General Game Feedback [Merged Threads]

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  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,575 ★★★★★
    I could see certain Paths. Since there are 6 per Chapter (assuming that structure is still being used), each Quest could have one Path which requires a specific Rarity. Quest 1 has a Path for only 1*s. Quest 2 has one for 2*s.....
    The entire Chapter, not so much.
  • H3t3rH3t3r Member, Guardian Posts: 2,882 Guardian

    I could see certain Paths. Since there are 6 per Chapter (assuming that structure is still being used), each Quest could have one Path which requires a specific Rarity. Quest 1 has a Path for only 1*s. Quest 2 has one for 2*s.....
    The entire Chapter, not so much.

    Wrong you are. And how would one path be orientated for 1* while the rest are for 5 and 6* how would the boss be scaled?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,575 ★★★★★
    edited May 2020
    H3t3r said:

    I could see certain Paths. Since there are 6 per Chapter (assuming that structure is still being used), each Quest could have one Path which requires a specific Rarity. Quest 1 has a Path for only 1*s. Quest 2 has one for 2*s.....
    The entire Chapter, not so much.

    Wrong you are. And how would one path be orientated for 1* while the rest are for 5 and 6* how would the boss be scaled?
    You can bring more than one Champ. You could also design a separate Boss for that matter. You could make Requirements for individual Fights. You could even Gate it with a Key to prevent too easy of an initial Completion. There are many ways if you have creative license.
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  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,575 ★★★★★

    H3t3r said:

    I could see certain Paths. Since there are 6 per Chapter (assuming that structure is still being used), each Quest could have one Path which requires a specific Rarity. Quest 1 has a Path for only 1*s. Quest 2 has one for 2*s.....
    The entire Chapter, not so much.

    Wrong you are. And how would one path be orientated for 1* while the rest are for 5 and 6* how would the boss be scaled?
    You can bring more than one Champ. You could also design a separate Boss for that matter. You could make Requirements for individual Fights. You could even Gate it with a Key to prevent too easy of an initial Completion. There are many ways if you have creative license.
    They could just as well do one rarity per quest/chapter instead of reinventing the wheel. The former evidently works considering variant 4.
    That's an idea.
  • r_amar_ama Member Posts: 6
    Amadeo01 said:

    @r_ama

    As for removing the unit cost, I totally agree, we've already spent all the units buying the cores to unlock, why do we need to keep paying every time to switch? But I can pretty much guarantee that this cost will never be removed. For obvious reasons.

    Yeah, I get why they haven't removed that cost. Regardless, I really feel like it shouldn't be there considering that it can cost over 1000 units to unlock one level of certain masteries.

  • Wakandas_FinestWakandas_Finest Member Posts: 859 ★★★★

    xNig said:

    Bulmkt said:

    the best content Kabam have put in this game to date has been Variant 4

    the requirement to use champs from all Star rating levels was excellent and they need more it.

    Except it was so easy that almost everyone with a decent roster can explore it.
    That's the whole point, and it's the number one reason people aren't happy with the Gates. It makes the content not for everyone. Everyone and their dog got through Uncollected. It's not even a challenge now. All people need to do is look up some YouTube and they can do it within a matter of months of starting the game.
    It's also worth pointing out that Seatin makes content that caters to a certain demographic learning how to get through content, and that's most likely a motivating factor for the stance against Gates. However, it's not meant for the average Roster. (I don't even want to get into 2*s in Book 2.)
    There would have been nothing wrong with kabam making 2* viable in Book 2. In fact it would have been entirely consistent with their constant claims of wanting summoners to use more of their rosters and not just in arenas or niche content like variants
    I don't agree with that line of thinking at all. Progression-wise, I don't expect to use lower Champs in progressively higher Story content. While I will agree that the Gates between Act 5 and Act 6 are extreme, I don't see going backwards as something that logically happens. There are many ways to create content for lower, unused Champs. This isn't one of them that I see. To be perfectly honest, it leaves me scratching my head.
    Ahh but your vision is too narrow kabam could and probably should have installed progression gates based on roster size. For example a summoner would have to be level 60, have completed (not explored) acts 1-6, have (x) amount of 5* champs and (x) amount of 6* champs before accessing Book 2. They could even take it further and say the PI of your 5* and above roster must be (x) amount. This would ensure players would have progressed far enough to tackle more difficult content while preventing the average player from accessing content meant for end game players.

    A very serious buff to rewards would motivate players to progress their roster rather than focus on ranking up a handful of champs to complete content. It also prevents those who are lucky with RNG and those who throw thousands at cav crystals from accessing content too early because even if you get champs you still would have to rank them up plus progress through other content first. Kabam already has a broad progression gate on incursions as well as the monthly AQ.

