New champions = Too much stuff

I am the only one thinking that every new champ feels like having 7 nodes inside his passive? I was playing Incursions and damn, Infamous Iron Man has too much stuff to pay attention to, same with other champs like Hulkling, Galan, etc etc.

They have like 3 to 15 things to pay attention to and if you add that to the nodes it just becomes quite boring.

I think Im not the only one thinking each new champion has more text than the one before him, Im cool with the champs being more complex than before, but being complex is not having 15 passives, buffs, mechanics, etc etc in only one champion.

So please Kabam, stop

Comments

PapaMidnite007

Improvise adapt overcome

Jefechuta

Bro just don't use them if you don't like them. Or watch a video 😱 what do you want more OG iron man?

All jokes aside the new champs just take time to learn

Thats the point, I dont want an OG Iron Man, but I want champs like in 2019-2020, I think those were the most perfect ones, not too much stuff, but enough to have to learn how they work, but now a days they just have more text than the Grandmaster nodes

Crine60

Bro just don't use them if you don't like them. Or watch a video 😱 what do you want more OG iron man?

All jokes aside the new champs just take time to learn

I believe his point is that it's not a matter of just not using them if they are too complex for you. If they are too complicated you can always just use regular combos and throw whatever special with no thought to deal some damage, though perhaps not optimal or utilizing utility abilities. The issue he brought up is having to understand them to fight against them.

Normax_X

galan has an essay for his abilities and literally all you do is MLM heavy sp1 like 90% of the time. they have lots of writing cause people are always saying oh bug bug cause they don't understand the abilities so they need to be extra specific. just watch a 5 minute video on YouTube and u'll learn them.

Jefechuta

Thats the problem, when its faster to watch a video than read and understand what the champ does, it just means that its too much stuff to put in a single champion, and its more obvious when they just become the best option for a lot of stuff, because they just have too much things so they will be good against a loooooot of champions, when they are not even real counters to that champ

magnus_xix

OK so what's your solution?

AverageDesi

There's a lot of stuff but you only need to pay attention to a few things while fighting them

Jefechuta

OK so what's your solution?

Lol, just dont put that much stuff on champions, as I said, the ones on 2019-2020 have the perfect amount of info and mechanics

Terra

Skill and reading issue.

ItsDamien

OK so what's your solution?
Lol, just dont put that much stuff on champions, as I said, the ones on 2019-2020 have the perfect amount of info and mechanics

If they didn’t add more things, the game would inevitably become stagnant. The evolution of any live service game is to continue to build and expand to keep the interest of the player. If we only stayed in the 2020 style of gameplay, people would get bored as there would be less innovation in gameplay.

People often look to the past and remember it fondly but when given the chance to experience that past version again are usually disappointed. Take World of Warcraft and their “Classic” versions of the base game, Burning Crusade, and Wrath of the Lich King. People remember those as some of the glory days of WoW, however on replaying them, the newer features that are missing from the more recent expansions are now requested for implementation due to the convenience and gameplay they offer.

ChiliDog

I don't think this post is about "learning to play". I think it is more about "learning to play against without a counter".

Jefechuta

OK so what's your solution?
Lol, just dont put that much stuff on champions, as I said, the ones on 2019-2020 have the perfect amount of info and mechanics
If they didn’t add more things, the game would inevitably become stagnant. The evolution of any live service game is to continue to build and expand to keep the interest of the player. If we only stayed in the 2020 style of gameplay, people would get bored as there would be less innovation in gameplay.

People often look to the past and remember it fondly but when given the chance to experience that past version again are usually disappointed. Take World of Warcraft and their “Classic” versions of the base game, Burning Crusade, and Wrath of the Lich King. People remember those as some of the glory days of WoW, however on replaying them, the newer features that are missing from the more recent expansions are now requested for implementation due to the convenience and gameplay they offer.

Putting a lot of stuff in only one champion aint innovation, putting new things like Kravens root per example is innovation.

I don't think this post is about "learning to play". I think it is more about "learning to play against without a counter".

My main issue is that new champs have too much stuff, either for learning to play with it, against it or whatever.

A lot of people just play the same 3 champs vs everythings which just demostrates the fact that you put a lot of stuff to it to just beat him the same way you would the rest of champions with those 3 champs that are Top tier.

I just want new champs that may or may not have new mechanics but they wont have 10 pages of text explaining what they do

PapaMidnite007

I have no problem with it all you need is patience this game isn't going anywhere you need to take time and read while yes essays are annoying but it'll help you in the long run.

unknown

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Jefechuta

Games that have abilities evolve by increasing abilities and creating more abilities to counter old meta abilities etc
It's just evolution otherwise it would go stale
Take your 2019 champs and go do act 5 or something and maybe youll have fun 🤷‍♂️

I already explained this, its not evolving, Im fine with that, but you dont need 10 pages of passives, mechanics and buff to counter new meta abilities, the problem aint those new metas, problem is the quantity

H3t3r

Games that have abilities evolve by increasing abilities and creating more abilities to counter old meta abilities etc
It's just evolution otherwise it would go stale
Take your 2019 champs and go do act 5 or something and maybe youll have fun 🤷‍♂️
I already explained this, its not evolving, Im fine with that, but you dont need 10 pages of passives, mechanics and buff to counter new meta abilities, the problem aint those new metas, problem is the quantity

I'd much rather have 10 pages of stuff then 3. More fun and engaging in my opinion

Jefechuta

Games that have abilities evolve by increasing abilities and creating more abilities to counter old meta abilities etc
It's just evolution otherwise it would go stale
Take your 2019 champs and go do act 5 or something and maybe youll have fun 🤷‍♂️
I already explained this, its not evolving, Im fine with that, but you dont need 10 pages of passives, mechanics and buff to counter new meta abilities, the problem aint those new metas, problem is the quantity
I'd much rather have 10 pages of stuff then 3. More fun and engaging in my opinion

Yeah same, but I think its better 6 than 3 or 10

NearJr

This looks like a "you" problem, not a Kabam problem.

