Can anyone tell me how this is possible?

BabyMiikeBabyMiike Member Posts: 1,184 ★★★★
edited July 2023 in General Discussion
So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg
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Comments

  • PikoluPikolu Member, Guardian Posts: 7,972 Guardian
    What seems to be the issue here? AA is immune to AAR but not the disorient debuff, but you should still be able to parry all day everyday with him
  • BabyMiikeBabyMiike Member Posts: 1,184 ★★★★
    Pikolu said:

    What seems to be the issue here? AA is immune to AAR but not the disorient debuff, but you should still be able to parry all day everyday with him

    And I wasn't as you can see in the video it parry wasn't working so the ability reduction is somehow working on him
  • PikoluPikolu Member, Guardian Posts: 7,972 Guardian
    edited July 2023
    BabyMiike said:

    Pikolu said:

    What seems to be the issue here? AA is immune to AAR but not the disorient debuff, but you should still be able to parry all day everyday with him

    And I wasn't as you can see in the video it parry wasn't working so the ability reduction is somehow working on him
    Your screenshot doesn't have the parry callout so it just looks like you are showing he has the debuffs. I'll test it myself, which quest was this?
  • BabyMiikeBabyMiike Member Posts: 1,184 ★★★★
    Pikolu said:

    BabyMiike said:

    Pikolu said:

    What seems to be the issue here? AA is immune to AAR but not the disorient debuff, but you should still be able to parry all day everyday with him

    And I wasn't as you can see in the video it parry wasn't working so the ability reduction is somehow working on him
    Your screenshot doesn't have the parry callout so it just looks like you are showing he has the debuffs. I'll test it myself, which quest was this?
    It's in the video are dumb? Or is it not showing?
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
  • PikoluPikolu Member, Guardian Posts: 7,972 Guardian
    BabyMiike said:

    Pikolu said:

    BabyMiike said:

    Pikolu said:

    What seems to be the issue here? AA is immune to AAR but not the disorient debuff, but you should still be able to parry all day everyday with him

    And I wasn't as you can see in the video it parry wasn't working so the ability reduction is somehow working on him
    Your screenshot doesn't have the parry callout so it just looks like you are showing he has the debuffs. I'll test it myself, which quest was this?
    It's in the video are dumb? Or is it not showing?
    I didn't realize it was a video, my bad 🤣🤣🤣🤣
  • PikoluPikolu Member, Guardian Posts: 7,972 Guardian
    If you can tell me which quest this was in, then I can help get that bug reported
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    BabyMiike said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    Definitely doesn't work that way and disorient is one their "abilities" because every source of ability reduction is a "Debuff"
    No. Magneto magnetization, black widow sig and domino are all direct aar which aa is immune to. Its not just debuffs. Btw im not saying it doesnt work for any debuff. Its just depends on the developers to consider a debuff or buff a direct ability
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    I don't believe that's correct. Sersi's glancing doesn't count because it's an ability that applies to her specifically, while Ant Man's applies to Archangel. He's immune to ability accuracy reduction on himself, not on opponents. Disorient reducing his AA is most definitely a bug.
  • Drago_von_DragoDrago_von_Drago Member Posts: 970 ★★★★
    BabyMiike said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    Definitely doesn't work that way and disorient is one their "abilities" because every source of ability reduction is a "Debuff"
    This isn’t accurate. There are lots of ability accuracy reductions that are not tied to a debuff. Black Widow’s sig ability was the first one I thought of but there are others.





