What should we do with three versions of "Captain Marvel"?

As someone who's always talking about champions buffs and suggestions, I've been thinking about Captain Marvel (Carol Danvers) recently. And not just because of that 6* Captain Marvel (Classic) that I pulled...

There are currently three versions of Carol Danvers in the game. Two are very early champions (Captain Marvel Classic, and Ms Marvel) who are physically identical re-skins that have little current application in the game. One is Captain Marvel Movie (CMM) who remains an effective and playable champion; although not necessarily a top-level cosmic champion.

CMM certainly doesn't need a buff. She's great. But what about the other two earlier versions? They must be on the 'buff list' somewhere. What shall we do with them?

I ask because if clearly the buff program has a lot to do. Should we be hoping Kabam spend time and effort doing major re-designs for both? That's going to be time-consuming: would we be better off if they put all their (finite) time and effort into just one overhaul? If so, what do we do with the other champion? Do we even keep them?

Let's give Kabam our thoughts; so they've plenty of time to put something into action before they need a tie-in for "The Marvels" movie (Release date: 17 February 2023)...

Comments

Magrailothos

Personally, I'd favour option 2 or possibly 3.

I do think that option 3 has potential. There would be ways to make it work – there can’t be many players who have taken up both of these champions to a high rank, surely? It would surely be possible to calculate a return of Iso/Gold/Cats for the less-advanced version; and (for example) if you’ve got both Unawakened in your roster, for you to end up with a single Awakened champion.

Maybe that would be more work for the Kabam team than just doing the extra buff, though!

As regards Option 2, I've generated a couple of buff suggestions below - one moderate, one overhaul.
Do share your thoughts on what Kabam could do with these champions; thoughts on the poll options; and buff redesigns.

Magrailothos

Ms Marvel (moderate rework)

Attack 2572

Health 31398

Passive

Ms Marvel has a permanent Fury buff which grants from +643 to +2572 Attack based on stored Power. If removed, this buff returns after six seconds.

Poison Immunity

Blocking

Gain +2670 Energy Resistance.

Gain +2% Power when blocking an Energy-based Attack.

Holding block for 2.2 seconds removes any Damaging Energy debuffs, each granting a burst of 10% Power.

Signature

Start the match with a Seventh Sense buff, granting Vigilance, +212-636 Crit Rating, and 65% chance to Autoblock Special Attacks for 4s. This buff starts Paused, and Unpauses when either an Autoblock is triggered or a Miss is bypassed. If Autoblock triggers, it counts as a Well-Timed block; and all subsequent hits of the Special Attack are also Autoblocked.

If removed for any reason, the Seventh Sense buff returns after 18-36 seconds (fastest at high Sig) or whenever using an SP3.

Special Attacks

Special Attacks have an 80% chance to trigger a random Fury (+643 Attack), Cruelty (+450 Critical Damage) or Energise (+25% Combat Power Rate) buff for seven seconds.

SP1: This attack has True Damage, and inflicts up to a burst of +30-90% Direct damage, scaling up with the opponent's Armour rating.

SP2: Each hit inflicts an Armour Break (-1200 Armour for 12s). Critical hits inflict an additional Armour Break.

Targets immune to Armour Break instead suffer a Fragility debuff for each Armour Break that would have been inflicted (+750 Critical Damage rating when hit) for 12s.

SP3: Grants an additional Fury buff for 20 seconds (effects identical to her permanent Fury buff). Additionally, gain a Stopping Power buff which removes any Unstoppable buffs for 10s when striking the opponent (this is effective through block).

Magrailothos

Captain Marvel -> Binary (Overhaul)

Thanks to the introduction of the MCU version of Captain Marvel, Captain Marvel (classic) is no longer needed in MCOC. She needs to become..... Binary!

(She may need some new animations...)

Attack 2572

Health 31398

At the start of the match

Start the match with a Power Gain buff granting 50% of a bar of Power over 12s.

Passive

+4420 Energy Resistance

Binary is immune to Poison, Coldsnap and Frostbite

Incinerate and Shock effects count as buffs for Binary's other abilities

Whilst she has five or fewer Prowess buffs, Binary generates an indefinite Prowess buff every ten seconds. Each Prowess buff increases her Special damage by 10%

Basic Attacks

All basic attacks inflict a burst of Energy damage equivalent to 10% of the damage done by the attack. This rises by a flat +5% per buff active on Binary.

Blocking

Gain +2% Power when blocking an Energy-based Attack.

Holding block for 2.2 seconds removes any Damaging Energy debuffs, each granting a burst of 10% Power.

A well-timed block against any Energy attack generates an indefinite Prowess buff that increases her Special damage by 10%. No stack limit.

Signature

Start the match with an indefinite Binary buff, granting an additional +3560 Energy Resistance, and enhancing the potency of Prowess and Power Gain buffs by 100%

If removed for any reason, the Binary buff returns after 18-36 seconds (fastest at high Sig) or upon using an SP3.

Special Attacks

All Prowess buffs are consumed at the end of any Special Attack.

SP1: This attack Incinerates the opponent for 70% of the damage done, over six seconds

SP2: Each hit inflicts a Burst of Energy damage equal to 20% of the damage dealt, for each buff active on Binary.

SP3: Grants a Fury buff for 20 seconds, increasing damage by 853. Additionally generates a Power Gain buff granting 50% of a bar of Power over 12s.

unknown

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World Eater

Technically there’s 4 cap marvels with Kamala Khan

pseudosane

@Magrailothos i really liked the rework ideas. kudos.

