She hulks slow debuff does not deactivate the champions unstoppable

FireangleFireangle Member Posts: 10 ★
in Bugs and Known Issues
So the champion boss has the ability to activate primal fury which causes unstoppable to occure. She hulk has a counter to him with her slow debuff which stops all unstoppable effects from occuring. So I go and use my she hulk on the champion with the slow debuff and he can still activate the unstoppable. During the 100-70% this did not do much since I could attack him during this phase while the unstoppable was active, so I believed this was just a visual bug, however during the next phase once I attacked into him he stunned me but he should not be able to do so because he can not have an unstoppable active during a slow debuff so he should not be able to stun me. He had 2 linked notes as well, those were all ability effects trigger 20% more and aspect of death.


Comments

  • UnknownUnknown
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  • FireangleFireangle Member Posts: 10 ★
    edited June 2019
    UmbertoDelRio said:

    It's due to the "enhanced abilities"-node, I assume.

    You don't literally prevent unstoppable/evade with the slow-debuff. You simply reduce the chance of those effects triggering by 100%.

    Now if there's any kind of aa enhancement in play, there will still be a chance, in this case 20%, for the effect to occure.

    I would agree with you, but I have fought the champion around 10 times with the she hulk and he activated every single unstoppable buff (slow debuff applied). Not 20%.
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited June 2019
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  • UnknownUnknown
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  • WerewrymWerewrym Member Posts: 2,830 ★★★★★
    This seems odd, because She-Hulks abilities state that this debuff reduces ability accuracy of unstoppable buffs and evade by 100%. Even if Champion has increased ability accuracy 100% of anything is still 100%... Plus I've seen many people use She-Hulk on The Champion boss and her slow debuff was working just fine.
  • WerewrymWerewrym Member Posts: 2,830 ★★★★★
    UmbertoDelRio said:

    With only the node and his "champion of the universe"-effect, assuming nothing else is in play here, he should still have a 45% chance to trigger his unstoppable, when affected by a slow-debuff.

    I'm not sure where you are getting the 45% from...? Are you adding the 20% Enhanced Ability node to his 25% ability accuracy? If so that's not correct because they are two different things. One increases the rate at which his abilities trigger, the other increases the effectiveness of his abilities. However, he would not have any additional percentage chance to trigger unstoppable because She-Hulks slow buff reduces ability accuracy of his unstoppable buffs by 100%. Regardless of what numbers The Champion has for his unstoppable buffs, 100% of X will always be X.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • WerewrymWerewrym Member Posts: 2,830 ★★★★★
    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    With only the node and his "champion of the universe"-effect, assuming nothing else is in play here, he should still have a 45% chance to trigger his unstoppable, when affected by a slow-debuff.

    I'm not sure where you are getting the 45% from...? Are you adding the 20% Enhanced Ability node to his 25% ability accuracy? If so that's not correct because they are two different things. One increases the rate at which his abilities trigger, the other increases the effectiveness of his abilities. However, he would not have any additional percentage chance to trigger unstoppable because She-Hulks slow buff reduces ability accuracy of his unstoppable buffs by 100%. Regardless of what numbers The Champion has for his unstoppable buffs, 100% of X will always be X.
    I'm not sure about the node, but his "champion of the universe"-effect does increase his ability accuracy according to his spotlight.

    And the rest of what you said is simply incorrect.

    For example: An awakened voodoo on an aspect of war node will have a 200% chance to become unstoppable, when using a special, due to his 100% ability accuracy increase.
    Therefore slow debuffs don't work in that scenario. People already tried it and whether that's intended or not this is how slow-debuffs currently work. And seeing how percentages in this game aren't as easy to digest as you seem to think in several other instances, it's not that far fetched to assume this is the intended interaction.

