parrying opponent with high attack(above 12-13k), not an issue with Guardian.

Capiw takes 0 damage on parries by himself.
Moreover capiw has more block proficiency than max sig guardian.
But yeah guardian helps so many champs with less block proficiency like cull obsidian.

Kerneas

Block prof is great, no doubt. It saves a ton of hp.

Energy resist is good against DoTs like Coldsnap. Try dupped Guardian and any other champion against Iceman and you'll see how much hp it saves you

Bleed resist and crit resist is for cases when you slip up

Overall it provides a very nice bonus utility that can come in handy in multiple scenarios.

Valmarx

Suicide Mastery Players benefit he's Higher Sig because he'll HEAL UP each time he bleeds
just like Magneto and Corvus.
We enjoy such champs because it gets us 8-10% HP recovered easily each fight if not hit.
and since Guardian is such a TANK he'll benefit it the most.
I dont see any other use in he's other Sig lines.

AATT

Is it for the bonus block profiency? Or the bleed resistance utility? I know everyone says it’s really helpful for him, but...why?
It is a few things, but let's take a look at just one of them: block proficiency. Guardian's intrinsic block proficiency stat is, for a 5* rank 5 (it varies, but not by a huge amount) 3734. That means against CR100 opponents Guardian has about 65% block proficiency. Awakened at sig 1 he gains about 535 additional block proficiency (when he has an armor up). That increases his block to 68%. At sig 200 he gains about 2563, which increases his block to about 76%.

The difference between 65% and 68% and 76% doesn't seem like a lot, but it actually is for two reasons. First, the important thing is not how much damage you block, it is how much damage you take. 65% block means you take 35% of the damage from blocked hits. 68% block means you take 32%, and 76% means you take 24%. At max sig you're taking only (24/35) = 69% of the damage you'd take unawakened. Or alternatively, at max sig Guardian takes 31% less damage from blocked hits. That's not a small improvement.

But secondly it gets even more interesting when you consider those are normal blocked hits and not well-timed blocked hits. If you have the Parry mastery you can get an additional +25% block proficiency from well-timed hits. This is a flat improvement over and above the DR stat. So those same block proficiency numbers above become 90%, 93%, and 101%. Which means the difference between unawakened r5 Guardian and max sig Guardian is the difference between taking 10% damage from well-timed blocked hits and taking zero.

The bleed resistance is also nice to have because you can buy up to 30% additional bleed resistance with Coagulate. Not only does that help in terms of survivability, it also makes Guardian more suicide friendly because he can actually heal from Double Edge (via Willpower) which indirectly helps Guardian offensively.

80% energy resistance is also nice to have. Gladiator Hulk is considered a strong counter to passive DoT with a lower amount of effective mitigation.

Guardian probably has one of the better designed signature abilities in terms of game balance, in that on the one hand you don't need it for the champ to be useful, but on the other hand you do notice it when you have it and you also notice when you sig it up.

Amazing, very detailed analysis. Thank your for taking the time to write up so clearly

altavista

@DNA3000 , how do the calculations work? I’ve never worked out myself how a block proficiency number translates to percentage.

Worknprogress

@DNA3000 , how do the calculations work? I’ve never worked out myself how a block proficiency number translates to percentage.

I'm not exactly sure how to work it out myself but there is a calculator on the auntmai website

altavista

@DNA3000 , how do the calculations work? I’ve never worked out myself how a block proficiency number translates to percentage.
I'm not exactly sure how to work it out myself but there is a calculator on the auntmai website

Great thanks. Never noticed the Stat calculator on the site before, as I just have the Champions one bookmarked.

DNA3000

@DNA3000 , how do the calculations work? I’ve never worked out myself how a block proficiency number translates to percentage.

In general, the calculations the game performs to translate a flat stat into a percentage value is known. For all but one flat stat, it is this:

Percentage = FlatStat / (FlatStat + 1500 + 5*CR)

where CR is the *opponent* challenge rating. in other words, the higher the CR of the thing you're fighting, the lower your stats get. Its a relatively small change, but that's what it is there for. Think of Challenge Rating as "suppressing" the stats of opponents. Yours suppresses your opponent, your opponent's suppresses yours.

The one known exception is Critical Damage Rating. For critical damage rating, take the output of that formula, multiply by 5, then add 0.5.

This *only* applies to a specific list of flat stats - for example this doesn't apply to attack rating or health. The rule of thumb for which stats are flat stats is: if the stat is intrinsically a percentage, it is probably a flat stat. Block proficiency, critical rating (chance to crit), critical damage rating (bonus damage as a percentage of base damage), armor, the three resistances (physical, energy, and critical resistance), and the two penetration stats (armor penetration and block penetration) are the "flat stats" for which DR applies.

DNA3000

Think CapIW can by himself reduce damage to 0 on parry, not sure about this!!!

This varies with opponent challenge rating, but the rule of thumb is to look for 6000+ block proficiency. Anyone with 6000 block or higher will reach 75% block percentage mitigation against a CR100 opponent, which combines with max Parry (+25%) to reach 100% block damage mitigation. If you want this to hold all the way up to rank 5 6* opponents (which I presume would have a challenge rating of 150) the target number is 6750.

5/65 CapIW and 6* r2 has a block proficiency of 6743 which is plenty enough for CR100 but not quite enough for CR150 (although it is very close). At 6* r3 he goes to 6903 which is enough for any conventional challenge rating you'd ordinarily encounter in the game currently.

unknown

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DNA3000

Think CapIW can by himself reduce damage to 0 on parry, not sure about this!!!
This varies with opponent challenge rating, but the rule of thumb is to look for 6000+ block proficiency. Anyone with 6000 block or higher will reach 75% block percentage mitigation against a CR100 opponent, which combines with max Parry (+25%) to reach 100% block damage mitigation. If you want this to hold all the way up to rank 5 6* opponents (which I presume would have a challenge rating of 150) the target number is 6750.

5/65 CapIW and 6* r2 has a block proficiency of 6743 which is plenty enough for CR100 but not quite enough for CR150 (although it is very close). At 6* r3 he goes to 6903 which is enough for any conventional challenge rating you'd ordinarily encounter in the game currently.
@DNA3000 so a 5* R5 CAIW with Guardian synergy can get there for CR150?

Yes, I believe that should be enough, at least according to the numbers. Any rarity of Guardian with the self-synergy (meaning any rarity other than the 2*) should be enough. Even without it you're almost there. The 3* self-synergy is +500, which means to reach the target number of 6750 (for 75% block vs CR150) even a 5* rank 2 CapIW would get there (6261 + 500 = 6761).

Daddrieda

Well... @DNA3000... red skull have the highest block numbers if you look it up.

Sakhr

He has a Large Benift from the Awakining Ability and High sig!