Now that the BG Season is almost over, what are your thoughts on Attacker/Defender tactics in Bgs?

Verreaux

This season debuted with putting the Alliance War tactics into battlegrounds for both victory track and gladiator circuit, so I'm curious how people feel about them since it's a possibility Kabam will continue to follow this trend for future battleground seasons.

For me the hazard shift meta in particular has opened up a lot of interesting counters to fights that weren't normally viable such as Nebula, Jabari Panther and Void. On the other hand, if Kabam continue to use these tactics then two things need to be addressed for the future in my opinion:

1. Champions that fulfill an attacker or defender tag should be highlighted/displayed as such in every part of battlegrounds

It should not be a requirement that players have to essentially memorise which champions are part of Decay or Sugar Pill during the match. With the tech meta, you could immediately tell if a champion would be benefitting from the attacker tactic because the class is clearly displayed, but in this meta you have no indication whether a champion is decay or sugar pill other than remembering their tag before entering the match. If Kabam intend to use tagged tactics for future seasons, then some kind of visual change needs to occur in battleground decks that allows people to easily tell which champions are affected by the nodes.

Maybe a small symbol underneath the relic icons on every champion? Not too sure on the solution but this is a definite problem Kabam needs to address for future seasons if this trend continues.

2. The Decay tactic was overtuned and counters far more fights than I believe was originally intended.

Any Attacker tactic should help the champion counteract the defender node, which it did in this case. However, one part of decay stood out as really weird:

"Attackers gain 35% resistance to Damage over time effects for each debuff on the defender" in theory should only affect damaging effects that actually have a duration. From what I assume the goal here was to allow decay champions to counteract hazard shift in both war and the final gladiator circuit meta. However, there are a multitude of fights that decay champions can take that I don't believe was intended due to how strong this ability actually is:

1. Attumas Thorns (the most egregious example, his ability is an instant amount of damage whenever he is struck yet it counts as a damage over time effect for decay)
2. Mysterios damage reflection from the SP1 (All of the damage happens at once, and so should not be affected by the resistance)
3. Degeneration effects (While these do count as damage over time effects, the ability completely ruins multiple good mystic defenders such as Kindred, Mojo, Ebony Maw etc)
4. Dominos critical failure (This one also works from the wording, although I can't imagine they had Dominos sig in mind when making the decay tactic)
5. Havoks plasma detonation (Another case of instant damage affected by a resistance to "damage over time effects")

While these are only a few examples (not even including champions such as Mephisto, Immortal Abomination or Korg), the Decay Tactic gives any tagged champion a lot of options for dealing with normally difficult defenders that as far as I can tell was not part of the original design of the nodes. This severely limited defender placement during the season and at the top end of Gladiator Circuit most players would just pick non sugar pill defenders and champions who could shrug off debuffs instead of placing the "intended" defenders as it would actually be worse to place Sugar pill defenders if your opponent has drafted decay champions.

While this did open up some more interesting defenders such as Crossbones and Void (who is unaffected by decay for whatever reason), it was unusual that so many good defenders could just be shut down by champions like Ronin or Terrax who would normally struggle a lot, with the only requirement being to apply a lot of debuffs.

I'm still not entirely sure if it was actually intentional for Decay to be this strong, or if this is just a bug that Kabam chose not to fix. This doesn't even include how the Slow debuff from knocking down the defender can shut down Attumas unstoppable which by the rules of how slow works should not be possible.

If these tactics continue for the future, then in my opinion they need to be tested and checked that they give tagged champions benefits against tagged defenders, but not completely shut down random champions outside of the nodes and lead to tactic champions dominating against defenders that normally they would struggle significantly against.


What do you guys think of both Sugar Pill and Decay during this battlegrounds season? Should Kabam continue this trend of node design or scrap it entirely? Curious on what everyone else thinks and whether it's just me who thinks Decay was too strong, and also thoughts on how the entire season was dedicated to these tactics instead of split between two different metas for gladiators' circuit.

