So, I wanted to loop back to this, for a Proof in Concept and also as another example of why this kit in BGs — on a timer with nodes — is just so problematic:
I played this as well as you can do it — not bragging. This is the best it can be done, actually playing as the attacker:
The problem is that IN ADDITION to all the things in the kit, Placebo just makes it basically impossible to do basically anything other than attempt to survive long enough to try a rotation that actually works.
Again: I am not the most skilled player in the world. But I have a lot of experience with the game, and I do know when I do it right and when I don’t.
You shouldn’t have a kit/node combo that CANNOT be killed by a viable counter.
I KNOW, absolutely KNOW, Thor (Ragnarok) can do it exactly the way I described:
Again, it absolutely takes time, but it can be done.
But the kit is so broken, any assistance you add to it with a node in BGs makes it…man, IDK. I literally don’t get what you’re supposed to do in BGs with how this kit is designed.
Depending on what the nodes are in other content, IDK. Everest content…IDK. Better players than me are going to deal with that stuff, like what Necropolis II or whatever.
But BGs man…IDK. Just broken. Flat-out broken
This is the problem with these outside the box counters, one node is all it takes to trivialize them. And if you don’t have mystic power control then it just takes passive AI
ANYTHING that adds power to that kit in BGs…it’s hard to see how an extremely limited set of characters is ever going to kill it consistently in BGs with a power gain element
I know time will bring something else to deal with it, but man. I just am amazed at how few things actually work, with nothing really working well
lol get ready for some crazy conflictor over time combined with stun immunity meta… there goes maybe every counter other than Wigra which often requires a bit of AI compliance and luck to solo.
One thing is certain skill isn’t meant to matter here
Suggestions for the tournament of champions, Domino does not activate luck or bad luck against rob champion, Red Skull loses shields to cosmic champion like Venom in E1 and does not drain power in E3 against Venom!
So, I wanted to loop back to this, for a Proof in Concept and also as another example of why this kit in BGs — on a timer with nodes — is just so problematic:
I played this as well as you can do it — not bragging. This is the best it can be done, actually playing as the attacker:
The problem is that IN ADDITION to all the things in the kit, Placebo just makes it basically impossible to do basically anything other than attempt to survive long enough to try a rotation that actually works.
Again: I am not the most skilled player in the world. But I have a lot of experience with the game, and I do know when I do it right and when I don’t.
You shouldn’t have a kit/node combo that CANNOT be killed by a viable counter.
I KNOW, absolutely KNOW, Thor (Ragnarok) can do it exactly the way I described:
Again, it absolutely takes time, but it can be done.
But the kit is so broken, any assistance you add to it with a node in BGs makes it…man, IDK. I literally don’t get what you’re supposed to do in BGs with how this kit is designed.
Depending on what the nodes are in other content, IDK. Everest content…IDK. Better players than me are going to deal with that stuff, like what Necropolis II or whatever.
But BGs man…IDK. Just broken. Flat-out broken
This is the problem with these outside the box counters, one node is all it takes to trivialize them. And if you don’t have mystic power control then it just takes passive AI
ANYTHING that adds power to that kit in BGs…it’s hard to see how an extremely limited set of characters is ever going to kill it consistently in BGs with a power gain element
I know time will bring something else to deal with it, but man. I just am amazed at how few things actually work, with nothing really working well
lol get ready for some crazy conflictor over time combined with stun immunity meta… there goes maybe every counter other than Wigra which often requires a bit of AI compliance and luck to solo.
One thing is certain skill isn’t meant to matter here
I keep saying it because I really this way: I legit don’t know what you’re supposed to do.
I don’t get it. I don’t understand this one, how it’s staying as is. I don’t understand it
Bullseye is nasty. Some other kits can be pretty freaking nasty, especially with nodes
You have nerfed champions in the past for having an advantage over your ascendant class but you have gone back to creating champions that break the game, like the serpent who is completely broken in the game. Reformulate this.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
I mean in a game where they sell stuff that’s just factually inaccurate… but great contributions to the convo.
They will probably sell a counter at some point too and if we give them dollar money then they will owe us what we paid for.
Glad to see you got the points… it’s definitely because he’s a hard defender, it has nothing to do with the design direction of devaluing skill. I mean there’s only 20 pages here of discussion saying that.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
We must persevere until the mods see this thread.
They've seen the Thread.
You're not a forum guardian, stop acting like one.
I'm not. The Thread has been up for 7 days. Anyone visiting the Forum in the last week has seen the Thread. Considering it's their job, that's an obvious conclusion.
Based on the fact that forums don’t even get banners on the raids situation and are getting the news from other people screenshotting Discord, this may be a bolder conclusion than you think.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
Where in this whole thread did anyone claim they owe us anything?
when you say they're ignoring the thread that implies that we should get a response.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
No it doesn't, it implies we want a response and they can either give us one or not, and people can either be frustrated due to this (us) or not care about it cause you just take whatever they give you (you).