    A progression gate would also give kabam the freedom to start over with Book 2 allowing sufficiently experienced players to use more of their rosters without the worry that new or average players would access it and progress too fast.
    There's still going to be a certain amount of waiting for specific Champs. That's part of the RNG structure. I'm sure making it 2* oriented means everyone has everything they need, but there's no logical reason to regress to using 2*s in it. The game is one that's based on RNG. It's been that way for 5 and a half years. The second we start discussing removing that element, we start talking about deconstructing the entire game itself and designing a new one.
    Again your thinking is too narrow. If kabam allowed players to use their 1/2/3/4* champs across the first 3/4 chapters Of book 2 while offering rewards meant to build their 5/6* rosters for the latter chapters it would help to combat the RNG. Kabam could easily create node combinations that would make the game challenging even using 1-4* champs variant 4 proved this. Just because the story progresses doesn’t mean kabam has to trap itself in an insane upward spiral of difficulty. Besides what’s the point of forcing players to hold on to their lower star champs on the off chance they’ll have a use for them once or twice a year? Why continue to have them in rewards?

  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,575 ★★★★★

    xNig said:

    Bulmkt said:

    the best content Kabam have put in this game to date has been Variant 4

    the requirement to use champs from all Star rating levels was excellent and they need more it.

    Except it was so easy that almost everyone with a decent roster can explore it.
    That's the whole point, and it's the number one reason people aren't happy with the Gates. It makes the content not for everyone. Everyone and their dog got through Uncollected. It's not even a challenge now. All people need to do is look up some YouTube and they can do it within a matter of months of starting the game.
    It's also worth pointing out that Seatin makes content that caters to a certain demographic learning how to get through content, and that's most likely a motivating factor for the stance against Gates. However, it's not meant for the average Roster. (I don't even want to get into 2*s in Book 2.)
    There would have been nothing wrong with kabam making 2* viable in Book 2. In fact it would have been entirely consistent with their constant claims of wanting summoners to use more of their rosters and not just in arenas or niche content like variants
    I don't agree with that line of thinking at all. Progression-wise, I don't expect to use lower Champs in progressively higher Story content. While I will agree that the Gates between Act 5 and Act 6 are extreme, I don't see going backwards as something that logically happens. There are many ways to create content for lower, unused Champs. This isn't one of them that I see. To be perfectly honest, it leaves me scratching my head.
    Ahh but your vision is too narrow kabam could and probably should have installed progression gates based on roster size. For example a summoner would have to be level 60, have completed (not explored) acts 1-6, have (x) amount of 5* champs and (x) amount of 6* champs before accessing Book 2. They could even take it further and say the PI of your 5* and above roster must be (x) amount. This would ensure players would have progressed far enough to tackle more difficult content while preventing the average player from accessing content meant for end game players.

    A very serious buff to rewards would motivate players to progress their roster rather than focus on ranking up a handful of champs to complete content. It also prevents those who are lucky with RNG and those who throw thousands at cav crystals from accessing content too early because even if you get champs you still would have to rank them up plus progress through other content first. Kabam already has a broad progression gate on incursions as well as the monthly AQ.

    A progression gate would also give kabam the freedom to start over with Book 2 allowing sufficiently experienced players to use more of their rosters without the worry that new or average players would access it and progress too fast.
    There's still going to be a certain amount of waiting for specific Champs. That's part of the RNG structure. I'm sure making it 2* oriented means everyone has everything they need, but there's no logical reason to regress to using 2*s in it. The game is one that's based on RNG. It's been that way for 5 and a half years. The second we start discussing removing that element, we start talking about deconstructing the entire game itself and designing a new one.
    Again your thinking is too narrow. If kabam allowed players to use their 1/2/3/4* champs across the first 3/4 chapters Of book 2 while offering rewards meant to build their 5/6* rosters for the latter chapters it would help to combat the RNG. Kabam could easily create node combinations that would make the game challenging even using 1-4* champs variant 4 proved this. Just because the story progresses doesn’t mean kabam has to trap itself in an insane upward spiral of difficulty. Besides what’s the point of forcing players to hold on to their lower star champs on the off chance they’ll have a use for them once or twice a year? Why continue to have them in rewards?

    You don't think 3-4 Chapters which use 1-4* Champs and give 6* Rewards is a bit too much? Asking for something along the lines of using Champs on the shelf is reasonable. 4 Chapters of it is pretty much pushing it.
  • REVELATIONS68REVELATIONS68 Member Posts: 28
    Who cares if seatin leaves the game? I mean really guys is he such a key component? No big deal when COwhale left huh? Don't know who else to send your money too to help but those $200 worth of crystals every week? Send it to me. I'll make a video so you can get your fix. My laugh is no where near as annoying. Burn out happens. It's just a game. Let em go in peace.. oh God please let em go..
  • Wakandas_FinestWakandas_Finest Member Posts: 859 ★★★★
    @Redvendetta nicely put
  • H3t3rH3t3r Member, Guardian Posts: 2,882 Guardian

    xNig said:

    Bulmkt said:

    the best content Kabam have put in this game to date has been Variant 4

    the requirement to use champs from all Star rating levels was excellent and they need more it.

