Why does Kabam Hate BGs?

I'm at a loss right now... I'm sure Kabam is aware of the fact that prominent community members like DamnEpicWhale, Trappy, AndrewtheRuff, Lagacy... and I'm sure many others have put out videos discussing the disastrous neglect of BGs over the last 18 months. If I had to recommend any one video, and it's one that's been shared previously on the forums it has to be DamnEpicWhale's

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmKxEWU-ehI&t=113s

He does a great job pleading for Kabam to acknowledge the deficiencies in this mode, and all and all I think he does his best to highlight what he loves about the mode and why these persistent flaws are just so damn discouraging at this point. It is fair, it is constructive, and I sincerely hope they've watched it and taken notes.

What's most shocking about it though, is the absolute SILENCE, from Kabam following these videos, and on post after post after post we see on this topic. In fairness, back in January Pinwheel did offer to collect feedback on a post on what a realistic rewards buff would look like, but then the thread fizzled and looks all but dead and that's pretty much where it stands today. And while that was a nice action for Pinwheel to take too... how would we as the community be able to provide accurate feedback to such a request? It's almost like a doctor asking a patient what medicine would they like to take for a complex illness? The best we can do is tell Kabam, that this doesn't feel good, where it doesn't feel good, and explain why it feels bad. It's really up to them to determine the best treatment plan for it...

But then... I ask myself... why? Why is this necessary for the community to have to point this out, over and over and over again for almost every game mode? BGs is currently the most criminal case, as for a game that strives to be a "FOREVER GAME" as we've been told multiple times during this 10th year run, it seems beyond crazy to me that the mode that reinvigorated the community 3 years ago is being given pre-fairy godmother Cinderella treatment by Kabam. It's clear to us outsiders that this is the fairest Game Mode of them all. It makes anybody that enjoys it care about not only the top tiers of progression but making sure their roster widens to that tier of progression. It makes you CARE insanely about defensive value, so much so that the most celebrated champs of 2024 include Enchantress, who for 99.5% of the community is a pure defender only. When BGS came out, Korg was a niche AW player rank up... now he's considered an amazing investment. And not only do BG force you to care about defense, they force you to care about interactions and "match up" capabilities. Titania is another massive winner from BGs, as her power wasn't really clear until we saw just how many champs she was capable of fighting, and fighting well. But back to the point here... no other mode enforces this level of roster development and engagement with champion kits and node interactions. In AW, you only need a few skilled planners to tell the highly skilled players what to do. In AW you build hyper specific champs you use like broken records over and over and over again with no need to change them. Story content has been nerfed to being essentially Valiant EQ and Valiant EQ doesn't actually exist (although it's nice to hear that's actually coming). But if you wanted a forever chase BGs is that mode as its players chasing players.

So then why? Why is this mode still in Beta? Why are the rewards that were OK when they were last buffed neglected for 18 months now? Why are BGs nodes an after thought?

I don't know...my best guess is that there's an internal dislike of the mode with this level of neglect, as the logical answers fail to explain the why, so I guess it's the illogical speculative guess about preference. But maybe just maybe, there's a whole host of plans to introduce new ways to play BGs, better server stability for the fights, and a rewards identity that's easy to and constantly maintained and Kabam is keeping those cards close to their collective chests. I'd argue it's dangerously too close as it wouldn't hurt for somebody to pop in a few places to tell us "We hear you, and we are working on a number of BGS focused improvements, please bear with us" and that's the part that has me at a loss. Because it's either that... or Kabam is the Evil Stepmother doomed to lose it all in the end since they neglected the fairest MCOC mode of them all.

If you read all that, thanks for your time. It’s probably the last I’ll say on this and probably my longest post by a mile… but I needed to get it out.

Comments

Yodabolt21

BG rewards need to be buffed, no doubt about it. OR at the very least, the store needs a massive update.

BUT, if we buff BG rewards let's face it, the top 200 players are the only ones that will see that benefit. Buffing rewards for less than 1% of players is out of touch. I think that is why they haven't done anything yet. They are trying to figure out how to make a BG reward update for everyone.

My suggestions would be to revamp the solo and alliance events to be useful. Have them gated to progression if need be, because the current milestones are fair for TB and under. Paragon and Valiant need better rewards than a 6* crystal and a minimal amount of a 7* shards. Valiants should be getting a 7* at minimum every season. Add another 1/2 Titan and I think that would be fair. As for rank rewards etc... i really don't know how to make them fair for everyone. The top players should get the best rewards, a fair amount better. But the rewards need to be buffed across all. I would also make the milestone rank rewards a bit less and move those rewards into what bracket you finish in. As an example, if I finish Celestial 5, but only scored 300k points, my rewards are pretty crappy. But if I finish gamma 2 with 600k points, the rewards are far better. I understand the elder marks etc... but the usage of elder marks does not make a single difference in skill or where you finish in BGs. OR, they need to make matches with elder marks significantly more points. At least then it's worth it to use them and Kabam will make some money on people buying them. I sore between 425k-475k every season and always have 6k+ elder marks. Make me use them more by giving me better rewards.