    After all they choose to make the slow-debuff reduce the ability accuracy of unstoppable/evade by 100% instead of flat out canceling it in any given way.
    Slow debuffs don't work on aspect of war I didn't think... Also I'm just going off her description. When you are working with percentages 100% reduction means it can't happen. I've seen people take The Champion boss with She-Hulk and when he's under a slow debuff he can't proc unstoppable, doesn't matter how much ability accuracy he has.
  • Mirage_TurtleMirage_Turtle Member Posts: 1,868 ★★★★
    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    With only the node and his "champion of the universe"-effect, assuming nothing else is in play here, he should still have a 45% chance to trigger his unstoppable, when affected by a slow-debuff.

    I'm not sure where you are getting the 45% from...? Are you adding the 20% Enhanced Ability node to his 25% ability accuracy? If so that's not correct because they are two different things. One increases the rate at which his abilities trigger, the other increases the effectiveness of his abilities. However, he would not have any additional percentage chance to trigger unstoppable because She-Hulks slow buff reduces ability accuracy of his unstoppable buffs by 100%. Regardless of what numbers The Champion has for his unstoppable buffs, 100% of X will always be X.
    I'm not sure about the node, but his "champion of the universe"-effect does increase his ability accuracy according to his spotlight.

    And the rest of what you said is simply incorrect.

    For example: An awakened voodoo on an aspect of war node will have a 200% chance to become unstoppable, when using a special, due to his 100% ability accuracy increase.
    Therefore slow debuffs don't work in that scenario. People already tried it and whether that's intended or not this is how slow-debuffs currently work. And seeing how percentages in this game aren't as easy to digest as you seem to think in several other instances, it's not that far fetched to assume this is the intended interaction.

    After all they choose to make the slow-debuff reduce the ability accuracy of unstoppable/evade by 100% instead of flat out canceling it in any given way.
    Slow debuffs don't work on aspect of war I didn't think... Also I'm just going off her description. When you are working with percentages 100% reduction means it can't happen. I've seen people take The Champion boss with She-Hulk and when he's under a slow debuff he can't proc unstoppable, doesn't matter how much ability accuracy he has.
    It does. I've been able to use She Hulk's slow to prevent Aspect of War unstoppable on the path in 6.2.1
  • WerewrymWerewrym Member Posts: 2,830 ★★★★★
    Mirage_Turtle said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    With only the node and his "champion of the universe"-effect, assuming nothing else is in play here, he should still have a 45% chance to trigger his unstoppable, when affected by a slow-debuff.

    I'm not sure where you are getting the 45% from...? Are you adding the 20% Enhanced Ability node to his 25% ability accuracy? If so that's not correct because they are two different things. One increases the rate at which his abilities trigger, the other increases the effectiveness of his abilities. However, he would not have any additional percentage chance to trigger unstoppable because She-Hulks slow buff reduces ability accuracy of his unstoppable buffs by 100%. Regardless of what numbers The Champion has for his unstoppable buffs, 100% of X will always be X.
    I'm not sure about the node, but his "champion of the universe"-effect does increase his ability accuracy according to his spotlight.

    And the rest of what you said is simply incorrect.

    For example: An awakened voodoo on an aspect of war node will have a 200% chance to become unstoppable, when using a special, due to his 100% ability accuracy increase.
    Therefore slow debuffs don't work in that scenario. People already tried it and whether that's intended or not this is how slow-debuffs currently work. And seeing how percentages in this game aren't as easy to digest as you seem to think in several other instances, it's not that far fetched to assume this is the intended interaction.

    After all they choose to make the slow-debuff reduce the ability accuracy of unstoppable/evade by 100% instead of flat out canceling it in any given way.
    Slow debuffs don't work on aspect of war I didn't think... Also I'm just going off her description. When you are working with percentages 100% reduction means it can't happen. I've seen people take The Champion boss with She-Hulk and when he's under a slow debuff he can't proc unstoppable, doesn't matter how much ability accuracy he has.
    It does. I've been able to use She Hulk's slow to prevent Aspect of War unstoppable on the path in 6.2.1
    Ok, I didn't know that. Does it always work? According to She-Hulk's abilities if they have a slow debuff they should never be unstoppable.
  • Mirage_TurtleMirage_Turtle Member Posts: 1,868 ★★★★
    Werewrym said:

    Mirage_Turtle said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    With only the node and his "champion of the universe"-effect, assuming nothing else is in play here, he should still have a 45% chance to trigger his unstoppable, when affected by a slow-debuff.

