Sabretooth and Sasquatch Synergy [Merged Threads]

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  • Mike192Mike192 Posts: 324 ★★
    Sabretooths kit says that he will bring all fury effects - effects are considered passives. Fury buffs are the active ones. Hence it seems its not working as intended. People pointing out to spotlight dont realize that the spotlight says '...bring 11 instead of 10..' but it doesn't say 'cross your fury threshold of 15'

    Would love to have the interaction as is but I think it will be fixed.
  • b3atub3atu Posts: 14
    this synergy is obviously not working as intended, broken and brought a bug to light that has been there since ST has released.
    should be fixed to where you can keep up to 15 passive furies through an entire quest with the synergy
  • NightCrackerNightCracker Posts: 146
    Mike192 said:

    Sabretooths kit says that he will bring all fury effects - effects are considered passives. Fury buffs are the active ones. Hence it seems its not working as intended. People pointing out to spotlight dont realize that the spotlight says '...bring 11 instead of 10..' but it doesn't say 'cross your fury threshold of 15'

    Would love to have the interaction as is but I think it will be fixed.

    I was re-reading the spotlight several times and could not find it anywhere saying it can go over 15. Most likely will just be fixed to match the intended 15 passive.

    Spotlight - Sabretooth
  • DonnymeijDonnymeij Posts: 680 ★★★
    Lvernon15 said:

    They crrated the synergy knowing what they were doing. No.

    2 words.
    G2099 synergy
    Not the same. To use this in long game modes you pay with units/revives. It has a downside. G2099 has no downside at all.
  • Thicco_ModeThicco_Mode Posts: 5,584 ★★★★★
    Ebony_Naw said:

    how did the designers intend this synergy to work then, if they didn't think it could do what ccp is doing? was it just a way to keep his damage for the entire quest?


    Tbf, one of his greatest setbacks has always been that you have 4-6 fights of ramp up before starting over. Adding this synergy makes him more practical on a fundamental level before he gets op.

    But the fact that they couldn't see past that is an issue, and the ccp videos should have never seen the light of day if this was never intended. I woukd guess we saw them before Kabam did, but that's part of the problem, not the explanation. If they fix it now, it's a bit of a weak move imo (same as with g2099)
    yeah I think the first paragraph you mentioned was their intention of they didn't realize the insane stuff he could do. honestly, that itself is a pretty good synergy. personally, I think it's fine leaving it in because it's so impractical to build him up like the CCP, but even without it, it makes him much better.
  • Thicco_ModeThicco_Mode Posts: 5,584 ★★★★★
    Donnymeij said:

    Lvernon15 said:

    They crrated the synergy knowing what they were doing. No.

    2 words.
    G2099 synergy
    Not the same. To use this in long game modes you pay with units/revives. It has a downside. G2099 has no downside at all.
    I think they were referring to the sybgery with Ultron and some others where they would get fury/power gain when triggering an immunity, but I could be wrong. @Donnymeij
  • OrdalcaOrdalca Posts: 497 ★★
    Mike192 said:

    Sabretooths kit says that he will bring all fury effects - effects are considered passives.

    The champ says he activates all his previous effects, and effects are passives, buffs, and debuffs, not just passives. Otherwise, the immunities that are "immune to shock effects" would only be for passive shocks, right? Even though it clearly stops both passive and debuff shocks.

    If you have active furies, they get reactivated as passives, not from being converted as you fight, so the 15-fury limit shouldn't be interfering, in my opinion. On the other hand, you only get 2 furies per fight at most once you pass the limit, 1 from s3 and 1 from 10-hits/5-hits against you.
  • Mike192Mike192 Posts: 324 ★★
    edited July 13
    Ordalca said:

    Mike192 said:

    Sabretooths kit says that he will bring all fury effects - effects are considered passives.

    The champ says he activates all his previous effects, and effects are passives, buffs, and debuffs, not just passives. Otherwise, the immunities that are "immune to shock effects" would only be for passive shocks, right? Even though it clearly stops both passive and debuff shocks.

    If you have active furies, they get reactivated as passives, not from being converted as you fight, so the 15-fury limit shouldn't be interfering, in my opinion. On the other hand, you only get 2 furies per fight at most once you pass the limit, 1 from s3 and 1 from 10-hits/5-hits against you.
    Not true. Look at stealth spidey and she hulk. It says Fury 'effects'. Now go look at Hyperion or Hulk, it says Fury 'buffs. In fact, Hulk has a synergy that 'converts buffs into effects'. Now look at Maw SP1 which says nullifies Fury 'buffs'. Try nullifying she hulks Fury 'effects'

    Edit: The immunities are a one-stop thing. If you are immune to bleed, you cant be bled regardless of active/passive.
  • OrdalcaOrdalca Posts: 497 ★★
    edited July 13
    Mike192 said:

    Ordalca said:

    Mike192 said:

    Sabretooths kit says that he will bring all fury effects - effects are considered passives.