    Except it was so easy that almost everyone with a decent roster can explore it.
    That's the whole point, and it's the number one reason people aren't happy with the Gates. It makes the content not for everyone. Everyone and their dog got through Uncollected. It's not even a challenge now. All people need to do is look up some YouTube and they can do it within a matter of months of starting the game.
    It's also worth pointing out that Seatin makes content that caters to a certain demographic learning how to get through content, and that's most likely a motivating factor for the stance against Gates. However, it's not meant for the average Roster. (I don't even want to get into 2*s in Book 2.)
    There would have been nothing wrong with kabam making 2* viable in Book 2. In fact it would have been entirely consistent with their constant claims of wanting summoners to use more of their rosters and not just in arenas or niche content like variants
    I don't agree with that line of thinking at all. Progression-wise, I don't expect to use lower Champs in progressively higher Story content. While I will agree that the Gates between Act 5 and Act 6 are extreme, I don't see going backwards as something that logically happens. There are many ways to create content for lower, unused Champs. This isn't one of them that I see. To be perfectly honest, it leaves me scratching my head.
    Ahh but your vision is too narrow kabam could and probably should have installed progression gates based on roster size. For example a summoner would have to be level 60, have completed (not explored) acts 1-6, have (x) amount of 5* champs and (x) amount of 6* champs before accessing Book 2. They could even take it further and say the PI of your 5* and above roster must be (x) amount. This would ensure players would have progressed far enough to tackle more difficult content while preventing the average player from accessing content meant for end game players.

    A very serious buff to rewards would motivate players to progress their roster rather than focus on ranking up a handful of champs to complete content. It also prevents those who are lucky with RNG and those who throw thousands at cav crystals from accessing content too early because even if you get champs you still would have to rank them up plus progress through other content first. Kabam already has a broad progression gate on incursions as well as the monthly AQ.

    A progression gate would also give kabam the freedom to start over with Book 2 allowing sufficiently experienced players to use more of their rosters without the worry that new or average players would access it and progress too fast.
    There's still going to be a certain amount of waiting for specific Champs. That's part of the RNG structure. I'm sure making it 2* oriented means everyone has everything they need, but there's no logical reason to regress to using 2*s in it. The game is one that's based on RNG. It's been that way for 5 and a half years. The second we start discussing removing that element, we start talking about deconstructing the entire game itself and designing a new one.
    Again your thinking is too narrow. If kabam allowed players to use their 1/2/3/4* champs across the first 3/4 chapters Of book 2 while offering rewards meant to build their 5/6* rosters for the latter chapters it would help to combat the RNG. Kabam could easily create node combinations that would make the game challenging even using 1-4* champs variant 4 proved this. Just because the story progresses doesn’t mean kabam has to trap itself in an insane upward spiral of difficulty. Besides what’s the point of forcing players to hold on to their lower star champs on the off chance they’ll have a use for them once or twice a year? Why continue to have them in rewards?

    You don't think 3-4 Chapters which use 1-4* Champs and give 6* Rewards is a bit too much? Asking for something along the lines of using Champs on the shelf is reasonable. 4 Chapters of it is pretty much pushing it.
    V4 you use lesser rarities and gain 6* shards and rank up gems so
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  • Wakandas_FinestWakandas_Finest Member Posts: 859 ★★★★

    xNig said:

    Bulmkt said:

    the best content Kabam have put in this game to date has been Variant 4

    the requirement to use champs from all Star rating levels was excellent and they need more it.

    Except it was so easy that almost everyone with a decent roster can explore it.
    That's the whole point, and it's the number one reason people aren't happy with the Gates. It makes the content not for everyone. Everyone and their dog got through Uncollected. It's not even a challenge now. All people need to do is look up some YouTube and they can do it within a matter of months of starting the game.
    It's also worth pointing out that Seatin makes content that caters to a certain demographic learning how to get through content, and that's most likely a motivating factor for the stance against Gates. However, it's not meant for the average Roster. (I don't even want to get into 2*s in Book 2.)
    There would have been nothing wrong with kabam making 2* viable in Book 2. In fact it would have been entirely consistent with their constant claims of wanting summoners to use more of their rosters and not just in arenas or niche content like variants
    I don't agree with that line of thinking at all. Progression-wise, I don't expect to use lower Champs in progressively higher Story content. While I will agree that the Gates between Act 5 and Act 6 are extreme, I don't see going backwards as something that logically happens. There are many ways to create content for lower, unused Champs. This isn't one of them that I see. To be perfectly honest, it leaves me scratching my head.
    Ahh but your vision is too narrow kabam could and probably should have installed progression gates based on roster size. For example a summoner would have to be level 60, have completed (not explored) acts 1-6, have (x) amount of 5* champs and (x) amount of 6* champs before accessing Book 2. They could even take it further and say the PI of your 5* and above roster must be (x) amount. This would ensure players would have progressed far enough to tackle more difficult content while preventing the average player from accessing content meant for end game players.

