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Since we are talking nerfs

Gregdagr8Gregdagr8 Posts: 380 ★★★
in General Discussion
Why has there never been a champion nerfed or tuned down for DEFENSE? Every nerf is because a champ is too powerful on offense. What about defense? You nerfed She-hulk because she was the best counter for 6.2 Champion, that's the truth, admit it or not, we all know that's why. So now you leave us with Sym Supreme and Cap IW for 6.2 Champion counters. That's it. Is that balance? That fight is complete garbage. 6.2 Sinister is complete garbage. Ghulk(with Hemdal/Angela) and Cap IW are only counters. Is that balance? In alliance war, All or Nothing Thing, 2 counters, Quake and Stark. Aegis intercept Thor Rags, Aspect of War Korg/Hype, Unstoppable buffs Jugs, ect. These are all way too overpowered defensive placements. Would you ever give us a champ that read "this champ cannot die unless the defender dexed out of your specials five times". No freaking way! That would be WAY too overpowered. This is my point. Please start looking at tuning down defensive champions. Thing, Korg, Annihilus, Havok, Modok, Spider Gwen, Wasp, DOMINO all are way too overpowered on defense. Yes I know there are counters to all of them but still these champs are too good on defense, they should be looked at getting tuned down as well. Balance!!!

Comments

  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,369 ★★★★★
    edited August 2019
    Gregdagr8 said:

    Why has there never been a champion nerfed or tuned down for DEFENSE? Every nerf is because a champ is too powerful on offense. What about defense? You nerfed She-hulk because she was the best counter for 6.2 Champion, that's the truth, admit it or not, we all know that's why. So now you leave us with Sym Supreme and Cap IW for 6.2 Champion counters. That's it. Is that balance? That fight is complete garbage. 6.2 Sinister is complete garbage. Ghulk(with Hemdal/Angela) and Cap IW are only counters. Is that balance? In alliance war, All or Nothing Thing, 2 counters, Quake and Stark. Aegis intercept Thor Rags, Aspect of War Korg/Hype, Unstoppable buffs Jugs, ect. These are all way too overpowered defensive placements. Would you ever give us a champ that read "this champ cannot die unless the defender dexed out of your specials five times". No freaking way! That would be WAY too overpowered. This is my point. Please start looking at tuning down defensive champions. Thing, Korg, Annihilus, Havok, Modok, Spider Gwen, Wasp, DOMINO all are way too overpowered on defense. Yes I know there are counters to all of them but still these champs are too good on defense, they should be looked at getting tuned down as well. Balance!!!

    She hulk can still counter the champion, it just wont be as easy. Also there are other counters you did not list such as the hood.

    In addition your 6.2 sinister list is incomplete, Captain marvel movie works there very well aswell for example. I would recommend actually figuring out counters.

    You should not call for nerfs for things when you have an incomplete understanding of them.
  • Gregdagr8Gregdagr8 Posts: 380 ★★★
    Good catch! Typing error. I meant Cap Movie instead of Cap IW as Sinister counter.
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,369 ★★★★★
    Gregdagr8 said:

    Good catch! Typing error. I meant Cap Movie instead of Cap IW as Sinister counter.

    There are actually more than captian movie, such as nebula, quake, OG vision, the last 3 with synergies.. Again you dont understand the game deeply enough to be calling for nerfs...

    Also your main premise is faulty as they have tuned down encounters before, such as the IW thanos event that they over tuned.
  • Wubbie075Wubbie075 Posts: 734 ★★★
    When did the forums every not talk about nerfs? Every time someone misses a parry there's a thread asking about the "silent nerf"
  • NeotwismNeotwism Posts: 1,803 ★★★★★
    Most of the problems listed have to due with nodes attached to defenders. That doesnt mean the defender is too overpowered. Simply adjust the nodes and the existing defenders could be beaten easily. Thats why i dont think any champion is overpowered on defense. Its the nodes that make them overpowered.
  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 20,983 ★★★★★
    Wubbie075 said:

