**WINTER OF WOE - BONUS OBJECTIVE POINT**
As previously announced, the team will be distributing an additional point toward milestones to anyone who completed the Absorbing Man fight in the first step of the Winter of Woe.
This point will be distributed at a later time as it requires the team to pull and analyze data.
The timeline has not been set, but work has started.
There is currently an issue where some Alliances are are unable to find a match in Alliance Wars, or are receiving Byes without getting the benefits of the Win. We will be adjusting the Season Points of the Alliances that are affected within the coming weeks, and will be working to compensate them for their missed Per War rewards as well.

Additionally, we are working to address an issue where new Members of an Alliance are unable to place Defenders for the next War after joining. We are working to address this, but it will require a future update.

Removal of Revive Farming and the Apothecary Discussion

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Comments

  • Ironman3000Ironman3000 Posts: 1,893 ★★★★★

    Because farming for 9 hours is just so easy and def wouldn't cost units on refills.

    If someone is spending Units on that they're not thinking. 30 Units for an Energy Refill, 40 for a Rev.
    I'm not sure if you understand the math here.
  • JefechutaJefechuta Posts: 1,194 ★★★★

    Jefechuta said:

    Because farming for 9 hours is just so easy and def wouldn't cost units on refills.

    When you have most of the content done, you dont use that much Energy, so you will have refills anyway, and it takes 1 refill to do 3 runs, not even talking about the refills you could get in that runs, so that point is senseless.

    And yeah, farming for 9 hours is easy, it just takes time, but the time you use to farm 9 hours is worth it by far because you would get enough revives to do a succesful EoP run
    9 hours of farming is ~90-100 refills. I have literally ALL of the content in the game and never have nearly that many refills in the stash.
    You need to do the maths again fam
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,189 ★★★★★

    Because farming for 9 hours is just so easy and def wouldn't cost units on refills.

    If someone is spending Units on that they're not thinking. 30 Units for an Energy Refill, 40 for a Rev.
    I'm not sure if you understand the math here.
    Yes. 30 some Energy per Rev, providing it spawns.
  • BocksaroxBocksarox Posts: 329 ★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    Bocksarox said:

    I've been trying to think of solutions that resemble an actual compromise. What if we had the ability to buy 20% revives with units? 20% health isn't enough health to do meaningful damage in many situations. Sure, Herc exists, but it would be fairly easy to create content that is Herc-proof through tags and/or nodes. I feel like DNA touched on this in the "AW Revives for 1 Loyalty" post: players will still need to heal.

    Funny you should mention that, because I've been thinking of an idea along those lines. Or maybe it would be more precise to say: exactly opposite those lines. However, there's no point in tossing out a half-baked idea while emotions are running this high and we're all waiting for Change.org to kick in and cause Netmarble to reverse course (which worked so well for the other 70 petitions targeting the company).
    I look forward to hearing whatever it is that you come up with. The devs have listened to you in the past, and I think your ideas have made a positive impact on this game.

  • BigBlueOxBigBlueOx Posts: 1,534 ★★★★★

    Mackey said:

    Mackey said:

    Jefechuta said:

    Mackey said:

    many people can dedicate 9 ready?

    If only 10 people exploit it then the rest of players will not be affected by the change at all, and 6 hours farming revives is not equal to 20 revives, I got 15 in maybe 2 hours
    Like I just replied to GW ... remove the auto play option then. Simple 🤷‍♂️ lucky you getting 15 in 2 hours, goes to show it can't be relied upon
    What's the difference if the AI is doing it and we're doing it? It's still the exploitation of something intended for newer Players to have a hand with. It takes the same amount of time to Fight as it does to Auto (notwithstanding using Platpool).
    I'm surprised at the lengths people are going to in order to minimize the issue.
    "when they're clicking auto while they do everything from sit on the toilet to spend time with family?" Its quite clear youre saying the auto feature is the problem from this comment (and previous ones) .... I'm surprised at the lengths you're going to to maximise the issue.
    The problem is people are milking the Revs from Act 3 beyond what the game should give them. That's the issue. We can run in circles but it's yet another thing that has to be adjusted because it's been taken advantage of. That's it.
    I guess the question though is if you think the appropriate adjustments are included in the kabam post.
    Well, I suppose that depends on how available Kabam wants them to be. A couple things I would consider is increasing the Inventory cap, which they're discussing. I'm not sure I would go so far as 99, as was suggested. Another aspect I think might help is perhaps one guaranteed Rev per EQ Difficulty. Let it spawn once, and that would add to the overall month.
    I mean I know this is probably going to go absolutely positively nowhere, but please elaborate on why Kabam’s position on availability has anything to do with your personal take? Because that’s the question that was asked.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,189 ★★★★★
    BigBlueOx said:

    Mackey said:

    Mackey said:

    Jefechuta said:

    Mackey said:

    many people can dedicate 9 ready?