    A very serious buff to rewards would motivate players to progress their roster rather than focus on ranking up a handful of champs to complete content. It also prevents those who are lucky with RNG and those who throw thousands at cav crystals from accessing content too early because even if you get champs you still would have to rank them up plus progress through other content first. Kabam already has a broad progression gate on incursions as well as the monthly AQ.

    A progression gate would also give kabam the freedom to start over with Book 2 allowing sufficiently experienced players to use more of their rosters without the worry that new or average players would access it and progress too fast.
    There's still going to be a certain amount of waiting for specific Champs. That's part of the RNG structure. I'm sure making it 2* oriented means everyone has everything they need, but there's no logical reason to regress to using 2*s in it. The game is one that's based on RNG. It's been that way for 5 and a half years. The second we start discussing removing that element, we start talking about deconstructing the entire game itself and designing a new one.
    Again your thinking is too narrow. If kabam allowed players to use their 1/2/3/4* champs across the first 3/4 chapters Of book 2 while offering rewards meant to build their 5/6* rosters for the latter chapters it would help to combat the RNG. Kabam could easily create node combinations that would make the game challenging even using 1-4* champs variant 4 proved this. Just because the story progresses doesn’t mean kabam has to trap itself in an insane upward spiral of difficulty. Besides what’s the point of forcing players to hold on to their lower star champs on the off chance they’ll have a use for them once or twice a year? Why continue to have them in rewards?

    You don't think 3-4 Chapters which use 1-4* Champs and give 6* Rewards is a bit too much? Asking for something along the lines of using Champs on the shelf is reasonable. 4 Chapters of it is pretty much pushing it.
    No it’s not unreasonable a player got 5/6* rewards for completing variant 4 with 1-4* champs. Besides in book 1, it’s not recommended, but you can use 1* champs through act 5 If you wanted too.

  • Lvernon15Lvernon15 Member Posts: 11,598 ★★★★★

    Who cares if seatin leaves the game? I mean really guys is he such a key component? No big deal when COwhale left huh? Don't know who else to send your money too to help but those $200 worth of crystals every week? Send it to me. I'll make a video so you can get your fix. My laugh is no where near as annoying. Burn out happens. It's just a game. Let em go in peace.. oh God please let em go..

    This isn’t about seatin, it’s about the core issues he brought up, restricting and boring content that isn’t enjoyable, outdated rewards in alliance war and events, and repetitive aq, and the extent of rng coupled with how specific new content is, yes if seatin leaves it won’t be that big a blow, but the issues he’s brought forth are what have sparked this thread
  • cookiedealercookiedealer Member Posts: 260 ★★

    Another thing coming to my mind would be feedback on monthly content.

    Mostly because it has been mentioned a few comments above:

    Not a single monthly event in the past has come close to the my little symbiont event. And after seeing how labs and rifts are recycled I wonder why we didn't get a my little sentinel, my little adaptoid, my little skrull or my little doombot event yet?

    That event was challenging, fun, rewarding, customizable and still simple, it was in my opinion the best the design team has done besides maybe variant 4.

    And this is not me complaining that all the other monthly content is so so bad. It's me wondering why they can't do more content that is so so good.

    Recycling content is completely understandable, I don't expect every other monthly event to be completely unique to it's core. But I'd like so see more of the good stuff.

    Additionally regarding the standard monthly eq:

    I understand that a cavalier difficulty is not coming soon. And I'm actually really okay with that, since the further along the road it comes the better the rewards can be.

    But there still is an issue with the monthly content becoming really stale as soon as one has a full team of r5's and got at least somewhat comfortable with 6.2.+ difficulty.

    One idea I could present is adding customizable boosts to uc eq, similar to the global boosts we can select for aq. For example a global mighty charge node in exchange for like a +10% rewards multiplier.

    Something along the lines of a customizable hardcore mode. I mean, we could really go wild with this. We could push ourselves by creating our own eq to a degree that is just as punishing as we want it to be. There could be several tiers of boosts we could select with maybe up to one per tier.

    I have no idea how hard this would be to implement, but even a watered down version of this might help the endgame players be more excited for the next monthly eq to come out.

    I wouldn't consider myself an endgame player, but even I quite mindlessly rip through the uc eq at day one since many months now.

    Another way would be similar, but instead of global boosts we could be allowed to select global gates.

    If I could for example set a 4* gate for the monthly uc eq in exchange for [X]% better rewards I'd immediately have a bigger challenge and it wouldn't feel pointless committing to that challenge.

    And even here we could go a bit wild. I'm sure there are some madlads in this community that would love trying to do uc eq with 3* champs if they were rewarded appropriately.

