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Due to issues related to the release of Mastery Loadouts, the "free swap" period will be extended.
The new end date will be May 1st.
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Future Antman stuns on combo enders
AmaadAkira
Posts: 388 ★★★
Having a minimum 10% chance of being stunned while ending a combo against this guy is a really bad idea as it will inevitably be treated as a 100% chance by most players, especially in competitive content.
Many champions (especially non-meta relevant ones) require ending a combo as part of their rotation, or simply sacrifice too much damage (that they already don't have) by not ending a combo. Whereas the already insane champions, IE Herc, Hulkling, Doom, Tigra, KP, Nick, Apoc, AA, Kitty, Magneto, Ghost, QS, Valk, list goes on... can avoid the stun completely in their main rotation or have anti-stun mechanics. I wouldn't mind this as much if it was a one-off, but more and more champions solely exist now to be countered by S-tier champions, leaving everybody else behind.
Why does it matter though? Honestly, if this was the first champion to have this kind of mechanic, I wouldn't care at all. But it is becoming increasingly too common for Kabam to create champions that are to be countered by newer champions 6 months down the line rather than the older champions which are quickly becoming outdated with each passing day.
Tl;dr Future antman has a stun mechanic that imo only increases the disparity between OK champions and the S-tier champions which isn't good for the game.
Many champions (especially non-meta relevant ones) require ending a combo as part of their rotation, or simply sacrifice too much damage (that they already don't have) by not ending a combo. Whereas the already insane champions, IE Herc, Hulkling, Doom, Tigra, KP, Nick, Apoc, AA, Kitty, Magneto, Ghost, QS, Valk, list goes on... can avoid the stun completely in their main rotation or have anti-stun mechanics. I wouldn't mind this as much if it was a one-off, but more and more champions solely exist now to be countered by S-tier champions, leaving everybody else behind.
Why does it matter though? Honestly, if this was the first champion to have this kind of mechanic, I wouldn't care at all. But it is becoming increasingly too common for Kabam to create champions that are to be countered by newer champions 6 months down the line rather than the older champions which are quickly becoming outdated with each passing day.
Tl;dr Future antman has a stun mechanic that imo only increases the disparity between OK champions and the S-tier champions which isn't good for the game.
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Comments
Science: Ant-Man, AV, CapIW, any of the Hulks, any of the Spider people, any of the F4, Mr Negative.
Skill: KP, OG BP, Black Cat, DDHK, Hawkeye, Blade, Crossbones, Hit-Monkey, Massacre, Mantis, Moleman.
Mutant: Colossus, Namor, Cap Brittain, Stryfe, Namor, Bishop, OR, Wags, Jubilee.
Tech: pretty much anyone
Cosmic: anyone asides from CGR
Mystic: Except for maybe OG Ghost Rider and Wiccan, I think everyone can deal with him
It's a new mechanic and people tend to say it's OP without having even fought the new champion yet. People will just learn how to adapt their playstyle when fighting Future Antman like they have been doing with every strong defender for years. It's not the end of the world.
Every month we get champions that further increase the disparity between the top 20 champions in MCOC and everyone else, that recent buffs to champions like Hulk, Juggernaut, IMIW, Gorr, Antman, Thor (JF) etc. are outdated before they are even introduced. None of the above champions counter Future Antman, Cassie Lang, Zemo, Absorbing man, Attuma, Spot, etc. INTUITIVELY.
How on earth is this good for the game?
You notice anything in common with those champs? They were slowly bumped out of the meta by the S-tier champions and for this EXACT reason.
Nobody is going to 4 hit combo Future Antman with mediocre champs that have bad damage as it is. You're just going to bring Herc, Nick fury, Kitty, Doom, Tigra and every other S-tier champion that nukes every defender that releases nowadays.
Zemo: you can parry him so all you have to do is avoid inflicting debuffs other than stun. It's that simple.
Absorbing Man: at least 50% of the science class has a way to deal with regeneration. Learn how to heavy counter his specials to prevent him from refining his form.
Attuma: Stryfe, Namor, Bishop, Captain Brittain, Toad. Any mutant that punishes purify will be great.
Spot: Just don't hit him while untouchable.
Cassie Lang doesn't look like she'll need specific counters and I already gave you a huge list for Future Ant-Man.
None of these champions are particularly difficult defenders. They are just annoying. If you can't find a way to adapt to each scenario then that's on you for being inflexible as a player.
There's a bigger issue here I think and it's speed. Without AAR or pierce you're dealing with 70% glance practically always and this adds to a toxic game design of absolutely requiring counter champions. There aren't that many pierce champs and AAR is almost never high enough to be reliable
Absorbing man: Knock him down, which then goes on a 20-second CD. If he throws 2 SP1s or SP2s in that time frame (not difficult seen as he's a mystic champ with MD), you're gonna wish you brought a better counter.
Attuma: Most the above champions don't counter him as they do not have incinerate, so he'll go unstoppable and you'll be wishing you brought a better counter.
