How I would tune up Patriot!

As a R3 Sig. 20 Patriot enjoyer I feel like I have enough experience with him to have some sort of opinion on the guy. I personally think he is beyond underrated but he does lack a bit generally speaking. Disclaimer: obviously I have 0 game design knowledge and DLL has given us nothing but banger champs (shh serpent) so there could be very valid reasons anything I say was not initially implemented, however, this is what I would look into or change. Anything stated below isn't necessarily everything he needs in one go, it's just bits and pieces that I've noticed that just feel a bit weak.

A - "While a Science Opponent has a Fury Passive active and Patriot is Blocking, he inflicts a 40% weakness Passive. This Weakness gains up to 100% increased potency based on Patriot’s missing health."
Issue: This part, although mostly obiously made for photon, I've never seen it come up other than against her or a node that happens to line up on a science champ. Other science champs with fury passives include anti-venom and hulk, or jessica, and thing who patriot just isn't good for as he ramps jessica and triggers protection on every hit against thing after resolve.
Solution: This could either expand to any champ with a fury passive, or all science champs regardless of having fury or not, or maybe fury effect rather than just passive. If that encompasses too many champs for balancing issues then its potency could be reduced a bit. Better to have some more often than nothing most of the time.

B - "If a personal Precision is not active, knocking down the Opponent grants Patriot a +[1] precision Passive for 5 seconds"
Issue: This is a great ability and hitting block to pause is great, however knocking down the opponent makes them more prone to throwing a special after standing up, and by that time the precision is essentially gone
Solution: Pausing this precision during opponent's special attacks, or having it start paused for a bit giving some time for the player to get the combo started back up after a heavy makes it a bit more viable

C - "As an Attacker, if Patriot would be struck by a Basic Attack while charging a Heavy Attack, he consumes 7 Resolve to execute a Reversal and gain two personal Precision Passives, and his Fury gains 87% increased duration."
Issue: We are seeing the same AI behavior still that we saw affect Mr Negative's playstyle where the opponent gets super defensive during heavy charge. While there are tricks to make it work it is risky at times and it might not always line up
Solution: Just like beta ray bill, I think adding an infuriate while heavy charging with enough resolve would make this way less risky. Another idea would be making his heavy charge last longer before auto-dropping, such as red skull, professor x, etc.

D - "Special 1: For each multiple of 10 the Combo Meter passes during this attack, the final hit inflicts one [1] physical vulnerability Debuff for 20 seconds, plus another if the Opponent is suffering from a Rupture Debuff."
Issue: While this isn't that big of a thing, the value of these vulnerabilities are low enough that (by my testing) my 5* black panther relic's vulnerabilities are as if you have 1 of patriot's, which seems pretty low. They do feel GREAT when stacking 4-5 of them however, but 2 just don't do much and often go unnoticeable
Solution: Increasing the potency of these debuffs would be great as a general damage starter when doing the sp1 sp2 loop

E - "Special 3: The first three times this attack is used, Patriot reduces the number of Resolve Debuffs consumed by his Reversal by 1 for the rest of the fight."
Issue: I really don't see anywhere when this would be useful. I have tried him in abyss, if you only throw special 3 once to gain some benefit, it isn't worth wasting a loop for a single resolve saved, and if you do all 3 special 3s, that is WAY too much time lost where you might as well just be playing normally and you'd be well ahead in the fight.
Solution: Throwing 1 special 3 and getting the full benefit of the current 3 special 3s would be best for this. Because if you ever get pushed to a special 3 it just feels bad as it is now and a bit of a time waster, instead of it giving a worth advantage.

F - "Signature ability: Against Science Champions, Patriot's Block Proficiency cannot be reduced below where this ability would set it, and the Opponent's Block Penetration is locked to 0."
Issue: Same as the first argument, this really only applies to photon and maybe one other champ I'm missing. While this does work on nodes, it is very unlikely to ever have a node land on a science champ for this, and if it did it's 1 fight on a whole path.
Solution: Since this is a signature ability, I feel like it is important that it encompasses a wider range of champs, such as setting the block penetration to 0 against all classes, but only keeping his block proficiency set against science, then he'd have some benefit against champs that aren't photon.

