Domino Massacre Synergy changes with Limber nodes

I am running V24.1.6 and I have noticed a very significant change to how Domino with the Massacre synergy interacts with limber. The synergy extends all of Dominos debuffs by +1 seconds. With limber nodes, stuns (including parries) would be reduced by the appropriate percent each time one is inflicted and the +1 seconds are then added to the time. This would ensure that you always had enough time with that 1 second stun to land both hits of you heavy attack for the duration of the stun. This allowed Domino to gain the bonus attack from landed hits with the heavy while stunned which gave a significant damage increase, especially when applied with Red Hulk synergy as well. This also gives infinite stuns no matter how many you use because you always have 1 second of stun duration.

I have very recently noticed that the +1 seconds are being counted before limber is applied, eventually reducing stun time to basically 0. This is a major change to Domino both in damage and utility. I was affected in Alliance War when I was using Domino (5 star 5/65 unduped) with Red Hulk (5 star 4/55 sig 20) and Massacre (4 star 5/50 sig 17). This change cause me to die against Nightcrawler on node 48 in a Tier 4 war (20% Limber) because I ran out of parries (which I did not expect to happen)

This is really a serious issue for me as I use Domino to clear a lot of content. This reduces a significant amount of her use and I also was not aware of change being made to the character prior to it being implemented

I am on a Samsung Galaxy S9, Android Version 9, Game Version 24.1.6

Comments

unknown

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Lormif

There are multiple types of limbers. There are limbers that reduce it by 10%, 20% AND by .10 seconds and .20 seconds.

Dominos synergy with massacre works on all of them, to an extent. On the ones with a % decrease, the first 2 above, domino will always have a tleast 1 second to perform the heavy because no matter how many times you perform a stun limber CANNOT drop the time below 0 seconds.

On the second set, the ones that drop the stun by a number of seconds the massacre will work, in that it will add time, but only to the point where the time from the stun goes so far into the negatives that it does not matter. For example using the .20 drop, you will have at most 10 parries before you are stuck with 1 second with massacre , after 15 parries you will be at 0 and so on.

This was not a chance to the character, and not even a change to the nodes, these have generally always been there, but the flat time reduction does seem to be used more now.

Str

There are multiple types of limbers. There are limbers that reduce it by 10%, 20% AND by .10 seconds and .20 seconds.

Dominos synergy with massacre works on all of them, to an extent. On the ones with a % decrease, the first 2 above, domino will always have a tleast 1 second to perform the heavy because no matter how many times you perform a stun limber CANNOT drop the time below 0 seconds.

On the second set, the ones that drop the stun by a number of seconds the massacre will work, in that it will add time, but only to the point where the time from the stun goes so far into the negatives that it does not matter. For example using the .20 drop, you will have at most 10 parries before you are stuck with 1 second with massacre , after 15 parries you will be at 0 and so on.

This was not a chance to the character, and not even a change to the nodes, these have generally always been there, but the flat time reduction does seem to be used more now.

What a great and detailed reply.

arni2

It’s the order that kabam apply the duration increase.
In flat numbers the order is (starting with 1 second for example):
1. Deduct 0.2 seconds from the current number
2. Add one second from the sinergy
3. If negative number round to 0.

This is wrong behavior in my opinion, They should round the number to 0 if it’s negative and then add the synergy

Lormif

It’s the order that kabam apply the duration increase.
In flat numbers the order is (starting with 1 second for example):
1. Deduct 0.2 seconds from the current number
2. Add one second from the sinergy
3. If negative number round to 0.

This is wrong behavior in my opinion, They should round the number to 0 if it’s negative and then add the synergy

They do not round to 0 for any aspect before applying synergies, so why should they now? Everything in this game can go into the negatives AA is one of the greatest examples of this, shoot in many cases dots can go so far into the negatives they start healing you

arni2

They also shouldn’t go to negative numbers....

Lormif

They also shouldn’t go to negative numbers....

*why*

arni2

They also shouldn’t go to negative numbers....
*why*

Really? Stun in negative number? -10 seconds of stun? This is development laziness. There should be a common sense and logic while developing interaction (something that I did as a developer)

Lormif

They also shouldn’t go to negative numbers....
*why*
Really? Stun in negative number? -10 seconds of stun? This is development laziness. There should be a common sense and logic while developing interaction (something that I did as a developer)

It is common sense and logical, when you take something past zero it goes into negative. This is taken into account with the abilities. Again everything goes into negatives, if it did not all the abilities would have to be reworked to take that into account.

unknown

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Thesurvivlist

How is a stun even a stun anymore if it is in the negative? This dude is another groundedwisdom. Can’t you guys just go away for just one day?

Even though it logic? like whats 1 - 2? it's -1, that logic applies to this aswell.

Lormif

How is a stun even a stun anymore if it is in the negative? This dude is another groundedwisdom. Can’t you guys just go away for just one day?

it goes into the negative and is then rounded up to zero at the end of the calculation, how is that difficult to understand? Eventually on a flat negative you will reach the point where the defender is effectively immune. I realize you may not like the answer, but that does not make my answer incorrect.

arni2

@Lormif I read your answer regarding the % and it seems incorrect. If Kabam applies % like the do static value, you also shouldn’t have constant 1 second.
Let’s have an example.
I have 1 second stun as a base parry.
Apply 1 second from synergy and then deduct 20%
now the new base time is 1-0.4 = 0.6 seconds

At the end, you will reach to a very low number and the time will be:
~0 + 1 = 1 (first add sinergy)
20% of 1 (then the node)
The timer will be 0.48 seconds, but I did the count and it's second.

What did I missed?

Lormif

@Lormif I read your answer regarding the % and it seems incorrect. If Kabam applies % like the do static value, you also shouldn’t have constant 1 second.
Let’s have an example.
I have 1 second stun as a base parry.
Apply 1 second from synergy and then deduct 20%
now the new base time is 1-0.4 = 0.6 seconds

At the end, you will reach to a very low number and the time will be:
~0 + 1 = 1 (first add sinergy)
20% of 1 (then the node)
The timer will be 0.48 seconds, but I did the count and it's second.

What did I missed?

The calculation for the % based is this (assuming 20% reduction):

(2 * .80^n ) + 1 (domino/mass synergy)

the left part is recursive, every time you parry or stun another .80 is multiplied so n is incremented all the way to infinity. As n approaches infinity the left side will approach 0 but never reach it.

The right side is static so it will always add to whatever is on the left side, so even at n=infinity the equation will equal 1.

The equation is slightly different for the -.20, it is :

(2 - .2n) +1

In this case as in approaches infinity your left side approaches negative infinity.

Cassy

When negativ values would be exspelled from the game, negative healing would no longer work for void or via masteries for example.