Boss Rush, but wait, something different...

Sundance_2099

Is it just me, or does anyone else feel that it's a bit unfair that there's only one level of Boss Rush? Like, sure alla y'all endgame players who've skipped and danced through Acts 5 and 6 and who frolic through UC difficulties month-in-month-out get to do it. But what about the lesser players who're still fighting to get to Uncollected, or who are only Conqueror or Proven or even lower? What do we lesser mortals get? sweet fanny adams, that's what. I know, I know, "git gud" or "not all content is for all players", but when they make something special for IWD like this, it's rather pants that only one chunk of the player base gets catered to.

I just feel like there ought to be a top tier BR for 10k 5* shards and stuff for the endgame players and then maybe a couple easier levels, say one worth 5k 5* shards or 4k 4* shards for the middle levels and one worth 4k 3* shards for the lowest levels.

Comments

Etm34

I think they don’t do it like that mainly so the endgame players don’t just run through 3 or so difficulties and gain 15k+ shards. Doing it that way would even further the gap between endgame players and the average one.

Oesername123

Most of these "endgame players" experienced the same struggle you guys are experiencing when the previous versions were out. It's part of the process of growing your account.

Plus, players have clearly shown that it's doable with 4* because it was made for Uncollected level players, which I'm sure is a good portion of the players playing this game.

Bugmat78

As someone who did the last boss rush (with a bit of difficulty..maybe twice

) and this one (which was much easier to me this time around), it is definitely all about progress. I failed to complete the special event they had early last year with the 2 chapters for the 5* awakening gem (the one with about 8 paths and one boss per section) - did the first 3 parts and couldn't do the last one.

It is all about progress.

Raganator

I'm fairly certain that "endgame" players would take increased difficulty and increased rewards for the boss rush challenges. 10k 5* shards are not geared towards endgame players - its a nice bonus is how I would describe it.

Colinwhitworth69

There is content designed for the veteran players that lesser experienced players cannot handle. For example, last year I could not complete the boss rush, giving up after the second or third fight. This year I did it without any revives and only a little but of health potions for one champ.

Think of it as something to aspire to. I had the same reaction as you when they came out with the variants, because the difficulty levels are either stupid easy or extremely challenging. No in between. But now, after playing for two years, I can tackle the variants, although not easily.

You'll get there.

Kerneas

Don't lesser players still get objectives? Besides, this boss rush is quite okay to do. There is enough content released for almost all players (except the very endgamers. They rush through everything and then complain)

Werewrym

Most of these "endgame players" experienced the same struggle you guys are experiencing when the previous versions were out. It's part of the process of growing your account.

Plus, players have clearly shown that it's doable with 4* because it was made for Uncollected level players, which I'm sure is a good portion of the players playing this game.

Not to mention that it’s easier than it ever was to progress in the game these days. 4-5 years ago when I was growing my account things were much more difficult. People have it so easy and still find things to complain about.

CaptainPoll

There is content designed for the veteran players that lesser experienced players cannot handle. For example, last year I could not complete the boss rush, giving up after the second or third fight. This year I did it without any revives and only a little but of health potions for one champ.

Think of it as something to aspire to. I had the same reaction as you when they came out with the variants, because the difficulty levels are either stupid easy or extremely challenging. No in between. But now, after playing for two years, I can tackle the variants, although not easily.

You'll get there.

i also shared op's thoughts. but now i thnk u have got a point. ur absolutely correct, its all part of the journey and its not neccessary that everyone might be able to do it

GroundedWisdom

Typically, the Boss Rush is a very specific piece of content with stronger Champs. Challenges are different. They usually come in varying levels, all the way up to the hardest.

Dshu

Its supposed to be a boss rush and you want reduced difficulty? What would you suggest for difficulty? Saying make it easier for lesser rosters is a statement that leaves a lot of grey area. If they took off 1 node from each champ (depending on the node removed) you could actually make this harder. Or are you suggesting they drop it down to all 2* champs with no nodes or boosts and remove special attacks so everyone including brand new players can complete it? I'm not sure it would qualify as a boss rush at that point but I guess everyone can get their participation trophy that way. Please elaborate on what the scaling level should be to include all players in the game and the rewards that fairly fit that level of difficulty.

