Black Widow Claire Voyant underrated?

2

Comments

  • GildenlowGildenlow Posts: 622 ★★★
    She is an amazing champ, specially if you run suicides.

    Now i don't think that damage wise she's equivalent to warlock sin the armor break from warlock's sp2 actually deals nice damage, in her case the sp2 deals nice damage as well but i'm not sure is the same.

    However she is actually top3 in mystic class, and she is only defeated by any other mystic just because of personal preferences, in anyway she has been ever called a meme champ or just an okay champ.
  • RetlawIVRetlawIV Posts: 49
    Underrated
    Gildenlow said:

    She is an amazing champ, specially if you run suicides.

    Now i don't think that damage wise she's equivalent to warlock sin the armor break from warlock's sp2 actually deals nice damage, in her case the sp2 deals nice damage as well but i'm not sure is the same.

    However she is actually top3 in mystic class, and she is only defeated by any other mystic just because of personal preferences, in anyway she has been ever called a meme champ or just an okay champ.

    So the highest damage sp2 for warlock, in the best case scenario with all crits and class advantage, is around 70k-80k and with BWCV in the best case scenario where she has death touch active, every hit deals 4600 extra, and every hit crits your sp2 will deal just over 70k damage. With warlock though there is no guaranteed damage which means sometimes his sp2 actually hits really weak when you have bad crit rng, but BWCV if you are in hellfire mode and have death touch you’ll deal 37k damage on top of all your hits guaranteed.
  • PolygonPolygon Posts: 1,850 ★★★★
    Without suicides shes no longer the 2nd best, sorcerer supreme took that spot @Thicco_Mode

    @GagoH Not really sorc supreme is still good but not as good as claire, she is more versatile and can handle many more situations than sorc supreme with her immunities and she is very suicide friendly and moreover has around the same kit of utilty as sorc with power steal and control, regen, nullify abilites which also build up sp3 damage for death touch and her sp2 deals insane burst energy damage in hellfire curse but i can say that sorc suprene is a worthy competitor for claire, however i believe claire edges sorc out by a little bit.

    Being able to block specials that are hard to evade is crazy utility to me, shell heal most of right back off. Not just that, but her damage far exceeds claires without suicides and against non immunity champs. Against non immunes claire becomes a bit hard to make the most out of her utility as her buff immunity on sp2 doesn’t last as long even on champs like Aarkus it can be difficult unless you really get the timing down
  • FiiNCHFiiNCH Posts: 926 ★★★★
    Perfectly rated
    I’m finding this thread really useful seeing as I just pulled her...


  • DeliDeli Posts: 304 ★★
    Overrated
    I clicked the wrong thing. I think she underated because I actually think she is better than doom. Lol
  • shadow_lurker22shadow_lurker22 Posts: 3,243 ★★★★★
    edited August 2020
    Perfectly rated
    Deli said:

    I clicked the wrong thing. I think she underated because I actually think she is better than doom. Lol

    You are part of a very small group of people then but as long as you aren't toxic about it like a certain someone (who shan't be named) in the past then you are entitled to your opinion.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 6,355 ★★★★★
    Overrated
    She's incredibly overrated imo. Without suicides she's meh at best
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 6,355 ★★★★★
    Overrated
    The people that hype her up to the insane levels you hear run suicides permanently and she's one of the few mystics that can handle that
  • RetlawIVRetlawIV Posts: 49
    Underrated
    GagoH said:

    Without suicides shes no longer the 2nd best, sorcerer supreme took that spot @Thicco_Mode

    @GagoH Not really sorc supreme is still good but not as good as claire, she is more versatile and can handle many more situations than sorc supreme with her immunities and she is very suicide friendly and moreover has around the same kit of utilty as sorc with power steal and control, regen, nullify abilites which also build up sp3 damage for death touch and her sp2 deals insane burst energy damage in hellfire curse but i can say that sorc suprene is a worthy competitor for claire, however i believe claire edges sorc out by a little bit.

