AI recovery speed

KontraktKilla

Anyone else getting AI fights that they recover and react at nano-second speed?? I’m getting double combo’d… AI can dash attack twice before my champ can finish a single dash back. When you close distance dash in against An AI opening (especially when the AI is walking towards you) you get light intercepted, where the distance is physically impossible for a human player to do the same intercept to the AI? Throwing a special before your combo even finishes its last hit animation?

MrTreeman

Yeah, it's kinda wacky...

DrZola

My theory: what you see on screen and what’s going on behind the screen are not always synched.

That explains more than the lightning recovery by opponents. It also explains the weird intercepts and “misintercepts” as well as the hits that don’t make contact even when it looks like they did.

Code on code, month after month, dev after dev. Eventually, it starts to build up.

That’s just my uninformed opinion, however. I know I know nothing.

Dr. Zola

KontraktKilla

Yeah good point Zola, it does feel quite a bit like code construction and a combination of overly turned AI. It’s like as the code filters by the AI automatically injects an input to the next action without a natural break in response time. Like it bumps the next action as soon as the last action terminates. Resulting in the nano second reaction to our inputs or… just the AIs chain of actions without the code providing for a natural pause between actions.

Ragnaruk5178

@DrZola awesome analysis. Thing is though, I feel that certain champs are coded quite differently compared to others. Some are known knowledge such as venom’s aggressiveness which is expected, but some is ridiculous. Shocker’s AI recovery speed is phenomenal….

PT_99

I called it on day-1 of 60fps, when everyone was celebrating how smooth and responsive AI feels,
I said that Kebem will 100% mess with AI speed again
And once again, Kebem proved me right.

They can't help themselves into touching perfect things but god forbid we ask them to fix broken things, then they either go mute or say "we're looking into it"

Nothing in between.

TotemCorruption

Yes, they can recover insanely quickly at times.
The way I view it is: we all deal with it, so it's just part of the game difficulty now.
You can still counter it but it requires zero hesitation in your own inputs, which does make the playing experience pretty intense and stressful when tackling competitive content....

Bosley

These posts come up at least once a day and KABAM continues not to reply to any of them.

From their inaction I can only assume that everything is working as intended according to KABAM and nothing will change...... which is absolute garbage.

TotemCorruption

Bosley said:

These posts come up at least once a day and KABAM continues not to reply to any of them.

From their inaction I can only assume that everything is working as intended according to KABAM and nothing will change...... which is absolute garbage.

Ok, I understand the sentiment of frustration, but just so you know, if you watch gameplay streams from Kabam designers (like DLL and others) you will literally see them scream at the AI for recovering too quickly and how that is frustrating beyond belief.
So why assume this is some conspiracy instead of a complex AI interaction or consequence that has no easy fix?

Bosley

TotemCorruption said:

So why assume this is some conspiracy instead of a complex AI interaction or consequence that has no easy fix?

Mainly because of how long it's been going on and the lack of response by KABAM (more recently than ever).

I feel like if they really wanted to it would be fixed already. How hard it is to dial back the recovery speed? So easy to turn it up but they can't turn it back down. C'mon man....

Maybe you're right though. But the longer KABAM avoid addressing the community the worse it makes them look IMO.

TotemCorruption

Bosley said:

TotemCorruption said:

So why assume this is some conspiracy instead of a complex AI interaction or consequence that has no easy fix?

Mainly because of how long it's been going on and the lack of response by KABAM (more recently than ever).

I feel like if they really wanted to it would be fixed already. How hard it is to dial back the recovery speed? So easy to turn it up but they can't turn it back down. C'mon man....

Maybe you're right though. But the longer KABAM avoid addressing the community the worse it makes them look IMO.

I feel like they usually don't address the community about issues they have no clear fix for.
And I think this is one of them because based on what everyone says (and what video shows) this isn't something that a global AI behavior tweak would fix.
The unpredictability and randomness of the recovery speed suggests that it’s an unintended side effect of multiple mechanics interacting. That is super difficult (and maybe even impossible) to cleanly fix.

I just can't imagine that at these Kabam meetings, in a room full of people like DLL and others who play this game as passionately as the rest of us, the meeting ends with something like: "Even though we hate this recovery issue, and even though there is an easy fox for it, let's just not do anything and keep everyone, including us, super frustrated and unhappy."

Bosley

I hear your logic and that makes sense as a possibility.

I guess I just think that KABAM needs to communicate a lot more with us on this either way.

It just doesn't feel like they're even starting to address the problem. If they have, how so?

BowTieJohn

I agree @DrZola . Sadly this has plagued the game a lot longer than most other issues.

Sachhyam257

It's definitely recovering from combos faster after the update, I've noticed my specials getting blocked more often when I combo into special...

TotemCorruption

Bosley said:

I hear your logic and that makes sense as a possibility.

I guess I just think that KABAM needs to communicate a lot more with us on this either way.

It just doesn't feel like they're even starting to address the problem. If they have, how so?