    I'm not sure where you are getting the 45% from...? Are you adding the 20% Enhanced Ability node to his 25% ability accuracy? If so that's not correct because they are two different things. One increases the rate at which his abilities trigger, the other increases the effectiveness of his abilities. However, he would not have any additional percentage chance to trigger unstoppable because She-Hulks slow buff reduces ability accuracy of his unstoppable buffs by 100%. Regardless of what numbers The Champion has for his unstoppable buffs, 100% of X will always be X.
    I'm not sure about the node, but his "champion of the universe"-effect does increase his ability accuracy according to his spotlight.

    And the rest of what you said is simply incorrect.

    For example: An awakened voodoo on an aspect of war node will have a 200% chance to become unstoppable, when using a special, due to his 100% ability accuracy increase.
    Therefore slow debuffs don't work in that scenario. People already tried it and whether that's intended or not this is how slow-debuffs currently work. And seeing how percentages in this game aren't as easy to digest as you seem to think in several other instances, it's not that far fetched to assume this is the intended interaction.

    After all they choose to make the slow-debuff reduce the ability accuracy of unstoppable/evade by 100% instead of flat out canceling it in any given way.
    Slow debuffs don't work on aspect of war I didn't think... Also I'm just going off her description. When you are working with percentages 100% reduction means it can't happen. I've seen people take The Champion boss with She-Hulk and when he's under a slow debuff he can't proc unstoppable, doesn't matter how much ability accuracy he has.
    It does. I've been able to use She Hulk's slow to prevent Aspect of War unstoppable on the path in 6.2.1
    Ok, I didn't know that. Does it always work? According to She-Hulk's abilities if they have a slow debuff they should never be unstoppable.
    I wasn't sure either until I tried it. I thought I'd share.

    It seems to always work, though the champs were all cosmic champs who don't tend to have any funky ability accuracy modifiers. It may still trigger on someone like Voodoo.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • Kobster84Kobster84 Member Posts: 2,898 ★★★★★
    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    With only the node and his "champion of the universe"-effect, assuming nothing else is in play here, he should still have a 45% chance to trigger his unstoppable, when affected by a slow-debuff.

    I'm not sure where you are getting the 45% from...? Are you adding the 20% Enhanced Ability node to his 25% ability accuracy? If so that's not correct because they are two different things. One increases the rate at which his abilities trigger, the other increases the effectiveness of his abilities. However, he would not have any additional percentage chance to trigger unstoppable because She-Hulks slow buff reduces ability accuracy of his unstoppable buffs by 100%. Regardless of what numbers The Champion has for his unstoppable buffs, 100% of X will always be X.
    I'm not sure about the node, but his "champion of the universe"-effect does increase his ability accuracy according to his spotlight.

    And the rest of what you said is simply incorrect.

    For example: An awakened voodoo on an aspect of war node will have a 200% chance to become unstoppable, when using a special, due to his 100% ability accuracy increase.
    Therefore slow debuffs don't work in that scenario. People already tried it and whether that's intended or not this is how slow-debuffs currently work. And seeing how percentages in this game aren't as easy to digest as you seem to think in several other instances, it's not that far fetched to assume this is the intended interaction.