    And don't get me wrong, the increase in rewards are not my main focus here. They'd merely be a byproduct to make this enticing and actually feel like a proper substitute for a new difficulty.
    This is an interesting idea. So a possible legends leaderboard run with only 3 or 4*? Reward doesn't have to be insane, but more for bragging rights
  • Stagedear85Stagedear85 Member Posts: 774 ★★★

    I’ve played this game for over 5 years now, but rarely, if ever posted on the forums, I do like having a read through them every now and then but finding the energy to construct a post about the state of the game has always seemed like a wasted effort. I’m hoping I will be proven wrong. It’s going to be long though, you’ve been warned. It's ok if no one has the time to read it, I just wanted to get my feelings out there. It's healthy, ya' know.

    I play in a casual alliance, we run map 5 and compete in alliance war at around the gold 1/2 boundary. I’ve completed act 6 and I’m working on exploration there while I save up the units to give the abyss a run. I’m happy enough at this level and I’m not aiming to be at the top in any aspect of the game. I did a legends run in one of the event quests a few years ago and was lucky enough to make the cut. So that’s about the level I’m at if it helps add some perspective to my opinion. I spend occasionally but not religiously.

    Firstly, on a whole, I still enjoy the game. Aspects have become stale, and can sometimes feel unrewarding and overly challenging but there have been hits and misses in the content, so I’m always looking forward to the next thing to do. I’m looking forward to act 7… but I don’t think I’ll enjoy it. Which makes it likely to be a huge disappointment. The difficulty is out of control. Somewhere along the way ‘challenging to beat’ became ‘easy to lose’, and that is simply not fun. Playing this game’s endgame content can be best summed up in one word; stressful.

    Whether it’s having the right champions to combat specific nodes efficiently, being gated out of using the few champions you might have to help you try fighting those nodes in any way you want to try or simply knowing that if you slip up once, you’re dead and will likely have to spend money (a fair bit of money too, I might add) to recover or chalk it up as a loss, start over, and hope to play perfectly next time. This knowledge that even if you have the ‘right’ champions, you’re going to have to play perfectly is sometimes enough to put people off even trying. It’s exhausting and frustrating. There are a few key issues with this which I’m going to try and outline and put forward my suggestions on possible fixes.

    Problem 1; what is story mode? It used to be your path to progression. Progress you needed to make in order to complete more challenging content elsewhere, difficult (but short) special events, higher difficulty AQ maps, permanent challenging content like RoL/LoL, higher difficulties of the monthly event quests. This has flipped totally since the end of act 5. Now, you complete other content to get the rewards you need to try and get through the story mode. The issue with this is that the ‘throwaway’ content is boring. It is boring because it is not challenging and it is not challenging because people need to do it to make slow progress. This also, in turn, makes the story stale. It’s too difficult and too annoying, and once you’ve completed it you have nothing to use your rewards on. When the most challenging content in a game like this is the permanent content, it’s going to get stale. The road to progression, currently, is not good. When was the last time an endgame player struggled in a boss challenge? Or needed tips to beat an event quest boss? The monthly events (including the special events like rifts etc) have become a daily grind that you need to do complete because they’re your primary source of progression, only you will never progress enough to make beating something like act 6 a fun experience.

    Solution; switch it up. Story should be long, interesting and rewarding, it should introduce you to new mechanics and encourage you to find ways to beat those mechanics. Story should allow you to play with whichever champions you want. It should punish you if you’re unprepared but it must never feel impossible, or that you’ll ‘return to it in a few months or years’. Your challenge then becomes the monthly events. Make them hard, give us more Nameless Thanos, give us more boss rushes that are actually difficult, give us something to make use of the story rewards we have earned. If we can’t beat it one month, we’ll have something new to try next month. This helps ‘future proof’ difficulty. I get the feeling you’re currently trying to make sure act 6 will still be difficult in 6 months, 12 months, 2 years time… and that’s just silly. Increase that difficulty gradually via the monthly challenges instead. In my view it should go like this;

    1. Completing story content provides the rewards needed to continue further into the story, and allow you to begin to attempt some difficult…
    2. Monthly content. This should be a challenge, rewarding enough to be worth the trouble, and providing a more gradual ramp up in difficulty over few months, providing resources to be able to tackle…
    3. Actual endgame content. This is your labyrinth, your abyss, your longterm goals. Here we need trophy champions, not just for legends runs but for getting through the content, exclusive profile pictures and titles and rewards that encourage further roster expansion.

    Which brings me to problem 2.

    Problem 2; what is ‘difficult’? Part of the problem here is that there is such a range of champions, and such a variation in their usefulness. However, the current system of designing content around a handful of the ‘best’ champions creates a level of frustration unlike anything else I have seen in any game I have played. The content should not be borderline impossible for the best champions in the game. Pulling the best champions in the game should not be your key to even having a chance at completing content, it should simply make clearing that content ‘easier’. A word that’s probably frowned upon. Any champion in the game, at the appropriate rank and level, when played well, should be able to allow the player to progress. Certain content should be very difficult with Joe Fixit, and relatively easy with Ghost, but no content should be impossible with Joe Fixit and still almost impossible with Ghost.