    Being able to block specials that are hard to evade is crazy utility to me, shell heal most of right back off. Not just that, but her damage far exceeds claires without suicides and against non immunity champs. Against non immunes claire becomes a bit hard to make the most out of her utility as her buff immunity on sp2 doesn’t last as long even on champs like Aarkus it can be difficult unless you really get the timing down
    BWCV can also take a lot of blocked hits and heal it all the way back up with her sp2 and her utility doesn't stop at immunities, with despair she can stop regen and with buff immunity as long as you are playing fairly aggressive once you get it up on champs that have a good amount of buffs it is very straightforward to completely shut down the opponent and like mentioned before her damage isn't affected by immunities. It's based on being able to throw the sp2 while in curse of hellfire. She also can power steal as well, and if you have vision Aarkus, if the opponent is near or at 3 bars of power you can throw back to back sp2s, because on every hit you steal 5% of their current power. And being able to cheat death is a nice cherry on top, because if you are playing against an ai that won't throw their specials, you just push them to an sp3, pop your sp3 and you won't die when they pop theirs, and you'll regen like 20%, then you throw your sp2 while in curse of blood and you regen basically back up to full.
  • Iron_Patriot_is_litIron_Patriot_is_lit Posts: 1,822 ★★★★★
    Perfectly rated
    I think she’s ever so slightly overrated, but for the most part she’s ranked pretty fairly.
  • Perfectly rated
    Until doom came into the contest, it was only sym supreme, dr. Voodoo and claire voyant (the most preferred content clearers)
  • Perfectly rated
    I meant the places, after doom its just either of these people.
  • BulmktBulmkt Posts: 693 ★★★
    Underrated
    She is better than Doom IMO...
    I have her as a R2 6* and she rocks...
  • AceOfDiamondAceOfDiamond Posts: 194 ★★
    Perfectly rated
    I love using her in incursions.. She always stays full with few sp2 dmg boosting hacks like crit rate and crit dmg boost or prowess.
  • The_enlightenedThe_enlightened Posts: 545 ★★★
    RetlawIV said:

    Not hate against seatin but I wouldn’t rly use him as a refrence for specific champs
    He has doom and most “god tier” champs
    I doubt his willing to put the extra work to look into other champs like swedeah
    Looking at the last month it’s just gameplay of mainly EQ
    Heck the only “reviews” of champs are ones that we already know are great. His two carnage and venom ones I haven’t watched but honestly a 20 min long video for each.... is a bit much

    I agree I don’t value his opinion higher than anyone else, but he has such a large platform that it means he has influence and when he says something it tends to cause others to think similarly. And like I’ve stated I started this poll for the sole purpose of seeing the community’s general consensus.
    Fair enough
    Was watching seatins live stream on v5 and he kept dissing BWCV a lot

    It was joking but you can rly sense the undertone he has. Recently gave up trying to get him from the duel crystals, Since I figured she can basically do the same thing as doom. Power control is there with sp2 not as potent but just as reliable. If you play her against ideal match ups like buff reliant opponents or poison immune she probably has better power steal.

    Her sig is very underrated, saved me a ton. For about 30 seconds you are completely death immune ( 24 from her death touch passive and 4 seconds if you would be KOed)plus any damage that would kill you if the death immunity buff is up will give you a charge making you gain more power to throw another. This happened to me against a G99 in v5: she threw her sp2 and immediately I threw sp3. I failed an intercept and got 2 degens on me. Dumb mistake right?..... well yess but it was an unintended calculationThat I made. Immediately her charges went up like crazy due to the reverse regen and degen. It allowed me to throw a second sp3. Pretty cool and definitely not something doom can do.
    Any kind of immune match up is ideal.

