**Mastery Loadouts**
Due to issues related to the release of Mastery Loadouts, the "free swap" period will be extended.
The new end date will be May 1st.
Due to issues related to the release of Mastery Loadouts, the "free swap" period will be extended.
The new end date will be May 1st.
Devil of Hell's Kitchen Overhaul: Thoughts?
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Yep, but most people thought it was a buff when Kabam updated the description after the buff release.
When in reality, DDHK always had it in his kit.
I’m not 100% certain, but I’m pretty sure that’s what happened
If you have read this thread, we have some serious reservations about this champion, and we would like to have a chance to get them addressed.
Thank you.
Unfortunately, DDHK is both unusable to suicide friendly players, and unused by the rest.
And he is DEFINITELY not a ‘new player friendly’ champ, so what gives John? 😂
However you try to use him, he ends up having the same hit count.
But since Fury and Bleed are his main sources of damage, you’ll want to build up to 29 hits on the Combo meter, fire off the SP2 which gives you a Rage debuff, which will then be purified and converted into a Fury because you’ll have entered Murdock Boy. Rinse and repeat while trying to stack the Fury buffs and weaving in some Heavy Attacks.
That’s the one I know of, FPM any other suggestions?
1) Setting the regeneration rate to 70% (ideally it should be 100% with 40% Regen from Rage).
2) Increase the duration and potency of Cruelty and Precision by 50% to 650 Crit Rating and 1000 Crit Damage Rating, 25 seconds each?
3) Increasing the chance to proc Direct Bleed from Righteous Wrath to 50% (currently 35%).
Do you have any opinions on this? Would you say this tune up would make DDHK both more accessible to suicides users, and bring him into his own as a stand-alone champion?
2. Duration is short and there is a short window where they stack. Targeting stacking cruelty causes my play style to become riskier
3. RW to 50 is great. BUT Hercules has burst damage on every hit. I’m not saying he’s like Herc or to make him like Herc but if you decrease the potency of the RW and increase the proc way higher - that may work better.
How’s that?
#2 I'd say yeah, would increase his damage fairly nicely. Most other champs in his class has equal or better crit potential, I wonder why almost all things he has, has been put to so low a % compared to his class peers.
#3 I almost never use sp3 since the activation chance for it to proc is so low. I'd say a 55% would be fair ish. Considering he's still gimped against immunes, maybe make them take a small burst of physical damage in this stance if enemy is immune to bleeds? (Small side note, I wonder if DDHKs sp3 stance interacts with OR similar to how NC does)
I'd say it would definitely bring him up further on both suicide and non suicide users list if his kit was expanded just a tiny bit. So close yet so far to be a amazing champion, not broken like some others, but just right, you get me?
1) Set the regen rate to 100%, and that’s enough. He doesn’t even need to heal from Rage! Just give him the Attack for God’s sake!
2) I would still vouch for an increased duration in both Cruelty and Precision, before an increase in potency. Here’s why: since DDHK is a high management champ (thanks for coining this Rockypantherx), ideally your reward would be seeing all the ‘good stuff’ in harmony. You know? Why should I work so hard and go through this complicated rotation, if I’m not going to reap the rewards of it? Whenever you work to get something, something else you have in the bank is expired, and this is as crucial as the regen. The potency is the cherry on top, but if you ask me, I see no sense in giving a 6-star Rank 3 champion only +454 Crit Rating off their Special 1. He could use a bump in potency of Cruelty and Precision.
So duration needs to go up, there’s no debating that one. Potency, up for debate.
3) Yes, higher is always better. I’ll take 70% happily.
I'll combine what little I have left of it, plus a little more:
DDHK is both a amazing champion and someone who falls short. Considering how some champs can sit on debuffs all fight and benefit both healing wise and damage wise (like Surfer or Ibom) the argument of "he'd be too strong" doesn't really apply, considering DDHK is one of the handful with halved or below heal rate, plus there being others who have way more beneficial interactions with suicides and debuff nodes. I'd say making him able to shrug damaging debuffs akin to Kingpin (which he was buffed together is a good idea, even if perhaps it will have to have a longer cool-down)
He also needs another option against bleed immunes. Similar to Hawkeyes Poison synergy switch or perhaps giving him either physical or energy burst damage like Masacre against immunes. Hes just so terribly gimped again immunes it isn't funny. Let's take someone like Domino, she's gimped against immunes but SHE makes up for it with high crit damage.
