She-Hulk Heavy Speed Bug Fix [Title Edited for Clarity]

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Comments

  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 8,901 Guardian
    Nomad22 said:

    Sorry to be THAT guy...but those that ranked she hulk got what they needed and should not be given any compensation unless they are made to do 6.2.6 over again.

    This presumes the problem is with that one fight alone. And I'm sure there are a lot of people who believe RDTs are justified for that one fight alone. But if it was just that one fight alone, I would have argued against them. In my opinion RDTs are only justified as a remedy of last resort, when players should be allowed to reverse a rank up decision that was made under unfair conditions. If the game changes organically due to evolution or changing game balance requirements, those are changes the players simply have to roll with. You're told ahead of time such changes can happen. But in this case the players were implicitly told She Hulk's combo mechanics were working correctly, and she was given abilities that played into those mechanics when she was updated explicitly to drive interest in the champion. That's what makes the decision circumstances unfair, and why the only reasonable remedy is to allow players to reconsider that decision.
  • ZuroZuro Posts: 1,717 ★★★★
    thudd22 said:

    I am happy about the rank down ticket news, but I am still curious about those of us that used an awakening gem on her... I took her up to r5 and didn’t want to leave her unduped, because you may as well have your strongest champs at their best... but I will now be taking her back down and would hope there is a way to rectify this as well... thoughts?

    That's tuff
  • ZuroZuro Posts: 1,717 ★★★★

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 2,596 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    Nomad22 said:

    Sorry to be THAT guy...but those that ranked she hulk got what they needed and should not be given any compensation unless they are made to do 6.2.6 over again.

    This presumes the problem is with that one fight alone. And I'm sure there are a lot of people who believe RDTs are justified for that one fight alone. But if it was just that one fight alone, I would have argued against them. In my opinion RDTs are only justified as a remedy of last resort, when players should be allowed to reverse a rank up decision that was made under unfair conditions. If the game changes organically due to evolution or changing game balance requirements, those are changes the players simply have to roll with. You're told ahead of time such changes can happen. But in this case the players were implicitly told She Hulk's combo mechanics were working correctly, and she was given abilities that played into those mechanics when she was updated explicitly to drive interest in the champion. That's what makes the decision circumstances unfair, and why the only reasonable remedy is to allow players to reconsider that decision.
    No one was ever told that she should be able to chain a heavy from combo. Not once.

    There are multiple instances however where people were told, by kabam, that either a champion or a champion/mastery interaction was working as intended. That was then changed later and no one was given the opportunity to reconsider anything.

    Again, I'm not upset at people being able to rank SH down but please do not even act like this is "fair". This coming about bc more people and more prominent people got riled up about it unlike the other past changes. They got worried about the backlash with all the hype floating around. Of all the changes they made that affected champion performance this was actually the least deserving of RDT in my opinion. She was acting outside stated abilities in a unique way that very few champions can. The past changes were made to things that were actually stated to be working as intended and yet absolutely no one was given a chance to reconsider anything.

    I'm happy for the people that get to bring her down but please do not even act like this was warranted when taking previous actions into account. This was flat out damage control bc they got nervous
  • Wisdom_of_DoomWisdom_of_Doom Posts: 11
    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    But she wasn't supposed to be able to do that so they fixed her.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 8,901 Guardian
    DrZola said:

    DNA3000 said:

    DrZola said:

    But I find your first paragraph implausible. Why?

    Because there’s almost certainly a process for triaging bug fixes, which is what we’ve been told, more or less, in these forums. It seems odd to think that coders just take a look at the list of known and unknown issues and pick a random bug to fix without someone deciding the ones that take priority over others. And if chaining heavies at the end of a combo was a big game issue, this would likely have been a global fix, not a champ-specific one.

    And notice it wasn't a global fix or announced as one. All the announcement says is: She-Hulk: Fixed an issue where she could Combo into a Heavy Attack.