    Immunity to AAR? Do you have pacify mastery?Boom charge every single parry- fun trivia for new BWCV users
  • 98320575739832057573 Posts: 152
    Perfectly rated
    Best mystic champ ever used , and immune to bleed, incinerates, poison,
    And many more abilities
  • unoobmeprounoobmepro Posts: 792 ★★★
    Perfectly rated
    Below SS and doom
  • Colonaut123Colonaut123 Posts: 2,832 ★★★★★
    Perfectly rated

    The people that hype her up to the insane levels you hear run suicides permanently and she's one of the few mystics that can handle that

    I don't run suicides and she is my MVP in many difficult match-ups (Hyperion, Aarkus, Korg, Annihilus,...).
  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 17,887 ★★★★★
    Where is the “i-don’t-have-her-so-i-can’t-say” option
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 6,355 ★★★★★
    Overrated

    The people that hype her up to the insane levels you hear run suicides permanently and she's one of the few mystics that can handle that

    I don't run suicides and she is my MVP in many difficult match-ups (Hyperion, Aarkus, Korg, Annihilus,...).
    I'd take Doom over her against every one of those
  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 17,887 ★★★★★

    The people that hype her up to the insane levels you hear run suicides permanently and she's one of the few mystics that can handle that

    I don't run suicides and she is my MVP in many difficult match-ups (Hyperion, Aarkus, Korg, Annihilus,...).
    I'd take Doom over her against every one of those
    some of us don’t have doom
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 6,355 ★★★★★
    edited August 2020
    Overrated

    The people that hype her up to the insane levels you hear run suicides permanently and she's one of the few mystics that can handle that

    I don't run suicides and she is my MVP in many difficult match-ups (Hyperion, Aarkus, Korg, Annihilus,...).
    I'd take Doom over her against every one of those
    some of us don’t have doom
    Okay, but this is talking about under or over rating a champ in general not for someone's specific situation, so assuming having all options available (which I personally do) I'm not using her against those champs

    I've never once said Claire is a bad champ bc she obviously isn't. All I've ever said is that permanent suicide users tend to overrate her as a mystic bc she's one of the few that not only works but benefits from suicides.
  • RetlawIVRetlawIV Posts: 49
    Underrated

    RetlawIV said:

    Not hate against seatin but I wouldn’t rly use him as a refrence for specific champs
    He has doom and most “god tier” champs
    I doubt his willing to put the extra work to look into other champs like swedeah
    Looking at the last month it’s just gameplay of mainly EQ
    Heck the only “reviews” of champs are ones that we already know are great. His two carnage and venom ones I haven’t watched but honestly a 20 min long video for each.... is a bit much

    I agree I don’t value his opinion higher than anyone else, but he has such a large platform that it means he has influence and when he says something it tends to cause others to think similarly. And like I’ve stated I started this poll for the sole purpose of seeing the community’s general consensus.
    Fair enough
    Was watching seatins live stream on v5 and he kept dissing BWCV a lot

    It was joking but you can rly sense the undertone he has. Recently gave up trying to get him from the duel crystals, Since I figured she can basically do the same thing as doom. Power control is there with sp2 not as potent but just as reliable. If you play her against ideal match ups like buff reliant opponents or poison immune she probably has better power steal.

    Her sig is very underrated, saved me a ton. For about 30 seconds you are completely death immune ( 24 from her death touch passive and 4 seconds if you would be KOed)plus any damage that would kill you if the death immunity buff is up will give you a charge making you gain more power to throw another. This happened to me against a G99 in v5: she threw her sp2 and immediately I threw sp3. I failed an intercept and got 2 degens on me. Dumb mistake right?..... well yess but it was an unintended calculationThat I made. Immediately her charges went up like crazy due to the reverse regen and degen. It allowed me to throw a second sp3. Pretty cool and definitely not something doom can do.
    Any kind of immune match up is ideal.