TP33

I think the idea is that for something like international women’s day they could have included a little side quest or something else, not just make one thing for one type of player and be done with it

Dshu

I think the idea is that for something like international women’s day they could have included a little side quest or something else, not just make one thing for one type of player and be done with it

In case you missed it they included solo objectives for women's day that don't require you to do the boss rush. Those can be done by anyone at any level of the game and reward shards.

DarthPhal

I think they should allow players who haven’t started act 5 yet a chance to attempt the Web Slinger boss rush, so those players can get a taste of the content act 6 players got to dance through when they only had 4* champs.

Chadhogan

I think that boss rush challenges have been a good marker of where you are in the game. As you hone your skills and develop your roster they get easier every time one comes round but I don't think they should change anything it's good how it is.

Dshu

I think they should allow players who haven’t started act 5 yet a chance to attempt the Web Slinger boss rush, so those players can get a taste of the content act 6 players got to dance through when they only had 4* champs.

They would have to remove emma frost and venom from their roster to be anywhere close to accurate

unknown

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dot_ditto

As a "not an endgame player", I can easily say, I'm not concerned about not having a "boss rush" for my level of ability .. there SOOOO much to do at my level (mid game, Uncollected) ... I don't want more grind to consume my time

LOL

That all said, I've enjoyed reviewing the boss rush nodes and setups .. watching the youtubers showing how to tackle them and such .. it helps my game play by learning "dirty little tricks" here and there

And yes, sometime later in the month, I probably will actually "try" a few fights on boss rush to see how I do and test myself ... but I won't hold my breath on having any chance to complete it!!!

unknown

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Dshu

Maybe they should do it like the variants, where there is the original easy level difficult and then there is the Endgame level difficult with the awesome rewards that come with it.

So the Boss Rush can continue to have the Top Tier Endgame difficulty with the 10k in 5* shards as a reward. And then a “no node” version with a PHC as a reward for those that can’t complete the content with Endgame difficulty

A boss rush involves boss level fights. Take away the nodes and you have a lane in eq without a boss. Also if they take away the nodes they would have to reduce the rewards. With no nodes they would probably not give more than half a phc. Then the forum will be full of complaints about unfair rewards. Added to that it removes all the effort the ladies put into designing the fight. There is no shame in not being able to beat it but asking for a participation trophy seems petty.

DNA3000

Think of it as something to aspire to.

This is a large part of it right here. The boss rush is something to aspire to, and if it was just one rung on a ladder of twelve different boss rush difficulties then it would be much less special of an accomplishment.

*Most* of the content in the game does have progression tiers. The boss rush and events like it are the very few non-permanent content that doesn't. That's intentional: it serves a purpose that laddered content doesn't, in being deliberately all or nothing.

The rewards are not spectacular because they aren't supposed to be. Most of the fun in doing it is supposed to be in completing it, not basking in the enormous rewards contained in it. That means players who haven't progressed enough to be able to tackle it aren't missing much if they can't do it. They don't have to pressure themselves into spending tons of units just to get over it. They can try it, see they can't do it, and then skip it and wait for the next one. You get way more rewards from normal progressional content, which means focusing on those will allow you to close the gap on the difficulty of content like this.

unknown

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Dshu

Maybe they should do it like the variants, where there is the original easy level difficult and then there is the Endgame level difficult with the awesome rewards that come with it.

