Void and Suicide Masteries

HENRIQUE_FORTE

Some weeks ago I went for full suicides and today I fought a 100% attack and health boosted Void at AW. No blows were exchanged, my Blade just dropped dead after some seconds. I know Void deals direct damage if he places debuffs on opponents, but he deals also direct damage with the debuffs of the Mastery Tree! So:

1. Is this working as intended?
2. Is it fair to lose health on a fight just by choosing certain masteries?
3. Is taking a bleed/poison immune champ to this fight the only solution?

Opinions?

Stark78Alfa

About 3. Is taking a bleed/poison immune champ to this fight the only solution? I think that or you change your masteries or bring a bleed+poison immune champ.

Bendy

Yeah it says about a debuff does direct damage so suicides would deal there damage and then voids direct damage void also works if u have chaos and they have any debuff they lose health so just being bleed or poison or change mastery before fighting if it's 100% void in war

Mirage_Turtle

1) He is working as intended. This same issue came up when he was the boss of the Event Quest a few months ago. If you had suicide masteries and you weren't immune, you were dead in seconds.

2) To be fair, by nature of the suicide masteries, you lose health by choosing certain masteries.
But I know that's not what you're asking. To me, it doesn't seem unfair. You're talking about 1 specific mastery setup being disadvantageous against 1 specific champ...and the disadvantage goes away if you're using a bleed/poison immune champ. Seems ok to me.

3) Immunity is a solid option. I'd argue that the smarter move is to take off suicide masteries when competing in AW. When defenders have recoil, they tend to die very quickly. Plus, because willpower regen doesn't scale with health they way the damage from suicides will, the masteries will cause the defender to lose health pretty steadily no matter what. When attackers use the masteries, they either lose health by firing off specials or they lose utility by not using specials. Plus, any defender that has despair will gimp your willpower, causing you to lose health. Suicide masteries have a place in the game, but AW isn't it.

Just my opinion. I think the matchup, like many others in the game, just needs a little planning to get around. Void is fine the way he is.

Deadbyrd9

He deals passive degen damage for each debuff active on the opponent. Why would you think this didn’t include suicides?

If you are running suicides against a void then you need a champ like iceman, vision, ultron, nebula, etc

HENRIQUE_FORTE

I remember that boss and thinking the Legend Run boys would love this fight.

I understand your point, Mirage, just not sure I agree with you. The penalty for choosing Suicides is recoil, bleed and poison. Ocasionally there is heal block also. But starting a fight and immediately lose health, without we or the opponent triggering anything, just because I choose a particular mastery, seems a little exagerated. Is there any other mastery that puts you in a similar situation?

HENRIQUE_FORTE

Deadbyrd9 wrote: »

He deals passive degen damage for each debuff active on the opponent. Why would you think this didn’t include suicides?

If you are running suicides against a void then you need a champ like iceman, vision, ultron, nebula, etc

This was at AW. I only knew my opponent was a science champion. If I knew it was Void I would ask for backup (which I did after losing the first fight)

Mirage_Turtle

HENRIQUE_FORTE wrote: »

I remember that boss and thinking the Legend Run boys would love this fight.

I understand your point, Mirage, just not sure I agree with you. The penalty for choosing Suicides is recoil, bleed and poison. Ocasionally there is heal block also. But starting a fight and immediately lose health, without we or the opponent triggering anything, just because I choose a particular mastery, seems a little exagerated. Is there any other mastery that puts you in a similar situation?

You say you disagree, but you didn't refute any of my points like despair and the handicap that suicides place on your defenders. I'd be that if your alliance is competitive in AW, they'd be happy to see you get rid of those masteries. The downside to the Suicide Masteries need to be severe because the upside is very big. +60% attack to all your attacks is pretty huge in this game. No other mastery or synergy combination comes close to giving this kind of boost.

As for masteries that put you in detrimental situations, the Suicide Masteries are definitely the king of the hill. Liquid Courage, Double Edge, and Recoil are nicknamed the "suicide masteries" for a reason. But if you're looking for a similar situation:

Glass Cannon takes up to 7.5% of your max health right off the top for the benefit of extra attack.

Dexterity creates a buff, which puts any user of this mastery at a disadvantage against Mystic Champs with the mystic dispersion mastery.

Resonate triggers willpower, which can ultimately heal your enemy more than hurting them in certain situations.

All these scenarios are less severe than the one you posed, but I'd say they all exist in the same vein.

The beauty of masteries is the customization. There is no "best setup". You have to weigh out all the trade-offs each mastery gives you to best suit your champs and fighting style.

HENRIQUE_FORTE

Damn. You just pointed out all other situations I was going to name. I would just add the new Parry on autoblock of Iron Man Infinity Wars.

I agree each mastery has its pros and cons, like you said, but I think that triggering mystic dispersion by dexterity or taking damage by Void like this just feel cheap. In my opinion, it shouldn't happen.