Summoner Sigil - Discussion Thread

Hey Summoners!

We've just announced the introduction of our brand new service, the Summoner Sigil!

The Summoner Sigil is a subscription based service that delivers a number of Bonuses, all for the introductory price of a Star-Lord’s Loot Bag (9.99 USD) every 30 days. Find all the information, and learn about our 7-Day Free Trial for all Summoners (Level 10+), over here!

Comments

Worknprogress

People would still be crying. One of the major reasons I see people want it is the gold. If they were doing enough arena to have the units to pay for it, they'd have plenty of gold. Most don't want to pay for it at all. They want it given to them.

Worknprogress

I think it would be completely fair though personally. I just don't think it would stop the overreaction to it.

TheTalents

People would still be crying. One of the major reasons I see people want it is the gold. If they were doing enough arena to have the units to pay for it, they'd have plenty of gold. Most don't want to pay for it at all. They want it given to them.

@Worknprogress they want the access. I think you're missing the point. Also, we all could use more gold and if you're anywhere near an endgame player like myself the gold they give you wouldn't even cover a month a map 6 let alone map 7. The subscription doesn't cover gold issues, its just another easier way to get gold outside of mundane arena.

DNA3000

I don't like the precedent inventory space is setting.

Some people don't but there are probably many people who do.

You can sell performance, you can sell convenience, and you can sell appearance. Inventory space is arguably a convenience item: it doesn't directly impact game performance, it affects how convenient it is to manage resources (this can have an indirect impact on performance, but it is qualitatively different than direct performance). Some people think it is okay to sell performance in small doses, but quality of life convenience benefits should be given to everyone. But there are others who feel the reverse: that all other things being equal, convenience is better to sell than performance, because convenience creates a smaller gap between those who spend and those who don't.

At the moment MCOC sells performance in different degrees for the most part. Expanding that from all performance to a mix of performance and convenience can be seen as an acknowledgement of the players who would rather see more revenue come from things other than direct performance.

Worknprogress

People would still be crying. One of the major reasons I see people want it is the gold. If they were doing enough arena to have the units to pay for it, they'd have plenty of gold. Most don't want to pay for it at all. They want it given to them.
@Worknprogress they want the access. I think you're missing the point. Also, we all could use more gold and if you're anywhere near an endgame player like myself the gold they give you wouldn't even cover a month a map 6 let alone map 7. The subscription doesn't cover gold issues, its just another easier way to get gold outside of mundane arena.

I'm sitting on 46m gold. Gold is the last ofy concerns personally. I'd definitely consider myself an endgame player as well.

TheVyrus

People would still be crying. One of the major reasons I see people want it is the gold. If they were doing enough arena to have the units to pay for it, they'd have plenty of gold. Most don't want to pay for it at all. They want it given to them.

I think you're right in both cases, but his idea is not a bad option to attempt to accommodate.
Like I stated before, I don't know if it is legal though. Governments are coming hard at gaming companies right now.

Worknprogress

I don't really care if they offer it for only cash, only units, either of them, or at all. My only point in the thread was this isn't a big deal at all regardless of how it's set to be purchased. I'll probably buy it for at least a few months to decide if it's worth it long term

Worknprogress

People would still be crying. One of the major reasons I see people want it is the gold. If they were doing enough arena to have the units to pay for it, they'd have plenty of gold. Most don't want to pay for it at all. They want it given to them.
I think you're right in both cases, but his idea is not a bad option to attempt to accommodate.
Like I stated before, I don't know if it is legal though. Governments are coming hard at gaming companies right now.

Oh if it sounded like I thought it was a bad idea I apologize. My following post was meant towards his idea in that I'd feel it was completely fair to do so as well. I just don't think it would stop a large portion of the screeching about it

Onmix

I think it would be completely fair though personally. I just don't think it would stop the overreaction to it.

To be fair, nothing short of completely free would stop the overreaction. Probably not even then.

But that argument shouldn’t stop them from using good ideas like that of TheTalents because then nothing could be implemented.

There are many of us who would understand the effort done to appeal to both sides and personally I’d be happy with any of the perks. Be it gold, inventory increase or energy. Any of them would be greatly appreciated.
(I think inventory increase is the only one that’s “warranted” but to each his own)

DNA3000

Also, we all could use more gold

Some people need gold. Some people don't need gold above what they earn normally. This is true at all levels of the game. We should be acknowledging that both groups of players exist.

