Would you consider Symbiote Supreme to be a top tier champ?

Legendary_Poey

Recently had discussions about Symbiote Supreme in my alliance. Interested to see what others think. I wouldn't consider him top tier because he doesn't have the same versatility as the best mystics (Doom, Claire, Sorcerer Supreme, Magik). I think he is great given the right conditions, but those conditions often aren't met in endgame content.

ŁŤÇ

Yes

On a buff heavy champ, he's probably the best.

But those you mentioned can do a lot on everyone.

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simolaz

Yes

He is the best choice against buffs.

Etjama

Yes

He handles champs with even just 1 recurring buff better than any other champ in the game.

Legendary_Poey

Primerprime5 said:

The only "condition" he needs is opponents who aren't Bleed immune, his Staggers still feed his Genetic Potential. The key to applying the Staggers is to backdraft in Chtlon's Cunning (to trigger Dexterity) and Parry in Null's Shadow (to gain the 50% chance to Stagger.) He's not as good as the above-mentioned Champs, but better than most other Mystics.

Seems we have a different opinion on what "top tier" is. I think he is good just not on that next level that I consider the top tier.

ThatGuyYouSaw235

Yes

If it can be nullified, he will kill it. Also Longshot.


#GamersAgainstElsa

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Legendary_Poey

Primerprime5 said:

Legendary_Poey said:

Primerprime5 said:

The only "condition" he needs is opponents who aren't Bleed immune, his Staggers still feed his Genetic Potential. The key to applying the Staggers is to backdraft in Chtlon's Cunning (to trigger Dexterity) and Parry in Null's Shadow (to gain the 50% chance to Stagger.) He's not as good as the above-mentioned Champs, but better than most other Mystics.

Seems we have a different opinion on what "top tier" is. I think he is good just not on that next level that I consider the top tier.

By your definition, Champs like Longshot, Dragon Man, Doctor Voodoo, etc. are all not top-tier, but I see them destroy content on a regular basis. They're all versatile and extremely potent, just in their own way.

Yeah I wouldn't consider those champs top tier either, I still consider them rank up worthy and useful champs though. Top tier, in my opinion, is only the best of the best.

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Papdichaat

Yes

Symb supreme is definitely top tier along with doom, Clair, sorcerer. It’s just that you hear more people talking about these champs and symb supreme kinda goes under the radar. He is still the best champ for a fight where the defender has buffs.

Doom is more likely to be taken into a team of 5 just because he is more versatile. He doesn’t need to nullify or stagger buffs to be good.

In conclusion, symb supreme is the best at what he/she/it does, therefore making symb top tier

Legendary_Poey

Primerprime5 said:

Legendary_Poey said:

Primerprime5 said:

Legendary_Poey said:

Primerprime5 said:

The only "condition" he needs is opponents who aren't Bleed immune, his Staggers still feed his Genetic Potential. The key to applying the Staggers is to backdraft in Chtlon's Cunning (to trigger Dexterity) and Parry in Null's Shadow (to gain the 50% chance to Stagger.) He's not as good as the above-mentioned Champs, but better than most other Mystics.

Seems we have a different opinion on what "top tier" is. I think he is good just not on that next level that I consider the top tier.

By your definition, Champs like Longshot, Dragon Man, Doctor Voodoo, etc. are all not top-tier, but I see them destroy content on a regular basis. They're all versatile and extremely potent, just in their own way.

Yeah I wouldn't consider those champs top tier either, I still consider them rank up worthy and useful champs though. Top tier, in my opinion, is only the best of the best.

Well, if you've already made up your mind about it, why even make this poll? Symbiote Supreme IS the best of his class (and even the game) if the opponent has Buffs.

Just wanted to see what other people thought. I enjoy reading other people's perspectives.

Etjama

Yes

@Primerprime5 don't see Longshot as top tier. He needs high buff situations but then he does nothing but nullify and do damage. SS controls those fights, he's got a lot of utility in those matchups.

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DannyB01

Yes

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Moot4Life

No

He's too niche for me, I have him as a 5* but hes staying rank 1. Hes a top 5 mystic AT BEST.

Nigelthornberry

Yes

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

Slapdash

No

Nigelthornberry said:

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

The conditions do exist, no one ever said they didn't. They just don't appear often enough to make him "top tier" imo. He's probably the best for that fight, but for how many more?

Demonzfyre

Slapdash said:

Nigelthornberry said:

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

The conditions do exist, no one ever said they didn't. They just don't appear often enough to make him "top tier" imo. He's probably the best for that fight, but for how many more?

He's viable for a ton of fights all throughout all the content in the game. Any fight that has buffs, he's good for. The defender doesn't need to bleed for him to do well either. Toss sp2's with 100 Genetic Potential and with MD you'll get it back. His SP2 hits pretty hard.

You can tank sp3s as well. None of those other mystics can do that.

Legendary_Poey

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

I don't see him brought him in war at all. That's the main endgame spot I'm talking about. There are places to use him in act 6 and 7, but I'm sure you'll find more places to use other mystics. And that's the main reason I don't put him up there is his versatility is much less.

Legendary_Poey

Demonzfyre said:

Slapdash said:

Nigelthornberry said:

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

The conditions do exist, no one ever said they didn't. They just don't appear often enough to make him "top tier" imo. He's probably the best for that fight, but for how many more?

He's viable for a ton of fights all throughout all the content in the game. Any fight that has buffs, he's good for. The defender doesn't need to bleed for him to do well either. Toss sp2's with 100 Genetic Potential and with MD you'll get it back. His SP2 hits pretty hard.