His sp3 also needs a higher % activation chance, I'd say a 55-65% sounds fair considering his 6-hit combo. Although then the lenght of it would probably have to be reduced a bit.
I'd say making the % of his critrelated abilities higher is good, since he's not really a hard hitting champ with them, unlike other peers in the Skill class with crits (Hawkeye, Karnak, Masacre ect) or has a real benefit from them (Masacre is a example)
I'd say making the % for his Righteous Wrath what I said above, increased chance but perhaps tiny bit less potency?
They’ve done something fair with iBom, and DDHK can have the same wording replacing “poison” with “rage”.
His damage is less than stellar. I understand his utility makes up for things - which we haven’t discussed much in this thread (I suppose it’s what’s wrong, not right with DDHK), but he’s lackluster even vs bleeders. His bleed only comes from SP2 or SP3 RW.
Perhaps if he was more viable (regen again - please adjust), the damage would be manageable since he is supposed to be gritty.
In the spirit of this character and the skin Kabam has used to represent him from the show we all love, he’s supposed to get back up and endure fights.
How can he do that when he loses half his health without getting hit once?
On the subject of base Regen, if they could set Rage at 40% then I think that would negate any argument about base Regen not being restored to the full 100%. But that said, there's other kits that would heal faster than DDHK at 100% - and don't forget he doesn't always have a Rage active all the time.
Here's hoping we hear something next week.
After restoring his regeneration to 100%, they can do that to the rage.
It’s pretty much replacing “Poison” with “Rage”.
I just fought ROL WS and tried not to get hit. With full level willpower (set at 3), not getting hit once and just dancing around and hitting into his block, I died from running liquid courage and double edge in a couple of minutes.
If they fix the regen we shouldn’t settle for what’s manageable only.
I’m a non suicides user, and my pain point with this champion includes the fact that he relies on synergies to give him what should be his base kit. And even then, they aren’t enough.
This man needs to stand up on his own. And we need to be rewarded for skillful gameplay. They need to increase the duration of Crit and Precision, this specific tuning is underrated, underestimated and would go a long way in bringing this champion into his own as @Rockypantherx said earlier on.
Also, thanks @Terra brilliant write up. Hadn’t thought of how he should perform vs Bleed immunes. Maybe a synergy with an updated Iron Fist, Elektra or Luke Cage perhaps?
I’m going to chime in again with a message I can’t stop repeating: If they fix the regen, we shouldn’t settle for what’s manageable only.
I’m a non suicides user, and my pain point with this champion includes the fact that he relies on synergies to give him what should be in his base kit. And even then, the synergies aren’t enough.
They need to increase the duration of Crit and Precision, this specific tuning is underrated, underestimated and would go a long way in bringing this champion into his own as @Rockypantherx said earlier on.
This man needs to stand up on his own. And we need to be rewarded properly for thinking so much during a fight. Managing him is too strenuous and there is little reward. Let me reap what is in his kit! I want him at his full potential! It’s too scrappy the way it is right now.
Also, thanks @Terra brilliant write up. Hadn’t thought of how he should perform vs Bleed immunes. Maybe a synergy with an updated Iron Fist, Elektra or Luke Cage perhaps?
110 hits or so to take down ROL WS is hardly a feat. Without synergies can anyone get it down more?
He has a ton of utility. It’s useless if you are the victim of one DOT debuff.
Below are the tune-ups that MUST be done. We have gone into great length of testing this champion, we are great with numbers and we love this champion, so everything below is well thought out and most importantly, it is fair and balanced.
Without further ado, the tune-up (must haves):
1) Base regeneration: increase to 100%, no reason for it to be lower unless there is a change in mechanics where DDHK is constantly purifying debuffs like Kingpin. The logic for setting the regen at 40% was that Daredevil would be sitting on a ton of Rage buffs. But for some reason, he takes more damage from debuffs than what should be the norm. In fact, he is way below the norm and an anomaly in this regard.
2) Rage regeneration: decrease to 20%, decrease the potency of each additional Rage debuff by 5%.