    The announcement reads like this was a little tweak to She Hulk. Which it might have been to the person who worked on it.
    Fair point. But I think it’s all moot right now. Just logged in to see there’s some sort of news.

    Dr. Zola
    I suppose it is moot for the players who wanted a remedy for the She Hulk change, but to be honest I think the question of how these kinds of changes are managed is the more important long term question. I would set She Hulk on fire if it meant we got a proper bug tracking process in place. Something about how the workflow happens made the left hand unaware of the right hand: someone at Kabam was changing a She Hulk behavior literally at the exact moment someone else at Kabam was congratulating a player for using that behavior. That's the kind of problem that will come back to haunt us if we just hand out a bunch of RDTs and move on.
  • ZuroZuro Posts: 1,717 ★★★★

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    But she wasn't supposed to be able to do that so they fixed her.
    How are we supposed to know that it wasn't intended like it's been out for 3 years without a problem
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 2,596 ★★★★★
    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    But she wasn't supposed to be able to do that so they fixed her.
    How are we supposed to know that it wasn't intended like it's been out for 3 years without a problem
    It wasn't a problem until she got buffed and that's blatantly obvious to anyone why.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 8,901 Guardian

    I'm happy for the people that get to bring her down but please do not even act like this was warranted when taking previous actions into account. This was flat out damage control bc they got nervous

    I gave my arguments for why this situation is different in my opinion extensively in this thread. If you want to argue that Kabam is only doing this because of the level of complaints, feel free to try to make that case in the face of the fact that the majority of the time when complaints are this high or even higher Kabam sticks to their guns and doesn't reverse their decisions.

    But regardless, when I say it is warranted that's because it is my judgment that they are warranted. I don't speak for Kabam or claim to know with certainty why they make the decisions they make. I can only judge if a decision is reasonable, not if it was made for reasonable reasons.
  • ZuroZuro Posts: 1,717 ★★★★

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    But she wasn't supposed to be able to do that so they fixed her.
    How are we supposed to know that it wasn't intended like it's been out for 3 years without a problem
    It wasn't a problem until she got buffed and that's blatantly obvious to anyone why.
    And? It's still dumb how as soon as a champ gets good they begin to focus on these type of thInga like if this was never intended why do nothing to fix it until now when she is buffed I wouldnt be surprised if they do the same with OML
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 2,596 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    I'm happy for the people that get to bring her down but please do not even act like this was warranted when taking previous actions into account. This was flat out damage control bc they got nervous

    I gave my arguments for why this situation is different in my opinion extensively in this thread. If you want to argue that Kabam is only doing this because of the level of complaints, feel free to try to make that case in the face of the fact that the majority of the time when complaints are this high or even higher Kabam sticks to their guns and doesn't reverse their decisions.

    But regardless, when I say it is warranted that's because it is my judgment that they are warranted. I don't speak for Kabam or claim to know with certainty why they make the decisions they make. I can only judge if a decision is reasonable, not if it was made for reasonable reasons.
    I can't remember the last time complaints were this high about a champion change honestly. 6.2 is probably the closest thing but that's quest content. They're not going to redesign and entire chapter unless just absolutely no one plays it.

    You honestly think this change warrants a reversal more than the changes like AA and MD/defenders after they were flat out stated to be working correctly? The SH chain was not one single time confirmed to be intended and yet here we are. I just think it's funny that unless enough of or the right youtubers get bent out of shape about a champion change and it affects you, you're screwed. Otherwise I don't particularly care one way or the other. 4 t2a back from dormammu isn't going to do much of anything for me these days. I just find the whole thing funny.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 8,901 Guardian

    You honestly think this change warrants a reversal more than the changes like AA and MD/defenders after they were flat out stated to be working correctly?

