**KNOWN AW ISSUE**
Please be aware, there is a known issue with Saga badging when observing the AW map.
The team have found the source of the issue and will be updating with our next build.
We apologize for the inconvenience.
Options

I Don't Want to Use Zemo Anymore

01000100 Posts: 54 ★
edited July 2023 in General Discussion
Seriously. I would like to formally request a rank-down-ticket for 6* and 5* versions.
Zemo went from an impressive champion, to super solid, and now finally average.

I would not have ranked him up if I had known he was being repeatedly nerfed.
Also, his furies are good and his Sp3 rotation is still solid, but that takes time ramping.
Post edited by Kabam Miike on
«1

Comments

  • Options
    FurrymoosenFurrymoosen Posts: 2,225 ★★★★★
    SecondSkriller said:

    Furrymoosen said:

    Rank down tokens have already been formally requested and officially denied. We live in a day and age in this game where no champions is safe for the first several months of their existence. You are not alone in rushing to rank up a champ that was subject to change and it is an unfortunate situation all around, but it is what it is at this point.

    Wrong, the request is still on and everyone agrees.
    What did I say that is wrong?
  • Options
    Colinwhitworth69Colinwhitworth69 Posts: 7,241 ★★★★★
    ORHypeBuffed said:

    @Colinwhitworth69
    You have to consider the state of the game changing constantly.
    The nerfs were unnecessary because *NOW* newer metas will turn him into a relic of the past just like Cap IW.

    Zemo isn't AA; he's not Warlock or Kitty, and certainly not Herc or Doom.

    I do not consider him nerfed. And with the game changing constantly (agree, nothing new about that), any champ can be minimized by new nodes or new counters that are released. That has been happening for years.

    When you refer to "metas" I assume you are referring to BGs, which is not my main interest in the game. I still believe he has uses in BGs. Good defender, great against champs that purify or proc his cleanse.

    Any re: your last comment, I am not sure what you are trying to say, because all of those things are obvious and are of course true about most champs in the game. He was never an attacker I would bring in to any fight; always a sharp tool in my toolbox, and remains as such.



  • Options
    GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,376 ★★★★★
    Drago_von_Drago said:

    GroundedWisdom said:

    ORHypeBuffed said:

    @Colinwhitworth69
    You have to consider the state of the game changing constantly.
    The nerfs were unnecessary because *NOW* newer metas will turn him into a relic of the past just like Cap IW.

    Zemo isn't AA; he's not Warlock or Kitty, and certainly not Herc or Doom.

    No, he was worse.
    Any Champ that can freeze the opponent in place and stop them from executing any Specials including L3s, is devastating to the game and future content. All you need is one Champ, and you can cheese anything.
    It’s been explained repeatedly that a single node or champ ability can prevent this just like they have introduced counters to every other top tier champ over time. Devastating is an extreme exaggeration.
    Right. So do you propose that every Node in the future contains that, or every Node has said Champ placed on it?
  • Options
    GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,376 ★★★★★
    When you pigeon hole their design constraints, that's devastating to the game.
  • Options
    GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,376 ★★★★★
    I don't think you realize how broken it is to have a Champ do what he could do.
    He WAS a cheat code in that state. It was only a matter of time before everyone started using it.
  • Options
    pseudosanepseudosane Posts: 3,887 Guardian
    BigBlueOx said:

    pseudosane said:

    If you dont want to play with him.... dont. RDTs arent required for this reason.

    Agree there, but there’s is more than valid reasons why they should be.

    1.) Root nerf was not included in the balancing announcement so it’s fair to say the champion was changed a second time, silently, and outside of the communicated process

    2.) Trello, where there was a note, is a tool that is not reliably used and is often out of date or vague in detail.

    3.) Only a small percentage of the forum community even knew about Trello. The forums as we’ve been told by Kabam are a very small vocal minority f the player base. So only a percentage of a percentage of players may have been aware.

    4.) We have never been told to consult Trello for official communications. There is no link to Trello in the game so it’s not apparent that resource would need to be consulted when weighing irreversible decisions.

    5.) Kabam themselves are inconsistent about bufg reporting on Trello vs the Forums, which creates confusions about where players should look.


