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Alliance War Season 19: Updates to Path Identities and New Nodes! [ June 30]

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    winterthurwinterthur Posts: 7,772 ★★★★★
    edited June 2020
    Sensei_Maat said:

    Pulyaman said:

    Seems to be that the majority of the problem comes from shell alliances and people selling off their champs to deliberately get easy wars. With these kind of leaches existing in the game, I am wondering if we will ever get a system which could be fair. I am seeing the top alliances in the last season have 1 member out of 30, where did they go? We all know what's happening. Wonder if we could start assigning war prestige to each account for war like champ prestige for aq. If you place Master this season, even if you move alliances, the points will follow you, and the alliance war prestige could be based on that. Anything I am missing? @Sensei_Maat @GroundedWisdom ?


    1. how to approach it when alliances run 1 or 2 bg wars. it is possible that they again would recruit 10 people with low war prestige to lower their average war prestige and then run 2 bg wars using the other 20 and getting easier matches.
    A simple method could be weighted average. I am sure this is not an issue if it is viable.

    Of course if 29 members have prestige individually between 1-2k and the 30th member has 10k, it is going to be a problem.
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    Sensei_MaatSensei_Maat Posts: 396 ★★★
    winterthur said:

    Sensei_Maat said:

    Pulyaman said:

    Seems to be that the majority of the problem comes from shell alliances and people selling off their champs to deliberately get easy wars. With these kind of leaches existing in the game, I am wondering if we will ever get a system which could be fair. I am seeing the top alliances in the last season have 1 member out of 30, where did they go? We all know what's happening. Wonder if we could start assigning war prestige to each account for war like champ prestige for aq. If you place Master this season, even if you move alliances, the points will follow you, and the alliance war prestige could be based on that. Anything I am missing? @Sensei_Maat @GroundedWisdom ?


    1. how to approach it when alliances run 1 or 2 bg wars. it is possible that they again would recruit 10 people with low war prestige to lower their average war prestige and then run 2 bg wars using the other 20 and getting easier matches.
    A simple method could be weighted average. I am sure this is not an issue if it is viable.

    Of course if 29 members have prestige individually between 1-2k and the 30th member has 10k, it is going to be a problem.
    thats what i was getting at. alliances specifically having some very weak members to lower the average and only compete in 2 bg wars.
    akin to how people were selling champs to drop account ratings at one point.

    would be the same as how prestige manipulation can happen now.
    Not something that i have exploited but have noticed with prestige when my alliance has had a mix of strong and weak peeps we get easy matches. We have a mix of peeps just cus you know some newer guys with low accounts but good skill, whatever.we have a couple guys that struggle in attack, but due to the lowered average prestige our top guys are able to demolish the defense and place a defense that holds up the opposition well.
    say you have 10 guys at 1 mill, 10 guys at 600k, 10 guys at 300k, ur prestige gets lowered a lot, but splitting those guys across BGS enables you to still have solid war attack while placing a defense much stronger than what your opposition can handle as they don't have any attackers as strong as your strongest.
    not something that would be a huge issue as most allies want 3bgs and to be at the top of AQ and AW but i am sure some would find any way to exploit any system.
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    ThecurlerThecurler Posts: 840 ★★★★
    A fairly simple solution would be if everyone leaves an alliance, reset that alliance's war rating to zero.
    Not sure if it's that simple or opens up other ways of manipulating the system.
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    GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,247 ★★★★★
    Pulyaman said:

    Seems to be that the majority of the problem comes from shell alliances and people selling off their champs to deliberately get easy wars. With these kind of leaches existing in the game, I am wondering if we will ever get a system which could be fair. I am seeing the top alliances in the last season have 1 member out of 30, where did they go? We all know what's happening. Wonder if we could start assigning war prestige to each account for war like champ prestige for aq. If you place Master this season, even if you move alliances, the points will follow you, and the alliance war prestige could be based on that. Anything I am missing? @Sensei_Maat @GroundedWisdom ?