Worknprogress

Also, we all could use more gold
Some people need gold. Some people don't need gold above what they earn normally. This is true at all levels of the game. We should be acknowledging that both groups of players exist.

Both groups exist but the notion of there being a gold shortage is a fallacy.

Worknprogress

I don't like arena either. That's why I open enough crystals and sell enough iso that I'll never need gold. If I wasn't able to do that, I'd just do more arena. There's an almost infinite amount of gold available in the game

Lormif

Also, we all could use more gold
Some people need gold. Some people don't need gold above what they earn normally. This is true at all levels of the game. We should be acknowledging that both groups of players exist.

The group of people who need gold is by choice, either prioritizing real life (nothing wrong with that), or just not wanting to play parts of the game that gives it.

DNA3000

Also, we all could use more gold
Some people need gold. Some people don't need gold above what they earn normally. This is true at all levels of the game. We should be acknowledging that both groups of players exist.
Both groups exist but the notion of there being a gold shortage is a fallacy.

To be precise, some players have a gold shortage. But that doesn't automatically mean the game itself doesn't have enough opportunities to earn gold.

The game can't be short of gold, because the game never runs out of gold. Only players can have shortages of anything. And that can happen because the game design doesn't contain enough opportunities to get the thing, or because some players don't take advantage of those opportunities. Or it could simply be inevitable, because when you need many different currencies simultaneously everyone is going to run out of one or the other, because that's when you must stop spending by definition.

I happen to believe the game's resource earning opportunities are fairly well balanced for the most part overall, even if there are localized oddities. But I wouldn't describe it as "gold shortages don't exist" because that would imply I was dismissing players experiencing a deficiency of those resources, however that deficiency arises.

Worknprogress

And this marks the beginning of running non-pay players out the game. It will be too hard for us to keep up

What or who are you trying to keep up with? I know at least two completely f2p players playing T1-2 war and map 7 x 5 AQ.

Both made videos saying that this in its current state changes absolutely nothing for anyone that's f2p really.

Worknprogress

Well BG talked about it in his stream. He hasn't made a video specifically about it

TheTalents

I think the issue with gold is that Kabam has created the problem with the price of rank ups. Gold was never an issue until r4 and r5 5 stars existed and its even worse with 6 stars. So players have a problem with gold not being a given anymore. Hence the "entitlement" if that's what you want to call it. I think if Kabam really wanted to appreciate the players just lower rankup cost for gold, they have been trying to make a gold a thing to profit off of in my opinion but there's enough to just wait it out whether you're a hardcore arena grinder or not. So I think gold inconvenience would be more accurate instead of a gold problem.

Webby72

And this marks the beginning of running non-pay players out the game. It will be too hard for us to keep up
What or who are you trying to keep up with? I know at least two completely f2p players playing T1-2 war and map 7 x 5 AQ.

Both made videos saying that this in its current state changes absolutely nothing for anyone that's f2p really.

The way I see this -purely speculation I will openly admit- is that they will make the deal more lucrative and pricey as time moves on, making a greater divide between f2p and p2w players. If this is the case, it does indeed mark the BEGINNING of running non-pay players out of the game.

As much as I feel it’s the wrong choice to lock specific quests and an inventory increase behind a paywall, i must admit that as it is at the minute, it’s nothing much to worry about.
It’s what it may represent that has me very worried personally

DNA3000

And this marks the beginning of running non-pay players out the game. It will be too hard for us to keep up

If it marks anything, it marks the beginning of running out of the game players that play for free but believe they are entitled to decide what the paying players are allowed to get for their money. Although it isn't so much the beginning as it is a continuation of what the game has been doing from day one.

Paying players have to decide if they are getting enough for their money. If they decide they aren't, then they will stop spending. Conversely, free players have to decide if the free experience is enough for them, relative to what paying customers get. If they don't, they won't play or won't start playing. The game has to balance the two, but everything they do will gain some and lose others. The game doesn't need everyone to agree that the free experience is good enough. It just needs enough people to agree to play the game. And honestly, people who think the free experience in MCOC is somehow bad just haven't experienced the full range of options out there.

In my opinion, free players get huge value for paying nothing when playing this game, especially compared to all other options. I think enough people would agree that the game's future isn't problematic.