G - Additions that could make him a competitive choice against other skill champs may include:
- Some sort of Ability Accuracy Reduction based on the amount of resolves on patriot
- Countering evade/autoblock based on the amount of resolves on patriot

Again, this is all from my personal testing in Battlegrounds, Abyss, Story, etc. And where I felt some of his abilities falling short, I would happily take him as he is with no buff but I can't deny that some things would need some tweaks. Feedback is appreciated! If you agree or disagree don't sue me I was bored and wrote this up real quick

Comments

EdisonLaw

#JusticeForTheSkillClass

Squidopus

Always nice to see a post discussing tune-up options from someone who both actually likes the champ as is and thus respects them while actually trying to maintain some reasonability instead of throwing the kitchen sink at the abilities and asserting that they must be made an all-powerful meta monster. I haven’t pulled Patriot at any rarity yet so I can’t really offer any more input of my own, but these seem like perfectly reasonable buffs to a champ that probably feels a little too hyper-specialized and seems to be generally underperforming.

Wolf911

is this the wongtuber Normax?

anyway

i agree with most of the listed things

but they won't be changing B and C that's 101% confirmed by DLL

for B he said that specials are release valves for the precisions to fall off else the damage will be bonkers

for C you just block 1 hit and hold heavy immediately that's the way

he doesn't really need much to make him wayy better than his current form

what I want to change is

give him AAR per resolve or give him long slow passive on sp1

and the 2nd most important thing that he needs is increased power rate per resolve ( for that sp3 cycling )

kingpin has 5% per debuff and he can have 7 of them so 35% is max limit

giving patriot 3% per resolve wouldn't make him any broken at all

the following will be nice to have

increased potency for vulnerability

increased number as well as potency on the ruptures ( he's tagged as offensive: DOT let it reflect in his kit ffs )

EdisonLaw

Always nice to see a post discussing tune-up options from someone who both actually likes the champ as is and thus respects them while actually trying to maintain some reasonability instead of throwing the kitchen sink at the abilities and asserting that they must be made an all-powerful meta monster. I haven’t pulled Patriot at any rarity yet so I can’t really offer any more input of my own, but these seem like perfectly reasonable buffs to a champ that probably feels a little too hyper-specialized and seems to be generally underperforming.

I could see leader get a tune up as well if he’s underperforming (which he may be)

EdisonLaw

As a R3 Sig. 20 Patriot enjoyer I feel like I have enough experience with him to have some sort of opinion on the guy. I personally think he is beyond underrated but he does lack a bit generally speaking. Disclaimer: obviously I have 0 game design knowledge and DLL has given us nothing but banger champs (shh serpent) so there could be very valid reasons anything I say was not initially implemented, however, this is what I would look into or change. Anything stated below isn't necessarily everything he needs in one go, it's just bits and pieces that I've noticed that just feel a bit weak.

A - "While a Science Opponent has a Fury Passive active and Patriot is Blocking, he inflicts a 40% weakness Passive. This Weakness gains up to 100% increased potency based on Patriot’s missing health."
Issue: This part, although mostly obiously made for photon, I've never seen it come up other than against her or a node that happens to line up on a science champ. Other science champs with fury passives include anti-venom and hulk, or jessica, and thing who patriot just isn't good for as he ramps jessica and triggers protection on every hit against thing after resolve.
Solution: This could either expand to any champ with a fury passive, or all science champs regardless of having fury or not, or maybe fury effect rather than just passive. If that encompasses too many champs for balancing issues then its potency could be reduced a bit. Better to have some more often than nothing most of the time.