    Solution; you need to have ‘good’ champions and ‘bad’ champions but you should be aiming the majority of the content at the mid-range of champions. Content should be challenging for Hulk, very challenging for Groot and not too bad for Corvus (for example). You’ve also got a fantastic range of utility that the lower ranked champions have in their toolkits but none are ever used because frankly, it’s a waste of time to even try. Champions only get ranked up if they’re the best at something, this is such a shame. Don’t be afraid of some content being too easy for some champions, because if it isn’t, it will be impossible for others. As it stands, You could probably remove half of the champions in the game and no one would miss them. This means that nodes which have been designed with one or two specific counters in mind need to go in the bin, they should not exist in any of the content. Massive attack ratings that destroy you in a few blocked hits should be restricted to challenging monthly events or longterm endgame content only, if at all. Massive health pools are a fun challenge, massive attack ratings are not. Most fights in the current ‘endgame’ aren’t worth healing up for… it’s more economical to just revive to 40%, die, and try again, because whether you have 40% or 100% health, you’re probably going to die in one combo - what’s the point? The fights with big health pools, interesting nodes, but reasonable attack values are your best in the game (see all of act 6 compared to the grandmaster fight…) Use that as a base. When we were all completing act 3 and 4, it was tough at the time. Our opponents had higher health pools and hit a bit harder than us, but the difference was nowhere near as absurd as it is now. You can’t future-proof the difficulty of Story content, nor would you have to if it’s your major source of progression. Get creative with it, add buffs and fun mechanics, give people the opportunity to swap out champions as with incursions. Start with making it unique and fun, even if its easy, and add from there. Test it yourselves. Give the worst player in your company the best champions and see if they can complete the content, give the best player the worst champions and do the same - when both are just about able, you’ve nailed it.

    Problem 3; offers and spending. This needs a bit of an overhaul. Your ‘offers’ are bad and too expensive. This creates a huge divide in players with a lot of money who are willing to spend on the game and players without a lot of money, which in turn exacerbates the issue you have with nailing the difficulty. I appreciate that you need to make money, and that you need methods of attracting wealthy players and keeping them interested in spending, but this should not come at the expense of the less fortunate who still want to play and support your game. I feel like while the introduction of Cavalier crystals might have provided a huge boost to your income in the short term, it has steadily, heavily contributed to a lot of the problems in the game currently. You can’t take them out of the game at this point, nor I feel, would you want to, but there is another solution.

    Solution; sales. Not like your current sales where you just bundle extra items into cash offers a few times a year, but instead real, regular sales. Get an Odin’s for $20, 1 day only, limited to 1 purchase. A full 6* crystal for $30 (available depending on your progression) and so on. Affordable to many more players than the current offers, being limited will not deter the wealthy from buying outside of sale periods, but it will encourage those with less to spend a little and also get a chance to buy some progress. Units to help clear content or open a few cavalier crystals, full crystals and shards are still a gamble, but if you address the difficulty it would be worth a gamble. Anyone remember potion sales? Again, great for pushing through content. Maybe make the offers that appear after clearing content more affordable and not absolutely terrible? Update the unit offers, no one is buying a 4* for 2,500 units. At the time this offer came out, a 4* took as long to save up for as a 6* does today. Make it a 6* for 2,500 units and people would buy it.

    Problem 4; crystals. Your featured crystals are trash, mate. I’m still relatively amazed you got away with the changes you made to featured crystals. It was always a massive cash grab to push people towards cavaliers, and so unashamedly blatant. It’s amazing to think that 15,000 shards a few years ago gave you a 1 in 5 chance of getting a specific featured champion, a slightly higher chance of getting something from the ‘featured pool’ but then also a chance of getting any champion in the game. Compare this to what we changed to, usually around 18 hand selected garbage tier, worthless champions from before 2017, 2 or 3 ‘featured’ champions that wouldn’t be so bad to have, 1 featured champion that you really want and a few featured duds. I don’t care what gymnastic reasoning you came up with at the time to try and suggest this was good for the player, but get out of here. It’s awful.

    Solution; stop being so ‘Kabam’. You’re not known as a generous company to your customers, it’s kind of a joke. But the extent of your greed in this case has severely hampered player progression and enjoyment. Saving up for a featured crystal these days is a bad idea unless you have everything you want in the basic pool. It used to be exciting to save up shards, and yes, it was likely that you would be able to save up enough shards to get the new champion you wanted, given a few months, but the amount of shards people can gather are more limited than the amount of units people can spend, so you made it a lot harder for the free to play players to get the new champions but did not hamper the spending players in the slightest. There are two solutions here. The first being to maintain the number of featured champions but to make the featured pool actually good. Only put good champions in there, you could even increase the cost if you want to limit the availability. Rotate them, keep the new champions but only add champions that are useful. The second option is to revert to the old system. In order to make sure the ‘whales’ keep spending, I have a further idea to this point. Remove shards from cavalier crystals. If you dupe a champion from a cavalier crystal all you should get is the dupe level on that champion and gold/iso. No shards, no max signature crystals, nothing like that. In conjunction with this you could (should have a long time ago) add a mercy system. Think outside the box, encourage people to spend rather than forcing them to.