Although I do spend occasionally, I would say the vast majority of my game progress has been fueled by arena grinding, which is entirely free (by fueled I mean the in-game resources I have, as opposed to things like my game playing skills or knowledge of the game which also contribute). If I hadn't spent on the game my progress would be lower than it is now for sure, but not dramatically so. It isn't actually easy to generate large amounts of progress in the game with spending, unless you spend huge sums of money which I don't. That's actually one of the things I like about the game. My place in the pecking order is primarily a product of my gameplay, not my spending. I'm never going to overtake COWhale, and I don't think I can even overtake someone like Seatin with any amount of gameplay, but I don't need to do either to enjoy playing the game.

Demonzfyre

And this marks the beginning of running non-pay players out the game. It will be too hard for us to keep up

Your like the 10th person in this thread to say this. This was said back when GMCs were released as well. Turns out F2Ps never left.

Thatweirdguy

I don't mind that they want to make money with a subscription and I don't know why people are upset about that. In a capitalist society that is perfectly acceptable. I just wish there was some better value for what they offering for end game players. I don't see anything worth the $10/month. If you are a newer player this will accelerate your development so good for you. This won't make a difference for the whales in the game.

Plantesan

I’m pretty sure someone brought this into consideration in the early pages, but was there an reason why Kabam didn’t consider going the Pokémon GO route with inventory upgrades?

but rather than units (or even put it at a high unit count) treat it like any normal unit package with a purchase limit. Thoughts?

LeNoirFaineant

And this marks the beginning of running non-pay players out the game. It will be too hard for us to keep up
Your like the 10th person in this thread to say this. This was said back when GMCs were released as well. Turns out F2Ps never left.

Honestly I find it bizarre that people think the Sigil will stop FTP from being viable. Cavalier crystals and high cost AQ maps for top rewards didn't do it, but a few extra shards and a gold quest is going to? I don't see how this affects FTP players in any way whatsoever. Much ado about nothing.

GroundedWisdom

That one puzzles me too. I mean, I understand that people take a certain amount of pride in growing without spending, but this gap is a bit of a misnomer. People who spend more will grow faster. There's really no getting around that. That doesn't mean F2P will be edged out of the game, or that progress isn't possible for free. We all grow, spending or not. Whales grow faster. No getting around that, and it's not possible to keep up with that. This whole competition between F2P and spending is foreign to me.

Demonzfyre

And this marks the beginning of running non-pay players out the game. It will be too hard for us to keep up
Your like the 10th person in this thread to say this. This was said back when GMCs were released as well. Turns out F2Ps never left.
Honestly I find it bizarre that people think the Sigil will stop FTP from being viable. Cavalier crystals and high cost AQ maps for top rewards didn't do it, but a few extra shards and a gold quest is going to? I don't see how this affects FTP players in any way whatsoever. Much ado about nothing.

I can't make the connection either. Out of everything you can pay for in this game, this is what makes them quit? All I see is just empty threats.

Worknprogress

Yep. I think it's beyond silly to get upset about. What puts a bigger gap between myself and someone f2p, some extra gold I don't need and being able to hold a few more items that won't expire or the 51 6*s and 128 5*s I have that a very large percentage were obtained through cav crystals?

DNA3000

I don't mind that they want to make money with a subscription and I don't know why people are upset about that. In a capitalist society that is perfectly acceptable. I just wish there was some better value for what they offering for end game players. I don't see anything worth the $10/month. If you are a newer player this will accelerate your development so good for you. This won't make a difference for the whales in the game.

This seems to synonymize end game players and whales. I'm more or less an end game player, but not really a whale. The value in the sub would help me some, but not as much as it would an up and coming player. I think in and of itself that's perfectly reasonable. It also helps low spenders proportionately more than whales. I think that's not just reasonable, but desirable.

GroundedWisdom

I mean, if I stretched I suppose I could see the Market and the discounted Features for that argument, but that amount doesn't even compare to the already-present gap. I don't even think the gap is something people should focus on. Can't compare to someone spending that much no matter how hard you try.

Stellar

24 pages of comments and apart editions of some comments by a moderator, there are no "official" comment from Kabam.
So it looks like a "let them comment, whatever they say we have already decided"

Demonzfyre

24 pages of comments and apart editions of some comments by a moderator, there are no "official" comment from Kabam.
So it looks like a "let them comment, whatever they say we have already decided"

They commented on the very first or 2nd pages..... Kabam Miike is as official as it gets. Others are just the admins while Miike is the bridge between the forums and Kabam.