    If only 10 people exploit it then the rest of players will not be affected by the change at all, and 6 hours farming revives is not equal to 20 revives, I got 15 in maybe 2 hours
    Like I just replied to GW ... remove the auto play option then. Simple 🤷‍♂️ lucky you getting 15 in 2 hours, goes to show it can't be relied upon
    What's the difference if the AI is doing it and we're doing it? It's still the exploitation of something intended for newer Players to have a hand with. It takes the same amount of time to Fight as it does to Auto (notwithstanding using Platpool).
    I'm surprised at the lengths people are going to in order to minimize the issue.
    "when they're clicking auto while they do everything from sit on the toilet to spend time with family?" Its quite clear youre saying the auto feature is the problem from this comment (and previous ones) .... I'm surprised at the lengths you're going to to maximise the issue.
    The problem is people are milking the Revs from Act 3 beyond what the game should give them. That's the issue. We can run in circles but it's yet another thing that has to be adjusted because it's been taken advantage of. That's it.
    I guess the question though is if you think the appropriate adjustments are included in the kabam post.
    Well, I suppose that depends on how available Kabam wants them to be. A couple things I would consider is increasing the Inventory cap, which they're discussing. I'm not sure I would go so far as 99, as was suggested. Another aspect I think might help is perhaps one guaranteed Rev per EQ Difficulty. Let it spawn once, and that would add to the overall month.
    I mean I know this is probably going to go absolutely positively nowhere, but please elaborate on why Kabam’s position on availability has anything to do with your personal take? Because that’s the question that was asked.
    I tend to suggest things I believe would be in line with their objectives as well, to the best of my knowledge of what their objectives are.
  • KingInBlackKingInBlack Posts: 308 ★★★
    gohard123 said:

    gohard123 said:

    gohard123 said:

    Like the starlord challenge for instance. I don't think it was designed to be a grind and revive challenge,I think it was designed when folks were posting vids of killing big bads with 3 and 4* for fun (and I think* pre sl nerf)

    Absolute nonsense you've said here. The starlord challenge was released 4 years after 4* SL nerf. Even before the nerf, people who originally did LOL with 4* starlord spent a ton of revives and potions upwards of 2-3 odins. They had that data before releasing the challenge and still did so. To address the "killing big bads with 3 and 4*", MSD and the rest only showcased singular and non related fights eg Cav EQ bosses. That does not translate to LOL runs being done with 4* champions. In Fact more evidence for the challenge intended to be revive-spammed is the non-allowance of synergy members like guardians of the galaxy like the canadian or inhuman challenge
    I mean that's fair enough. I couldn't remember when that stuff happened so you can take that out of there. Doesn't really change the other stuff I said. And what you're describing is a conception that all that high end content is meant to be done by the masses. Remember when we used to get in game mail when somebody would complete something crazy and everyone got a prize? That's because its content that isn't meant to be binged. Farming is great, im all about it as my diablo account can attest. But if folks are farming for 2 months to beat the collector or gm then something is being lost in translation. Again, I don't think they've done it right but I do see why they've done it.
    Do you even know the history behind those in game mails? BrutalDLX went past Wolverine in ROL by just letting Wolverine hit electro because there were no champions to deal with his regen. Imagine that, content being revive-spammed from the genesis of end game content. There was no guillotine sp2, all they had was a 4* electro to deal electroshock reflect damage on contact. When HQSean fully explored LOL do you know how many odins they spent. The map was locked, imagine going in and making a wrong turn to abomination or x-23. When you get those in-game mails celebrating their accomplishment, remember that they revive-spammed that content
    My bad, I didn't realize they had auto-farmed act 3 everyday for a month to hoard enough revives.
    I'm not sure how other dudes spending hundreds or thousands of dollars to complete content (and still needed tons of skill) entitles everyone else to have a free route to do the same.
    My point is the content they release necessitates revive-spamming regardless of skill and that is the underlying problem here. The only reason they didnt auto-farm act 3 then was because it didnt exist. If it did exist they would have because the content Kabam releases requires farming to that extent.
    I think the greater point is that most people just didn't do the content. If the game team feels content design is best geared towards a small handful of people and to be ignored by the vast majority then whatever floats their boat I guess.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,189 ★★★★★
    BigBlueOx said:

    BigBlueOx said:

    Mackey said:

    Mackey said:

    Jefechuta said:

    Mackey said:

    many people can dedicate 9 ready?