So the Boss Rush can continue to have the Top Tier Endgame difficulty with the 10k in 5* shards as a reward. And then a “no node” version with a PHC as a reward for those that can’t complete the content with Endgame difficulty

A boss rush involves boss level fights. Take away the nodes and you have a lane in eq without a boss. Also if they take away the nodes they would have to reduce the rewards. With no nodes they would probably not give more than half a phc. Then the forum will be full of complaints about unfair rewards. Added to that it removes all the effort the ladies put into designing the fight. There is no shame in not being able to beat it but asking for a participation trophy seems petty.
I think I need to work on my sarcasm more. In the current state of the game a PHC is pretty worthless so was trying to say (although put it across poorly) that if anyone wants an “easier” version of the Boss Rush it should be a training wheels version that doesn’t offer anything remotely useable as a joke. Boss Rush absolutely should remain with the same difficulty. I’ve completed the last 2 with ease. Couldn’t complete any before that, didn’t have the skill set or champs. I was frustrated I couldn’t complete them, only because I wanted to be at the level of someone who could complete them. Ability to understand the nodes is half the battle with these. Boss rushes are a good benchmark of where you are in the game, there shouldn’t be multiple difficulties.
I agree it definitely gives you a reality check. I've been doing them fairly easily since the chloe's challenge. That one kicked my backside. I'd love to see them bring back the older boss rushes even without rewards just to see the difference in my skills and roster development.

PsyLife

Why do I feel like endgame players more commonly complain about mid game players complaining about nothing to do than mid game players complains about not having enough to do?

Also, the mid game roster and skills has act 5 and Master difficulty. Act 5 is too hard for most, and master difficulty can get boring to grind out constantly to “gain skill”. It’s just those few things like boss rushes that make the game more fun. Oh, and we get objectives, while you guys get a new challenge. I’m not even at level 40 yet, so I can’t even try. I feel like it’s kinda weird how most of this community who are endgamers don’t like new people getting rewards. If I introduce one of my friends to this game, and one of them gets a four star really quickly, I would be happy about them being able to catch up to my roster level so that we could discuss our thoughts on new content. I don’t get people who say “we had it harder, they should to.” It’s kinda stupid. I get not having a variant difficulty, but I play a lot of other games too and watch all you tubers and look at the comments, and they are always trying to help people progress and have fun. I’m getting bored of this game, but I still have hope in Kabam to give the mid game players a new challenge that would be fun for them to experience. Maybe to prevent end gamers from getting extra rewards, they could lock each one to only specific star ratings/ranks. I would even be fine with not getting rewards for it, just as a challenge in this game.

Dshu

Why do I feel like endgame players more commonly complain about mid game players complaining about nothing to do than mid game players complains about not having enough to do?

Also, the mid game roster and skills has act 5 and Master difficulty. Act 5 is too hard for most, and master difficulty can get boring to grind out constantly to “gain skill”. It’s just those few things like boss rushes that make the game more fun. Oh, and we get objectives, while you guys get a new challenge. I’m not even at level 40 yet, so I can’t even try. I feel like it’s kinda weird how most of this community who are endgamers don’t like new people getting rewards. If I introduce one of my friends to this game, and one of them gets a four star really quickly, I would be happy about them being able to catch up to my roster level so that we could discuss our thoughts on new content. I don’t get people who say “we had it harder, they should to.” It’s kinda stupid. I get not having a variant difficulty, but I play a lot of other games too and watch all you tubers and look at the comments, and they are always trying to help people progress and have fun. I’m getting bored of this game, but I still have hope in Kabam to give the mid game players a new challenge that would be fun for them to experience. Maybe to prevent end gamers from getting extra rewards, they could lock each one to only specific star ratings/ranks. I would even be fine with not getting rewards for it, just as a challenge in this game.

This whole post makes no sense. You say mid game players have act 5 and master eq but they are too hard but then want more rewards for doing what? You want to block people who can do content from getting rewards and reward people who can't complete content. What kind of backwards strategy are you trying to say we need.

PsyLife

I’m saying that as a possibilty, but the overall main point is just a challenge for mid gamers that will help them build skills, practice against new nodes and make the game feel like they care about you. Right now it feels like they release a lot of new content for beginners and endgamers, but mid gamers just play the stuff already there.

Thecrusher_9756

I’m saying that as a possibilty, but the overall main point is just a challenge for mid gamers that will help them build skills, practice against new nodes and make the game feel like they care about you. Right now it feels like they release a lot of new content for beginners and endgamers, but mid gamers just play the stuff already there.

