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Iceman coldsnap immune?

Jaycray81Jaycray81 Posts: 368 ★★
in General Discussion
Why isn’t Iceman immune to coldsnap? Like wha? How does that make any sense?

Comments

  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 20,983 ★★★★★
    Wonder how many posts on this topic actually exist on here.
  • Il_JooOIl_JooO Posts: 470 ★★
    just wait for this to be closed too
  • cx23433cx23433 Posts: 465 ★★
    give it about a few hours
  • V1PER1987V1PER1987 Posts: 3,474 ★★★★★
    MasterTroller42 wrote: »
    iron man bleeds. Ghost rider can catch on fire. nothing makes sense

    Uh, Iron Man can bleed, yes. He’s a normal human being. If his suit of armor gets beat up enough or shredded, he will bleed.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 18,657 Guardian
    SpiritOfVengeance wrote: »
    It makes sense I mean it is a man who can change his body to ice so if you put coldsnap on him then he will feel cold... see how stupids it sounds he should be coldsnap immune.

    Except that's not how Iceman's powers canonically work in the comic books. Canonically Iceman subtracts molecular energy from the water molecules in a substance. "Feeling cold" is actually a side effect of his powers, not the actual effect. Because the precise mechanism Iceman uses to subtract molecular energy is not well described, it is impossible to predict what would happen if Iceman tried to subtract all of the molecular energy out of another Iceman's body. It wouldn't obviously be harmless.
    Ghost rider is on fire but you get the smarties who say yeah but it real fire it is mystical fire so basically what these people are saying is if ghost rider can get burnt by fire then if I put my hand on his flaming aura it should not burn me but do some mystical damage instead.

    Except that's not how Ghost Rider canonically works in the comic books either. If you put your hand on his flaming aura in the comic books you don't get burned and you don't take mystical damage either. Nothing happens unless Ghost Rider explicitly wills it to happen.
    The people who try to put logic into it should just stop because there was a response for ghost riders casw where a mod replied saying they would but ghost rider is balanced enough already with his set of abilities.

    So this is not about logic but it is about balance. I mean the hulk should one shot some of the champs like black widow yet they take so many hits from him.

    It is not about using logic to prove Ghost Rider should work the way he does. Logic cannot do that. It is about using logic to prove that the way other people demand him to work has no actual basis in either the comic books environment they claim to support or in the way they think physics works but doesn't.
  • Atticus9090Atticus9090 Posts: 521 ★★
    DNA3000 wrote: »
    Jaycray81 wrote: »
    Why isn’t Iceman immune to coldsnap? Like wha? How does that make any sense?

    Nothing about Iceman's abilities makes sense in the comic books either. But if you need a reason, Iceman's powers are explained in the comics as his ability to reduce the energy of water molecules. Doing so freezes them. But because Iceman's powers are not simply that he makes things cold, there's no specific reason to believe that if Iceman tried to apply that power to another Iceman it wouldn't have some damaging effect. Coldsnap might hurt most things because they are vulnerable to the cold, but even an Iceman immune to cold wouldn't necessarily be immune to Bobby Drake sucking the molecular energy out of his body.

    There's plenty enough ambiguity about how things work in the comic books to explain almost anything. There's no reason why the game should be held to a higher standard than that.

    "Science Rules" - Bill Nye
  • FR33_HUG5FR33_HUG5 Posts: 1,196 ★★★★
    MasterTroller42 wrote: »
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    Wonder how many posts on this topic actually exist on here.

    probably over 20 but most of them was closed by mods

    There are about 3 times as many “Nerf Blade” threads.

    Speaking of which, it’s been a while since we had one of those show up.
  • Username1583Username1583 Posts: 165
    DNA3000 wrote: »
    Jaycray81 wrote: »
    Why isn’t Iceman immune to coldsnap? Like wha? How does that make any sense?

    Nothing about Iceman's abilities makes sense in the comic books either. But if you need a reason, Iceman's powers are explained in the comics as his ability to reduce the energy of water molecules. Doing so freezes them. But because Iceman's powers are not simply that he makes things cold, there's no specific reason to believe that if Iceman tried to apply that power to another Iceman it wouldn't have some damaging effect. Coldsnap might hurt most things because they are vulnerable to the cold, but even an Iceman immune to cold wouldn't necessarily be immune to Bobby Drake sucking the molecular energy out of his body.

    There's plenty enough ambiguity about how things work in the comic books to explain almost anything. There's no reason why the game should be held to a higher standard than that.

    Really man, you've tried to find an explanation on why he isn't immune to his own coldsnap? Hope you work for kabam because it's really hard to find any sense at this ... LOL
    So for you Sabertooth coldsnap immune has more sense than Iceman being immune to it? Damn that sounds dumb...
  • Nick0609Nick0609 Posts: 71 ★
    because then he'd have 4 immunities which is something kabam would never do.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 18,657 Guardian
    Username1583 wrote: »
    DNA3000 wrote: »
    Jaycray81 wrote: »
    Why isn’t Iceman immune to coldsnap? Like wha? How does that make any sense?