    Problem 5; alliance content. This is the last problem I’m going to mention and the one I’m least familiar with. It seems to me no one is happy with the current alliance quest and alliance war game modes. I don’t find either particularly enjoyable and I don’t know many people who do. I also don’t really know what purpose they’re serving, but whatever purpose they were designed to serve, they’re not doing it anymore. I enjoy my alliance a lot, but that’s because of the people in it, not the content we’re completing, it’s repetitive, demanding and unrewarding, even at our level, so I can’t imagine what it’s like at the top.

    Solution; revamp the whole thing. Maintain consistent content such as AQ and AW, update the rewards and perhaps simplify them so that they take up less time. Which would give you an opportunity to add other, more fun events. Why isn’t there a boss that shows up with a huge health pool and 24hrs to take down once a week? You could even theme it, so magneto could show up and you might need to use your x-men champions, for example. Leaderboards for damage dealt, good rewards… something new. I’m sure there are other, better ideas, but that’s where I’m going to leave this rambling.

    All these problems combine to leave the burnt out and bored feeling. Bad crystal pulls, no way to guarantee progression, the path to progression is muddled, the void between rosters of spenders and non spenders is expanding rapidly, with content being created in the most part for the spenders, leading you to go to extremes to make content challenging. Alliance content is demanding, repetitive and unrewarding it seems to serve little purpose.

    To sum up, get creative, don’t be afraid to fail. Introduce things, take things away, find out what works and what doesn’t. Get faster at tweaking things and fixing things, and play the game yourselves. Cater to the majority of your player base, give the whales something to spend their money on but not at the expense of the rest of your customers.

    Move fast and break things.

    Great points Mate very constructive and well said
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,575 ★★★★★
    H3t3r said:

    xNig said:

    Bulmkt said:

    the best content Kabam have put in this game to date has been Variant 4

    the requirement to use champs from all Star rating levels was excellent and they need more it.

    Except it was so easy that almost everyone with a decent roster can explore it.
    That's the whole point, and it's the number one reason people aren't happy with the Gates. It makes the content not for everyone. Everyone and their dog got through Uncollected. It's not even a challenge now. All people need to do is look up some YouTube and they can do it within a matter of months of starting the game.
    It's also worth pointing out that Seatin makes content that caters to a certain demographic learning how to get through content, and that's most likely a motivating factor for the stance against Gates. However, it's not meant for the average Roster. (I don't even want to get into 2*s in Book 2.)
    There would have been nothing wrong with kabam making 2* viable in Book 2. In fact it would have been entirely consistent with their constant claims of wanting summoners to use more of their rosters and not just in arenas or niche content like variants
    I don't agree with that line of thinking at all. Progression-wise, I don't expect to use lower Champs in progressively higher Story content. While I will agree that the Gates between Act 5 and Act 6 are extreme, I don't see going backwards as something that logically happens. There are many ways to create content for lower, unused Champs. This isn't one of them that I see. To be perfectly honest, it leaves me scratching my head.
    Ahh but your vision is too narrow kabam could and probably should have installed progression gates based on roster size. For example a summoner would have to be level 60, have completed (not explored) acts 1-6, have (x) amount of 5* champs and (x) amount of 6* champs before accessing Book 2. They could even take it further and say the PI of your 5* and above roster must be (x) amount. This would ensure players would have progressed far enough to tackle more difficult content while preventing the average player from accessing content meant for end game players.

    A very serious buff to rewards would motivate players to progress their roster rather than focus on ranking up a handful of champs to complete content. It also prevents those who are lucky with RNG and those who throw thousands at cav crystals from accessing content too early because even if you get champs you still would have to rank them up plus progress through other content first. Kabam already has a broad progression gate on incursions as well as the monthly AQ.

    A progression gate would also give kabam the freedom to start over with Book 2 allowing sufficiently experienced players to use more of their rosters without the worry that new or average players would access it and progress too fast.
    There's still going to be a certain amount of waiting for specific Champs. That's part of the RNG structure. I'm sure making it 2* oriented means everyone has everything they need, but there's no logical reason to regress to using 2*s in it. The game is one that's based on RNG. It's been that way for 5 and a half years. The second we start discussing removing that element, we start talking about deconstructing the entire game itself and designing a new one.
    Again your thinking is too narrow. If kabam allowed players to use their 1/2/3/4* champs across the first 3/4 chapters Of book 2 while offering rewards meant to build their 5/6* rosters for the latter chapters it would help to combat the RNG. Kabam could easily create node combinations that would make the game challenging even using 1-4* champs variant 4 proved this. Just because the story progresses doesn’t mean kabam has to trap itself in an insane upward spiral of difficulty. Besides what’s the point of forcing players to hold on to their lower star champs on the off chance they’ll have a use for them once or twice a year? Why continue to have them in rewards?