Spot: You have to hit him to trigger his untouchable to begin with and he will counterattack your miss - gonna wish you had a better counter
Cassie Lang: 9% chance to evade on every hit at sig 200 -- better counter. Oddly enough I don't mind this one, know why? Because it makes older champions useful again as in there's no Herc, Kitty, Doom, go brrrr
All you're really showing is that you can't be flexible with your playstyle.
Funnily enough, I've also got iHulk at R3. Try playing him or Sasquatch without the 2nd medium. You make a mediocre champion go to trash tier. Guardian doesn't just need 5 hit combos to build his specials quicker, he also needs them for his armor up buffs that provide him most his utility.
I'm not saying he's difficult to fight, every R4 I have will make pudding out of him. But all the recently buffed champions or the average champions are growing more and more useless by the day. How does no one see this lmao. This isn't about skill anymore, it's about using the same 10 champions over and over again, EVERY. SINGLE. DAY.
Zemo: plenty of champions have damage that does not rely on debuffs like Stryfe, Cap Wilson, Guardian, Peni, Punisher 2099, Sersi, the Champion, Angela. The list goes on.
Absorbing Man: I said a lot of science champions have a way to deal with healing, even easier if you have despair. You know what else science champions are known for? Not having many, if any, buffs to counter mystic abilities that punish buffs.
Spot: Really easy. Bring someone who can't miss, trigger untouchable and back off until it ends. You'll only get a rupture on yourself which won't be a lot of damage.
Hawkeye: maybe if you made the effort to use him a lot more you'd realize how versatile he is. Poison immunity with NF, critical ruptures and poison, easy to access slow, massive DOT that can last the entire fight and doesn't need 5 hit combos to keep up. Just intercept.
Since when does Guardian need to land combo enders to gain armor ups??? He gains them on heavy attacks and he already starts the fight with one, which is all you need in most match-ups.
Also, I maintain hawkeye is bad. You tell me one good thing he can do, and there are about 20 champions that do it better. This hype for hawkeye is hilarious considering you NEVER see people using him in AW, AQ, Story Mode (unless to show off his abilities), incursions, BGs etc.
P.S., Don't bring half those champs you previously mentioned against Zemo, especially angela.
Never thought I'd see the day where I'd miss defenders like thing & korg, who actually required skill to play but were also counterable by the average day to day champions.
Look if you don't wanna use Hawkeye, I'm not gonna force you. I bring my Hawkeye everywhere and I have fun using him. He's not bad, that's just inaccurate. IMO he's in A tier but you do you.
I listed plenty of champions that can deal with the supposedly "OP" defenders. If you want to use them good, if you don't want to use them, not my problem. Just stop whining about them only having a handful of S tier champions as counters when that is just not true.
But thanks for the advice. I'll just use Kitty to counter all of them as per usual.
Honestly, this isn't the first Champ that's come along that has required us to use different play styles.
As for the Tier List, I don't bother with it. I use whatever Champs suit the job. I don't need mass approval.
Gladiator hulk with class disadvantage vs winter soldier: 2.5k medium crit.
(Both 5* R5)
Yes, she does.
to do 5 hit combos. The thing is, there are not that many of them, even from point of entire champion roster.
2015 - the only 2 champions that might get hurt from inability to perform 5 hit combos is Star-Lord and Juggernaut. Not the end of the world, that just might screw a little with their ramp-ups.
2016 - Ghost Rider and Civil warrior definitely suffer, Ghost rider specifically since he gets no access to full scope of judgements. But i'm not even sure if you want to play with him into new Ant-man, he should be hero so ghosty should be irrelevant anyway?
2017 - no one gets hurt in particular
2018 - again no one relies on exactly 5 hit combos
2019 - Stealth Spidey is unable to spent cartridge debuffs without sp 2
2020 - very likely this ability was given in first place to counter these matchups - Terrax and CGR. Both of them are cosmic armor-breakers that can stack a lot of them and very fast if used with right rotations. Only CGR gets hurt by it to the point of being bad matchup. I guess they wanted to make new tech guy to not be cheesable by him.
2021 - We are entering the territory where champions can barely be called old, but i will still name a few.
Shang and Strife. That's it. And for them its not even a problem.
2022 - Found another 3 characters that might have complicated relationships with chance of being stunned of 5 hit combo. But 2022 is last year and these are champs that considered pretty solid by community. I wonder what's the trend...
Wong, Rintrah and Wiccan. Wiccan can't reliably place incinerate on opponnent. Rintrah might need to do light ender combo into block. Wong will need to play parry into 4 lights to switch his mandalas. That's it.
TL;DR: 4 champions that significantly lose from ability to get stunned from new Ant-man and 8 champs that might need to switch playstyle a little. Bruh
Let's say (hypothetically) there's a new champion that only allows 2 hit combos. You aren't gonna bring Doc Ock, EVEN IF HE'S VIABLE, because Scorpion/Herc/Nick/Kingpin etc. will do a lot more damage in a shorter amount of time. This mechanic adds 0 skill to the game compared to rockstacks, power detonation, evades etc. All it serves is to make stronger champions, more OP, and lower-damage champions less attractive.
But thanks for the essay, anyway, even if you missed the entire point.