Is Spiral just a Serpent counter?

Amanda_Cruze

What's your thoughts?

CandyCane2

My thoughts are non existent

Ashacekar

She rolls, that's another use.

Ragnaruk5178

Really wants buff heavy matchups but serpent is a main factor of her usability

Friendly001

Less than.

BeastDad

I'd rather use Shathra over her, that is for sure.

TotemCorruption

Friendly001 said:

Less than.

I haven't ranked her or studied her, but I saw this match and she handled him pretty easily. Skill required probably, but again, I didn't really understand the rotation due to my ignorance of her kit.

altavista

I just tried Act 9.2 Medusa boss using Spiral, and boy was that not any good. Although blocking does remove one of Medusa's Fury buffs even when nullify immunity is on board, due to the reduced defensive ability accuracy per buff, even a single buff was enough to make that mechanic unreliable. Couple that with trying to keep track of your fervor counter, tracking Medusa's buff counts, and the encroaching stun timer, and it was not an easy time.

In general, the rate that Medusa gets her fury buffs means that you either can't keep up with it, or you'll be baiting hit into block frequently instead of doing normal damage rotation.

All that is to say - compared to Mystic that can control buffs, she's much more complicated to use (except against Serpent where she probably the simplest counter) and can only control a limited number of buffs. If you need that Rubble utility, it's more effective when the opponent gains those buffs slowly/infrequently as otherwise your playstyle will get interrupted by needing to block constantly.

And compared to Mystics where the focus is on damage, she's also more complicated to use than those Mystics.

Some players will like her, and some will be able to do great things with her against Cosmics and non-Cosmics. But she's just not my cup of tea.

Dr. Crab

I asked a similar question a month or so ago and honestly, I still have no idea where to use her or why I was excited when I got her…twice. No shade I just genuinely don’t know, and also she seems very difficult to use as well.

shield311

Spiral is indeed just a serpent counter generally in BGs atleast, can work for maestro but that's about it, she's insanely slow and mid outside very buff heavy matchups/metas.

Buttehrs

altavista said:

I just tried Act 9.2 Medusa boss using Spiral, and boy was that not any good. Although blocking does remove one of Medusa's Fury buffs even when nullify immunity is on board, due to the reduced defensive ability accuracy per buff, even a single buff was enough to make that mechanic unreliable. Couple that with trying to keep track of your fervor counter, tracking Medusa's buff counts, and the encroaching stun timer, and it was not an easy time.

In general, the rate that Medusa gets her fury buffs means that you either can't keep up with it, or you'll be baiting hit into block frequently instead of doing normal damage rotation.

All that is to say - compared to Mystic that can control buffs, she's much more complicated to use (except against Serpent where she probably the simplest counter) and can only control a limited number of buffs. If you need that Rubble utility, it's more effective when the opponent gains those buffs slowly/infrequently as otherwise your playstyle will get interrupted by needing to block constantly.

And compared to Mystics where the focus is on damage, she's also more complicated to use than those Mystics.

Some players will like her, and some will be able to do great things with her against Cosmics and non-Cosmics. But she's just not my cup of tea.

Sounds like a Wiccan fight

captain_rogers

Buttehrs said:

altavista said:

I just tried Act 9.2 Medusa boss using Spiral, and boy was that not any good. Although blocking does remove one of Medusa's Fury buffs even when nullify immunity is on board, due to the reduced defensive ability accuracy per buff, even a single buff was enough to make that mechanic unreliable. Couple that with trying to keep track of your fervor counter, tracking Medusa's buff counts, and the encroaching stun timer, and it was not an easy time.

In general, the rate that Medusa gets her fury buffs means that you either can't keep up with it, or you'll be baiting hit into block frequently instead of doing normal damage rotation.

All that is to say - compared to Mystic that can control buffs, she's much more complicated to use (except against Serpent where she probably the simplest counter) and can only control a limited number of buffs. If you need that Rubble utility, it's more effective when the opponent gains those buffs slowly/infrequently as otherwise your playstyle will get interrupted by needing to block constantly.

And compared to Mystics where the focus is on damage, she's also more complicated to use than those Mystics.

Some players will like her, and some will be able to do great things with her against Cosmics and non-Cosmics. But she's just not my cup of tea.

Sounds like a Wiccan fight

Yeah wiccan absolutely destroyed her

captain_rogers

Spiral is the only r3 I regret taking up. She is the definition of overrated. Champs are supposed to be rated on what they can do, not based on their beauty.

She is nothing more than a serpent counter. But there are still some players who are down bas and defend her lol.

TrongNov

I was over the moon when I got her twice from titans when all youtubers hyped her. I ranked 2 her afterwards and never touched her since.

Yaron_aviv

I love mine.
R4 sig 110.
Different animal at sig 200. Effectively immune to poison shock and incineration.

She’s a dual threat (slows down the match defensively with no obvious counters). She enjoys buff heavy opponents but as most of her dmg is rupture, very few champs don’t melt when she gets going.

Lastly, falter immunity is epic. Alt opening with the sword toss is great.

Feed her sig stones and don’t sleep on her.

Emilia90

captain_rogers said:

Spiral is the only r3 I regret taking up. She is the definition of overrated. Champs are supposed to be rated on what they can do, not based on their beauty.

She is nothing more than a serpent counter. But there are still some players who are down bas and defend her lol.

Reducing her to just a champ that’s a serpent counter and saying people who defend her are down bad is definitely a choice of all time

SirGamesBond

I like her. She big fun.