    You don't think 3-4 Chapters which use 1-4* Champs and give 6* Rewards is a bit too much? Asking for something along the lines of using Champs on the shelf is reasonable. 4 Chapters of it is pretty much pushing it.
    V4 you use lesser rarities and gain 6* shards and rank up gems so
    I don't know why people keep comparing Variant to Story. Variant is a special type of content and it isn't even in the same wheelhouse. There may be some ideas that can be used in Story, but the two are mutually exclusive and not at all a reflection of each other.
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  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,575 ★★★★★

    H3t3r said:

    xNig said:

    Bulmkt said:

    the best content Kabam have put in this game to date has been Variant 4

    the requirement to use champs from all Star rating levels was excellent and they need more it.

    Except it was so easy that almost everyone with a decent roster can explore it.
    That's the whole point, and it's the number one reason people aren't happy with the Gates. It makes the content not for everyone. Everyone and their dog got through Uncollected. It's not even a challenge now. All people need to do is look up some YouTube and they can do it within a matter of months of starting the game.
    It's also worth pointing out that Seatin makes content that caters to a certain demographic learning how to get through content, and that's most likely a motivating factor for the stance against Gates. However, it's not meant for the average Roster. (I don't even want to get into 2*s in Book 2.)
    There would have been nothing wrong with kabam making 2* viable in Book 2. In fact it would have been entirely consistent with their constant claims of wanting summoners to use more of their rosters and not just in arenas or niche content like variants
    I don't agree with that line of thinking at all. Progression-wise, I don't expect to use lower Champs in progressively higher Story content. While I will agree that the Gates between Act 5 and Act 6 are extreme, I don't see going backwards as something that logically happens. There are many ways to create content for lower, unused Champs. This isn't one of them that I see. To be perfectly honest, it leaves me scratching my head.
    Ahh but your vision is too narrow kabam could and probably should have installed progression gates based on roster size. For example a summoner would have to be level 60, have completed (not explored) acts 1-6, have (x) amount of 5* champs and (x) amount of 6* champs before accessing Book 2. They could even take it further and say the PI of your 5* and above roster must be (x) amount. This would ensure players would have progressed far enough to tackle more difficult content while preventing the average player from accessing content meant for end game players.

    A very serious buff to rewards would motivate players to progress their roster rather than focus on ranking up a handful of champs to complete content. It also prevents those who are lucky with RNG and those who throw thousands at cav crystals from accessing content too early because even if you get champs you still would have to rank them up plus progress through other content first. Kabam already has a broad progression gate on incursions as well as the monthly AQ.

    A progression gate would also give kabam the freedom to start over with Book 2 allowing sufficiently experienced players to use more of their rosters without the worry that new or average players would access it and progress too fast.
    There's still going to be a certain amount of waiting for specific Champs. That's part of the RNG structure. I'm sure making it 2* oriented means everyone has everything they need, but there's no logical reason to regress to using 2*s in it. The game is one that's based on RNG. It's been that way for 5 and a half years. The second we start discussing removing that element, we start talking about deconstructing the entire game itself and designing a new one.
    Again your thinking is too narrow. If kabam allowed players to use their 1/2/3/4* champs across the first 3/4 chapters Of book 2 while offering rewards meant to build their 5/6* rosters for the latter chapters it would help to combat the RNG. Kabam could easily create node combinations that would make the game challenging even using 1-4* champs variant 4 proved this. Just because the story progresses doesn’t mean kabam has to trap itself in an insane upward spiral of difficulty. Besides what’s the point of forcing players to hold on to their lower star champs on the off chance they’ll have a use for them once or twice a year? Why continue to have them in rewards?

    You don't think 3-4 Chapters which use 1-4* Champs and give 6* Rewards is a bit too much? Asking for something along the lines of using Champs on the shelf is reasonable. 4 Chapters of it is pretty much pushing it.
    V4 you use lesser rarities and gain 6* shards and rank up gems so
    I don't know why people keep comparing Variant to Story. Variant is a special type of content and it isn't even in the same wheelhouse. There may be some ideas that can be used in Story, but the two are mutually exclusive and not at all a reflection of each other.
    No one is suggesting the 2 are the same. Merely pointing out things that worked and were enjoyable about variant that could be incorporated into Book 2. Nice attempt to deflect though lol
    It worked for Variant because it was a different piece of content. That's not deflecting. It's pointing out that people are comparing apples and oranges. Story is a different piece of content with its own progression to consider, and its own objectives.
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