A possible solution to the unfairness of cheating, losing points and fighting in a lower tier.
Username72647
Member Posts: 387
Yes, Kabam, we all laud and extol your efforts and actions for punishing cheaters in AW. That's not the complaint. The complaint is dropping those cheaters into lower tiers, so they can steamroll legitimate alliances fighting tooth and nail in the gold and platinum brackets.
A run-in with one of these can unfairly cause hard working alliances to drop from a bracket; especially towards the end of a season.
It seems ludicrous to me there should be even more collateral damage caused by the cheaters.
I offer a solution:
Point Debt
What is point debt?
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1) It's an active and passive solution to AW cheating.
2) When an alliance is caught cheating, instead of getting points deducted, they keep their current score (maintaining their relative bracket) and the would-be point deduction is added as debt.
3) Half their points from any AW would go to paying off the debt (again, to maintain their relative bracket). Once their debt is paid off, they can start earning all their points towards their score again.
4) Any debt not paid off at the end of a season is deducted from their final score.
A run-in with one of these can unfairly cause hard working alliances to drop from a bracket; especially towards the end of a season.
It seems ludicrous to me there should be even more collateral damage caused by the cheaters.
I offer a solution:
Point Debt
What is point debt?
_______________________________
1) It's an active and passive solution to AW cheating.
2) When an alliance is caught cheating, instead of getting points deducted, they keep their current score (maintaining their relative bracket) and the would-be point deduction is added as debt.
3) Half their points from any AW would go to paying off the debt (again, to maintain their relative bracket). Once their debt is paid off, they can start earning all their points towards their score again.
4) Any debt not paid off at the end of a season is deducted from their final score.
6
Comments
Cause they get the rewards and jump over to a shell alliance and not be punished.
It's punishment. It's not meant to be negotiable. "Cheat now, pay later at your own convenience!". That's a no from me.
Whatever logic you apply it to, it equates to rationing punishment. That just incentivizes cheating more because it's a half-punishment and could easily be used at the last minute, or as a final push. I agree that mismatches as a result of reductions is an issue, but I'm certainly not in favor of negotiating punishment.
If they didn't earn their place in that Tier, they don't belong there. That's why the Rating is adjusted. They didn't earn it honestly. They're being knocked down to where they belong. That's about as just as it gets. What the real issue here is, is people aren't happy about losing to Allies that have been caught cheating. No one likes to lose.
Didn’t say you were a lowly player but you do make arguments at times that you couldn’t make if you played at the level being discussed. Play the martyr card if you like. Sometimes you’ve been charged with not being able to comment on end game unfairly. This isn’t one of those times. No one who competed in high level war could suggest that the piloting alliances demoted from master might belong in gold. Only someone who has no idea what they are talking about could suggest that as a legitimate take. Cheers
Yes, they didn’t earn it and should be demoted. No one, literally not one person disputes that. Knock them down to gold. Just don’t drop the war rating so that matchmaking puts them up against gold alliances. That punishes the gold alliances unless you are so out of touch that you think it’s reasonable to argue that the punished master groups might belong there.
We are talking about the way in which the system is broken. If Alabama got penalized by the ncaa for paying recruits, they would become bowl ineligible but they would still play an SEC schedule. What Kabam is doing is putting them in the Sun Belt, making Sun Belt teams miss Bowl Games by losing to Alabama, and then rewarding Alabama for going undefeated lol
You can debate it if you want to add to your wrongness. Matchmaking ordinarily would never let them play each other. You don’t think it’s a punishment for a 12 million alliance to play a 25 million alliance they have no chance of beating because the 25 million group cheated? And the outcome affects the rewards? Whatever man. You are talking nonsense due to your need to be right
Every Season end, we have Season Fever. People come out of the woodworks and start speaking out about the injustices of how they aren't getting ahead. I don't disagree that there's an adverse effect from altering Rating. I've also posted several suggestions to resolve the situation. However, I'm also not for the Victim Mentality. We've had our own Matches that were, in my opinion, the result of some form reduction. We fought, we either won or lost, then we moved on. That's just how the system works. If we come up agaisnt an Ally we can't beat, we fight our best, and take what Points we earn. That in and of itself is fair. The system is another subject. It's based on performance. If we lose, we still get the Points we put up. I agree on some levels, but I'm definitely not for allowing Allies to stay in the Tier they are just to make Matches easier. They cheat to get the War Rating, they deserve to lose it.
The multiplier would ruin their season as everyone in their tier earns 5-7x more point than them, but it also won’t destroy some alliance that’s on the verge of getting the next bracket (eg plat 3, very nearly plat 2) by having them match up against an alliance much too strong for them.
I'm not missing the point at all. You seem to be missing my point. They don't belong in that Tier to begin with because they cheated to get there. Removing Rating is the equivalent of losses. They shouldn't stay in it when their means of getting there was breaking the rules. The moment you allow them to stay in it, you're permitting it to happen. Certainly in part.
This seems like a sensible solution.
Cause sometimes you cannot ban the entire alliance for the actions of one person especially if they don't know who the cheater is and kabam doesn't help by stating who when they deduct points
One thing I wish Kabam would do is what steam does when they VAC ban people. Place a nice text on their profile similar to the legends badge with the number the bans on record and days since the last ban.
It seems like your idea of cheating for most of these alliances is somehow 1 guy who pilots all accounts and therefore if they lose THAT, they're no good. In reality, the reality that @LeNoirFaineant keeps bringing up to you, many cheating infractions were alliances who piloted 1 or 2 accounts and usually due to temporary absences etc. not lack of abilities or rosters.
Those alliances are plenty strong enough to get where they are and keep it. Dropping down is a massacre for all the alliances they are matched with until they, fairly quickly, work their way right back up the ladder quite undefeated on the way and leaving a trail of destruction for the lower tiers.
As far as the Olympics analogy above from @Mainer123 : That analogy is good but breaks down in this game like this...
The Olympics committee bans the American Olympics Team for cheating. When the American Team inquires for who was cheating and how, the Olympic committee says, "Sorry can't tell you", then they "Kick the MFers out of the season" as you said. That is not a fair solution either.