Symbiote Supreme Bugs

Being a proud new owner of a 6* Symbiote Supreme I've done a lot testing with him and have noticed a few bugs/issues with him:

1. When he is in "Null's Shadow" mode a well-timed block (ie. parry) is supposed to put a passive stagger on the opponent 100% of the time. Right now he is NOT placing a stagger on every parry while in this mode. My guess is that instead of being coded as an increase to 100% (as it's written on the ability) it's instead multiplying the base 15% chance by 100% making it 30%.

2. His level 3 states that it resets the timer of the current blessing and then activates all blessings. The way it works right now is that any blessing you are currently in at the time of using an L3 does NOT have it's timer reset, instead remaining at the same duration left on the timer from before the L3.

3. Not really a bug but still frustrating none the less is his short back dash. I had really hoped that the developers wouldn't intentionally put in any more champions with short back dashes but here we are again. His back dash length is not as short as Morningstar but not as long as an average champions, ending up somewhere similar to Dr.Voodoo. It doesn't impact every matchup but it makes fighting certain move sets much more difficult as his dash doesn't put him outside the reach of the enemies next attack. This leads to situations where you get cornered much faster trying to bait specials as instead of creating space the AI continues attacking. As an example for testing the general female moveset (Magik, Witch, Widow, etc.) is a prime example of this interaction.
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Comments

  • bloodyCainbloodyCain Posts: 627 ★★★
    Before I proceed I need to make the term 'Well-timed block' and 'Parry' perfectly clear.
    In this game a parry is ALWAYS a well-timed block that has stun effect on the opponent but we just call it a parry anyway.
    A well-timed block isn't always a parry because there can be a no stun involvement situation (i.e. when against a stun immune and debuff immune node).

    Based on my repeated reading of Sym Supreme's Null's Shadow ability (the blue icon), it's clearly says "Well timed blocks increase the Chance to 100%" which means a 100% to put a stagger on opponents upon a well-timed block.

    This isn't he case in the video here.
    No stagger is triggered at 0:07 of the vid. Please watch the other video in my YT channel for more example of this bug.
    So I conclude that it's a bug that need a quick fix. It would be a little lost value in his abilities if this continue to happen.

    PS: Mind you, I've tested this several times and tried to record them but my tablet doesn't do well with the apps and these 2 videos are the best I can produce ATM.






  • becauseicantbecauseicant Posts: 328 ★★★
    If you've noticed that certain active buffs aren't being removed at the start of the fight that is definitely a bug as well, however for the damage I think because it's based on genetic potential those buffs you remove immediately at the start of the fight don't do nullify damage because you start the fight at zero genetic potential. That of course means when fighting against him you shouldn't take nullify damage at the start of the fight either so unless there was some kind of node that gave him genetic potential then that's also a bug. Whoever wrote the "Dev Notes" probably misunderstood how genetic potential is used to scale his nullify damage for that blessing.

    After watching your video and doing some testing it appears that buffs that activate at the start of the fight are coded differently from champion to champion.
    Example:
    Against Unstoppable Colossus - Fight starts, Nullify notification pops up, Unstoppable removed, Mystic Dispersion procs
    Against Dr.Voodo - Fight starts, No notification, No mystic dispersion power gain, but his regen was still prevented

    It looks like Howard the Duck's 8 armors are coded the same as Dr.Voodo's regen, where they are removed "invisibly" without showing the Nullify text or triggering MD or giving you genetic potential.
  • demeddemed Posts: 71
    edited January 6
    Also isn't symbiote supreme supposed to cause bleed while set's fangs is active. I noticed that he doesn't cause bleed until after you activate special 3. Is this a bug?
  • buffajrbuffajr Posts: 222
    demed wrote: »
    Also isn't symbiote supreme supposed to cause bleed while set's fangs is active. I noticed that he doesn't cause bleed until after you activate special 3. Is this a bug?
    You need to have genetic potential
  • Hey there @becauseicant, sorry to hear about that. Would you happen to have any footage of Null's Shadow not applying a Stagger with a well-timed block or the issues you described with his SP3? If not, would you be able to let us know any specific game modes this has happened in or opponents you can remember this happening against?
  • buffajrbuffajr Posts: 222
    This is happening against all champs, in all modes. Feels like there’s a 25-50% chance, but definitely not 100%. Please fix soon as staggers are a huge part of this champions power gain and attack utilities.
  • buffajrbuffajr Posts: 222
    Yes, the placing a stagger on Nulls Shadow’s perfect blocks are still nowhere near 100%.
  • becauseicantbecauseicant Posts: 328 ★★★
    Any progress on this? I'm willing to help you get more information if you need anything else to get this fixed.
  • @Kabam Zibiit what about the initial nullify like on Howard the duck? It doesn't deal nullify damage at the start of the fight, whereas civil warrior, red skull take a huge damage at the start of the fight.
  • becauseicantbecauseicant Posts: 328 ★★★
    I'm still checking in here every few days. Probably got relegated to some list of things they need to fix but never have time to get to. Also I'm worried that whoever tested it and got "different results" doesn't understand the issue.
  • EakomoEakomo Posts: 32
    the stagger with parry i've noticed only works some of the time,
    and the issue with doctor vodoo is still a thing and is very weird
  • bloodyCainbloodyCain Posts: 627 ★★★
    So I will paraphrase what is in his description under the Null's Shadow ability. "100% chance to apply a stagger on opponent per Well-timed block/Parry".