    The champ says he activates all his previous effects, and effects are passives, buffs, and debuffs, not just passives. Otherwise, the immunities that are "immune to shock effects" would only be for passive shocks, right? Even though it clearly stops both passive and debuff shocks.

    If you have active furies, they get reactivated as passives, not from being converted as you fight, so the 15-fury limit shouldn't be interfering, in my opinion. On the other hand, you only get 2 furies per fight at most once you pass the limit, 1 from s3 and 1 from 10-hits/5-hits against you.
    Not true. Look at stealth spidey and she hulk. It says Fury 'effects'. Now go look at Hyperion or Hulk, it says Fury 'buffs. In fact, Hulk has a synergy that 'converts buffs into effects'. Now look at Maw SP1 which says nullifies Fury 'buffs'. Try nullifying she hulks Fury 'effects'

    Edit: The immunities are a one-stop thing. If you are immune to bleed, you cant be bled regardless of active/passive.
    She-Hulk: "for each of her personal Passive Fury effects". Specifically calls out the passive effects as the only ones with the extra mechanics.

    Hulk+Surfer: "All of Hulk's Fury Buffs are Passive effects..." once again calling them out as passives.

    Stealth spidey: only ever calls them Fury passives, never effects.

    Re immunities, look at electro. He "takes no damage from Shock effects." Both passive shocks and debuff shocks deal no damage. Look at Thing: "Immune to Bleed, Shock, Armor Break, Armor Shatter, Nullify, Stagger, and Fate Seal effects". Both passives and debuffs are immune.

    Re nullify: Only buffs can be nullified. All buffs are effects, all debuffs are effects, all passives are effects. Not all effects are passives. Not all effects are debuffs. Not all effects are passives.
  • Lvernon15Lvernon15 Posts: 9,000 ★★★★★
    Look, by the wording that’s how it should work, his wording for persistent charges clearly states he can convert those he finishes with after 15, and it is clear this synergy hasn’t been properly tested since this hasn’t been found, luckily the ccp have discovered it and hopefully there will be a definitive response before his crystals release, but things really need proper testing by kabam, the ccp shouldn’t be those who are checking for how broken things are, they’re there for content on things, and the hype created here makes this synergy disappointing if it’s nerfed, if kabam tested and changed it pre ccp release then it would simply look like a strong synergy
  • Ebony_NawEbony_Naw Posts: 645 ★★★★
    Lvernon15 said:

    Look, by the wording that’s how it should work, his wording for persistent charges clearly states he can convert those he finishes with after 15, and it is clear this synergy hasn’t been properly tested since this hasn’t been found, luckily the ccp have discovered it and hopefully there will be a definitive response before his crystals release, but things really need proper testing by kabam, the ccp shouldn’t be those who are checking for how broken things are, they’re there for content on things, and the hype created here makes this synergy disappointing if it’s nerfed, if kabam tested and changed it pre ccp release then it would simply look like a strong synergy


    Can't believe I became their defense attorney but when you create the box, it's incredibly difficult to think outside it. I'm sure there are better ways to test, and like you, I'm tired of false hype and immediate nerfs when testing could avoid it. But at the same time, I can understand the oversight here.
  • BigPoppaCBONEBigPoppaCBONE Posts: 1,310 ★★★★
    People that read Sasquatch's spotlight knew this immediately. A bunch of people, including me, commented about it as soon as it was posted. No one that could read needed the CCP hype to figure out where and how it could be put to devastating use. If someone wants to use a ton of units to acquire Sasquatch and then spend a ton of revives to get Sabretooth to Ludicrous Strength™ , I'm sure Kabam fully endorses that spending decision.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 4,620 ★★★★★
    Menkent said:

    This would be a pretty classic move for them. A dev tries to give sabertooth a little boost and they end up having to nerf what he could already do because no one at kabam actually knew how he worked in the first place. At least the CCP are doing their job and found this before the sasquatch crystals dropped.

    To be fair it's more than a little boost. I also certainly don't think it needs to be gutted. I could reasonably see a cap added to his fury but I don't think it needs to be capped at 15 for sure. It would still be very good at 30 and far from game breaking I think
  • PaytoPlayPaytoPlay Posts: 770 ★★★
    edited July 13
    The 15 furies limit is for permanent and passive fury during the fight. All active, temporary fury before the fight ends should be outside of this count (after ST reached 15 passive furies, he can only convert the fury gained from a sp3 finisher). Fury gained from sp3 finisher is arguably not during the fight. If it is, I would argue CG should've gained true strike with sp2 finisher after an evade.

    In short, this synergy requires some adjustment to how ST currently work... still a cool one though... I simply didn't want to rank 5 him because of the random persistent charges right out of the gate.. now I have some reassurance that the fury can be maintained...
  • Captain_ZanCaptain_Zan Posts: 69

    Hey guys,

    Can confirm that this is a Bug. We are discussing the course of action right now and will let you know what exactly needs to be fixed, and how fast we can do it.

    Sabretooth should NOT be able to get to this many Fury effects.

    Even though it's a bummer we appreciate the quick confirmation @Kabam Miike . Thank you
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