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
Where in this whole thread did anyone claim they owe us anything?
when you say they're ignoring the thread that implies that we should get a response.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
No it doesn't, it implies we want a response and they can either give us one or not, and people can either be frustrated due to this (us) or not care about it cause you just take whatever they give you (you).
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
no matter how garbage serpent looks right now, i am 99.99% positive that their decision not to nerf him is deliberate, intentional, planned, well thought out, and well reasoned.
our "frustrations" will be soothed in the future and they won't let us drown. they are not dumb enough to leave us without a life preserver. help is coming.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
We must persevere until the mods see this thread.
They've seen the Thread.
You're not a forum guardian, stop acting like one.
I'm not. The Thread has been up for 7 days. Anyone visiting the Forum in the last week has seen the Thread. Considering it's their job, that's an obvious conclusion.
Based on the fact that forums don’t even get banners on the raids situation and are getting the news from other people screenshotting Discord, this may be a bolder conclusion than you think.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
Where in this whole thread did anyone claim they owe us anything?
when you say they're ignoring the thread that implies that we should get a response.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
No it doesn't, it implies we want a response and they can either give us one or not, and people can either be frustrated due to this (us) or not care about it cause you just take whatever they give you (you).
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
no matter how garbage serpent looks right now, i am 99.99% positive that their decision not to nerf him is deliberate, intentional, planned, well thought out, and well reasoned.
our "frustrations" will be soothed in the future and they won't let us drown. they are not dumb enough to leave us without a life preserver. help is coming.
I'm not disputing that, of course it was intentional, doesn't however change the fact that it's **** to pull that off just so you can sell counters if people want to be able to enjoy BGs. I never buy pre-release bundles however I'm pretty much forced to do so with Shathra if I don't want to get wiped out again and again next meta with rich get richer.
You say they're not dumb enough yet DLL already quite literally said there will never be a Galan Peni situation where a defender becomes completely irrelevant due to a hard counter.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
We must persevere until the mods see this thread.
They've seen the Thread.
You're not a forum guardian, stop acting like one.
I'm not. The Thread has been up for 7 days. Anyone visiting the Forum in the last week has seen the Thread. Considering it's their job, that's an obvious conclusion.
Based on the fact that forums don’t even get banners on the raids situation and are getting the news from other people screenshotting Discord, this may be a bolder conclusion than you think.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
We must persevere until the mods see this thread.
They've seen the Thread.
There's no evidence that they have seen this thread, no replies or responses from mods, etc.
There's no evidence a lot of stuff gets reviewed. But it will have been - by a moderator.
There are still some moderators around; but moderators will be checking for stuff that breaks forum rules, and then moving on.
Keeping us happy isn't their job; and providing information to Kabam may not be their job, either. It may literally be above their pay grade.
That's the role of community managers; and the new ones just aren't up to it, yet.
It remains to be seen if they ever will be - the limited evidence available suggests that it isn't a very high priority for them...
If keeping us happy isn't their job then why should we just suck it up and move on? If they have the right to not care enough to even say something then we have a right to continue complaining as much as we want on this thread. Fair trade lol.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
We must persevere until the mods see this thread.
They've seen the Thread.
You're not a forum guardian, stop acting like one.
I'm not. The Thread has been up for 7 days. Anyone visiting the Forum in the last week has seen the Thread. Considering it's their job, that's an obvious conclusion.
Based on the fact that forums don’t even get banners on the raids situation and are getting the news from other people screenshotting Discord, this may be a bolder conclusion than you think.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
We must persevere until the mods see this thread.
They've seen the Thread.
There's no evidence that they have seen this thread, no replies or responses from mods, etc.
There's no evidence a lot of stuff gets reviewed. But it will have been - by a moderator.
There are still some moderators around; but moderators will be checking for stuff that breaks forum rules, and then moving on.
Keeping us happy isn't their job; and providing information to Kabam may not be their job, either. It may literally be above their pay grade.
That's the role of community managers; and the new ones just aren't up to it, yet.
It remains to be seen if they ever will be - the limited evidence available suggests that it isn't a very high priority for them...
If keeping us happy isn't their job then why should we just suck it up and move on? If they have the right to not care enough to even say something then we have a right to continue complaining as much as we want on this thread. Fair trade lol.
Yep, go for it.
I agree with the majority of what you're saying; and I support the ongoing discussion.
My point was to differentiate between basic forum moderators (who almost certainly have noticed a thread 20 pages long, but whose job isn't to keep us happy) from the community managers (whose job is, at least partially, to keep us happy)
The thread is getting read; both by moderators and forum Guardians.
I just don't know if it's being read by the right people.
And if it is getting read by the right people, they clearly don't know how to respond 🤷♂️😟.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
We must persevere until the mods see this thread.
They've seen the Thread.
You're not a forum guardian, stop acting like one.
I'm not. The Thread has been up for 7 days. Anyone visiting the Forum in the last week has seen the Thread. Considering it's their job, that's an obvious conclusion.