    However, I found out that's far from true. Please follow the video link below and read the description under the video.
    But if you so choose to watch it here, the bug happened at 0:15, 0:35, 0:37.

    From 0:39 until the end, that's what should've happened for a successful well-timed block.

    PS: from his signature ability, he will apply a stagger after a certain time duration. So you will see the stagger increases when there's no well-timed block. That's of course not a bug.

  • TheSpicyKnightTheSpicyKnight Posts: 1,046 ★★★
    He needs to have some Genetic Potential for it to work
  • bloodyCainbloodyCain Posts: 627 ★★★

    He needs to have some Genetic Potential for it to work

    Nope. That's not how it works buddy
  • webtswxwebtswx Posts: 192
    he's still bugged.

    when I use sym supreme against king groot, venom, corvus, howard the duck, etc., he nullifies their buffs at the start of the fight, but doesnt inflict any damage

    interesting though, when it comes to the opposite, when I use corvus, king groot, venoma against sym supreme, I take massive amount of damage at the start of the fight

    @Kabam Miike where's the update on this?
  • webtswxwebtswx Posts: 192




    @Kabam Zibiit

    image

    0:36 - 0:50 6 parries during Null's Shadow without a single stagger

    1:03 - 1:23 Level 3 doesn't refresh active blessing

    2:35 - 2:40 2 parries during Null's Shadow don't trigger stagger

    3:00 - 3:30 Level 3 doesn't refresh active blessing

    4:25 - 4:40 2 parries during Null's Shadow don't trigger stagger

    5:00 - 5:30 Level 3 doesn't refresh active blessing



    5:51 Vs Unst. Colossus - Start of match unstoppable is nullified and damage is done (correct)

    6:14 Vs Dr.Voodoo - Start of match regen is nullified but no damage is done (bug)

    6:35 Vs Civil Warrior - Start of match armor ups are nullified and damage is done (correct)

    7:02 Vs Howard The Duck - Start of match armor ups are nullified but no damage is done (bug)

    8:02 Vs Venom - Start of match buffs are not nullified at all (bug)


    Hey there, thanks for the video! We've been taking a look into some of this and while we are still looking into some of what you mentioned, we do have some info. First, we are still investigating the issues you reported with Nullifying buffs at the start of the fight. Second, our investigations into Stagger were giving different results than what you shared in your video, but we have passed along the footage you sent in for further review.



    Lastly, in regards to refreshing the blessings on SP3, the SP3 is actually adding a new stack of each blessing, which stacks with the one that is already active. The oldest stack will expire first, but the second stack will still have the same amount of time on it as the other blessings added by the SP3, so it will be active for the same amount of time as the others. If you slow down the video from about 1:18-1:22, you can actually see this happening.



    @Kabam Zibiit what's the update on this "investigation" of yours 3 months ago, specifically nullifying buffs at the start of the fight without inflicting any damage?
  • webtswxwebtswx Posts: 192
    when I use symbiote supreme against king groot, he nullifies buffs without dealing any damage at the start of the fight, even though his description says he should



    im very baffled, so then I tested king groot against symbiote supreme, wow! he finally deals the large amount of damage at the start of the fight.




    what could be the reason for this? why is there a difference between using him on offense and meeting him on defense. it this intended to perform this way? love to hear your thoughts :)
  • webtswxwebtswx Posts: 192
    Slimeball said:

    congrats on your duped 6* sym

    thanks, im just very confused why a 6R2 sym supreme couldnt kill a 3-star king groot immediatley at the start of the fight. i remember in last year's EQ, sym supreme boss would immediately kill any buff-heavy champions, even a 5R5 corvus :#

    is this working as intended?
  • KattohSKattohS Posts: 406
    Some might say RNG. I don’t have one so I can’t read his bio.