    Really these are all sub points to one larger one about established and visible communication pathways not being utilized here, but RDT should be issued.
    Tbf, very few folks actually ranked him ONLY for this "root" interaction. Zemo is a tough and annoying defender in war and BGs. His utility outside of the "root cheese" is still there. the only change was he cannot lock champs from an sp3 anymore, which isnt a huge part of his kit.
  • Options
    pseudosanepseudosane Posts: 3,887 Guardian
    AngelMcNugget said:

    pseudosane said:

    BigBlueOx said:

    pseudosane said:

    If you dont want to play with him.... dont. RDTs arent required for this reason.

    Agree there, but there’s is more than valid reasons why they should be.

    1.) Root nerf was not included in the balancing announcement so it’s fair to say the champion was changed a second time, silently, and outside of the communicated process

    2.) Trello, where there was a note, is a tool that is not reliably used and is often out of date or vague in detail.

    3.) Only a small percentage of the forum community even knew about Trello. The forums as we’ve been told by Kabam are a very small vocal minority f the player base. So only a percentage of a percentage of players may have been aware.

    4.) We have never been told to consult Trello for official communications. There is no link to Trello in the game so it’s not apparent that resource would need to be consulted when weighing irreversible decisions.

    5.) Kabam themselves are inconsistent about bufg reporting on Trello vs the Forums, which creates confusions about where players should look.


    Really these are all sub points to one larger one about established and visible communication pathways not being utilized here, but RDT should be issued.
    Tbf, very few folks actually ranked him ONLY for this "root" interaction. Zemo is a tough and annoying defender in war and BGs. His utility outside of the "root cheese" is still there. the only change was he cannot lock champs from an sp3 anymore, which isnt a huge part of his kit.
    For sure, I'll be the first one to deny the Zemo hate train. But if very few folks are affected, then Kabam can send out those RDT's due to their multiple failures in this situation and those very few folks will use them. If they don't send the tickets, I'm personally going to be worried about how changes like these are gonna be handled down the line. Zemo and Kraven are the least of my worries, it's just so many failures in communication being sidestepped by such an insignificant warning on the Trello board.
    no, there is no reason for an ulterior motive playing into this. The same mats can be used to r2 a 7* for example. This was a broken interaction, and basing a champ on a broken interaction, and then blowing stuff out of proportion is what we do best, as a community. I, personally, was at the forefront of overreacting when moleman got "nerfed", saying he would be unusable. The same person, me, now am planning on r5ing Moleman. Zemo cannot be defined on a small set of broken interactions.
    Kraven is a different case and i'd agree a rankdown ticket there may be warranted.
    BigBlueOx said:

    pseudosane said:

    BigBlueOx said:

    pseudosane said:

    If you dont want to play with him.... dont. RDTs arent required for this reason.

    Agree there, but there’s is more than valid reasons why they should be.

    1.) Root nerf was not included in the balancing announcement so it’s fair to say the champion was changed a second time, silently, and outside of the communicated process

    2.) Trello, where there was a note, is a tool that is not reliably used and is often out of date or vague in detail.

    3.) Only a small percentage of the forum community even knew about Trello. The forums as we’ve been told by Kabam are a very small vocal minority f the player base. So only a percentage of a percentage of players may have been aware.

    4.) We have never been told to consult Trello for official communications. There is no link to Trello in the game so it’s not apparent that resource would need to be consulted when weighing irreversible decisions.

    5.) Kabam themselves are inconsistent about bufg reporting on Trello vs the Forums, which creates confusions about where players should look.


    Really these are all sub points to one larger one about established and visible communication pathways not being utilized here, but RDT should be issued.
    Tbf, very few folks actually ranked him ONLY for this "root" interaction. Zemo is a tough and annoying defender in war and BGs. His utility outside of the "root cheese" is still there. the only change was he cannot lock champs from an sp3 anymore, which isnt a huge part of his kit.
    I don’t think that’s a statement that is supported by anything other than anecdotal evidence. In my conversations anybody I’ve discussed this with regrets taking Zemo to R4 or higher because of this change in combination with the removal of his armor up buff interaction. It removed 2 very fun interactions from his kit and gives him niche utility that’s fine at R3 and makes him a very mid tier skill champ. These interactions that made him worth considering ranking up over say a Nick Fury.

    But that’s just been from the players I’ve talked to about this.
    Then i can add my experience where nobody I've talked to is regretting their decision. Anecdotal evidence is not evidence.
  • Options
    BigBlueOxBigBlueOx Posts: 1,644 ★★★★★
    pseudosane said:

    Then i can add my experience where nobody I've talked to is regretting their decision. Anecdotal evidence is not evidence.

    Exactly my point to your original reply.
This discussion has been closed.