Kabam has already said: "AI recovery time is too fast. We didn't mean to increase it, this wasn't deliberate, but it pretty clearly is recovering faster than it used to. In my opinion, this is the core issue with why the AI feels so much harder than it used to, because it impacts so many different AI interactions. We are working to fix this."
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/378780/i-ve-given-up-hope-at-this-point/p2

smdam38

You can’t fix something you don’t know about.
If you’re having issues, you need to report it and be very specific and answer any questions they have.

There are a lot of moving pieces in this game. Narrowing down the actual problem helps a lot.

DrZola

@TotemCorruption I hear you, and I appreciate the fact that @KabamPinwheel and others have been willing to come onto forums and recognize the issues.

But that Crashed comment is still from October ‘24…

Dr. Zola

Herbal_Taxman

smdam38 said:

You can’t fix something you don’t know about.
If you’re having issues, you need to report it and be very specific and answer any questions they have.

There are a lot of moving pieces in this game. Narrowing down the actual problem helps a lot.

Here’s one example. Prior to the last update, it was possible to punish Serpent’s sp2 if you dashed in and blocked the beams while standing right in front of him. This doesn’t work anymore. He will block or parry you.

Deder80

KontraktKilla said:

Anyone else getting AI fights that they recover and react at nano-second speed?? I’m getting double combo’d… AI can dash attack twice before my champ can finish a single dash back. When you close distance dash in against An AI opening (especially when the AI is walking towards you) you get light intercepted, where the distance is physically impossible for a human player to do the same intercept to the AI? Throwing a special before your combo even finishes its last hit animation?

Man I thought I was Tripping or my phone was wasn’t working. I’m on an iPad Pro 11 2023. Very fast. I have 2g fiber optic internet. I was blown away by how fast AI was able to recovery and do back to back combos before my champ could block or dex the first combo. So far 3 5 hit combos is the most I received before being able to avoid the next attack. This is total BS.
And notice how they haven’t fixed the ability to scroll through friends in the contacts list.
Come on Kabam! Get your stuff together!

smdam38

Herbal_Taxman said:

smdam38 said:

You can’t fix something you don’t know about.
If you’re having issues, you need to report it and be very specific and answer any questions they have.

There are a lot of moving pieces in this game. Narrowing down the actual problem helps a lot.

Here’s one example. Prior to the last update, it was possible to punish Serpent’s sp2 if you dashed in and blocked the beams while standing right in front of him. This doesn’t work anymore. He will block or parry you.

Don’t tell me. You have to tell the support and game team.

Herbal_Taxman

You think they don’t know about it? I think they are aware of all these issues, there’s no point in submitting a ticket. I think it’s just a question of whether they don’t want to do anything about it or they can’t do anything about it.

TotemCorruption

DrZola said:

@TotemCorruption I hear you, and I appreciate the fact that @KabamPinwheel and others have been willing to come onto forums and recognize the issues.

But that Crashed comment is still from October ‘24…

Dr. Zola

Right, I was just responding to the other comments saying Kabam has never even acknowledged the issue.

smdam38

Herbal_Taxman said:

You think they don’t know about it? I think they are aware of all these issues, there’s no point in submitting a ticket. I think it’s just a question of whether they don’t want to do anything about it or they can’t do anything about it.

How are they going to look into or fix an issue if it’s not reported and don’t know about it?

Herbal_Taxman

@KabamPinwheel @KabamDORK Heres the report.

PT_99

TotemCorruption said:

Bosley said:

These posts come up at least once a day and KABAM continues not to reply to any of them.

From their inaction I can only assume that everything is working as intended according to KABAM and nothing will change...... which is absolute garbage.

Ok, I understand the sentiment of frustration, but just so you know, if you watch gameplay streams from Kabam designers (like DLL and others) you will literally see them scream at the AI for recovering too quickly and how that is frustrating beyond belief.
So why assume this is some conspiracy instead of a complex AI interaction or consequence that has no easy fix?

What is this scuffed demonfyze behaviour you're doing from past week or two?

JESUSCHRIST

TotemCorruption

PT_99 said:

TotemCorruption said:

Bosley said:

These posts come up at least once a day and KABAM continues not to reply to any of them.

From their inaction I can only assume that everything is working as intended according to KABAM and nothing will change...... which is absolute garbage.

Ok, I understand the sentiment of frustration, but just so you know, if you watch gameplay streams from Kabam designers (like DLL and others) you will literally see them scream at the AI for recovering too quickly and how that is frustrating beyond belief.
So why assume this is some conspiracy instead of a complex AI interaction or consequence that has no easy fix?

What is this scuffed demonfyze behaviour you're doing from past week or two?

Because people are frustrated by the AI recovery issue and they think that either Kabam doesn't know about it, or that Kabam knows about it and can easily fix it but is intentionally not doing it because they're evil.

But yes, I apologize for not being like you. How's this?
"Kebem suckz. I h8 dis game; it iz horrorrable. Neva gonna quitz tho becoz eyez gotz notin betterz 2 dooh. "

dv99999

many complaints about AI, but no responses from kabam?

smdam38

You have an issue. Posting it in a forum isn’t going to get it fixed.

Flood their ticket system with the issue.
It will make its way up if there’s enough tickets for the same thing and then work its way down to get people to fix it.