    After all they choose to make the slow-debuff reduce the ability accuracy of unstoppable/evade by 100% instead of flat out canceling it in any given way.
    Slow debuffs don't work on aspect of war I didn't think... Also I'm just going off her description. When you are working with percentages 100% reduction means it can't happen. I've seen people take The Champion boss with She-Hulk and when he's under a slow debuff he can't proc unstoppable, doesn't matter how much ability accuracy he has.
    Again, simply incorrect. No offense, but there are videos of slow-debuffs working on aow and videos of an awakened voodoo under the influence of a slow debuff still triggering the aow unstoppable.

    Now the only thing that could lead to that interaction is his ability accuracy increase.
    He gets +100% accuracy. That's a 200% for unstoppable to trigger. Minus the 100% from the slow-debuff leaves us with a tasty 100%.

    100% simply isn't the limit and there are several other instances of this. Proxima midnight for example has 200% offensive aar, while blocking. How would you explain the reason behind that?

    Back to the champion: I assume him having his "champion of the universe"-effect in play against she-hulk is unique to that fight, since she isn't on the list as far as I know.
    So when you fought him with she-hulk or spidergwen he never had those additional 25% ability accuracy. That's why you never had trouble with cancelling his unstoppable.
    Ye but for every unstoppable to activate still seems strange
  • WerewrymWerewrym Member Posts: 2,830 ★★★★★
    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    With only the node and his "champion of the universe"-effect, assuming nothing else is in play here, he should still have a 45% chance to trigger his unstoppable, when affected by a slow-debuff.

    I'm not sure where you are getting the 45% from...? Are you adding the 20% Enhanced Ability node to his 25% ability accuracy? If so that's not correct because they are two different things. One increases the rate at which his abilities trigger, the other increases the effectiveness of his abilities. However, he would not have any additional percentage chance to trigger unstoppable because She-Hulks slow buff reduces ability accuracy of his unstoppable buffs by 100%. Regardless of what numbers The Champion has for his unstoppable buffs, 100% of X will always be X.
    I'm not sure about the node, but his "champion of the universe"-effect does increase his ability accuracy according to his spotlight.

    And the rest of what you said is simply incorrect.

    For example: An awakened voodoo on an aspect of war node will have a 200% chance to become unstoppable, when using a special, due to his 100% ability accuracy increase.
    Therefore slow debuffs don't work in that scenario. People already tried it and whether that's intended or not this is how slow-debuffs currently work. And seeing how percentages in this game aren't as easy to digest as you seem to think in several other instances, it's not that far fetched to assume this is the intended interaction.

    After all they choose to make the slow-debuff reduce the ability accuracy of unstoppable/evade by 100% instead of flat out canceling it in any given way.
    Slow debuffs don't work on aspect of war I didn't think... Also I'm just going off her description. When you are working with percentages 100% reduction means it can't happen. I've seen people take The Champion boss with She-Hulk and when he's under a slow debuff he can't proc unstoppable, doesn't matter how much ability accuracy he has.
    Again, simply incorrect. No offense, but there are videos of slow-debuffs working on aow and videos of an awakened voodoo under the influence of a slow debuff still triggering the aow unstoppable.

    Now the only thing that could lead to that interaction is his ability accuracy increase.
    He gets +100% accuracy. That's a 200% for unstoppable to trigger. Minus the 100% from the slow-debuff leaves us with a tasty 100%.

    100% simply isn't the limit and there are several other instances of this. Proxima midnight for example has 200% offensive aar, while blocking. How would you explain the reason behind that?

    Back to the champion: I assume him having his "champion of the universe"-effect in play against she-hulk is unique to that fight, since she isn't on the list as far as I know.
    So when you fought him with she-hulk or spidergwen he never had those additional 25% ability accuracy. That's why you never had trouble with cancelling his unstoppable.
    I'd be interested to see these videos... It may not be the way it works, but it should be the way it works. Percentages are not additive. 100% of something will always be the entirety of that something, doesn't matter how much of it there is. My point is this may be bugged, because that's not how percentages work. Otherwise that'd be like if Namor at max sig didn't reflect all passive damage when attacking opponents even though his ability states he has a 100% chance to.
  • WerewrymWerewrym Member Posts: 2,830 ★★★★★
    In addition, there are many videos of She-Hulk fighting the champion boss in 6.2 and he does not trigger unstoppable once while under the slow debuff. This one for instance.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csL5HjaFc6k
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • FireangleFireangle Member Posts: 10 ★
    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Kobster84 said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    Werewrym said:

    UmbertoDelRio said:

    With only the node and his "champion of the universe"-effect, assuming nothing else is in play here, he should still have a 45% chance to trigger his unstoppable, when affected by a slow-debuff.

    I'm not sure where you are getting the 45% from...? Are you adding the 20% Enhanced Ability node to his 25% ability accuracy? If so that's not correct because they are two different things. One increases the rate at which his abilities trigger, the other increases the effectiveness of his abilities. However, he would not have any additional percentage chance to trigger unstoppable because She-Hulks slow buff reduces ability accuracy of his unstoppable buffs by 100%. Regardless of what numbers The Champion has for his unstoppable buffs, 100% of X will always be X.
    I'm not sure about the node, but his "champion of the universe"-effect does increase his ability accuracy according to his spotlight.

    And the rest of what you said is simply incorrect.

    For example: An awakened voodoo on an aspect of war node will have a 200% chance to become unstoppable, when using a special, due to his 100% ability accuracy increase.
    Therefore slow debuffs don't work in that scenario. People already tried it and whether that's intended or not this is how slow-debuffs currently work. And seeing how percentages in this game aren't as easy to digest as you seem to think in several other instances, it's not that far fetched to assume this is the intended interaction.

    After all they choose to make the slow-debuff reduce the ability accuracy of unstoppable/evade by 100% instead of flat out canceling it in any given way.
    Slow debuffs don't work on aspect of war I didn't think... Also I'm just going off her description. When you are working with percentages 100% reduction means it can't happen. I've seen people take The Champion boss with She-Hulk and when he's under a slow debuff he can't proc unstoppable, doesn't matter how much ability accuracy he has.
    Again, simply incorrect. No offense, but there are videos of slow-debuffs working on aow and videos of an awakened voodoo under the influence of a slow debuff still triggering the aow unstoppable.

    Now the only thing that could lead to that interaction is his ability accuracy increase.
    He gets +100% accuracy. That's a 200% for unstoppable to trigger. Minus the 100% from the slow-debuff leaves us with a tasty 100%.

    100% simply isn't the limit and there are several other instances of this. Proxima midnight for example has 200% offensive aar, while blocking. How would you explain the reason behind that?

    Back to the champion: I assume him having his "champion of the universe"-effect in play against she-hulk is unique to that fight, since she isn't on the list as far as I know.
    So when you fought him with she-hulk or spidergwen he never had those additional 25% ability accuracy. That's why you never had trouble with cancelling his unstoppable.
    Ye but for every unstoppable to activate still seems strange
    To be honest, I'd simply heavily doubt that. There should be a small chance for it to happen, but every single time is rather unlikely. Still not impossible, though.

    In general I'm arguing the way (enhanced) aa and aar work. I took OP's statement at faith value for the sake of only that.

    Out of that echo chamber I'd like to see a video.
    He pretty much activated the unstoppable buff nearly every time but not always so your explanation would make sense in this regard. And the percentage in this game is broken anyways, for example mesmerize node feels like 30% and etc. Anyways I just got through that fight and tbh your explanation makes a lot of sence, still would have preferred a better description of the node.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    You can see the slow debuff interacting with +% chance in the AW fight against Juggernaut. Slow does sometimes prevent unstoppable but not always.
    https://youtu.be/bCDU9wCh3Qo

    Also the 6.2.6 Champion has an enhanced Champion of the Universe ability which boosts the normal +% up to 65%(?). However from what I’ve seen it doesn’t come into play until the +20% AA incoming link is active.
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