    Nothing about Iceman's abilities makes sense in the comic books either. But if you need a reason, Iceman's powers are explained in the comics as his ability to reduce the energy of water molecules. Doing so freezes them. But because Iceman's powers are not simply that he makes things cold, there's no specific reason to believe that if Iceman tried to apply that power to another Iceman it wouldn't have some damaging effect. Coldsnap might hurt most things because they are vulnerable to the cold, but even an Iceman immune to cold wouldn't necessarily be immune to Bobby Drake sucking the molecular energy out of his body.

    There's plenty enough ambiguity about how things work in the comic books to explain almost anything. There's no reason why the game should be held to a higher standard than that.

    Really man, you've tried to find an explanation on why he isn't immune to his own coldsnap? Hope you work for kabam because it's really hard to find any sense at this ... LOL
    So for you Sabertooth coldsnap immune has more sense than Iceman being immune to it? Damn that sounds dumb...

    It is only hard if you either didn't read my post, or don't understand what it says.
  • JeniouisJeniouis Posts: 276 ★
    edited July 2019
    DNA3000 said:



    Except that's not how Iceman's powers canonically work in the comic books. Canonically Iceman subtracts molecular energy from the water molecules in a substance. "Feeling cold" is actually a side effect of his powers, not the actual effect. Because the precise mechanism Iceman uses to subtract molecular energy is not well described, it is impossible to predict what would happen if Iceman tried to subtract all of the molecular energy out of another Iceman's body. It wouldn't obviously be harmless.
    I realize this thread is super old BUT @DNA3000 Iceman doesn't necessarily have to subtract all of the molecular energy from another Iceman. He's causing a cold snap effect on himself. One can assume that in order for this effect to take place, he has to pass some water molecules to his other self. He obviously isn't passing all of himself over or else there wouldn't be a him left. So why can't Iceman subtract the molecular energy from the small amount of substance being passed to him.

    Matter of fact...why would he have to do it at all? the molecular energy has already been stripped away from when the first Iceman did it before it reached the second one. Why can't he automatically manipulate it?
    DNA3000 said:



    Except that's not how Ghost Rider canonically works in the comic books either. If you put your hand on his flaming aura in the comic books you don't get burned and you don't take mystical damage either. Nothing happens unless Ghost Rider explicitly wills it to happen.
    But if you check out his wikipedia page, fire immunity is indeed listed as one of his powers. I realize wikipedia isn't always right but...

    Not just that, his marvel wiki page says this:


    So there is a canonical argument for it.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 18,657 Guardian
    Jeniouis said:

    I realize this thread is super old BUT @DNA3000 Iceman doesn't necessarily have to subtract all of the molecular energy from another Iceman. He's causing a cold snap effect on himself. One can assume that in order for this effect to take place, he has to pass some water molecules to his other self. He obviously isn't passing all of himself over or else there wouldn't be a him left. So why can't Iceman subtract the molecular energy from the small amount of substance being passed to him.

    Matter of fact...why would he have to do it at all? the molecular energy has already been stripped away from when the first Iceman did it before it reached the second one. Why can't he automatically manipulate it?

    I don't see why it is a safe assumption to assume that for one Iceman to affect another he has to move water between them. In the comics, that isn't a requirement.
    Jeniouis said:

    But if you check out his wikipedia page, fire immunity is indeed listed as one of his powers. I realize wikipedia isn't always right but...

    Not just that, his marvel wiki page says this:


    So there is a canonical argument for it.

    As to Ghost Rider, it is true that in the comic books he's canonically immune to fire, but in the comic books he's also canonically immune to all forms of physical damage. He should also be completely immune to bullets, punches, kicks, missiles, swords, explosions, and practically all other attacks in the game. Which would be impractical in a fighting game. Also, it is canonically true that the Battlerealm universe is a completely different universe from all other Marvel realities, and subject to its own set of rules, and all the entitles within it are themselves different incarnations of the characters with different backstories and abilities. So if you accept that Ghost Rider is immune to fire because the comic books are the canonical final authority on that subject, then the Kabam developers are the canonical final authority on whether the Battlerealm version of Ghost Rider is immune to anything.
  • ẞlооdẞlооd Posts: 2,005 ★★★★
    @DNA3000
    I don't know man, the wiki straight up says he's immune to Sub-Zero temperatures. I think you're overthinking this. It's most likely just a balancing thing they were going for.

  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 18,657 Guardian
    ẞlооd said:

    @DNA3000
    I don't know man, the wiki straight up says he's immune to Sub-Zero temperatures. I think you're overthinking this. It's most likely just a balancing thing they were going for.

    Of course it is. But that's the answer to the question: why did the developers set things that way. If someone states that it doesn't make sense to do it that way, it is either reasonable to reply to that assertion, or it is unreasonable to make it in the first place.

    Also the very article you quote makes the same argument I do: Iceman doesn't make things cold, he subtracts heat. So even though Iceman is immune to subzero temperatures, that's not the same thing as saying he is immune to someone subtracting his energy from his body. They might seem the same thing casually, but they aren't actually the same thing in actual fact.
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