    If I keep asking you if you honestly believe this change doesn't warrant a reversal over and over again, approximately how many repetitions would it take to change your mind?
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 2,596 ★★★★★
    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    But she wasn't supposed to be able to do that so they fixed her.
    How are we supposed to know that it wasn't intended like it's been out for 3 years without a problem
    It wasn't a problem until she got buffed and that's blatantly obvious to anyone why.
    And? It's still dumb how as soon as a champ gets good they begin to focus on these type of thInga like if this was never intended why do nothing to fix it until now when she is buffed I wouldnt be surprised if they do the same with OML
    There's good and there's infinitely cornering a LoL fight with a 3* champ to take them out broken. Trying to justify how she was working is pretty ridiculous honestly.
  • AryannaAryanna Posts: 75
    Where does this end? The game has countless other bugs that favour Kabam'd bottom line but aren't addressed. You're going to have to give rank down tickets to every champ you "fix a bug" down the road. If you have actually skilled testers to test champs and content you wouldn't need to always have to "balance" the game out (aka nerf abilities and champs that doesn't help the bottom line)
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 2,596 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    You honestly think this change warrants a reversal more than the changes like AA and MD/defenders after they were flat out stated to be working correctly?

    If I keep asking you if you honestly believe this change doesn't warrant a reversal over and over again, approximately how many repetitions would it take to change your mind?
    And again, I don't have a problem with them giving RDT for this. I just think it's pretty sad that people weren't given the same option for previous changes that on paper were far more deserving. They just didn't have the right people crying about them apparently
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 2,596 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    You honestly think this change warrants a reversal more than the changes like AA and MD/defenders after they were flat out stated to be working correctly?

    If I keep asking you if you honestly believe this change doesn't warrant a reversal over and over again, approximately how many repetitions would it take to change your mind?
    Also I'm not going to read through this entire thread to find everything you said here. I didn't care about she hulk before they announced the change and I don't care about her still.

    I do care about the inconsistency that happens with these situations though so I came in here when the reversal was announced.
  • ZuroZuro Posts: 1,717 ★★★★

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    But she wasn't supposed to be able to do that so they fixed her.
    How are we supposed to know that it wasn't intended like it's been out for 3 years without a problem
    It wasn't a problem until she got buffed and that's blatantly obvious to anyone why.
    And? It's still dumb how as soon as a champ gets good they begin to focus on these type of thInga like if this was never intended why do nothing to fix it until now when she is buffed I wouldnt be surprised if they do the same with OML
    There's good and there's infinitely cornering a LoL fight with a 3* champ to take them out broken. Trying to justify how she was working is pretty ridiculous honestly.
    You say that like she can corned everything in the game SL just happens to have a easy sp1 to counter while others do not just like everyone else she has a fair share of weakness and her being a three star is not relevant at all
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,523 ★★★★★
    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    I didn't debate how others feel. I explained how I felt. Tickets are counterintuitive to the game. That's just my view.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 2,596 ★★★★★
    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    But she wasn't supposed to be able to do that so they fixed her.
    How are we supposed to know that it wasn't intended like it's been out for 3 years without a problem
    It wasn't a problem until she got buffed and that's blatantly obvious to anyone why.
    And? It's still dumb how as soon as a champ gets good they begin to focus on these type of thInga like if this was never intended why do nothing to fix it until now when she is buffed I wouldnt be surprised if they do the same with OML
    There's good and there's infinitely cornering a LoL fight with a 3* champ to take them out broken. Trying to justify how she was working is pretty ridiculous honestly.
    You say that like she can corned everything in the game SL just happens to have a easy sp1 to counter while others do not just like everyone else she has a fair share of weakness and her being a three star is not relevant at all
    It's definitely relevant bc feel free to find me the videos of the plethora of other 3* champs doing it.