    I experience the same thing with SW. When I’m using her all she does is weakness and power drain once the whole fight. But when I’m fighting against her I see buffs loading like crazy. And this is every fight when I’m using her. I hardly activate poison, healing, heal block, power lock, power gain or whatever.

    My brother likes using her because she gets everything activated. But for me the RNG works opposite.
  • webtswxwebtswx Posts: 192
    edited April 18
    KattohS said:

    Some might say RNG. I don’t have one so I can’t read his bio.

    I experience the same thing with SW. When I’m using her all she does is weakness and power drain once the whole fight. But when I’m fighting against her I see buffs loading like crazy. And this is every fight when I’m using her. I hardly activate poison, healing, heal block, power lock, power gain or whatever.

    My brother likes using her because she gets everything activated. But for me the RNG works opposite.


    I dont think this is a case of RNG

    his ability says 100% chance at the start of the fight to nullify all buffs and deal damage for each buff removed.

    and we can tell it's not RNG based, because in the fight against king groot, he has already nullified all fury buffs from king groot (king groot already in regeneration mode), it's just that he didnt deal any of the damage that he was supposed to based on each buff removed.
  • DrZolaDrZola Posts: 2,806 ★★★★★
    edited April 18



    So the first blessing (Chthon) has a 100% chance to nullify all buffs. That’s what you get at the fight start.

    Did KG have any buffs active at the start of the fight? What was your genetic potential? There’s that “based on Genetic Potental” clause in there.

    Dr. Zola

    EDIT: I’m guessing SS doesn’t gain any genetic potential for his initial stagger of buffs on champs. I just dueled a 5/50 4* Howard and it took me 34 hits (no specials). Seems like that ought to be one of those insanely quick fights.
  • webtswxwebtswx Posts: 192
    DrZola said:




    So the first blessing (Chthon) has a 100% chance to nullify all buffs. That’s what you get at the fight start.

    Did KG have any buffs active at the start of the fight?

    Dr. Zola

    king groot starts with two fury buffs. and you can already tell they have been nullfied, because king groot is now in regeneration.

    you can also compare when i use sym supreme vs. king groot , and when I use king groot vs. sym supreme. the difference is that one dealt damage, and the other didnt
  • DrZolaDrZola Posts: 2,806 ★★★★★
    webtswx said:

    DrZola said:




    So the first blessing (Chthon) has a 100% chance to nullify all buffs. That’s what you get at the fight start.

    Did KG have any buffs active at the start of the fight?

    Dr. Zola

    king groot starts with two fury buffs. and you can already tell they have been nullfied, because king groot is now in regeneration.

    you can also compare when i use sym supreme vs. king groot , and when I use king groot vs. sym supreme. the difference is that one dealt damage, and the other didnt
    Oh I agree with you...I’m just trying to science out why he doesn’t appear to work like he did when the AI played him. Also, I’m curious why he fails to gain Generic Potential after he nullifies the initial buffs.

    Dr. Zola
  • webtswxwebtswx Posts: 192
    DrZola said:

    webtswx said:

    DrZola said:




    So the first blessing (Chthon) has a 100% chance to nullify all buffs. That’s what you get at the fight start.

    Did KG have any buffs active at the start of the fight?

    Dr. Zola

    king groot starts with two fury buffs. and you can already tell they have been nullfied, because king groot is now in regeneration.

    you can also compare when i use sym supreme vs. king groot , and when I use king groot vs. sym supreme. the difference is that one dealt damage, and the other didnt
    Oh I agree with you...I’m just trying to science out why he doesn’t appear to work like he did when the AI played him. Also, I’m curious why he fails to gain Generic Potential after he nullifies the initial buffs.

    Dr. Zola

    i just did a little bit search. it seems that this has been a bug for a few months now.

    https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/123902/unduped-symbiote-supreme-not-nullifying-buffs

    https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/123329/symbiote-supreme-v-howard-the-duck
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