Shuri's Armor Ups not stopping Havok's Plasma Detonations

Terminatrix

Anybody know why? It says in Havok's kit that a champ with armor ups are not affected by the plasma detonations, yet she is. Armor ups are armor ups regardless of how a champ gets them.

pseudosane

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Bendy

It says u need an armor buff not a passive

Terminatrix

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

GinjabredMonsta

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Passive vs active

Terminatrix

Bendy said:

It says u need an armor buff not a passive

Its still an armor up. At max stacks, she takes less damage from hits. Thats an armor up.

SecondSkriller

Terminatrix said:

Bendy said:

It says u need an armor buff not a passive

Its still an armor up. At max stacks, she takes less damage from hits. Thats an armor up.

Yes, it’s passive, not a buff. Buffs are the ones that can be nullified.

Darkness275

It's an armour up yes, but it's not a buff.

Havok's kit specifies buffs, not "armour up effects" or something similarly worded.

Her personal armour up is a passive effect, not a buff.

Dirty_Dozz

His kit says Armor Up BUFF. What she's getting are Armor Up PASSIVES. It's an annoying distinction, but yeah.

AverageDesi

GinjabredMonsta said:

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Passive vs active

Passive vs Buff. Not active.

SgtBallcrusher

Armor up buff is a fixed amount. It's calculated before the damage base calculation. A armor up passive can be either not on and waiting for a trigger (I.E. heavy converts passive to active) or it can be continuously variable. They designed havoks kit to work with an active fixed amount. I feel your pain. Level a havoks and have fun with him against himself!

Terminatrix

Dirty_Dozz said:

His kit says Armor Up BUFF. What she's getting are Armor Up PASSIVES. It's an annoying distinction, but yeah.

Annoying indeed 😂 Thanks for that perfect description. Definitley stupid game mechanics lol

Terminatrix

Dirty_Dozz said:

His kit says Armor Up BUFF. What she's getting are Armor Up PASSIVES. It's an annoying distinction, but yeah.

Also annoying like Storm being shock immune, but not immune to all shock debuffs like static shock 😂😂😂

MDx

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Do you know the difference between a buff and a passive ?

Terminatrix

SecondSkriller said:

Terminatrix said:

Bendy said:

It says u need an armor buff not a passive

Its still an armor up. At max stacks, she takes less damage from hits. Thats an armor up.

Yes, it’s passive, not a buff. Buffs are the ones that can be nullified.

Ok noted. I was today's years old when I learned this 😂

Terminatrix

MDx said:

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Do you know the difference between a buff and a passive ?

Where exactly does the game explain the difference between the two?

TyEdge

Terminatrix said:

MDx said:

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Do you know the difference between a buff and a passive ?

Where exactly does the game explain the difference between the two?

Probably in the part where they gave them different names and icons.

Dukenpuke

Terminatrix said:

MDx said:

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Do you know the difference between a buff and a passive ?

Where exactly does the game explain the difference between the two?

Good description of it (and other stuff) here.

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/176360/frequently-asked-questions-about-combat-and-combat-mechanics

"Q: What is a status effect?
A: A status effect is what the game calls things that can affect a champion on an ongoing basis. Status effects can be Buffs, Debuffs, or Passive effects. Effects such as Armor Break which reduce armor rating or Poison which cause poison damage over time are status effects."

DNA3000

Dukenpuke said:

Terminatrix said:

MDx said:

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Do you know the difference between a buff and a passive ?

Where exactly does the game explain the difference between the two?

Good description of it (and other stuff) here.

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/176360/frequently-asked-questions-about-combat-and-combat-mechanics

"Q: What is a status effect?
A: A status effect is what the game calls things that can affect a champion on an ongoing basis. Status effects can be Buffs, Debuffs, or Passive effects. Effects such as Armor Break which reduce armor rating or Poison which cause poison damage over time are status effects."

There's a more specific section on passive effects:

DNA3000 said:

Q: What’s the deal with passives verses buffs/debuffs?
A: “Buff” and “Debuff” have both a colloquial definition and a technical definition within the game. Within the game, effects are tagged as buffs or debuffs for the purposes of defining when other abilities and effects interact with them. When an ability interacts with “debuffs” it is specifically looking for the debuff flag, it is not trying to figure out if the effect “should be” a debuff or not.

Some effects are not tagged as buffs or debuffs, because the explicit intent is for those effects to not interact with other abilities and effects that interact with “buffs” and “debuffs.” These are generally instead tagged as "passive" effects to distinguish them from effects tagged as “buffs” or “debuffs.” A passive effect is not a buff or a debuff for the purposes of the game deciding whether another ability or effect should interact with it.

Note that when a champion is immune to Debuffs, they are not immune to Passive Effects, as Passive Effects are not Debuffs by definition. Therefore, Passive Effects that cause damage or other harmful effects can affect a champion that is currently immune to Debuffs.