Herbal_Taxman

On the Kabam side, I suspect it’s a situation of too few people and too much work to do. It’s hard to find another reason for them to let their most dynamic and flexible game mode just wither away.

TotemCorruption

I can understand why DamnEpic and other top spenders/players find the top BG rewards stale and useless.
But to me it's like Elon Musk complaining about his taxes.
For a little fish like me, BG rewards have helped me progress more than most other content in the game.
And I'm not even jealous or anything; if Kabam makes the top tier rewards better and these top spenders/players get to widen the gap even further from the lower players, it doesn't really matter.
I was never going to catch up regardless.

Asher1_1

Where is u normally place in GC

Polygon

BG rewards need to be buffed, no doubt about it. OR at the very least, the store needs a massive update.

BUT, if we buff BG rewards let's face it, the top 200 players are the only ones that will see that benefit. Buffing rewards for less than 1% of players is out of touch. I think that is why they haven't done anything yet. They are trying to figure out how to make a BG reward update for everyone.

My suggestions would be to revamp the solo and alliance events to be useful. Have them gated to progression if need be, because the current milestones are fair for TB and under. Paragon and Valiant need better rewards than a 6* crystal and a minimal amount of a 7* shards. Valiants should be getting a 7* at minimum every season. Add another 1/2 Titan and I think that would be fair. As for rank rewards etc... i really don't know how to make them fair for everyone. The top players should get the best rewards, a fair amount better. But the rewards need to be buffed across all. I would also make the milestone rank rewards a bit less and move those rewards into what bracket you finish in. As an example, if I finish Celestial 5, but only scored 300k points, my rewards are pretty crappy. But if I finish gamma 2 with 600k points, the rewards are far better. I understand the elder marks etc... but the usage of elder marks does not make a single difference in skill or where you finish in BGs. OR, they need to make matches with elder marks significantly more points. At least then it's worth it to use them and Kabam will make some money on people buying them. I sore between 425k-475k every season and always have 6k+ elder marks. Make me use them more by giving me better rewards.

Half the people asking for BGs buff rewards dont even realize that its primarily going to benefit the people that place in Mysterium/Celestial. The same way only the top master alliances get a noticable buff when war rewards get buffed. So ultimately its going to lead to a bigger gap in roster for 90% of people on forums that just push to Uru and stop there.

Wouldn't it be better for them to buff rewards that would benefit everyone like EQ, SQ etc? Or the solo/alliance milestones of BGs?

Polygon

Also nice clickbait title OP, seems a little desperate

BigBlueOx

It’s not just rewards that need attention though. And rewards to to be buffed in a way that healthy across the board, not just in a way the creates unsustainable gaps between C5+ players, M+ players and the rest of the community. That’s why it’s not something I think players can accurately provide input on as to how to do this.

The mode itself needs TLC and innovation too. Matchmaking shouldn’t take 10 minutes just to hopefully have a bug free experience. I’d love to see what other types of experiences could be built around this. Week long team play that’s a hybrid of AW and Bags in a way? Reoccurring in game tournaments with seeding? I’m sure more can be done here. And almost any of it would create positive attention for the game as a whole.

TotemCorruption

Also nice clickbait title OP, seems a little desperate

Bro, have some sympathy on these legendary whales, they might act tough, but they're hurting right now....

BigBlueOx

Also nice clickbait title OP, seems a little desperate

I mean if 18+ months without a meaningful update to any primary element of the mode doesn’t classify as a desperate situation, what does in today’s limited attention based economy?

BringPopcorn

I think its a situation that snowballed too big. They can't update every reward at once cause the "economy" would go to ****. Pushing it slowly wouldnt have addressed the discontent anyway, and here we are...

GrabmeMCOC

BGs is a free game mode. It’s not monetised. You can get 90% of the rewards by completing the Victory Track and then 1 fight in GC.

It is also not noob friendly, and it’s the noobs that collectively spend the most money. Individual whales spend hundreds and thousands. But collectively, the noobs spend thousands and thousands trying to catch up.

If you’re ever in doubt. Start a new account and see how many offers get thrown your way.