    When did the forums every not talk about nerfs? Every time someone misses a parry there's a thread asking about the "silent nerf"

    You know what I haven't seen in a while is complaint or nerf threads about EQ bosses.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,236 ★★★★★
    Demonzfyre said:

    Wubbie075 said:

    When did the forums every not talk about nerfs? Every time someone misses a parry there's a thread asking about the "silent nerf"

    You know what I haven't seen in a while is complaint or nerf threads about EQ bosses.
    Memories of Ice Phoenix.
  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 20,983 ★★★★★
    Gregdagr8 said:

    Why has there never been a champion nerfed or tuned down for DEFENSE? Every nerf is because a champ is too powerful on offense. What about defense? You nerfed She-hulk because she was the best counter for 6.2 Champion, that's the truth, admit it or not, we all know that's why. So now you leave us with Sym Supreme and Cap IW for 6.2 Champion counters. That's it. Is that balance? That fight is complete garbage. 6.2 Sinister is complete garbage. Ghulk(with Hemdal/Angela) and Cap IW are only counters. Is that balance? In alliance war, All or Nothing Thing, 2 counters, Quake and Stark. Aegis intercept Thor Rags, Aspect of War Korg/Hype, Unstoppable buffs Jugs, ect. These are all way too overpowered defensive placements. Would you ever give us a champ that read "this champ cannot die unless the defender dexed out of your specials five times". No freaking way! That would be WAY too overpowered. This is my point. Please start looking at tuning down defensive champions. Thing, Korg, Annihilus, Havok, Modok, Spider Gwen, Wasp, DOMINO all are way too overpowered on defense. Yes I know there are counters to all of them but still these champs are too good on defense, they should be looked at getting tuned down as well. Balance!!!

    You realize there has to be some difficulty in terms of content as well right? Not everything has to be a walk in the park or have 100 champs that counter everything. All the champs you listed have lots of counters save for Thing.
  • Gregdagr8Gregdagr8 Posts: 380 ★★★
    I'm just bringing up the point that never has a champ been nerfed for defense. Why? Yes I remember Ice Phoenix and Thanos IW! I mean playable champs with their own built in abilities, not EQ champs noded up. I just think if Kabam is going to nerf champs on offense, they also need to look at nerfing champs for defense. Simple statement.
  • Gregdagr8Gregdagr8 Posts: 380 ★★★
    This is just my personal opinion. I think that every rank 5 5* champ that Kabam releases should be beatable with EVERY 3* champion in a DUEL. So no nodes, no extra HP, just a duel. If that is not possible, I do not think any champ should have that much defensive firepower. Some examples where this is not possible is Korg, Havok, and Domino. Those champs cannot be beaten with any 3* champ in a duel, you will lose taking zero hits. To me that's not balanced nor fair. So yes, I would love it if Kabam would start looking at toning down champs for defense.
  • CainCain Posts: 559 ★★
    Gregdagr8 said:

    This is just my personal opinion. I think that every rank 5 5* champ that Kabam releases should be beatable with EVERY 3* champion in a DUEL. So no nodes, no extra HP, just a duel. If that is not possible, I do not think any champ should have that much defensive firepower. Some examples where this is not possible is Korg, Havok, and Domino. Those champs cannot be beaten with any 3* champ in a duel, you will lose taking zero hits. To me that's not balanced nor fair. So yes, I would love it if Kabam would start looking at toning down champs for defense.