    I do think the devs could/should clear this up, either through updating AA’s description, fixing the discrepancies, or at least providing an explanation for how he’s supposed to work.
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    I don't believe that's correct. Sersi's glancing doesn't count because it's an ability that applies to her specifically, while Ant Man's applies to Archangel. He's immune to ability accuracy reduction on himself, not on opponents. Disorient reducing his AA is most definitely a bug.
    Then how do you explain aa not working in glancing node in aw before?
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Ruwqiersa said:

    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    I don't believe that's correct. Sersi's glancing doesn't count because it's an ability that applies to her specifically, while Ant Man's applies to Archangel. He's immune to ability accuracy reduction on himself, not on opponents. Disorient reducing his AA is most definitely a bug.
    Then how do you explain aa not working in glancing node in aw before?
    I'd have to know the description of the node to explain that
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    I don't believe that's correct. Sersi's glancing doesn't count because it's an ability that applies to her specifically, while Ant Man's applies to Archangel. He's immune to ability accuracy reduction on himself, not on opponents. Disorient reducing his AA is most definitely a bug.
    Then how do you explain aa not working in glancing node in aw before?
    I'd have to know the description of the node to explain that
    The unsteady ground node? Where it applies same debuff that antman applies after opponent specials.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Ruwqiersa said:

    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    I don't believe that's correct. Sersi's glancing doesn't count because it's an ability that applies to her specifically, while Ant Man's applies to Archangel. He's immune to ability accuracy reduction on himself, not on opponents. Disorient reducing his AA is most definitely a bug.
    Then how do you explain aa not working in glancing node in aw before?
    I'd have to know the description of the node to explain that
    The unsteady ground node? Where it applies same debuff that antman applies after opponent specials.
    I'd call that another bug. If it is the exact same debuff that Ant Man applies, it should work the exact same way. If it doesn't, I don't see how that could be working as intended.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,800 Guardian
    I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."

    Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.

    All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).

    The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."

    Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.

    All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).

    The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.

    That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Ruwqiersa said:

    DNA3000 said:

    I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."

    Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.

    All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).

    The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.

    That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
    Glancing doesn't only reduce ability accuracy. Nimrod's ability accuracy isn't reduced when he glances while fighting Mutants.
  • PikoluPikolu Member, Guardian Posts: 7,972 Guardian
    Ruwqiersa said:

    DNA3000 said:

    I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."

    Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.

    All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).

    The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.

    That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
    That's because glancing OP
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    DNA3000 said:

    I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."

    Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.

    All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).

    The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.

    That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
    Glancing doesn't only reduce ability accuracy. Nimrod's ability accuracy isn't reduced when he glances while fighting Mutants.
    I also tested mordo right now. His kit also says his ability accuracy cannot be modified but passivly. I went to a glancing node in 7.2.4. his sp1 degen triggered on hit but soul barb didnt. What the hell is this
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    Maratox said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    This is 100% wrong. Nodes are defender abilities. This has been confirmed many times.
    Inflicting the disorient might count as ability. But the reduction from it is the ability of the disoerient itself so it doesnt count
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Ruwqiersa said:

    Maratox said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    This is 100% wrong. Nodes are defender abilities. This has been confirmed many times.
    Inflicting the disorient might count as ability. But the reduction from it is the ability of the disoerient itself so it doesnt count
    I honestly don't see how that would even work. Debuffs and passives aren't considered abilities of themselves when inflicted by champions, they are champion abilities. If that were the case, Archangel wouldn't be immune to AAR from any debuffs or passives, which is clearly not true. As you stated earlier, Magnetized does not reduce Archangel's ability accuracy. Using your logic I could say the reduction is from the Magnetized passive and not Magneto, so it doesn't count as a champion ability. But it does.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Ruwqiersa said:

    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    DNA3000 said:

    I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."

    Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.

    All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).

    The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.

    That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
    Glancing doesn't only reduce ability accuracy. Nimrod's ability accuracy isn't reduced when he glances while fighting Mutants.
    I also tested mordo right now. His kit also says his ability accuracy cannot be modified but passivly. I went to a glancing node in 7.2.4. his sp1 degen triggered on hit but soul barb didnt. What the hell is this
    I think Passive AAR is only considered things like Falcon's Lock On or Magneto's Magnetized. He shouldn't be immune to those node's Glancing AAR. I believe those nodes only give an 85% chance to glance, so you probably just got that lucky 15% on the sp1 and not on the sp2. Sounds like it's working just fine in that case.
  • AverageDesiAverageDesi Member Posts: 5,260 ★★★★★
    Loooooong standing bug
  • AverageDesiAverageDesi Member Posts: 5,260 ★★★★★
    Ruwqiersa said:

    Maratox said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    This is 100% wrong. Nodes are defender abilities. This has been confirmed many times.
    Inflicting the disorient might count as ability. But the reduction from it is the ability of the disoerient itself so it doesnt count
    Go to a node that puts concussion and see what happens
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    Maratox said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    BabyMiike said:

    So I'm exploring act 7 and I found a path that places disorient on you so I figured to bring AA since the path boosts mutants and AA is immune to ability reduction but I guess he isn't anymore https://youtu.be/ateXeRAOLGg

    Its not a bug. Its just the nature of aa that developers decided on. Aa ability says that he is immune to ability accuracy reduction from opponents "abilities". Like directly. But when its some kind of debuff or buff (like the glancing that sersi has) doesnt count for that immunity to direct ability acuracy reduction immunity. But it does for some debuffs tho like antman glancing debuff. So its purely based on what developers consider as aar from ability or not.
    This is 100% wrong. Nodes are defender abilities. This has been confirmed many times.
    Inflicting the disorient might count as ability. But the reduction from it is the ability of the disoerient itself so it doesnt count
    I honestly don't see how that would even work. Debuffs and passives aren't considered abilities of themselves when inflicted by champions, they are champion abilities. If that were the case, Archangel wouldn't be immune to AAR from any debuffs or passives, which is clearly not true. As you stated earlier, Magnetized does not reduce Archangel's ability accuracy. Using your logic I could say the reduction is from the Magnetized passive and not Magneto, so it doesn't count as a champion ability. But it does.
    But magnetization is direct tho. If this is not the case as you say then aa is clearly bugged
  • RuwqiersaRuwqiersa Member Posts: 714 ★★★
    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    DNA3000 said:

    I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."

    Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.

    All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).

    The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.

    That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
    Glancing doesn't only reduce ability accuracy. Nimrod's ability accuracy isn't reduced when he glances while fighting Mutants.
    I also tested mordo right now. His kit also says his ability accuracy cannot be modified but passivly. I went to a glancing node in 7.2.4. his sp1 degen triggered on hit but soul barb didnt. What the hell is this
    I think Passive AAR is only considered things like Falcon's Lock On or Magneto's Magnetized. He shouldn't be immune to those node's Glancing AAR. I believe those nodes only give an 85% chance to glance, so you probably just got that lucky 15% on the sp1 and not on the sp2. Sounds like it's working just fine in that case.
    Its not just that node. There is also a node that makes medium sized champs glance all of their special attacks. Also since node doesnt apply any debuff or buff to make that work its passive.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Ruwqiersa said:

    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    AngelMcNugget said:

    Ruwqiersa said:

    DNA3000 said:

    I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."

    Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.

    All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).

    The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.

    That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
    Glancing doesn't only reduce ability accuracy. Nimrod's ability accuracy isn't reduced when he glances while fighting Mutants.
    I also tested mordo right now. His kit also says his ability accuracy cannot be modified but passivly. I went to a glancing node in 7.2.4. his sp1 degen triggered on hit but soul barb didnt. What the hell is this
    I think Passive AAR is only considered things like Falcon's Lock On or Magneto's Magnetized. He shouldn't be immune to those node's Glancing AAR. I believe those nodes only give an 85% chance to glance, so you probably just got that lucky 15% on the sp1 and not on the sp2. Sounds like it's working just fine in that case.
    Its not just that node. There is also a node that makes medium sized champs glance all of their special attacks. Also since node doesnt apply any debuff or buff to make that work its passive.
    That's not how the node works.

    Particle Protector is the node that makes champions glance their attacks. Size Matters just gives that node exclusions, meaning it would have practically no effect without Particle Protector.

    In this case it seems they're just defining passive AAR abilities as coming from a passive placed on the champion, so Mordo isn't immune to it. Maybe that's another bug, but it still makes sense if it isn't.
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