    That's part of the need for a stabilizer. One Account holds the place of the Alliance, and the rest go down south for the winter. Only, they end up fighting people lower than them and 50% is still an effect on people. Essentially, it's taking up the top spot and taking up whatever other spot they want to. The Player Prestige already does that. They join an Alliance and the Matches adjust because of the Prestige they carry. Without it, they can just peck off whoever they want.
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    Gregdagr8Gregdagr8 Posts: 380 ★★★
    Haji_Saab said:

    Amazing_Demon05 said:

    Thecurler said:

    A fairly simple solution would be if everyone leaves an alliance, reset that alliance's war rating to zero.
    Not sure if it's that simple or opens up other ways of manipulating the system.

    simply nobody would leave the alliance with 0 members just leave 1 member then put 1 fake id in it and let the last member leave too after that
    "In order to carry the war rating to the next season, at least 15 members should carry over to the next season."

    I think this should help in stopping shell alliances and I have never seen a 16 member turnover in a genuine top tier alliance.

    They could even make it like 20% of the members that played war should carry over and it will be fine. Normally in shell swap, whole alliance move as nobody wants to sacrifice a season.
    This is a REALLY good idea! Kabam, please take note of this and steal this idea.
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    WerewrymWerewrym Posts: 2,830 ★★★★★
    Haji_Saab said:

    Amazing_Demon05 said:

    Thecurler said:

    A fairly simple solution would be if everyone leaves an alliance, reset that alliance's war rating to zero.
    Not sure if it's that simple or opens up other ways of manipulating the system.

    simply nobody would leave the alliance with 0 members just leave 1 member then put 1 fake id in it and let the last member leave too after that
    "In order to carry the war rating to the next season, at least 15 members should carry over to the next season."

    I think this should help in stopping shell alliances and I have never seen a 16 member turnover in a genuine top tier alliance.

    They could even make it like 20% of the members that played war should carry over and it will be fine. Normally in shell swap, whole alliance move as nobody wants to sacrifice a season.
    This is actually a pretty good idea. The main issue I see is that if you had a pair of alliances they could still work together to shell and trade off each season who gets to take the easier wars.
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    OnmixOnmix Posts: 508 ★★★
    edited June 2020
    @Pulyaman
    Haji_Saab said:

    Amazing_Demon05 said:

    Thecurler said:

    A fairly simple solution would be if everyone leaves an alliance, reset that alliance's war rating to zero.
    Not sure if it's that simple or opens up other ways of manipulating the system.

    simply nobody would leave the alliance with 0 members just leave 1 member then put 1 fake id in it and let the last member leave too after that
    "In order to carry the war rating to the next season, at least 15 members should carry over to the next season."

    I think this should help in stopping shell alliances and I have never seen a 16 member turnover in a genuine top tier alliance.

    They could even make it like 20% of the members that played war should carry over and it will be fine. Normally in shell swap, whole alliance move as nobody wants to sacrifice a season.
    This could work... Kabam, it’s worth checking it out.
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    pseudosanepseudosane Posts: 3,818 Guardian
    Wow this thread got derailed over the weekend. Lots of hidden messages for me.

    The new war nodes are terrible. I'd honestly prefer any of the previous season iterations over this one. Any. Some of these nodes are just so painful with certain combinations ,and we havent even added defensive tactics yet. Unless attacker tactics gives us like a huge champion boost, this is going to be a painful wartime. Please reconsider the new nodes, most of these are a steaming pile of bs.

    The hidden nodes are another pain in the butt. Multiple have to run scouter lens ( and have to somehow guess a damn counter which tthey may or may not have). We have just one backup.

    Also, look at this combination. Aggression fury+ oscillate+ tunnel vision. Can a dev solo an r5/r3 6* champ there? I'd like to see how, especially since we have zero prior knowledge who it can be.
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    Kevo9513Kevo9513 Posts: 356 ★★
    I’ve been looking everywhere trying to prepare my alliance for all of this and still cannot find the “Cold turkey,” node. Can anyone give me insight as to what it does?
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    Dmc1990Dmc1990 Posts: 40 ★
    edited June 2020
    Mcord11758 said:

    so much to read through but eb and flow intercept reads awful. I guess its made for ghost to fight but I can see that node being a pain

    It sounds like a painful node, for me Annihilus comes to mind & I’m glad i have a 5/65 one 🤣
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    pseudosanepseudosane Posts: 3,818 Guardian
    Isnt there an update to this? Or is Kabam just "reading" again.
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    GreywardenGreywarden Posts: 843 ★★★★
    Remove hidden nodes, this is taking away the ability to counter play especially when the hidden nodes are minis.

    The 90% reduced dmg nodes are the furthest thing from fun. We had the exact same issue in AQ with can't stop won't stop and you saw how that went. Drop the % in dmg reduction and/or make the reward for playing correctly a lot more rewarding.