    Immunity to AAR? Do you have pacify mastery?Boom charge every single parry- fun trivia for new BWCV users
    I was also watching his stream and he kept kind of shitting on BWCV and I spent the entire time thinking how she would work for everything for completion basically and then I used her for like 90% of the fights for completion and one shot every boss except venom who I missed an sp2 evade and Symbiote Spider-Man who I only had to use one revive on because I mistimed a single heavy lol and I hadn’t even though about pacify against AAR Immunity that’s some galaxy brain **** lol
  • RetlawIVRetlawIV Posts: 49
    Underrated

    The people that hype her up to the insane levels you hear run suicides permanently and she's one of the few mystics that can handle that

    I don't run suicides and she is my MVP in many difficult match-ups (Hyperion, Aarkus, Korg, Annihilus,...).
    I'd take Doom over her against every one of those
    some of us don’t have doom
    Okay, but this is talking about under or over rating a champ in general not for someone's specific situation, so assuming having all options available (which I personally do) I'm not using her against those champs

    I've never once said Claire is a bad champ bc she obviously isn't. All I've ever said is that permanent suicide users tend to overrate her as a mystic bc she's one of the few that not only works but benefits from suicides.
    I will say that having used her a ton now she also just ignores so many BS nodes in act 6. Freezer burn ez, acid wash ez, biohazard ez, fun and interactive degen ez, icarus ez, like she just has answers for so much bs this game has to offer and then death immunity and regen literally save potions and units.
  • The_enlightenedThe_enlightened Posts: 545 ★★★
    RetlawIV said:

    RetlawIV said:

    Not hate against seatin but I wouldn’t rly use him as a refrence for specific champs
    He has doom and most “god tier” champs
    I doubt his willing to put the extra work to look into other champs like swedeah
    Looking at the last month it’s just gameplay of mainly EQ
    Heck the only “reviews” of champs are ones that we already know are great. His two carnage and venom ones I haven’t watched but honestly a 20 min long video for each.... is a bit much

    I agree I don’t value his opinion higher than anyone else, but he has such a large platform that it means he has influence and when he says something it tends to cause others to think similarly. And like I’ve stated I started this poll for the sole purpose of seeing the community’s general consensus.
    Fair enough
    Was watching seatins live stream on v5 and he kept dissing BWCV a lot

    It was joking but you can rly sense the undertone he has. Recently gave up trying to get him from the duel crystals, Since I figured she can basically do the same thing as doom. Power control is there with sp2 not as potent but just as reliable. If you play her against ideal match ups like buff reliant opponents or poison immune she probably has better power steal.

    Her sig is very underrated, saved me a ton. For about 30 seconds you are completely death immune ( 24 from her death touch passive and 4 seconds if you would be KOed)plus any damage that would kill you if the death immunity buff is up will give you a charge making you gain more power to throw another. This happened to me against a G99 in v5: she threw her sp2 and immediately I threw sp3. I failed an intercept and got 2 degens on me. Dumb mistake right?..... well yess but it was an unintended calculationThat I made. Immediately her charges went up like crazy due to the reverse regen and degen. It allowed me to throw a second sp3. Pretty cool and definitely not something doom can do.
    Any kind of immune match up is ideal.

    Immunity to AAR? Do you have pacify mastery?Boom charge every single parry- fun trivia for new BWCV users
    I was also watching his stream and he kept kind of shitting on BWCV and I spent the entire time thinking how she would work for everything for completion basically and then I used her for like 90% of the fights for completion and one shot every boss except venom who I missed an sp2 evade and Symbiote Spider-Man who I only had to use one revive on because I mistimed a single heavy lol and I hadn’t even though about pacify against AAR Immunity that’s some galaxy brain **** lol
    Yep saw that too, I don’t care much about seatin anyway but It kinda shows how he rly does rly on the meta champs. Can’t blame him, if I had all Meta champs maxed out I’d probably would too.