Based on the fact that forums don’t even get banners on the raids situation and are getting the news from other people screenshotting Discord, this may be a bolder conclusion than you think.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
We must persevere until the mods see this thread.
They've seen the Thread.
There's no evidence that they have seen this thread, no replies or responses from mods, etc.
There's no evidence a lot of stuff gets reviewed. But it will have been - by a moderator.
There are still some moderators around; but moderators will be checking for stuff that breaks forum rules, and then moving on.
Keeping us happy isn't their job; and providing information to Kabam may not be their job, either. It may literally be above their pay grade.
That's the role of community managers; and the new ones just aren't up to it, yet.
It remains to be seen if they ever will be - the limited evidence available suggests that it isn't a very high priority for them...
If keeping us happy isn't their job then why should we just suck it up and move on? If they have the right to not care enough to even say something then we have a right to continue complaining as much as we want on this thread. Fair trade lol.
Yep, go for it.
I agree with the majority of what you're saying; and I support the ongoing discussion.
My point was to differentiate between basic forum moderators (who almost certainly have noticed a thread 20 pages long, but whose job isn't to keep us happy) from the community managers (whose job is, at least partially, to keep us happy)
The thread is getting read; both by moderators and forum Guardians.
I just don't know if it's being read by the right people.
And if it is getting read by the right people, they clearly don't know how to respond 🤷♂️😟.
That's a fair point, I misunderstood your comment lol I agree with everything you said.
Even if a mod seen this thread (the surely have) what do you expect them to say. "Hey we understand your frustrations but you gotta deal with it. He isn't getting nerfed".
They all know they have nothing to say in this matter. So they probably will never comment on this thread
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
Where in this whole thread did anyone claim they owe us anything?
when you say they're ignoring the thread that implies that we should get a response.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
No it doesn't, it implies we want a response and they can either give us one or not, and people can either be frustrated due to this (us) or not care about it cause you just take whatever they give you (you).
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
no matter how garbage serpent looks right now, i am 99.99% positive that their decision not to nerf him is deliberate, intentional, planned, well thought out, and well reasoned.
our "frustrations" will be soothed in the future and they won't let us drown. they are not dumb enough to leave us without a life preserver. help is coming.
I'm not disputing that, of course it was intentional, doesn't however change the fact that it's **** to pull that off just so you can sell counters if people want to be able to enjoy BGs. I never buy pre-release bundles however I'm pretty much forced to do so with Shathra if I don't want to get wiped out again and again next meta with rich get richer.
You say they're not dumb enough yet DLL already quite literally said there will never be a Galan Peni situation where a defender becomes completely irrelevant due to a hard counter.
i'm not pretending to like serpent. i don't. i'm not prepared to fight him in bgs because i'm not great at deck making and drafting, so i ban him. do i wish he was toned down? yeah, but when was the last time a defender existed in the game with no good counters? let's count.
while there might not be another hulking/peni situation in the future, there will be GOOD counters and this serpent problem won't be as big as it is now. patience, we've been through this so many times and the game's still here and we're still here.
Comments
One thing is certain skill isn’t meant to matter here
I don’t get it. I don’t understand this one, how it’s staying as is. I don’t understand it
Bullseye is nasty. Some other kits can be pretty freaking nasty, especially with nodes
This one isn’t like that. It’s just not
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
They will probably sell a counter at some point too and if we give them dollar money then they will owe us what we paid for.
Glad to see you got the points… it’s definitely because he’s a hard defender, it has nothing to do with the design direction of devaluing skill. I mean there’s only 20 pages here of discussion saying that.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
our "frustrations" will be soothed in the future and they won't let us drown. they are not dumb enough to leave us without a life preserver. help is coming.
There are still some moderators around; but moderators will be checking for stuff that breaks forum rules, and then moving on.
Keeping us happy isn't their job; and providing information to Kabam may not be their job, either. It may literally be above their pay grade.
That's the role of community managers; and the new ones just aren't up to it, yet.
It remains to be seen if they ever will be - the limited evidence available suggests that it isn't a very high priority for them...
I never buy pre-release bundles however I'm pretty much forced to do so with Shathra if I don't want to get wiped out again and again next meta with rich get richer.
You say they're not dumb enough yet DLL already quite literally said there will never be a Galan Peni situation where a defender becomes completely irrelevant due to a hard counter.
I agree with the majority of what you're saying; and I support the ongoing discussion.
My point was to differentiate between basic forum moderators (who almost certainly have noticed a thread 20 pages long, but whose job isn't to keep us happy) from the community managers (whose job is, at least partially, to keep us happy)
The thread is getting read; both by moderators and forum Guardians.
I just don't know if it's being read by the right people.
And if it is getting read by the right people, they clearly don't know how to respond 🤷♂️😟.
They all know they have nothing to say in this matter. So they probably will never comment on this thread
while there might not be another hulking/peni situation in the future, there will be GOOD counters and this serpent problem won't be as big as it is now. patience, we've been through this so many times and the game's still here and we're still here.