B - "If a personal Precision is not active, knocking down the Opponent grants Patriot a +[1] precision Passive for 5 seconds"
Issue: This is a great ability and hitting block to pause is great, however knocking down the opponent makes them more prone to throwing a special after standing up, and by that time the precision is essentially gone
Solution: Pausing this precision during opponent's special attacks, or having it start paused for a bit giving some time for the player to get the combo started back up after a heavy makes it a bit more viable

C - "As an Attacker, if Patriot would be struck by a Basic Attack while charging a Heavy Attack, he consumes 7 Resolve to execute a Reversal and gain two personal Precision Passives, and his Fury gains 87% increased duration."
Issue: We are seeing the same AI behavior still that we saw affect Mr Negative's playstyle where the opponent gets super defensive during heavy charge. While there are tricks to make it work it is risky at times and it might not always line up
Solution: Just like beta ray bill, I think adding an infuriate while heavy charging with enough resolve would make this way less risky. Another idea would be making his heavy charge last longer before auto-dropping, such as red skull, professor x, etc.

D - "Special 1: For each multiple of 10 the Combo Meter passes during this attack, the final hit inflicts one [1] physical vulnerability Debuff for 20 seconds, plus another if the Opponent is suffering from a Rupture Debuff."
Issue: While this isn't that big of a thing, the value of these vulnerabilities are low enough that (by my testing) my 5* black panther relic's vulnerabilities are as if you have 1 of patriot's, which seems pretty low. They do feel GREAT when stacking 4-5 of them however, but 2 just don't do much and often go unnoticeable
Solution: Increasing the potency of these debuffs would be great as a general damage starter when doing the sp1 sp2 loop

E - "Special 3: The first three times this attack is used, Patriot reduces the number of Resolve Debuffs consumed by his Reversal by 1 for the rest of the fight."
Issue: I really don't see anywhere when this would be useful. I have tried him in abyss, if you only throw special 3 once to gain some benefit, it isn't worth wasting a loop for a single resolve saved, and if you do all 3 special 3s, that is WAY too much time lost where you might as well just be playing normally and you'd be well ahead in the fight.
Solution: Throwing 1 special 3 and getting the full benefit of the current 3 special 3s would be best for this. Because if you ever get pushed to a special 3 it just feels bad as it is now and a bit of a time waster, instead of it giving a worth advantage.

F - "Signature ability: Against Science Champions, Patriot's Block Proficiency cannot be reduced below where this ability would set it, and the Opponent's Block Penetration is locked to 0."
Issue: Same as the first argument, this really only applies to photon and maybe one other champ I'm missing. While this does work on nodes, it is very unlikely to ever have a node land on a science champ for this, and if it did it's 1 fight on a whole path.
Solution: Since this is a signature ability, I feel like it is important that it encompasses a wider range of champs, such as setting the block penetration to 0 against all classes, but only keeping his block proficiency set against science, then he'd have some benefit against champs that aren't photon.

G - Additions that could make him a competitive choice against other skill champs may include:
- Some sort of Ability Accuracy Reduction based on the amount of resolves on patriot
- Countering evade/autoblock based on the amount of resolves on patriot

Again, this is all from my personal testing in Battlegrounds, Abyss, Story, etc. And where I felt some of his abilities falling short, I would happily take him as he is with no buff but I can't deny that some things would need some tweaks. Feedback is appreciated! If you agree or disagree don't sue me I was bored and wrote this up real quick

Another problem I noticed is that that he is not the best with suicide masteries. Similarly to Daredevil (HK), his regen rate is currently set at 44, which means he will take a lot of Poison damage from the Liquid Courage mastery even with max willpower

EdisonLaw

Here’s my concept

Balance Update: Patriot

Always active - Get Back Up Again
Incoming Weakness, Fatigue and Exhaustion effects and the potency of the Opponent’s Inequity Mastery suffer 76% reduced potency.
For each Debuff on Patriot, he gains +X Attack Rating. Max benefit at 10 Debuffs.
Patriot’s Base Regeneration Rate is 50% and cannot be lowered further.
While an Opponent has a Fury effect active and Patriot is Blocking, he inflicts a 40% Weakness Passive. This Weakness gains up to 100% increased potency based on Patriot’s missing health.