Kabam has an article that officially defines the terms "buff" "debuff" "passive" and a few more. Link here: http://kabam.force.com/PKB/articles/en_US/FAQ/Battle-Status-Effects

Also note that a "Passive Ability" is just an ability that is always on, while a "Passive Effect" is a specific kind of effect, different than Buffs and Debuffs. Passive Abilities do not automatically create passive effects. For example, Medusa's signature ability is a Passive Ability, but what that signature ability generates are Fury Buffs.

Note; the knowledgebase link from the FAQ is broken, the new version of that page is here: https://help.kabamsupport.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052574431-Battle-Status-Effects

AverageDesi

DNA3000 said:

Dukenpuke said:

Terminatrix said:

MDx said:

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Do you know the difference between a buff and a passive ?

Where exactly does the game explain the difference between the two?

Good description of it (and other stuff) here.

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/176360/frequently-asked-questions-about-combat-and-combat-mechanics

"Q: What is a status effect?
A: A status effect is what the game calls things that can affect a champion on an ongoing basis. Status effects can be Buffs, Debuffs, or Passive effects. Effects such as Armor Break which reduce armor rating or Poison which cause poison damage over time are status effects."

There's a more specific section on passive effects:

DNA3000 said:

Q: What’s the deal with passives verses buffs/debuffs?
A: “Buff” and “Debuff” have both a colloquial definition and a technical definition within the game. Within the game, effects are tagged as buffs or debuffs for the purposes of defining when other abilities and effects interact with them. When an ability interacts with “debuffs” it is specifically looking for the debuff flag, it is not trying to figure out if the effect “should be” a debuff or not.

Some effects are not tagged as buffs or debuffs, because the explicit intent is for those effects to not interact with other abilities and effects that interact with “buffs” and “debuffs.” These are generally instead tagged as "passive" effects to distinguish them from effects tagged as “buffs” or “debuffs.” A passive effect is not a buff or a debuff for the purposes of the game deciding whether another ability or effect should interact with it.

Note that when a champion is immune to Debuffs, they are not immune to Passive Effects, as Passive Effects are not Debuffs by definition. Therefore, Passive Effects that cause damage or other harmful effects can affect a champion that is currently immune to Debuffs.

Kabam has an article that officially defines the terms "buff" "debuff" "passive" and a few more. Link here: http://kabam.force.com/PKB/articles/en_US/FAQ/Battle-Status-Effects

Also note that a "Passive Ability" is just an ability that is always on, while a "Passive Effect" is a specific kind of effect, different than Buffs and Debuffs. Passive Abilities do not automatically create passive effects. For example, Medusa's signature ability is a Passive Ability, but what that signature ability generates are Fury Buffs.

Note; the knowledgebase link from the FAQ is broken, the new version of that page is here: https://help.kabamsupport.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052574431-Battle-Status-Effects

If you check the older versions of the broken link there's some interesting stuff

Rasilover

Kabam needs to add a glossary in the game

MDx

Terminatrix said:

MDx said:

Terminatrix said:

pseudosane said:

no, you need armor ups. Shuri gets armor passives. those are different. you need an armor up BUFF.

Its still an armor up. She takes less damage from hits when getting armor ups

Do you know the difference between a buff and a passive ?

Where exactly does the game explain the difference between the two?

When did u start playing mcoc ? And where are you in story content?
Pretty sure over the time they made passives a thing there are several talks and mentions in content that make the difference visible . There are several nodes in act 7 and 8 that highlight the difference. If you're just a cav , then it's possible you haven't come across such things. But there are a lot of champs that utilize passive mechanics instead of buffs , then again if you're a new player you would've taken them as bugs. Nvm learn a new thing every once a while : )

Magrailothos

Since this thread was initially about Shuri Vs Havok in Thronebreaker EQ, which I imagine was an exceptionally short and one-sided fight, let's have a shout-out to the lovely person at Kabam who put Havok on a quest node which constantly places Shocks on him.

Cheers! 👍

DNA3000

Rasilover said:

Kabam needs to add a glossary in the game

The first entry will probably be what bases are.

GinjabredMonsta

Terminatrix said:

Dirty_Dozz said:

His kit says Armor Up BUFF. What she's getting are Armor Up PASSIVES. It's an annoying distinction, but yeah.

Also annoying like Storm being shock immune, but not immune to all shock debuffs like static shock 😂😂😂

If you are talking about electro, that dmg isn’t shock dmg, but energy damage. It just has shock in the name

Lovejoy72

You want a real nightmare, read Fantmans. Nano armor ups are buffs, and are are treated as armor up effects, per his description. Now this states his nanos are buffs, and it states that they count as armor up effects, but never states they count as specifically armor up buffs. But they do. It’s just all trapped in the increasingly wack a doodle lingo of the game.

Wubbie075

To those of you who responded to her question about where to find info on the difference between buff and passives with "HAha ur a duMMy 4 not no dis alreddy!!!"...

Congratulations. We're all suitably impressed with your staggering intellect.

Colinwhitworth69

It took me forever to grok that there was even a difference between a Buff and Passive. The game offers few explanations.