    If only 10 people exploit it then the rest of players will not be affected by the change at all, and 6 hours farming revives is not equal to 20 revives, I got 15 in maybe 2 hours
    Like I just replied to GW ... remove the auto play option then. Simple 🤷‍♂️ lucky you getting 15 in 2 hours, goes to show it can't be relied upon
    What's the difference if the AI is doing it and we're doing it? It's still the exploitation of something intended for newer Players to have a hand with. It takes the same amount of time to Fight as it does to Auto (notwithstanding using Platpool).
    I'm surprised at the lengths people are going to in order to minimize the issue.
    "when they're clicking auto while they do everything from sit on the toilet to spend time with family?" Its quite clear youre saying the auto feature is the problem from this comment (and previous ones) .... I'm surprised at the lengths you're going to to maximise the issue.
    The problem is people are milking the Revs from Act 3 beyond what the game should give them. That's the issue. We can run in circles but it's yet another thing that has to be adjusted because it's been taken advantage of. That's it.
    I guess the question though is if you think the appropriate adjustments are included in the kabam post.
    Well, I suppose that depends on how available Kabam wants them to be. A couple things I would consider is increasing the Inventory cap, which they're discussing. I'm not sure I would go so far as 99, as was suggested. Another aspect I think might help is perhaps one guaranteed Rev per EQ Difficulty. Let it spawn once, and that would add to the overall month.
    I mean I know this is probably going to go absolutely positively nowhere, but please elaborate on why Kabam’s position on availability has anything to do with your personal take? Because that’s the question that was asked.
    I tend to suggest things I believe would be in line with their objectives as well, to the best of my knowledge of what their objectives are.
    But what’s is your take as an independent thinking person? Why do you have to estimate their objectives prior to forming a thought? Honestly, I’m happy to concede that endless revive farming is bad for the game and a change is needed. But I’m curious on your individual opinion on if the proposed correction is appropriate at the moment?
    I'm pretty sure I offered what I would suggest in addition to that.
  • Bugmat78Bugmat78 Posts: 2,107 ★★★★★

    Dudes.... kabam is missing a major point here...
    It's not like we snap our fingers and 1000 revives randomly fall into our inventory....
    We have to spend our energy refills and hundreds of Hours on the game to earn those...
    Basically we were trading our time and energy refills for revives

    But they really only want your money...not necessarily your time. They only want your time for it to turn into money. The free revives was reducing this equation far too much. If they could get you to log in for 1 minute and pay for an odin's worth of revives it is better than you logging in for 12 hours to grind that.

    I am surprised it's taking days for them to bring us the compromise.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,189 ★★★★★
    BigBlueOx said:

    BigBlueOx said:

    BigBlueOx said:

    Mackey said:

    Mackey said:

    Jefechuta said:

    Mackey said:

    many people can dedicate 9 ready?

    If only 10 people exploit it then the rest of players will not be affected by the change at all, and 6 hours farming revives is not equal to 20 revives, I got 15 in maybe 2 hours
    Like I just replied to GW ... remove the auto play option then. Simple 🤷‍♂️ lucky you getting 15 in 2 hours, goes to show it can't be relied upon
    What's the difference if the AI is doing it and we're doing it? It's still the exploitation of something intended for newer Players to have a hand with. It takes the same amount of time to Fight as it does to Auto (notwithstanding using Platpool).
    I'm surprised at the lengths people are going to in order to minimize the issue.
    "when they're clicking auto while they do everything from sit on the toilet to spend time with family?" Its quite clear youre saying the auto feature is the problem from this comment (and previous ones) .... I'm surprised at the lengths you're going to to maximise the issue.
    The problem is people are milking the Revs from Act 3 beyond what the game should give them. That's the issue. We can run in circles but it's yet another thing that has to be adjusted because it's been taken advantage of. That's it.
    I guess the question though is if you think the appropriate adjustments are included in the kabam post.
    Well, I suppose that depends on how available Kabam wants them to be. A couple things I would consider is increasing the Inventory cap, which they're discussing. I'm not sure I would go so far as 99, as was suggested. Another aspect I think might help is perhaps one guaranteed Rev per EQ Difficulty. Let it spawn once, and that would add to the overall month.
    I mean I know this is probably going to go absolutely positively nowhere, but please elaborate on why Kabam’s position on availability has anything to do with your personal take? Because that’s the question that was asked.
    I tend to suggest things I believe would be in line with their objectives as well, to the best of my knowledge of what their objectives are.
    But what’s is your take as an independent thinking person? Why do you have to estimate their objectives prior to forming a thought? Honestly, I’m happy to concede that endless revive farming is bad for the game and a change is needed. But I’m curious on your individual opinion on if the proposed correction is appropriate at the moment?
    I'm pretty sure I offered what I would suggest in addition to that.
    Did you? Then why not state it here in plain words?
    If you're interested in engaging with me in an actual conversation, I'm all ears. If you're just going to dance around my words, then I can use my time better.
  • Shadow_ShooterShadow_Shooter Posts: 257 ★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    Dudes.... kabam is missing a major point here...
    It's not like we snap our fingers and 1000 revives randomly fall into our inventory....
    We have to spend our energy refills and hundreds of Hours on the game to earn those...
    Basically we were trading our time and energy refills for revives

