Cav skill nodes

Hey all what your veiw on the cav skill nodes?

I feel like it just screws over suicide users in the game. Having to waste units to switch just to comple it Is a pain in the rear!

Comments

Qfury

Hey all what your veiw on the cav skill nodes?

I feel like it just screws over suicide users in the game. Having to waste units to switch just to comple it Is a pain in the rear!

Completely agree, but I don't have bwcv or diablo ranked up so I always have to take them off anyway for the mystic quest.

Lpoo

The design is not well thought through. I get that the node places a ton of debuffs on you, so they don’t want massive healing going on for free with willpower. But, it actively works against a mastery that is available in the game that is supposed to help.

If they get that update on changing up masteries in a much less expensive/ complex way, the quest nodes are fine.

Edit: especially with side objectives connected the event quest

_wasabi_

I agree with this as well. There are two major mastery set ups in the game and I don't think one should be in such disadvantage over the other, especially in monthly quest.
At the same time, it is still doable, I used Mole God for most of it and it will be changed in time again, we just need to wait it out.

TrashyPanda

I think it'll cause a division in the community every time it's used. Naturally, as nothing we like more than hating on each other.

A simple change to mitigate the monthly strife would be preventing the suicide debuffs from proccing. There'd still be moaning, because there always is, but it'd be far less.

DNA3000

The design is not well thought through. I get that the node places a ton of debuffs on you, so they don’t want massive healing going on for free with willpower. But, it actively works against a mastery that is available in the game that is supposed to help.

I find the heal block annoying as well, but I don't buy the idea that suicides are "supposed to help" so heal block is unfair. Suicides are supposed to have a trade off, they aren't supposed to just be universally wonderful. If it is unfair for a node to hurt suicide masteries, then what of things like Spectre that hurt Willpower. Is that unfair as well?

I don't think this is poorly thought out as well. I'm pretty sure the devs know what the impact is, and are choosing from a list of equally problematic options. For example, you could make the debuffs passives instead: then they wouldn't interact with Willpower, but they would also become invisible to champions that can shake off debuffs. Is that fair? We can go even further, and make them not debuffs and not passives, so Willpower doesn't interact with them but they behave differently from normal passive effects, but then we would confuse 99% of the playerbase into not understanding what the heck they were seeing and getting into fist fights over what a passive effect is, again.

It is really the current limitations of the game engine, and the limitations on the players ability to remember and deal with complex mechanics, that is at work here, not "lazy design" as I've heard it referred to elsewhere. If someone has an idea that would resolve the problem, instead of just pushing the problem somewhere else they don't care about as much (but other people would), I would love to hear it.

LeNoirFaineant

You don't have to use skill champs. Just take a suicide team. I'm not changing my masteries for it.

unknown

This content has been removed.

PastorAmerica

Two Words: Mole Man.
Took him in with full suicides on. Cleared the lane each time.

Moosetiptronic

Hate it too, think they should change it.

Aegon at sig 200 does work for it though, if you get an early shrug in the first fight.

Odachi

MLM with shang chi then you're good to go. Only special you will use is sp2 which will be the end of it, so no recoil. Same with hit monkey; parry - medium + heavy, no bleed or poison build to the sp2, throw a medium+sp2 game over.

Almccarthy

The design is not well thought through. I get that the node places a ton of debuffs on you, so they don’t want massive healing going on for free with willpower. But, it actively works against a mastery that is available in the game that is supposed to help.
I find the heal block annoying as well, but I don't buy the idea that suicides are "supposed to help" so heal block is unfair. Suicides are supposed to have a trade off, they aren't supposed to just be universally wonderful. If it is unfair for a node to hurt suicide masteries, then what of things like Spectre that hurt Willpower. Is that unfair as well?

I don't think this is poorly thought out as well. I'm pretty sure the devs know what the impact is, and are choosing from a list of equally problematic options. For example, you could make the debuffs passives instead: then they wouldn't interact with Willpower, but they would also become invisible to champions that can shake off debuffs. Is that fair? We can go even further, and make them not debuffs and not passives, so Willpower doesn't interact with them but they behave differently from normal passive effects, but then we would confuse 99% of the playerbase into not understanding what the heck they were seeing and getting into fist fights over what a passive effect is, again.

It is really the current limitations of the game engine, and the limitations on the players ability to remember and deal with complex mechanics, that is at work here, not "lazy design" as I've heard it referred to elsewhere. If someone has an idea that would resolve the problem, instead of just pushing the problem somewhere else they don't care about as much (but other people would), I would love to hear it.

Nice write up. That's all well and good what you have stated but my problem is
1. The cost of turning suicides off and on.
2. The time it takes doing so we could really use a "profile 1" (suicide build) or "profile 2" (non suicides) they could implement a 50 unit cost to switch between the 2 if they want that cost to stay.

Masterpuff

As a suicide user, I used Shang, Moleman, Hit-Monkey, and Ronin. But some people may not have those champs or have them ranked, which would be tough.

mbrace

I didn’t worry about it much. An R5 KP with Hood synergy handled every lane well, even with the heal block working against his sustainability.

