I've reached mental capacity for champions (and what that can mean for the game going forward)

1. Dunbar's Number is a sociology concept about the ideal maximum community size of approximately 150, with that being the limit to how many relationships one can maintain.

While not an obvious connection to that concept, I feel like I've reached my limit of champions I can hold in my head.

Looking at Solvarch/Cassandra's abilities, my eyes glaze over and I can't remember in detail what they do even an hour later. This has probably been the case for most of the 2025 champions. However, I can still tell you that off the top of my head that Vox's SP3 can neutralize Inhuman champions (even though I've never used it) or that Kamala can nullify buffs (despite never actually using her). I just think that I can't stuff any more champion knowledge into my brain.

2. Champions are getting more complicated, and the number of champions is constantly growing as well. For normal game modes, this doesn't really matter since you have time to plan and resources (potions) to retry. However, even for game modes like Arena, this starts becoming an issue.

For competitive game modes (AW, BGs) this means that most casuals won't be able to keep up purely from a champion quantity/quality perspective. While one could argue that a player only needs to commit 30-50 champions to memory each month (based on meta relevancy), it still is a mental ask that not all players will be inclined to continue. Setting aside complaints about matchmaking, I wonder if there will be a natural attrition rate just from there being too many champions.

I don't think this is an actual problem, its intrinsic to the game (2 champions added each month) and just the natural progression of the game (champions have to be different from pre-existing champions). But I just think it highlights that this game will have a shelf-life for old farts like myself.

Comments

NoahSansman

While I think this continued expansion of the sheer amount of nodes and champion kits people have to learn or memorize will turn off new players, as a veteran player myself, I personally have yet to be negatively affected.

It may be harder to understand everything about certain champions, and I do find myself having to check kits occasionally; this doesn't upset me. I enjoy the planning and scouring to find the right champ for the job.

SandeepS

I agree with the new champs, there is so much text and complexities to each kit. I thought there was a drive to simplify this going forward. Either my memory is wrong or they've not implemented the change yet.

ahmynuts

I see where you're coming from, and for anyone who hasn't been playing the game for a very long time, this is an extraordinary issue. The barrier to entry is high, and the barrier to even understanding half of what things do in this game is ridiculous (especially for this generation. cough cough)

The easiest way to get around this, imo, is by grouping and association. A lot of champions at this point in the game either do exactly what another does or have very similar abilities to others and can be grouped into categories and you can make educated assumptions on what an ability will do when you see it pop up, even if you don't know exactly what is the slight difference in a certain scenario.
Another big one in this category is with animations. Kabam reuses and recycles so many animations, timings, etc, and just puts a new coat of paint on them, probably beyond what a lot of players expect without actually looking for it. This is to the point where you can look at a champion's special attack and go "Oh yeah, that's just Korg's sp1," and then never have to worry about dexing it again. Or "That's just x's or y's heavy attack, spacing, animations" and not even worry about what the animation is actually doing

ahmynuts

I see where you're coming from, and for anyone who hasn't been playing the game for a very long time, this is an extraordinary issue. The barrier to entry is high, and the barrier to even understanding half of what things do in this game is ridiculous (especially for this generation. cough cough)

The easiest way to get around this, imo, is by grouping and association. A lot of champions at this point in the game either do exactly what another does or have very similar abilities to others and can be grouped into categories and you can make educated assumptions on what an ability will do when you see it pop up, even if you don't know exactly what is the slight difference in a certain scenario.
Another big one in this category is with animations. Kabam reuses and recycles so many animations, timings, etc, and just puts a new coat of paint on them, probably beyond what a lot of players expect without actually looking for it. This is to the point where you can look at a champion's special attack and go "Oh yeah, that's just Korg's sp1," and then never have to worry about dexing it again. Or "That's just x's or y's heavy attack, spacing, animations" and not even worry about what the animation is actually doing

Recent example: Casandra Nova: That's just Jean Grey and Professor X but a little to the left. You can kinda get the gist of what's going on without worying too much about it and anything you miss you'll collect as information as you fight

Sundance_2099

I can't remember half my roster these days

Rayven5220

As somebody who has had a very bad memory my entire life, I haven't been able to remember half the champs abilities for at least a couple years now.

The champs are only getting more and more complicated and I'm already to the point where I just watch a couple videos about them, learn their basic rotation and go with that.

I don't remember half the abilities so it does screw me up in bg's alot, and down the road may affect it even moreso than it already does.

I'm not getting any younger and not gonna spend hours learning how to effectively use every single champ I use, their ideal rotations for each matchup, who they're good and terrible against, and every other intricacy of kits.
I go in, punch things and hope for the best.

N8buckeye08

I’ve long since argued that we need a Thanos snap. The biggest problem would be that everyone has a different favorite champion that might be eliminated.

That said, there’s basically two (maybe two and a half) types of players out there:
1. Newer/casual players that enjoy slow progression in the game
2. End game players who play competitively
2.5. End game players who play and spend competitively

If you’ve been playing this game for more than a year or two and aren’t valiant right now and regularly making gladiator’s circuit, you’re not a competitive player (which is fine). You’re probably mostly happy to play your favorite marvel characters and the ability to keep up with the quantity and complexity of champions ended somewhere between Year 3-5

For the end game competitive players, the game will get stale without growth. Frankly, the best thing that can happen is the new champions further stratifies the players by skill. I’m fine releasing high-skill complex champions that are OP such that the best players can dominate battlegrounds and AW. If we ever get to a point where MSD or Fintech level of skill is necessary to complete endgame content, I think that will be a problem.