    Used her for every boss and could consistently solo all bosses.
    Any kind of buff reliant champs or any form of immune Fights I’d take BWCV every day. Hype korg are easy solos and even if you mess up in any way she can easily heal.
    Definitely going to use her for my first AOL in a few months
  • RetlawIVRetlawIV Posts: 49
    Underrated

    RetlawIV said:

    RetlawIV said:

    Not hate against seatin but I wouldn’t rly use him as a refrence for specific champs
    He has doom and most “god tier” champs
    I doubt his willing to put the extra work to look into other champs like swedeah
    Looking at the last month it’s just gameplay of mainly EQ
    Heck the only “reviews” of champs are ones that we already know are great. His two carnage and venom ones I haven’t watched but honestly a 20 min long video for each.... is a bit much

    I agree I don’t value his opinion higher than anyone else, but he has such a large platform that it means he has influence and when he says something it tends to cause others to think similarly. And like I’ve stated I started this poll for the sole purpose of seeing the community’s general consensus.
    Fair enough
    Was watching seatins live stream on v5 and he kept dissing BWCV a lot

    It was joking but you can rly sense the undertone he has. Recently gave up trying to get him from the duel crystals, Since I figured she can basically do the same thing as doom. Power control is there with sp2 not as potent but just as reliable. If you play her against ideal match ups like buff reliant opponents or poison immune she probably has better power steal.

    Her sig is very underrated, saved me a ton. For about 30 seconds you are completely death immune ( 24 from her death touch passive and 4 seconds if you would be KOed)plus any damage that would kill you if the death immunity buff is up will give you a charge making you gain more power to throw another. This happened to me against a G99 in v5: she threw her sp2 and immediately I threw sp3. I failed an intercept and got 2 degens on me. Dumb mistake right?..... well yess but it was an unintended calculationThat I made. Immediately her charges went up like crazy due to the reverse regen and degen. It allowed me to throw a second sp3. Pretty cool and definitely not something doom can do.
    Any kind of immune match up is ideal.

    Immunity to AAR? Do you have pacify mastery?Boom charge every single parry- fun trivia for new BWCV users
    I was also watching his stream and he kept kind of shitting on BWCV and I spent the entire time thinking how she would work for everything for completion basically and then I used her for like 90% of the fights for completion and one shot every boss except venom who I missed an sp2 evade and Symbiote Spider-Man who I only had to use one revive on because I mistimed a single heavy lol and I hadn’t even though about pacify against AAR Immunity that’s some galaxy brain **** lol
    Yep saw that too, I don’t care much about seatin anyway but It kinda shows how he rly does rly on the meta champs. Can’t blame him, if I had all Meta champs maxed out I’d probably would too.

    Used her for every boss and could consistently solo all bosses.
    Any kind of buff reliant champs or any form of immune Fights I’d take BWCV every day. Hype korg are easy solos and even if you mess up in any way she can easily heal.
    Definitely going to use her for my first AOL in a few months
    That’s very true. Let me know how it goes using her in AOL, because I thought she could work, but I’m not quite at that point yet I’m still working on act 6.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 6,355 ★★★★★
    Overrated
    RetlawIV said:

    The people that hype her up to the insane levels you hear run suicides permanently and she's one of the few mystics that can handle that

    I don't run suicides and she is my MVP in many difficult match-ups (Hyperion, Aarkus, Korg, Annihilus,...).
    I'd take Doom over her against every one of those
    some of us don’t have doom
    Okay, but this is talking about under or over rating a champ in general not for someone's specific situation, so assuming having all options available (which I personally do) I'm not using her against those champs

    I've never once said Claire is a bad champ bc she obviously isn't. All I've ever said is that permanent suicide users tend to overrate her as a mystic bc she's one of the few that not only works but benefits from suicides.
    I will say that having used her a ton now she also just ignores so many BS nodes in act 6. Freezer burn ez, acid wash ez, biohazard ez, fun and interactive degen ez, icarus ez, like she just has answers for so much bs this game has to offer and then death immunity and regen literally save potions and units.
    None of those nodes you mentioned are problem nodes and all have champs that are much better for them. She's an okay option in a lot of places but incredibly rarely is she ever the best option for anything
  • Panchulon21Panchulon21 Posts: 2,068 ★★★★★
    Perfectly rated
    Where did you get she was underrated. She probably the second or third best mystic in the game.
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