3) Cruelty duration: increase the duration to 25 seconds. We need more uptime on this, DDHK doesn’t have any enhanced Combat Power Rate or Power Gain, so this is his main squeeze to bring him into his own. Consider increasing potency from 440 to 660 for a 6-star Rank 3.
4) Precision duration: increase the duration to 25 seconds. Right now, the values are senseless. 8 seconds out of the current 15 are lost to the duration of the SP1. 2 more seconds are lost if the AI is being passive right after. What does that leave us with? 5 seconds? We won’t have time to fill even one bar of power with the current duration. Then, what advantage can we take of this? It’s useless. We need this to have enough duration to bring to his SP2, which is impossible to do right now. Consider increasing potency from 716 to 950 for a 6-star Rank 3.
5) Rage duration from SP2: shorten to 6 seconds. We need more uptime on stacking the Fury buffs if and when we can’t access Murdock Boy.
6) Righteous Wrath chance: increase from 35% chance to proc direct Bleed to 50% chance. The point of this was to give him something to work with in long fights, except, whether we use it or not in a long fight, it doesn’t make ANY difference. Please, make it make a difference.
This tune up should be enough to bring DDHK into his own, without any changes in mechanics. With the changes above, we will be able to create an effective cycle between his SP1, SP2 and Heavy Attacks. One where they all flow harmoniously and come together for one big banger of an SP2. Currently, this isn’t possible because some things expire when other things proc. Let us have everything, like Venompool, Venom, Odin, etc.
DDHK has a higher skill and management cap, give him his crowning moment as a Catholic brawler please, he doesn’t always have to be so hard on himself (and us, for that matter).
Mechanics to consider (nice to haves):
1) Pausing buffs when striking the opponent, during basic and special attacks (similar to Odin). This could provide more uptime, but as @Chobbly suggested there is the Shared Astronomy synergy with Mister Fantastic and Masacre / Angela for this. This has been tested and makes no difference currently. So the tune-up is required and then this can either be provided in his base kit or we could still rely on the synergy.
2) Proc the Precision buff on the last hit of the SP1. That way we could benefit more from the Precision buff, instead of losing half of it to a low hitting SP1 (similar to Ikaris).
3) Refresh one copy of each buff on activation of SP3 (similar to Odin).
Synergy approach to consider (nice to haves, in the future):
The fault in the current synergy design is the following implementation: Synergies should never COMPLETE a champion. Synergies should ENHANCE a champion. No work is required on the current synergies, but work is required on future synergies:
1) Viability: against Bleed immunes (perhaps).
2) Variety: currently synergizes with 7 Skill champions, he could use more variety. I am looking forward to the Luke Cage and Iron Fist buffs to see if they provide something useful to DDHK; and vice-versa.
To conclude, @Kabam Miike, @Kabam Boo and @Kabam John, please take a look at this tune-up proposal, which is a culmination of everything we have discussed in this thread over the past week. It’s fair, it’s balanced and it would go a long way in overturning the perception of this failure, and more importantly, making this champion buff a true success.
I want to ask @Kabam Miike again if he could set up a Q&A with John like the Guillotine buff.
That would at least help us understand you as well
1) The Regen Rate penalty is the most maligned part of the kit and for good reason. It makes him unplayable with Suicides, and when not he still suffers excessively to DoT effects.
2) Overall damage. His damage is dependent upon rotations, specially the SP2, but is unable to sustain then for long enough.
DDHK shouldn't be the biggest Skill hitter - in my opinion that's not what he is. What he is though is tough and resilient which is why the Regen Rate penalty doesn't sit well from an implementation perspective to me.
I hope that Kabam can look at him again, and increase the Regen Rate. The damage with rotations can be improved by increasing the duration of some of his buffs. Neither of these should be complex or involved changes and may just be configuration.
I hope we can get a response from one of the mods.
Referencing your thread below, it was dumped in Suggestions & Requests without any follow up or response:
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/280939/ddhk-buff-9-months-in-and-a-request
@Kabam Miike please
So much thought and effort went into providing all this insight from all these great forum members.
Kingpin is totally different. The DOT debuffs help you in many regards.
Here’s to awaiting a response by someone addressing the issues at hand so the community can enjoy this guy:
🍻