New champs are fun and actually require you to think and have a modicum of skill.

This is not a "git gud" post.

Qwerty12345

The issue isn't just for the player... but for Kabam. How many times have there been some synergy or node interaction totally unexpected because there just is too many things out there that can interact with eachother.

Then you get confusion like the difference between stagger (the application of it and when it actually nullifies) vs. nullify vs. neutralize...

Purify vs. shrug off

and don't get me started on its often hard to tell what is active/passive, and that the icons usually suggesting something is a passive aren't consistantly used.

And of course if anything actually ever gets "corrected"... its immediately seen as a nerf... so many times we are stuck with unintended side effects.

And it isn't like there is some rule book or something that explains all these things. Its hard enough to find where it is that poisons lower your healing rate... let alone something as nuanced as why something with true-strike or true-accuracy can be glanced.

NearJr

I hate to be the guy to tell you, but.... Mcoc is a very complex game and it needs to evolve in order to stay fresh.

If you cant keep up with the complexity or just dont want to, there are plenty of games out there that are much easier.

SuelGames

Agree. Too much stuff to read, i like the simple old school gameplay without having to worry about a bunch of rotations

Treo

I completely agree I have tried to bring this point to attention but failed in my wording more then once. It’s not the nodes, it’s not the abilities. It’s the stacking that is getting out of hand. And I totally get that is not a problem for everyone. But it is for a group of players. And the more they keep stacking the bigger that group eventually will become. Out it that comes my fear at a point it will not only outgrow my own capabilities of playing this game but a growing group. for myself I have accepted it woont understand a lot of champs when they get released and maybe understand a part of then when I need that part. my feelings towards this is we are reaching the point of maximum saturation.

Buttehrs

Agree. Too much stuff to read, i like the simple old school gameplay without having to worry about a bunch of rotations

You can still do that you know. You don't have to play every champ on their optimal rotations. It's a choice you have.

Jefechuta

Looks like theres a plenty of people that dont understand what Im saying so Ill explain it again.

It is not the difficulty of the game, is not the complexity

Im not saying that I want a bunch of Scarlet Witches with 2 mechanics.

What I am saying is that the champions that are going out recently have more stuff in them than boss fights with a bunch of nodes.

And that is not innovation, if you put 30 ingredients in a salad, thats not a better salad or an innovation, thats just too much stuff.

And the problem is, again, that doesnt matter how much stuff you put in a champion to make it different of what you have when you still gonna play Kitty Pride, Herc, CGR, Doom or Torch vs it, and maybe some other new champs that are good, but still, it is senseless to give a lot more stuff to the new champs if it just makes it more annoying to read, because you are going to play the same way that you play vs all the other stuff because you have the 10 top tier champs that destroy everything.

Its cool to bring new metas, but as I said, more stuff is not equal to better stuff.

And I say this not because its harder or not, Its just annoying to be reading a lot of nodes plus all the stuff that the champions itself have to go to a youtube video and see that some guy is just doing the match with a top tier champion not giving af about all the mechanics that he should be aware off.

Doug4theWin

Your response is longer than any new champion’s description. There are plenty of original champions with similar mechanics and minimal synergies for your entertainment.

Captainaiden

I love too much stuff

ReignkingTW

Imagine trying to learn this game now!

unknown

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KoopaKrusher

I'm in agreement that the game needs to keep getting more technical with complex champions in order to evolve, but it does bring up a good point about how steep the learning curve is for new players. I brute forced my way to Uncollected before I even considered looking for external resources on YouTube or the forums to learn the game better. Kabam kinda addressed that when they started buffs. 1* Colossus still uses his old kit, but they gave 1* BP the new kit and I assume they'll do the same with the Spidey and Hulk updates. So if you're a new player, is reading complex champion descriptions a significant enough barrier to entry that they quit the game?

I don't think so, for 2 reasons. First, a lot of the more popular characters still don't have buffs and are using simple descriptions. If you come to MCOC excited to play Iron Man and Thor, you're not going to be turned off by essay champ mechanics cuz those champs are still simple. I haven't looked at it, but I would guess that champs expected to be more popular on release (connected with MCU content) have simpler descriptions than more niche champs (Iron Doom, Galan). Second, and more importantly, new players get stronger champs a lot quicker than 3 years ago, so reading the champ description isn't really necessary until you're already somewhat invested in the game. You can ignore champ descriptions entirely until you hit a wall and have to figure out why your current champs aren't working. With the new Act 1-4, that wall doesn't come for a lot of players until they've already been playing the game for a while. You can get pretty far in the game by just swiping and tapping and never reading a champ description. If you're at a point where you want to dive into champ descriptions, you're probably at a point where an essay isn't going to turn you off the game.

Hilbert_unbeatable2

I am the only one thinking that every new champ feels like having 7 nodes inside his passive? I was playing Incursions and damn, Infamous Iron Man has too much stuff to pay attention to, same with other champs like Hulkling, Galan, etc etc.

They have like 3 to 15 things to pay attention to and if you add that to the nodes it just becomes quite boring.

I think Im not the only one thinking each new champion has more text than the one before him, Im cool with the champs being more complex than before, but being complex is not having 15 passives, buffs, mechanics, etc etc in only one champion.

So please Kabam, stop

Idoom playstyle is more or less same as mystic doom