XFREEDOMX

I personally enjoyed this meta.

Darkraw346

When it comes to vt meta it didn't feel like a bgs meta at all simply cuz some fights could be just the most basic fights ever with no nodes... if for example u use a non #Decay attacker vs a non #Steviapill defender, so it was just a regular fight like Realm of legends

Blackjack555yy

I didn't really like it, most of the times it felt like a basic fight, so much i forgot they were timed.

i prefer when the meta is more general for champions

Zuro

I hated this meta personally. Attacker tactics should only give a slight boost in a fight, not make or break the whole match. Literally every match the same 3 decay attackers always get banned and I have to stick with the same 5 champs while also having to work around sugarpill which is literally impossible. I honestly preferred it when there was no attack tactics as it caused more diversity in decks, instead of the current whoever has the higher ranked kingpin, silk, etc. wins.

Pikolu

I like the idea of the meta. However if we get tactic attackers and defenders again, I want some sort of symbol to show up on them.

The main thing I didn't like about the meta is how worthless some defenders became. Drafting tactic defenders would be a major waste if the opponent drafts multiple decay champions. For the most part, I found myself placing non-tactic defender much more often than not.

WinterFields

I'm personally not a fan of AW, so I was not thrilled with making BG more like AW. I normally like the harder seasons because it's nice to not just mindlessly throw CGR/Torch/AA at an opponent. This season though, the tactics in VT could be ignored most of the time, as in GC, sugar pill defenders were more of a liability than an asset.

The one thing I liked though was that so many opponents had so many mystics/science champs, that their other classes were lacking

BigPoppaCBONE

iMO, these tactics suck. I'm at a distinct disadvantage already which is all my doing*. Hopefully Kabam puts in tactics that are going to give a hard disadvantage to the usual BG deck fillers.

*I'm not ranking up champs I don't play and I'm all the way out on primarily defense champs. I'm especially not ranking up champs I don't like just for this. Unfortunately, Kabam has put all the best stuff in BGs.

Kappa2g

Absolute terrible meta. Just made draft RNG even more impactful and the coin flip or who places defender first in the final round even worse.

It's a design failure when most of the matches in GC end up being I need to draft X amount of attackers that are that tag and X amount of defenders of that tag otherwise I'll lose, but then factor in some defenders that require specific counters that don't play well into the nodes, its a miserable lose in draft meta.

TyEdge

Put an icon on champs to show who’s a tactics attacker/defender. Don’t make me memorize 30 champs.

flapjax

Personally I liked this tactic but I might be biased because I generally have a lot of Sugar Pill and Decay champs ranked, as they're some of my favorites.

I noticed a lot of people, even in the 150-200 GC range, aren't really leaning into the meta though. I've played several games where my opponent didn't draft a single Decay attacker and it seemed a little odd. Tbf some champs like Hulkling still cook as long as you wait out the bleed phase but a lot of my wins felt like they were because I was drafting for the meta and my opponent wasn't.

And others have said, an icon is desperately needed for tactics if they're going to be a thing. I memorized most of them but the odd I forgot and it was kind of annoying.

BigPoppaCBONE

flapjax said:

Personally I liked this tactic but I might be biased because I generally have a lot of Sugar Pill and Decay champs ranked, as they're some of my favorites.

I noticed a lot of people, even in the 150-200 GC range, aren't really leaning into the meta though. I've played several games where my opponent didn't draft a single Decay attacker and it seemed a little odd. Tbf some champs like Hulkling still cook as long as you wait out the bleed phase but a lot of my wins felt like they were because I was drafting for the meta and my opponent wasn't.

And others have said, an icon is desperately needed for tactics if they're going to be a thing. I memorized most of them but the odd I forgot and it was kind of annoying.

In the 0 - 35 GC range, people seem keenly aware of the tactics and their ruthless application with a menacingly stacked deck. 😂🤣

willrun4adonut

flapjax said:

Personally I liked this tactic but I might be biased because I generally have a lot of Sugar Pill and Decay champs ranked, as they're some of my favorites.