    Niche nodes with few counters to begin coupled with global and 2 new champs a month is asking for trouble. Fairly confident all combinations haven't been thought of and that the community will come up with something damn near impossible to solo as soon as this comes out.
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    TeaguearinoTeaguearino Posts: 24 ★
    some of these new nodes are incredibley niche. Like you can only do dmg if you do a certain thing and you have to do that thing every 6-10 seconds. Also, I think changing window of opportunity to make it so the defender is stun vulnerable while its on cooldown would make it so much better- just little stuff like that
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    WeeHobbit89WeeHobbit89 Posts: 146 ★
    I enjoyed the war map before the current one with most of it being hidden nodes. That put a lot of fun into a war (and fear)
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    MrTicTac19992008MrTicTac19992008 Posts: 572 ★★
    edited June 2020
    Personally I would love if they implemented a league system with promotion and relegation. At the start of the season you decide do you want to be part of a 1BG, 2BG or 3BG war season. Ideally every group would have 13 alliances so you would have your 12 matches throughout the season. everyone plays everyone else in the group so no complaining of easy/hard match ups and no repeat matches as everyone plays everyone else. Now granted, as you go lower down, the number of alliances increases so there has to be more groups which may lead to some groups being stronger than other. I don't know how many alliances participate on AW but i would think you could have it something like this Group A1 = Master. A2 = Master 2 (This would be a new group so promotion and relegation can be even). B1 = Platinum 1. B2 = Platinum 1 and so on. As you go down the ranks, more groups would be needed for each tier. You would then know at the start of every season what rewards you will be guaranteed. If you start in Gold 1, you get those rewards no matter what happens. If you get promoted then next season you will be guaranteed platinum rewards, yes you may drop straight back down but at least you would get the rewards. Yes, that alliance could decide to take the season off and save resources, lose every match and drop straight down again but thats their decision. This would also stop shell alliances as would be stuck in a certain bracket. The map difficulty would be set for each level. So that would get rid of the scenario where alliances on the edge of tiers getting a lower multplier on a harder map. master play on expert, Plat play on Challenger, Gold play on hard and so on. As groups are set and everyone plays everyone else in the group you dont need to have the multiplier.
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    Sensei_MaatSensei_Maat Posts: 396 ★★★
    could work if done well but i think rewards would need to be different for top of bracket v bottom of bracket and you would need to address what to do in the case of tanking every second season.
    i for one know many alliances like mine are on the cusp of 15/t6. t6 is a much better place to be.
    so we would push hard one season to try and go up a tier while we are in tier 6, but then the next season we would definately not try hard as we would be content to lose all our wars and fall.
    so we would only be putting in effort every second season and we would be getting gold 1 rewards one season and plat 4 the next alternating between the two whilst intentionally tanking every second season.

    now if you were play 4 and then intentionally tanked the entire season maybe you would get gold 3.
    there would certainly need to be something to encourage you to not tank. maybe the potential to drop 2 or 3 brackets if your season was that poor.

    i think its god in theory but too hard to implement
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    Little_Crocodili29Little_Crocodili29 Posts: 268 ★★★
    That would be a miracle! It takes them several months to implement something (cough HB buff cough). So all points to this "new" war having been in the works for ages. Plus it toes the exact same bs line of Act 6, AQ and book 2.

    I reckon they only announced it coz they would've anyways. As we're all expecting changes for the better tho (with the road map and all) we got ice bucketed instead.

    Remains to be seen what they meant about timers now. Other than that they said they wanted reduced stress. I don't see how right now.
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    pseudosanepseudosane Posts: 3,818 Guardian
    Weird they haven't given node explanations, defense tactics, attack tactics, and the wars are supposed to be live in 24 hours. How do we test it with zero knowledge?
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    RenegädeツRenegädeツ Posts: 98 ★
    edited June 2020
    pseudosane said:

    Weird they haven't given node explanations, defense tactics, attack tactics, and the wars are supposed to be live in 24 hours. How do we test it with zero knowledge?

    I dont know, they've made it very confusing.
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    RenegädeツRenegädeツ Posts: 98 ★
    @Kabam Miike clarification on when all maps, nodes, attack tactics, defense tactics, and stress alleviation will be introduced to Alliance War please.
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    pseudosanepseudosane Posts: 3,818 Guardian
    edited June 2020

    Hopefully they are posting the new announcements, fingers crossed!
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