EdisonLaw

She can counter Maestro and other cosmics quite well, but for general matchups Shathra is better

NONYABIZZ

Lol, I knew this since I saw her deep dive 😂
Between how good her livestream made her look (against serpent) and that one guy who went to NYCC convention saying how good spiral was and how he didn't like playing dazzler, you couldn't tell her fans SHYT 😂😂

Once I saw both champions deep dives, I did lots of analysis (BECAUSE I WAS VERY EXCITED AND HAD ALOT OF TIME ON MY HANDS LOL).
I deemed spiral was not going to last past the initial hype because of that in built mix master node she has.

She simply has no versatility, she's kinda like a dani moonstar, rotation is already a drag and then you add any difficult nodes and they just gets washed. Couple that with dancing blades that takes lots of practice to execute reliably, all that for mediocre and unreliable damage. She relies on buffs specifically power gain buffs for her to perform well as that is the only way for her loop to feel comfortable.

With lots of endgame nodes relying on the player to adjust their playstyle or wait for certain mechanics, she was always going to be a no go👎

Don't get me wrong, she's packing TONS OF UTILITY, her playstyle is just the problem

The_0wenpus

Strangely, the only defenders she shines against other than serpent are all 4 years old or more

TotemCorruption

altavista said:

I just tried Act 9.2 Medusa boss using Spiral, and boy was that not any good. Although blocking does remove one of Medusa's Fury buffs even when nullify immunity is on board, due to the reduced defensive ability accuracy per buff, even a single buff was enough to make that mechanic unreliable. Couple that with trying to keep track of your fervor counter, tracking Medusa's buff counts, and the encroaching stun timer, and it was not an easy time.

In general, the rate that Medusa gets her fury buffs means that you either can't keep up with it, or you'll be baiting hit into block frequently instead of doing normal damage rotation.

All that is to say - compared to Mystic that can control buffs, she's much more complicated to use (except against Serpent where she probably the simplest counter) and can only control a limited number of buffs. If you need that Rubble utility, it's more effective when the opponent gains those buffs slowly/infrequently as otherwise your playstyle will get interrupted by needing to block constantly.

And compared to Mystics where the focus is on damage, she's also more complicated to use than those Mystics.

Some players will like her, and some will be able to do great things with her against Cosmics and non-Cosmics. But she's just not my cup of tea.

Are you talking about the 9.2.5 Medusa boss that anyone can solo with Doom like it's 2019?
Look up Doom cycle on youtube and save your revives for actual difficult content.

TotemCorruption

The_0wenpus said:

Strangely, the only defenders she shines against other than serpent are all 4 years old or more

That's a pretty big "other than". Serpent pretty much redefined MCOC defenders...

Jack2634

I think she is underrated on her utilities and defense prowess

altavista

NONYABIZZ said:

Lol, I knew this since I saw her deep dive 😂
Between how good her livestream made her look (against serpent) and that one guy who went to NYCC convention saying how good spiral was and how he didn't like playing dazzler, you couldn't tell her fans SHYT 😂😂

Once I saw both champions deep dives, I did lots of analysis (BECAUSE I WAS VERY EXCITED AND HAD ALOT OF TIME ON MY HANDS LOL).
I deemed spiral was not going to last past the initial hype because of that in built mix master node she has.

She simply has no versatility, she's kinda like a dani moonstar, rotation is already a drag and then you add any difficult nodes and they just gets washed. Couple that with dancing blades that takes lots of practice to execute reliably, all that for mediocre and unreliable damage. She relies on buffs specifically power gain buffs for her to perform well as that is the only way for her loop to feel comfortable.

With lots of endgame nodes relying on the player to adjust their playstyle or wait for certain mechanics, she was always going to be a no go👎

Don't get me wrong, she's packing TONS OF UTILITY, her playstyle is just the problem

I’ve always complained about champions being designed around BGs - champions seemed to be designed to either be Bullseye/Serpent, or counter Bullseye/Serpent. The common shutdown response was “if they can handle Bullseye/Serpent, that means they have stuff in their kit that’ll be good for a lot of things.”

Well, Gentle / Spiral seem to be designed to be amazing against their target, but a little lacking outside of that target. An evade counter that only works in response to Bullseye. Damage cycle that relies on Serpent level power gain (her 1-3% power steal is not gonna outpace any faster power gain)

TotemCorruption said:

altavista said:

I just tried Act 9.2 Medusa boss using Spiral, and boy was that not any good. Although blocking does remove one of Medusa's Fury buffs even when nullify immunity is on board, due to the reduced defensive ability accuracy per buff, even a single buff was enough to make that mechanic unreliable. Couple that with trying to keep track of your fervor counter, tracking Medusa's buff counts, and the encroaching stun timer, and it was not an easy time.

In general, the rate that Medusa gets her fury buffs means that you either can't keep up with it, or you'll be baiting hit into block frequently instead of doing normal damage rotation.

All that is to say - compared to Mystic that can control buffs, she's much more complicated to use (except against Serpent where she probably the simplest counter) and can only control a limited number of buffs. If you need that Rubble utility, it's more effective when the opponent gains those buffs slowly/infrequently as otherwise your playstyle will get interrupted by needing to block constantly.

And compared to Mystics where the focus is on damage, she's also more complicated to use than those Mystics.

Some players will like her, and some will be able to do great things with her against Cosmics and non-Cosmics. But she's just not my cup of tea.

Are you talking about the 9.2.5 Medusa boss that anyone can solo with Doom like it's 2019?
Look up Doom cycle on youtube and save your revives for actual difficult content.

The point was not that she's a good/bad option for the specific boss - the point is that she's not useful where you think she could be since there is a lot of limitations in accessing her utility.

Sceptilemaniac2

Yall crazy.
Spiral is so good when you know how to play her.