Then during ‘sales events’ (the word events for this BS is laughable (as is a voting event but whatever)), they target the progression slightly below end game, why?? Because they’re desperate to milk people who are trying to catch up.

TL:DR

BGs is a non profit game mode that’s overrun by endgame players and grinders.

PT_99

BGs is a free game mode. It’s not monetised. You can get 90% of the rewards by completing the Victory Track and then 1 fight in GC.

It is also not noob friendly, and it’s the noobs that collectively spend the most money. Individual whales spend hundreds and thousands. But collectively, the noobs spend thousands and thousands trying to catch up.

If you’re ever in doubt. Start a new account and see how many offers get thrown your way.

Then during ‘sales events’ (the word events for this BS is laughable (as is a voting event but whatever)), they target the progression slightly below end game, why?? Because they’re desperate to milk people who are trying to catch up.

TL:DR

BGs is a non profit game mode that’s overrun by endgame players and grinders.

Who do you think is buying OP pre release bundles,
Who do you think is buying all the sales offers?

BG and war players because otherwise there's literally no reason to build 7r3 7r4 decks

Remember that 500 dollars count Nefaria sales, who you think bought those?

ItsClobberinTime

BG rewards need to be buffed, no doubt about it. OR at the very least, the store needs a massive update.

BUT, if we buff BG rewards let's face it, the top 200 players are the only ones that will see that benefit. Buffing rewards for less than 1% of players is out of touch. I think that is why they haven't done anything yet. They are trying to figure out how to make a BG reward update for everyone.

My suggestions would be to revamp the solo and alliance events to be useful. Have them gated to progression if need be, because the current milestones are fair for TB and under. Paragon and Valiant need better rewards than a 6* crystal and a minimal amount of a 7* shards. Valiants should be getting a 7* at minimum every season. Add another 1/2 Titan and I think that would be fair. As for rank rewards etc... i really don't know how to make them fair for everyone. The top players should get the best rewards, a fair amount better. But the rewards need to be buffed across all. I would also make the milestone rank rewards a bit less and move those rewards into what bracket you finish in. As an example, if I finish Celestial 5, but only scored 300k points, my rewards are pretty crappy. But if I finish gamma 2 with 600k points, the rewards are far better. I understand the elder marks etc... but the usage of elder marks does not make a single difference in skill or where you finish in BGs. OR, they need to make matches with elder marks significantly more points. At least then it's worth it to use them and Kabam will make some money on people buying them. I sore between 425k-475k every season and always have 6k+ elder marks. Make me use them more by giving me better rewards.
Half the people asking for BGs buff rewards dont even realize that its primarily going to benefit the people that place in Mysterium/Celestial. The same way only the top master alliances get a noticable buff when war rewards get buffed. So ultimately its going to lead to a bigger gap in roster for 90% of people on forums that just push to Uru and stop there.

Wouldn't it be better for them to buff rewards that would benefit everyone like EQ, SQ etc? Or the solo/alliance milestones of BGs?

This isn't just about Celestial rewards tho, milestone rewards (including rank rewards) are terrible too, store is as outdated as can be, and for some weird reason every single league (including VT) still gives us relic shards and alloys when nobody cares about that stuff at this point and should've been replaced with something else a while ago.

ItsClobberinTime

I can understand why DamnEpic and other top spenders/players find the top BG rewards stale and useless.
But to me it's like Elon Musk complaining about his taxes.
For a little fish like me, BG rewards have helped me progress more than most other content in the game.
And I'm not even jealous or anything; if Kabam makes the top tier rewards better and these top spenders/players get to widen the gap even further from the lower players, it doesn't really matter.
I was never going to catch up regardless.

I've remained almost completely f2p since I started playing, I'm about 6 months behind compared to everyone else because I missed the Banquet as well as the entire Autumn of Agony, and I also think BGs isnoutdated. I don't know why a lot of people on this thread are assuming this is only about Celestial rewards, it's not, this is about all rewards you get forms BGs in general the entire mode needs a revamp.

BigBlueOx

BGs is a free game mode. It’s not monetised. You can get 90% of the rewards by completing the Victory Track and then 1 fight in GC.

It is also not noob friendly, and it’s the noobs that collectively spend the most money. Individual whales spend hundreds and thousands. But collectively, the noobs spend thousands and thousands trying to catch up.

If you’re ever in doubt. Start a new account and see how many offers get thrown your way.

Then during ‘sales events’ (the word events for this BS is laughable (as is a voting event but whatever)), they target the progression slightly below end game, why?? Because they’re desperate to milk people who are trying to catch up.