    Ummmm I can beat any of those with a 3* and I’m
    Not particularly great at the game.
  • NeotwismNeotwism Posts: 1,803 ★★★★★
    I disagree. Your argument would be valid if you are comparing the same class of champs. A 3* should beat a 3* and a 5* should beat a 5*. If 3* champs can beat anyone what is the point of progressing. Thats the reason they have 4*, 5*, and 6* champs. They get stronger and more powerful than the level below them. Why should any 3* be able to take out 5* champs? I dont see how that makes sense. Maybe i am missing something.
  • Gregdagr8Gregdagr8 Posts: 380 ★★★
    The point is "you will lose taking zero hits". Eventually Korg's thorns will kill you. Eventually Plasma will detonate with Havok and kill you. And eventually Domino's crit failure damage will kill you. IMO these are too overpowered defensive abilities. In a DUEL, every champ should have the chance if played correctly and properly to beat every other champion in the game. There should not be a matchup in a duel with a 100% certainty that you will lose by taking zero hits.
  • TacoScottyTacoScotty Posts: 407 ★★
    Korg can be beat in duel with any champion - I remember seeing people 2* SL a r4 or r5 5* Korg. His damage can be avoided though a lot don’t do the light intercept on him (including myself). Now place Korg on some AWD nodes and things can change up a bit. Havok / dominos don’t fall into same boat - specific counters, depending on node, are usually needed
  • TwmRTwmR Posts: 662 ★★★
    Gregdagr8 said:

    I'm just bringing up the point that never has a champ been nerfed for defense. Why? Yes I remember Ice Phoenix and Thanos IW! I mean playable champs with their own built in abilities, not EQ champs noded up. I just think if Kabam is going to nerf champs on offense, they also need to look at nerfing champs for defense. Simple statement.

    Changing md was pretty much a nerf to defence of a whole class
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 18,657 Guardian
    Gregdagr8 said:

    This is just my personal opinion. I think that every rank 5 5* champ that Kabam releases should be beatable with EVERY 3* champion in a DUEL. So no nodes, no extra HP, just a duel. If that is not possible, I do not think any champ should have that much defensive firepower.

    Well, that would explain why you think defenders are too strong.
  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 20,983 ★★★★★
    Gregdagr8 said:

    I'm just bringing up the point that never has a champ been nerfed for defense. Why? Yes I remember Ice Phoenix and Thanos IW! I mean playable champs with their own built in abilities, not EQ champs noded up. I just think if Kabam is going to nerf champs on offense, they also need to look at nerfing champs for defense. Simple statement.

    In all honesty the only real nerfs that happened were during 12.0. You call these changes to the likes of She Hulk a nerf but its not a listed ability. I get she was able to do it but doesn't mean she was supposed to. Its a fine line to tread as she's only been "playable" for a few months. No one ranked her before her buff and she was considered one of the worst in the game. So its possible they werent really aware that buffing her would result in what it did.

    After 12.0 there hasnt been any nerfs that I can recall. They changed MD but as many people who were upset, more people had been calling for changes to it forever.

    Gwenpool had a very similar changed to a unintended ability like She Hulk. Again, never part of her kit and it was extremly OP.

    AA was fixed and wasnt a nerf. Yes I know a mod confirmed it but use common sense, stun immune shouldn't be stunned.

    Drax was another change that happened but again, people ranking up a champ to fight 1 single champ had it coming. Plus none of draxs abilities ever said he could bypass astral evade.

    The fact is there isnt anyone on defense that is overly troubling. If you are having trouble, its probably your skill and not that the champ needs adjusted.

    Again, I get that people view these changes as nerfs but a true nerf was the champs of 12.0. Nothing compares to those.
  • KillerRino19KillerRino19 Posts: 370 ★★
    TacoScotty said:

    Korg can be beat in duel with any champion - I remember seeing people 2* SL a r4 or r5 5* Korg. His damage can be avoided though a lot don’t do the light intercept on him (including myself). Now place Korg on some AWD nodes and things can change up a bit. Havok / dominos don’t fall into same boat - specific counters, depending on node, are usually needed

    Also someone beat a 5* rank 5 korg with a rank 2 Havok and Seatin beat one with a rank 4 3* Magneto and someone beat a 5* Havok with a 3* Archangel so yeah it's possible to beat them with 3*, it's juat hard to do.
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