I noticed a lot of people, even in the 150-200 GC range, aren't really leaning into the meta though. I've played several games where my opponent didn't draft a single Decay attacker and it seemed a little odd. Tbf some champs like Hulkling still cook as long as you wait out the bleed phase but a lot of my wins felt like they were because I was drafting for the meta and my opponent wasn't.

And others have said, an icon is desperately needed for tactics if they're going to be a thing. I memorized most of them but the odd I forgot and it was kind of annoying.

Oh, you played me then?

Juanmi

Horrible. Same champs were used for every fight.

Yodabolt21

I personally do not like the idea of tactic defenders or attackers. It seems lazy. I thought we switched to 2 metas so they could focus on making them better? And we get the same tactics from AW? Lame. It was mostly easy, but as OP said, the attack tactic never seemed to work as intended. Many good non-tactic defenders were shut down also. It was basically a nuke meta, which we see WAY too often. Bring back armor burn and metas that make you think and actually be smart with your drafts etc…

BUT, if we get more laziness and tactic stuff returns, they HAVE to be identified during the drafting portion. Saving a screen shot of the tagged champs and constantly checking during the draft phase was totally lame and took the fun out of it.

Drago_von_Drago

I don’t play war much so this was my first exposure to tactic champs. I never took the time to learn who was a tactic champ and who wasn’t so when weird stuff would happen I’d just assume it was related to the tactics. I’ve also only made it to plat so far and haven’t played a lot this season.

I definitely agree there needs to be some sort of label or visible cue for tactic champs. I can’t keep up with learning all the new champ kits and special attack animations. Adding another list to remember on top of that is too much.

captain_rogers

I ranked up korg and attuma who became useless this meta

phillgreen

Don't turn BG's into AW and if you really want to use AW nodes, at least mark the champs so we can see who is who in the very short ban/draft time we have to work in.

phillgreen

I dont mind not being able to use the same champs every season, if anything it encourages roster diversity which should be paramount in the only solo PVP competition in the game but I'd rather some unique creativity applied to BG's.

Adri5846

I enjoy this meta and I am happy with the roster diversity. At least we change the deck all months and make some rank ups that without BGs i wouldnt do.

For the tactic champions i think that they can use the same icon of AW. Easy for then to make this change with the existing icon.

IvarTheBoneless

In the beginning it confused me, as I wasn't up to speed on aw tactics. Then it confused me some more because I thought the nodes applied to all champs. Then when I learnt it it was fun for bit. Afterwards I really started to despise it because some champs like titania, hulk and spider ham have evaded me since they came out and now they are suddenly vital. Only advantage to this was that I could easily ban them if I saw them.

Real_Madrid_76_2

This meta was awesome for me. I got my 2nd r5, titania and was constantly smashing fights like attuma and KM in bgs, who are really troublesome for me personally

pseudosane

OP, i disagree with you.

While the attacker tactic was very powerful, the fact that the dex buff exists, made it very difficult in certain war fights, which is why it was made as powerful as it was.
This knock on effect into BGs made it much more strategy oriented, which was very enjoyable. This meta is super fun with all the incredible maneuvering. It isnt a nuke meta, which is what is the absolute best thing about it. I hope future metas are like this.

TheShinyDome

captain_rogers said:

I ranked up korg and attuma who became useless this meta

I used korg a bunch with great success. He can shrug off their debuffs and make them take hazard shift damage. Same reason my zemo became a great defender in this meta.

GrO_ot78

Made it to GC, with no ambitions or a terribly strong deck...no R5s or 7r2s, none of the dreaded defenders...well, it was a bit of fun too.

R4 NF, 200 sig 5/65 ascended Korg, 7*r1 Frost and Killmonger my most used defenders, and yes…they will kill.



This guy ^ 😍 I just love Morbius 🥰
All those mystic Doom, Abs, Sassy, Maw etc are done fast with a lot of health left. 150k sp2 with 18-20 bleeds…🔥🔥🔥