    Defending that mechanic is just silly honestly. I'm not going to keep beating a dead horse bc that's done now and arguing about it is pointless. I feel that expecting that mechanic to stay in the game was beyond naive and ranking her up for it was foolish. I'm usually not a fan of foolish behavior being rewarded but here we are. I'm happy for those that get to make the change bc I've been in the same situation and didn't get that chance (even though I still feel those were far more warranted). Im glad they changed her and I'm glad that people get another chance with their rank materials. Im just yet again disappointed in the people that run this game
  • ZuroZuro Posts: 1,717 ★★★★

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    I didn't debate how others feel. I explained how I felt. Tickets are counterintuitive to the game. That's just my view.
    They maybe be counterintuitive for the most part but not for this situation as it was advertised that SH can do this by the community which led some to rank her up and when this is taken away it makes them feel scammed so the right thing to do would to be given the choice to reverse the rank up
  • DrZolaDrZola Posts: 2,825 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    DrZola said:

    DNA3000 said:

    DrZola said:

    But I find your first paragraph implausible. Why?

    Because there’s almost certainly a process for triaging bug fixes, which is what we’ve been told, more or less, in these forums. It seems odd to think that coders just take a look at the list of known and unknown issues and pick a random bug to fix without someone deciding the ones that take priority over others. And if chaining heavies at the end of a combo was a big game issue, this would likely have been a global fix, not a champ-specific one.

    And notice it wasn't a global fix or announced as one. All the announcement says is: She-Hulk: Fixed an issue where she could Combo into a Heavy Attack.

    The announcement reads like this was a little tweak to She Hulk. Which it might have been to the person who worked on it.
    Fair point. But I think it’s all moot right now. Just logged in to see there’s some sort of news.

    Dr. Zola
    I suppose it is moot for the players who wanted a remedy for the She Hulk change, but to be honest I think the question of how these kinds of changes are managed is the more important long term question. I would set She Hulk on fire if it meant we got a proper bug tracking process in place. Something about how the workflow happens made the left hand unaware of the right hand: someone at Kabam was changing a She Hulk behavior literally at the exact moment someone else at Kabam was congratulating a player for using that behavior. That's the kind of problem that will come back to haunt us if we just hand out a bunch of RDTs and move on.
    I can second that. There’s little as frustrating as trying to inform the game team about a bug—not a “my crystal gave a bad champ” bug—but a bug like my combo just now getting interrupted in mid-stream via special by Var3 3.1 Colossus bug.

    First you get ignored. You might get a “provide more info” message. Then—if you’re lucky—you get a “looking into it” or possibly a “can’t duplicate it” message. Weeks pass. Threads get bumped, posts get deleted and warnings get issued. One day maybe, just maybe, someone notices and decides it’s worth it to fix.

    That’s the basic routine. And that doesn’t even consider trying to file a ticket, which only a masochist could enjoy.

    So yeah...that part wouldn’t be moot, would it?

    Dr. Zola
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 8,901 Guardian

    DNA3000 said:

    You honestly think this change warrants a reversal more than the changes like AA and MD/defenders after they were flat out stated to be working correctly?

    If I keep asking you if you honestly believe this change doesn't warrant a reversal over and over again, approximately how many repetitions would it take to change your mind?
    Also I'm not going to read through this entire thread to find everything you said here. I didn't care about she hulk before they announced the change and I don't care about her still.

    I do care about the inconsistency that happens with these situations though so I came in here when the reversal was announced.
    RDTs aren't going to be consistently applied because RDTs are a remedy of last resort: by definition they are going to be decided on a case by case basis. There's a thought process of considering what prompts the change, is the change indicative of an unfair player choice, and are there any reasonable reasons why the change should have been anticipated.

    Which I went through in detail throughout the thread, but especially here, here, and very especially here.
  • Bear3Bear3 Posts: 996 ★★★
    Saying she wasn’t supposed to be able to do that so it’s a bug is just stupid. It’s been that way for over 3 years and kabam showed her using the technique in the strategies for champion boss, so they were well aware. They decided to change it because the cash grab boss was losing cash... really can’t call it a bug after 3 years where she’s clearly always been able to do that... or if you wanna call it a bug tough cookies, you created her bugged you missed the boat on fixing it years ago. Amazing how things don’t get fixed until it’s allowing people to complete difficult content.... before that it’s all good.