    I hope no one was doing that. I could snap my fingers and make fifty revives show up at the cost of no net energy refills (just the ones that show up on the map itself) and almost zero time by just starting the map, picking the appropriate path, turn on auto fight, and go do something else, for about a weeks worth of energy.

    I'm usually done with monthly EQ with something like a week and a half to go. I'm generally burning that energy on one of two things. If I'm planning on doing anything that might require revives, I autofight 3.2.6 until I have a ton of them. If not, I'm burning that energy in the ISO quests, either by autocomplete or by just autofighting through them. These resources are for all intents and purposes, completely free.

    If I needed more than fifty or sixty revives for something, I could simply farm them in the last week and a half of one month, then continue for another week and a half at the start of the next month, knowing this would not impair my ability to complete everything I want, and then end up with something like 120 revives or so. Again, while costing nothing except energy that would otherwise expire anyway, and essentially zero actual time spent in the game.

    To put the time expense into perspective, 3.2.6 farming requires something on the order of about six to ten taps on the screen every five to seven hours. For context, this is comparable to the amount of time I spend collecting and opening free crystals in the game.

    If ever I needed a thousand revives, with the current maps I could get those without seriously compromising my ability to do monthly EQ in about six months, at the cost of about six to eight collective hours of my actual attention span. If anyone thinks this was hard, expensive, or time consuming, they were not doing it optimally. It was in fact none of those things.

    We can legitimately discuss if the content is properly balanced against the availability of revives, I think that's fair game. But anyone who tries to make the argument that these revives were not trivial to acquire and were some kind of small reward for the high level of effort it took to get them simply did not do this themselves enough to understand just how free flowing these revives were.
    No one’s going to reward you for your sore tongue though.
  • TyphoonTyphoon Posts: 1,737 ★★★★★

    Folks, kabam is most probably reading all of this and hopefully comes up with a good compromise. Plenty of good material in here.

    All we need to do is remain constructive and ignore the common derailer. Eyes on the prize folks.

    Just curious when we will see what their response is. I think a lot of people are waiting to see what it looks like before making any sudden decisions. Not sure there’s anything left for the community to say really. Everyone has a done a great job speaking their piece.
  • firedoodfiredood Posts: 7
    Theres a group of players who try to maximise progression, non casual. This game requires a moderate to high level of commitment in time to achieve that. Between AW AQ, incursions, battlegrounds, thats already a good 2 hours a day to say the least. Add in f2p attempts to grind resources via minimalist arena? Upwards of 3hrs daily?

    Long form everest type content dictates revive usage. A solo we see on youtube is not the norm (duh). This has been mentioned several times. Anyone listening?

    So paragraph 1 = f2p demands time/commitment. Potions, seldom mentioned but grindable.

    Paragraph 2 = Everest content dictates usage of under lets say…30 revives if Kabam decides to be generous and double the cap. Failing which, players either choose to restart at a later date after recovering stash, or do Kabam’s favorite thing.

    All anyones need to do to increase revenue is make the boss or late fights so difficult that no one would wanna restart and just do Kabam’s favorite thing.
  • willrun4adonutwillrun4adonut Posts: 3,025 ★★★★★
    I would love to see their revive farming numbers from the time they made this announcement to the time the update kicks in.
This discussion has been closed.