DrZola

If only the game engine and servers could match the complexity of current and new champs…

Dr. Zola

Zuro

I'm in the same boat, at this point the ban button has been my only saving grace. But since Kabam is so keen on releasing absurd defenders every month, the ban button can only do so much

arifin74

I think this is more of a problem for Battle Ground, where you instantly need to remember the ability of champions.

NoahSansman

I think this is more of a problem for Battle Ground, where you instantly need to remember the ability of champions.

That's a good point. I have found myself scrambling to pull up aunt mai with 10 seconds left on the clock to see a defender's immunites.

Amanda_Cruze

Ok..
I was just thinking

Which in game champ has the least worded description?

Ronan?

Terminatrix

Agreed. This is part of the reason why I only use around 10 champs consistently.

Anotherconcernplayer

Ok..
I was just thinking

Which in game champ has the least worded description?

Ronan?

Well I know Drax have the longest abilities description, we just can't see it.

150? I lucky if I can remember 15. I just do a recap every time I need to use them. My old brain don't let me hold much.

Graves_3

Ok..
I was just thinking

Which in game champ has the least worded description?

Ronan?

Nope. That honor goes to OG cap I think. Maybe even the old cap marvels.

Terminatrix

I think this is more of a problem for Battle Ground, where you instantly need to remember the ability of champions.

Right. There is no way to pull up the champs abilities to see what you're up against and who you need to counter them, in the time allowed. It's just another thing that makes BGs frustrating.

GroundedWisdom

I don't think we're supposed to remember them all, and for those of us of a certain age, the mind weakens. Personally I'd rather they stay creative about new Champs and Abilities than repetitive or too simplistic.

World Eater

Excellent post

I’ll add that I felt the same way 6 years ago.

CheeseMaster482

Everyone uses the same exact champs in BGs so it's really easy to remember abilities after 3 matches. In story content you can just look it up.

The hardest mechanic is reverse controls since it forces you to learn a new playstyle. You're also playing against a very predictable AI not real players. Imagine if you had to keep track of startup frames, active frames, recovery frames, whiff punishing, frame traps, and safe on block.

LexSavi

I’ve been thinking this for a while. I keep adding champs to my “learn to play” list. Issue is that the list has gotten so unwieldy that it sometimes feels unsurmountable. When I’m trying to catch up on learning champs from a few years ago to the detriment of newer ones, I always feel behind.

Makes me wonder whether the game needs to move away from the 2 champs a month model.

Terminatrix

Ok..
I was just thinking

Which in game champ has the least worded description?

Ronan?

I found a few from the simple days

Slig

This has been an issue for me as well. It’s also why I’m annoyed by reworks of old champs. I’ve accepted that some old champs aren’t usable anymore more. And then Kabam goes and gives them new kits so I have to learn them because I’ll see them soon enough in BG, arena, etc. I understand why they can’t stop putting in new champs (unless they unveil skins - hint, hint), but the reworks should stop.

PT_99

What's worst is that Kabam also likes to sometimes give ability description in lore style.

Popper chopper pops the trigger popper chopper, WTF
Till this day idk what some of wording in spiderham means, even tho he's going to be next 7r4

Like I get it what's it trying to say, but I don't remember it.

ESF

I can't remember half my roster these days

NGL: When they said Anti-Venom was getting a tune-up for Rebirth, I had completely forgotten that kit was in the game. Hadn’t used Sabretooth in probably FIVE YEARS or more.

Slig

I can't remember half my roster these days
NGL: When they said Anti-Venom was getting a tune-up for Rebirth, I had completely forgotten that kit was in the game. Hadn’t used Sabretooth in probably FIVE YEARS or more.

I haven’t used any of the ones getting reworked at all.

Slig

And I was chastised by Kabam Rex (I think) when I brought this up in another thread. I said that we basically have to watch a video to understand how each new champ worked and was told that reading the description is enough.

Tim1234

😂😂😂😂 sometimes I even forget some characters are in the game … like Karnak … I got em six star some time ago and I was shocked he was in the game

phillgreen

Champ acquisition used to be slow enough that you would use the shiny new champ, albeit with a very simple kit, and be able to keep up.

I open 7* crystals much faster than my ability to want to use or learn them so now it's niche abilities that pull them off the bench and nothing else.

Buttehrs

This has been an issue for me as well. It’s also why I’m annoyed by reworks of old champs. I’ve accepted that some old champs aren’t usable anymore more. And then Kabam goes and gives them new kits so I have to learn them because I’ll see them soon enough in BG, arena, etc. I understand why they can’t stop putting in new champs (unless they unveil skins - hint, hint), but the reworks should stop.

So you'd be cool pulling a drax, og groot or Kamala without a rework? That's the craziest thing ever read.

Herbal_Taxman

I don’t want those champs as they currently exist, no. But I gotta say, I’m not very hyped up this upcoming batch of reworks either. Niche uses for Viv and maybe AV, expect they both want high sig.

On DLL’s video, he basically says, yeah, we didn’t have time to make major changes so this is the level of update that was possible. What I would like to ask is, why bother updating six champs that probably aren’t different enough to get significant playtime? Why not do substantive reworks for a smaller number of champs?