AMS94

A better way forward fr such content will be giving some despair like node to the defenders where debuffs affect ur healing potency
This will give time to suicide users to counter those debuffs & get rid of them before their willpower healing stops & poison eats them
Non suicide users will also have to ensure that they don't stack too many debuffs & play as the node wants them to
These passive heal blocks are getting used much more frequently than they ever were & it's a problem that not enough people are addressing currently

xNig

Isn’t suicides a mastery choice? I mean, you won’t bring a non poison immune into a poison node right?

Lpoo

Isn’t suicides a mastery choice? I mean, you won’t bring a non poison immune into a poison node right?

True, I guess I see masteries as this investment that is not something that easy to change. If it were easier, then I wouldn’t mind turning suicides off and then back on for EQ’s.

Dontsellthem

I was hoping that this was more about discussing the new skill EQ nodes.

I’m loving the new way. I was finally able to use my aegon outside of LOL.

I can basically use any skill champ no need to worry about dumb shock champs. I did love using my rank 3 6* BWDO, but it’s nice to open up lots of other skill champs.

I don’t run suicides and never have, so I can’t comment on that.

xNig

Isn’t suicides a mastery choice? I mean, you won’t bring a non poison immune into a poison node right?
True, I guess I see masteries as this investment that is not something that easy to change. If it were easier, then I wouldn’t mind turning suicides off and then back on for EQ’s.

Iirc, Kabam seems to be working on a quick mastery switch setup as part of a QoL improvement.

DNA3000

Isn’t suicides a mastery choice? I mean, you won’t bring a non poison immune into a poison node right?

Technically, iBom is not poison immune.

Palanthrax

My team is Aegon, Mole Man, Hit Monkey and Ronin. They all throw off the bleed and poison at the beginning of the fight, job done.

Raichu626

If someone has an idea that would resolve the problem, instead of just pushing the problem somewhere else they don't care about as much (but other people would), I would love to hear it.

I might have such an idea that would at least make it more manageable: Replace half the debuffs in the rotation with heal block debuffs. That way, players would still be permanently heal blocked unless they got rid of the debuffs by using the nodes/intended playstyle. Suicide users would still be at a disadvantage due to being heal blocked some of the time, but not as much as currently, while also not allowing endless regen for anyone else.

Deda

Problem is not in the nodes but in the costs of masteries.

What is the point of masteries if I have to switch them off/on every few days? Obviously only to bring Kabam more profit.

Solution is to play all the time without them. Fights will be longer, I'll have to spend more ingame time which I don't wont to and next step is deleting game because my time as recourse is limited and more valuable than satisfaction I receive playing this game longer than I intended only for Kabam's profit margin to be thicker.

xNig

Problem is not in the nodes but in the costs of masteries.

What is the point of masteries if I have to switch them off/on every few days? Obviously only to bring Kabam more profit.

Solution is to play all the time without them. Fights will be longer, I'll have to spend more ingame time which I don't wont to and next step is deleting game because my time as recourse is limited and more valuable than satisfaction I receive playing this game longer than I intended only for Kabam's profit margin to be thicker.

That’s a lot of “I”s.

Deda

That says alot about me doesn't it

))

Morpheus_123

Aegon breezed through it for me.

xNig

That says alot about me doesn't it ))

Not too good, tbh. 😂

unknown

This content has been removed.

unknown

This content has been removed.

Graves_3

The design is not well thought through. I get that the node places a ton of debuffs on you, so they don’t want massive healing going on for free with willpower. But, it actively works against a mastery that is available in the game that is supposed to help.
I find the heal block annoying as well, but I don't buy the idea that suicides are "supposed to help" so heal block is unfair. Suicides are supposed to have a trade off, they aren't supposed to just be universally wonderful. If it is unfair for a node to hurt suicide masteries, then what of things like Spectre that hurt Willpower. Is that unfair as well?

I don't think this is poorly thought out as well. I'm pretty sure the devs know what the impact is, and are choosing from a list of equally problematic options. For example, you could make the debuffs passives instead: then they wouldn't interact with Willpower, but they would also become invisible to champions that can shake off debuffs. Is that fair? We can go even further, and make them not debuffs and not passives, so Willpower doesn't interact with them but they behave differently from normal passive effects, but then we would confuse 99% of the playerbase into not understanding what the heck they were seeing and getting into fist fights over what a passive effect is, again.

It is really the current limitations of the game engine, and the limitations on the players ability to remember and deal with complex mechanics, that is at work here, not "lazy design" as I've heard it referred to elsewhere. If someone has an idea that would resolve the problem, instead of just pushing the problem somewhere else they don't care about as much (but other people would), I would love to hear it.

Does making the heal block a debuff which reapplies each time another non damaging debuff triggers a potential solution? That way when a non damaging debuff from the node is applied you are prevented from healing but once you shrug off/debuff drops off, you can heal normally. Doesn’t help non skill champs or champs that cannot shrug debuffs off but it may make using champs like fury/Elsa and the likes a bit easier with suicides. I am sure I am overlooking something that may make this a flawed suggestion.

unknown

This content has been removed.