TL:DR

BGs is a non profit game mode that’s overrun by endgame players and grinders.
Who do you think is buying OP pre release bundles,
Who do you think is buying all the sales offers?

BG and war players because otherwise there's literally no reason to build 7r3 7r4 decks

Remember that 500 dollars count Nefaria sales, who you think bought those?

Exactly. It’s the only mode that’s truly built around roster progression and expansion at scale.

It’s why everyone ran out and got Bullseye, Serpent and Enchantress pre-release bundles too. Meta champs matter more here.

It drives spending arguing more than any other mode..: it’s another element of this current situation that is just so damn confusing.

TotemCorruption

I can understand why DamnEpic and other top spenders/players find the top BG rewards stale and useless.
But to me it's like Elon Musk complaining about his taxes.
For a little fish like me, BG rewards have helped me progress more than most other content in the game.
And I'm not even jealous or anything; if Kabam makes the top tier rewards better and these top spenders/players get to widen the gap even further from the lower players, it doesn't really matter.
I was never going to catch up regardless.

I've remained almost completely f2p since I started playing, I'm about 6 months behind compared to everyone else because I missed the Banquet as well as the entire Autumn of Agony, and I also think BGs isnoutdated. I don't know why a lot of people on this thread are assuming this is only about Celestial rewards, it's not, this is about all rewards you get forms BGs in general the entire mode needs a revamp.

I'm talking about the standard BG rewards, which is like the 100k or more tokens we get each season for doing the objectives and finishing somewhere in lower tier of GC, I'm just comparing that to like incursion rewards or loyalty store (750k for one T6B??) or the traders outpost, etc.
You can say the BG store/rewards don't satisfy you, but relatively speaking, other content in the game needs a reward update way more desperately I think, at least for Valiants...

BigBlueOx

I can understand why DamnEpic and other top spenders/players find the top BG rewards stale and useless.
But to me it's like Elon Musk complaining about his taxes.
For a little fish like me, BG rewards have helped me progress more than most other content in the game.
And I'm not even jealous or anything; if Kabam makes the top tier rewards better and these top spenders/players get to widen the gap even further from the lower players, it doesn't really matter.
I was never going to catch up regardless.

I've remained almost completely f2p since I started playing, I'm about 6 months behind compared to everyone else because I missed the Banquet as well as the entire Autumn of Agony, and I also think BGs isnoutdated. I don't know why a lot of people on this thread are assuming this is only about Celestial rewards, it's not, this is about all rewards you get forms BGs in general the entire mode needs a revamp.
I'm talking about the standard BG rewards, which is like the 100k or more tokens we get each season for doing the objectives and finishing somewhere in lower tier of GC, I'm just comparing that to like incursion rewards or loyalty store (750k for one T6B??) or the traders outpost, etc.
You can say the BG store/rewards don't satisfy you, but relatively speaking, other content in the game needs a reward update way more desperately I think, at least for Valiants...

You seem really fixated on the rewards element… that’s BGs smallest problem and probably the easiest fit to fix. Dangle small amounts of T7b and people will chase. But that still ignores the plethora of other items not explored or maximized in the mode.

ItsClobberinTime

I can understand why DamnEpic and other top spenders/players find the top BG rewards stale and useless.
But to me it's like Elon Musk complaining about his taxes.
For a little fish like me, BG rewards have helped me progress more than most other content in the game.
And I'm not even jealous or anything; if Kabam makes the top tier rewards better and these top spenders/players get to widen the gap even further from the lower players, it doesn't really matter.
I was never going to catch up regardless.

I've remained almost completely f2p since I started playing, I'm about 6 months behind compared to everyone else because I missed the Banquet as well as the entire Autumn of Agony, and I also think BGs isnoutdated. I don't know why a lot of people on this thread are assuming this is only about Celestial rewards, it's not, this is about all rewards you get forms BGs in general the entire mode needs a revamp.
I'm talking about the standard BG rewards, which is like the 100k or more tokens we get each season for doing the objectives and finishing somewhere in lower tier of GC, I'm just comparing that to like incursion rewards or loyalty store (750k for one T6B??) or the traders outpost, etc.
You can say the BG store/rewards don't satisfy you, but relatively speaking, other content in the game needs a reward update way more desperately I think, at least for Valiants...

As a Valiant myself no, what I need right now are r2s and r3s 7* anything less has no value for me anymore, even r2s are kind of a stretch cause most GC players already have at the very least 15-20 r3s. What is my biggest source for these materials? BGs store and AQ but we know they don't care about AQ so that's why I haven't mentioned the glory store in any of my comments.