Draconic_12

As someone who's always talking about champions buffs and suggestions, I've been thinking about Captain Marvel (Carol Danvers) recently. And not just because of that 6* Captain Marvel (Classic) that I pulled...

There are currently three versions of Carol Danvers in the game. Two are very early champions (Captain Marvel Classic, and Ms Marvel) who are physically identical re-skins that have little current application in the game. One is Captain Marvel Movie (CMM) who remains an effective and playable champion; although not necessarily a top-level cosmic champion.

CMM certainly doesn't need a buff. She's great. But what about the other two earlier versions? They must be on the 'buff list' somewhere. What shall we do with them?

I ask because if clearly the buff program has a lot to do. Should we be hoping Kabam spend time and effort doing major re-designs for both? That's going to be time-consuming: would we be better off if they put all their (finite) time and effort into just one overhaul? If so, what do we do with the other champion? Do we even keep them?

Let's give Kabam our thoughts; so they've plenty of time to put something into action before they need a tie-in for "The Marvels" movie (Release date: 17 February 2023)...

I would love them to get different reworks

DNA3000

I do think that option 3 has potential. There would be ways to make it work – there can’t be many players who have taken up both of these champions to a high rank, surely? It would surely be possible to calculate a return of Iso/Gold/Cats for the less-advanced version; and (for example) if you’ve got both Unawakened in your roster, for you to end up with a single Awakened champion.

There's a lot of reasons why this will never happen. It goes against general developer principles, more players probably care than you are accounting for, the work involved is not worth it. But I'll mention one you probably didn't consider: is the only consideration the game mechanics?

You're thinking in terms of champion usage and rank ups, compensation for used resources, and awakening merged champions. But what happens when you take two champions that are essentially different skins of the same champion (basically) and delete one? Precisely because the abilities are almost identical, you're saying one of those two appearances are worthless.

You aren't changing numbers, you aren't trading one set of abilities for another set of abilities with different game performance metrics. We know this is already a heated argument, and it is just about game performance. Here, you're saying the people who like this look get to keep the champ, while the people who like that look aren't important. Who's going to volunteer to make that call? And this would almost certainly need Marvel approval. Who at Marvel is going to approve either decision?

Never going to happen. Too many people have to say yes, only one of them has to say no.

LibertyPrimeV1

In this case instead of removing one you could turn it into Captain Mar-Vell

LibertyPrimeV1

In this case instead of removing one you could turn it into Captain Mar-Vell

(with him having his own Abilities of course)

Magrailothos

I do think that option 3 has potential. There would be ways to make it work – there can’t be many players who have taken up both of these champions to a high rank, surely? It would surely be possible to calculate a return of Iso/Gold/Cats for the less-advanced version; and (for example) if you’ve got both Unawakened in your roster, for you to end up with a single Awakened champion.
There's a lot of reasons why this will never happen. It goes against general developer principles, more players probably care than you are accounting for, the work involved is not worth it....Too many people have to say yes, only one of them has to say no.

Thanks DNA.

Don't misread that I was strongly advocating for the option of removing one version from the game: just making the argument that it was possible to do it without necessarily disadvantaging those who'd taken them up. I admit, Marvel oversight hadn't particularly occurred to me, though!

I'd much rather have two decent reworks; as my suggestions further down hopefully implied.

However, others have suggested just 'removing' old champions rather than buffing then, if a newer version already exists. So although that wouldn't be my personal preference either, I thought the third option could generate interesting conversation, particularly given recent announcements about the pace of the 'buff program'. Thanks for joining in, to make it so.

unknown

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mostlyharmlessn

Option 4 - Rework Cap Marvel, Rework Ms. marvel, Release New Cap Marvel (Monica
Rambeau) make previous 3 versions of Carol Danvers so bugged no one plays them.

MaxGaming

May the worthy stand

DrZola

Other option: return requisite 5/6* shards for every time OGCM and Ms. M were pulled for each account before removing both as playable characters.

Rinse and repeat for several other OG champs/skins (looking at you OGIM and SIM)).

Dr. Zola

unknown

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Knullvoid235

Merge them all into one Superior Captain marvel.
She could either look like one of Cat Murdock's exceptional champion fusion arts or an ugly amalgamation like Ibom. Your call.

mostlyharmlessn

Merge them all into one Superior Captain marvel.
She could either look like one of Cat Murdock's exceptional champion fusion arts or an ugly amalgamation like Ibom. Your call.

Ooo they could do them as a 3 for 1 trade in in the store.....

Regal_Panther

Technically there’s 4 cap marvels with Kamala Khan

There are 3 Carol Danvers, 2 of which go by the Captain Marvel moniker, and one as Ms. Marvel identical to Capt. Marvel (classic)

Ms. Marvel (Kamala Khan) isn't a Captain, and no similarity (move-set-wise) to make her technically CM, so this doesn't apply as a technicality.

That said, I'm in favor of overhauling both CM Classic and MM (Danvers) so they're actually relevant for play (and have some distinction from each other) and not turned into the movie version.

If one was to come out, I probably wouldn't even make her Binary, truthfully, I'd replace her with Moonstone, who posed as Capt. Marvel for a while in Dark Avengers. The distinction from Danvers her design would be based on would be incorporating phasing to the kit.

StevieManWonder

I'd like to point out that Captain Marvel (Classic)'s sig ability is half useless as she does not gain any real power from blocking energy based attacks. Miss Marvel does and it's very noticeable. It's always bugged me that CMC doesn't get the same amount of powergain.