    🐻
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 8,901 Guardian

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    I didn't debate how others feel. I explained how I felt. Tickets are counterintuitive to the game. That's just my view.
    As far as I'm aware, the game doesn't possess intuition.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,523 ★★★★★
    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Zuro said:

    Well, I'm glad people are happy. I'm still against Tickets on principle, but I'm glad they decided to alleviate peoples' concerns. I just hope it doesn't start another kamikaze of Ticket requests. Lol.

    When you actually start ranking max champs and taking on difficult content you’ll likely have a better understanding of why this is upsetting.
    Smooth dig. However, my view doesn't change regardless of the Rank. I'm aware of why people are upset. I don't agree with Tickets in general. They're counterproductive. The point is to progress by Ranking everything and anything you can. It all goes into growth for me. Every Ticket we received I used for SA or Level-Up.
    And you can still be ranking everything with the resources you get from ranking down SH
    Still counterproductive IMO. You make choices, you move on. That's my motto.
    And people made the choice to rank up SH because of the heavy chain but now it's gone they feel cheated
    I didn't debate how others feel. I explained how I felt. Tickets are counterintuitive to the game. That's just my view.
    They maybe be counterintuitive for the most part but not for this situation as it was advertised that SH can do this by the community which led some to rank her up and when this is taken away it makes them feel scammed so the right thing to do would to be given the choice to reverse the rank up
    I don't agree with Tickets in general. I wish they had never been introduced. Lol. There's no need to try and sell me on this instance. I respect that they chose to give people the option. I'm not agruing against this case. All I said was I'm against Tickets on principle. I'm for people living with whatever choices they made in whatever direction the game goes, and that's not going to change. I can appreciate that they thought it was fitting. I'm not even arguing they shouldn't have done it. That's their choice, and I already said I'm glad people are happy with the resolution. In general, they're a curse. They go against a number of internal systems, and we never hear the end of them. I'm not petitioning against them. Just stating my view.
  • Rougeknight87Rougeknight87 Posts: 535 ★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    You honestly think this change warrants a reversal more than the changes like AA and MD/defenders after they were flat out stated to be working correctly?

    If I keep asking you if you honestly believe this change doesn't warrant a reversal over and over again, approximately how many repetitions would it take to change your mind?
    And again, I don't have a problem with them giving RDT for this. I just think it's pretty sad that people weren't given the same option for previous changes that on paper were far more deserving. They just didn't have the right people crying about them apparently
    It is sad but nothing can be done about it now, like I’ve heard you say kabam has been terrible in communicating in the past so chalk this up as a step forward. They can’t change anything that’s been done but going forward if this means improved dialogue and improved relations then hopefully we can avoid it in the future.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 2,596 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    DNA3000 said:

    You honestly think this change warrants a reversal more than the changes like AA and MD/defenders after they were flat out stated to be working correctly?

    If I keep asking you if you honestly believe this change doesn't warrant a reversal over and over again, approximately how many repetitions would it take to change your mind?
    Also I'm not going to read through this entire thread to find everything you said here. I didn't care about she hulk before they announced the change and I don't care about her still.

    I do care about the inconsistency that happens with these situations though so I came in here when the reversal was announced.
    RDTs aren't going to be consistently applied because RDTs are a remedy of last resort: by definition they are going to be decided on a case by case basis. There's a thought process of considering what prompts the change, is the change indicative of an unfair player choice, and are there any reasonable reasons why the change should have been anticipated.

    Which I went through in detail throughout the thread, but especially here, here, and very especially here.
    You say that AA's unintended passive stun broke certain content designs but yet it was stated to be working as intended when it was brought up. Then it was changed later. How does that not warrant someone being able to reconsider a rank up while this interaction based solely on assumptions does is what confuses me?

    I'm legitimately just curious about the thought process behind this at this point. If something is stated to be functioning as intended in black and white and then changed after the fact, how does that not if anything justify people being able to reconsider a rank up?
  • Incitatus666Incitatus666 Posts: 191
This discussion has been closed.