Note: One of the current problems with Patriot is that he is not the best with suicide masteries. Similarly to Daredevil (HK), his regen rate is currently set at 44, which means he will take a lot of Poison damage from the Liquid Courage mastery even with max willpower. To improve this I decided to increase his regen rate to 50% (same as Kingpin), just enough to let him survive with suicides.

Prodigious Tactician

Patriot gains an additional hit in his Combo Meter when striking the Opponent or their Block with a Light Attack or when Blocking an attack.
Patriot starts the fight with an indefinite passive Combo Shield that, when struck, prevents him from losing Combo for 3 seconds before falling off. As a Defender his Shield does not fall off when struck while below 7 Resolve debuffs
\When either Champion Well-Timed Blocks, Patriot gains a Vigilance Passive for 3 seconds.
If a personal Precision is not active, knocking down the Opponent grants Patriot a +X Precision Passive for 5 seconds. Personal Precision effects allow Patriot to land Critical Hits into Block and pause for 0.5 seconds when the Opponent or their Block is struck.

Note: I decided to give Patriot a combo shield on offense that’s similar to Valkyrie. When he is struck, it protects him for a few seconds before falling off.

Heroic Resolve – Debuffs
Resolve Debuffs are indefinite and have no effect. Max stacks: 10.
When the Combo Meter rises past a multiple of 10, Patriot gains one Resolve Debuff and increases his Critical Damage Rating by +X for the rest of the fight.
Whenever a non-Damaging Debuff on Patriot other than Resolve ends for any reason, gain one Resolve Debuff.
When Patriot is struck by the final hit of a Special Attack, he loses one Resolve, or two against Mutants.

Sudden Reversal – While at 7+ Resolve Debuffs

As a Defender, when Patriot would be struck by a Basic Attack, he consumes 7 Resolve to execute a Reversal.
When Reversing, gain a non-stacking Fury Passive increasing Attack Rating by +X for 10 seconds.
As an Attacker, if Patriot would be struck by a Basic Attack while charging a Heavy Attack, he consumes 7 Resolve to execute a Reversal and gain two personal Precision Passives, and his Fury Passive gains 87% increased duration.

Heavy Attacks:
Patriot can charge his Heavy attack for an extended duration
Charging heavy for 3 seconds while Reversal is ready inflicts an Infuriate debuff for 5 seconds

Special attacks:
While the Opponent is standing up after a Reversal, Special attacks are Passively Unblockable

Special 1: Here’s the Windup
Each of the four hits grant +5 additional Combo Meter.
Inflicts a Slow Debuff for 2 seconds per Resolve debuff. Max: 20 seconds
For each multiple of 10 the Combo Meter passed during this attack, the final hit inflicts one Physical Vulnerability Debuff for 20 seconds, plus another if the Opponent is suffering from a Damaging Debuff.

Note: The Slow debuff is another addition to Patriot’s utility and will allow him to better counter Evade and Unstoppable opponents, common within the science class

Special 2: Stars and Stripes
Personal Fury and Precision Passives are paused during the Special and for 10 seconds after.
Projectile hits inflict Bleed Debuffs for 13 seconds. If the non-Mutant opponent is Bleed immune, they are replaced with Rupture debuffs.

Special 3: Adapt and Overcome
Refreshes personal Fury and Precision passives
Once per fight, Patriot reduces the number of Resolve Debuffs consumed by his Reversal by 3 for the rest of the fight.

Signature Ability – To Act Is To Be Committed

Personal Precision Passives gain 40% increased potency.
Each Debuff on Patriot grants +398.4 Block Proficiency.
Against Science champions, Patriot’s Block Proficiency cannot be reduced below where this ability would set it
The Opponent’s Block Penetration is locked to 0
Against non-Mutant Opponents, Patriot gains an indefinite Steadfast Passive while suffering from at least 7 non-Damaging Debuffs. Against Science Champions, this threshold is reduced to 3 non-Damaging Debuffs.