You can tank sp3s as well. None of those other mystics can do that.

I think your slightly exaggerating on that. You wouldn't bring him to the footloose kinetic transference node in war for example. Also all three mystics I mentioned have much easier access to some form of power control so they don't have as much of a need to tank an l3.

Etjama

Yes

Dude, you're wrong. Just give up already. Why make a poll if you're just going to do nothing but disagree with the majority? What was the point of this poll?

Legendary_Poey

Nigelthornberry said:

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

Abyss easy path is one of those places where he works very well. Would you r3 for this though. I think a good mark to see if a champ is "top tier" is would you r3 them without second guesses (not for thronebreaker).

Legendary_Poey

Etjama said:

Dude, you're wrong. Just give up already. Why make a poll if you're just going to do nothing but disagree with the majority? What was the point of this poll?

Clearly you didn't read, the poll was never about being right or wrong. It was merely to have a discussion and exchange of ideas. Rating a good champ is based on perspective and opinion.

Slapdash

No

Demonzfyre said:

Slapdash said:

Nigelthornberry said:

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

The conditions do exist, no one ever said they didn't. They just don't appear often enough to make him "top tier" imo. He's probably the best for that fight, but for how many more?

He's viable for a ton of fights all throughout all the content in the game. Any fight that has buffs, he's good for. The defender doesn't need to bleed for him to do well either. Toss sp2's with 100 Genetic Potential and with MD you'll get it back. His SP2 hits pretty hard.

You can tank sp3s as well. None of those other mystics can do that.

There are plenty of scenarios in act 6 and 7 where he's either not ideal (in comparison to other mystics or in general) or unusable, despite buffs present. His effective range is definitely narrower than all buff matchups.

Since top mystics tend to have power control, tanking l3s doesn't make him stand out that much, even though it can be useful.

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Demonzfyre

Legendary_Poey said:

Demonzfyre said:

Slapdash said:

Nigelthornberry said:

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

The conditions do exist, no one ever said they didn't. They just don't appear often enough to make him "top tier" imo. He's probably the best for that fight, but for how many more?

He's viable for a ton of fights all throughout all the content in the game. Any fight that has buffs, he's good for. The defender doesn't need to bleed for him to do well either. Toss sp2's with 100 Genetic Potential and with MD you'll get it back. His SP2 hits pretty hard.

You can tank sp3s as well. None of those other mystics can do that.

I think your slightly exaggerating on that. You wouldn't bring him to the footloose kinetic transference node in war for example. Also all three mystics I mentioned have much easier access to some form of power control so they don't have as much of a need to tank an l3.

He has as easy of access as the other 3. Doom has to toss specials for power drain and so does Sorcerer Supreme. Magik has to get to a L2 before she can power control. Symbiote Supreme is much better than all those with MD.

As for footloose, I'd take Sym Supreme over any of them-

This is 6.3.1 Rhino with Footloose and No Retreat.

Demonzfyre

Slapdash said:

Demonzfyre said:

Slapdash said:

Nigelthornberry said:

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

The conditions do exist, no one ever said they didn't. They just don't appear often enough to make him "top tier" imo. He's probably the best for that fight, but for how many more?

He's viable for a ton of fights all throughout all the content in the game. Any fight that has buffs, he's good for. The defender doesn't need to bleed for him to do well either. Toss sp2's with 100 Genetic Potential and with MD you'll get it back. His SP2 hits pretty hard.

You can tank sp3s as well. None of those other mystics can do that.

There are plenty of scenarios in act 6 and 7 where he's either not ideal (in comparison to other mystics or in general) or unusable, despite buffs present. His effective range is definitely narrower than all buff matchups.

Since top mystics tend to have power control, tanking l3s doesn't make him stand out that much, even though it can be useful.

But that's all champions. Is Sym Supreme the best for every fight? No, he's not. Neither is Doom.

Sym Supreme does have power control.

I have a 5/65 Doom and Sorcerer Supreme in addition to a R5 and R3 Sym Supreme and I use my Sym Supreme more that the other 2 every time.

Aleor

Yes

Legendary_Poey said:

Nigelthornberry said:

DannyB01 said:

"Those conditions often aren't met in endgame content"...are we playing different games?!

Apparently abyss VTD isn't end game

Abyss easy path is one of those places where he works very well. Would you r3 for this though. I think a good mark to see if a champ is "top tier" is would you r3 them without second guesses (not for thronebreaker).

I would. But the thing is you don't need to r3 him to solo fights, mine r5 5* worked just fine.
Also if you base your opinion on war, does it mean your top tier would change by a snap when they introduce some season node making quake and ghost useless? Doesn't have to be smth like flow even, just true strike and permanent armour break on attacker. Just as strong condition as opponent having buffs or not being bleed immune.

Etjama

Yes

Primerprime5 said:

Legendary_Poey said:

Primerprime5 said:

The only "condition" he needs is opponents who aren't Bleed immune, his Staggers still feed his Genetic Potential. The key to applying the Staggers is to backdraft in Chtlon's Cunning (to trigger Dexterity) and Parry in Null's Shadow (to gain the 50% chance to Stagger.) He's not as good as the above-mentioned Champs, but better than most other Mystics.

Seems we have a different opinion on what "top tier" is. I think he is good just not on that next level that I consider the top tier.

By your definition, Champs like Longshot, Dragon Man, Doctor Voodoo, etc. are all not top-tier, but I see them destroy content on a regular basis. They're all versatile and extremely potent, just in their own way.

Don't see Longshot as top tier. He needs those high buff matchups and then he does nothing but nullify and damage. SS actually controls those fights like it's no one's business.