It wouldn’t make sense for them to release so much “mid tier” content. Like you said you already have act 5 and the likes and that’s permanent so you can do it when you’re ready. Everyone at the end game didn’t get their magically they were in your situation once upon a time. If they keep focusing on mid tier players, end game players won’t spend (and they rake in the most money) and many will leave because content won’t be fun and exciting anymore.

DNA3000

I’m saying that as a possibilty, but the overall main point is just a challenge for mid gamers that will help them build skills, practice against new nodes and make the game feel like they care about you. Right now it feels like they release a lot of new content for beginners and endgamers, but mid gamers just play the stuff already there.

It seems completely different to the beginners and endgame players.

Most of the game is actually more appropriate to the mid tiers than anything else. That's actually a fundamental design rule that virtually all games as a service obey. The focus is on the middle. They keep accelerating beginners to get them to the middle, and they deliberately slow down the end gamers so they can't accelerate too far ahead of the middle. The middle is where most of the action is.

The Boss Rush itself is not end game content. It is intended to be extremely challenging for mid-tier players at or about to become Uncollected. When people say that things like the Boss Rush aren't meant for "middle" tier players, what they generally mean is that it is too hard for middle tier players. But that's on purpose: what you see as "too hard" the game devs see as "extremely challenging."

I can tell you that when I was involved with the Boss Rush last year, I specifically asked what target I should be designing for. What I was told was that the content I designed should be very challenging for players with well-developed 4* rosters. That's the target for the Boss Rushes: 5/50s. Does that mean everyone with 5/50s should be able to do it? No. That means it should be very challenging for that category of player, which means many of them will fail. But some percentage will succeed.

I think of the Boss Rush like honors or AP high school classes. They are obviously intended for high school students not college students or graduate students. But that doesn't mean all high school students can pass that class. It is intended for high school students, but intended to be very difficult for most of them by design. When someone looks at those classes, they could say they aren't fair, that they are clearly intended for college graduates because only college graduates could hope to be able to do the work at a reasonable level of effort. But that misses the point of those classes.

PsyLife

I dunno. Maybe boss rushes aren’t the place for it, but there should be a piece of content for everybody that will give each and every player some sort of way to grow their roster and skills to play and maybe that should be an ultimate goal. Maybe in the end, Kabam will reveal thoughts for a new AI system. I could fight winter soldier in rol for days, but 5 fights into 5.1.1 and I’m dead. Maybe the solution is a training ground.

I am not trying to come off as annoying of dumb, I’m trying to have a discussion about the state of the game.

PsyLife

The suggestion I made is just an idea, and don’t comment about it being unlikely. I am just putting ideas out there.

DNA3000

I dunno. Maybe boss rushes aren’t the place for it, but there should be a piece of content for everybody that will give each and every player some sort of way to grow their roster and skills to play and maybe that should be an ultimate goal.

That's literally the entire rest of the game, from the monthly quests to the story acts to the other tiered special events. That's where everyone else grows their roster and practices their skills.

As to Act 5.1.1, that's the Flare map. You have to think about what that node does; it isn't just about practicing your way past it. I used Rogue on that map. Rogue's SP1 health steal scales with her damage, so instead of recovering about 5% of her health per SP1 she's going to be grabbing more like 20% health per SP1; more if she crits.

You can also use other reliable healers, especially if they have class advantage in that fight. But you can't completely eliminate the degeneration damage, so you have to deal with it somehow. That requires a combination of good play and selecting the best champs for the paths you take.

In general, Act 5 is as much about finding the right strategy and roster selection to deal with the nodes as it is practicing how to fight against them. I don't see how a training room would help players do better in Act 5.1.1, when Act 5.1.1 itself is a pretty good training room for that purpose. It might be difficult for players that just finished Act 4, but it isn't so much more difficult that there needs to be a wedge between Act 4 and Act 5.1 Act 5.1 itself serves as a good way to get better at Act 5.1.