Black widow claire voyant vs Sorceror Supreme poll

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Comments

  • AGYAATAGYAAT Posts: 208
    Sorceror Supreme
    Final conclusion is if you aren't going to R5 a mystic champ for perfect control on your opponent's buffs (that's why mystic class is known for) then you can consider her for R5, Suicide user went crazy when they heard about bwcv (a mystic champ that gets more benefits from suicides) that's how she became over hyped champ in mcoc😂, don't get confused some of your beyond god/god tire champs are depended on suicides for example omega red (anyone wanna share his videos on Omega red without suicides and please don't take biohazard or caltrops path🤣)
  • Thanks_D19Thanks_D19 Posts: 1,412 ★★★★
    Sorceror Supreme
    If you run scuicides sorcerer supreme is better, if you don’t Claire is better... that’s about it
  • Black widow (claire voyant)
    AGYAAT said:

    Final conclusion is if you aren't going to R5 a mystic champ for perfect control on your opponent's buffs (that's why mystic class is known for) then you can consider her for R5, Suicide user went crazy when they heard about bwcv (a mystic champ that gets more benefits from suicides) that's how she became over hyped champ in mcoc😂, don't get confused some of your beyond god/god tire champs are depended on suicides for example omega red (anyone wanna share his videos on Omega red without suicides and please don't take biohazard or caltrops path🤣)

    @AGYAAT You 100% hate Claire Voyant, want to see V5, Cavalier, ACT 6.3 and 6.4 videos.

    Another question are you Asian, because Asians use alot of Emojis. I am just asking in general, because you are actually using alot of Emojis.

    And stop misguiding others I have already shown you a video of her buff control. Claire vs Hyperion and BWCV go watch it. Because now you are saying Claire don't have good buff control.

    Can you please send me your roster, I just want to see if you actually have these Champions or you are just trolling.
  • Black widow (claire voyant)

    s

    AGYAAT said:

    Bwcv is too overrated, believe me bud if don't use suicides then you will not gonna use her for most content if you do R5 her,
    She is good if you don't have strong rosters because she have some utility in one place but then her damage output it not acceptable without suicides for endgame content, I have her at r4 and I also have r5 mystic gem and overflowing t5b & t2a but still I don't consider her my r5 option until I switch to suicides,

    If you have some 6* or r4 champs for immunity then I suggest you to focus on SS because doom and SS (both versions) are best in mystic class if you need a solid nullify champ and new sorcerer supreme is the better version of symbiot supreme, I did r4 mine because of vision aarkus path in 6.4 final quest I'm really disappointed because that path has tenacity (75% chance) and she was useless if your opponent don't have bleed/poison/incinerate immunity because then her nullify ability ability completely depend on sp2 (only for 8-9 seconds), she was only useful for one fight CMM (any mystic champ is good against her)



    @AGYAAT I hate when people say Claire damage is trash without Suicides. I think this video may prove you wrong, and if it doesn't just tag me I am ready to make more videos on her to prove you wrong. And trust I believe in proving.

    So my judgement you are 100% using her Wrong if you are saying her damage is trash without Suicides. Suicides only boost claire potential, she own her own is a queen.

    So stop misguiding others that she needs Suicides.

    Without suicides Claire is the 2nd best Mystic, but with Suicides she tops the list not in just her class but overall one of the top game breaking Champions. I have Sorcerer Supreme and Claire both and trust me Sorcerer Supreme is not even close to Claire.
    @MagnaAngemon_333 Woah, uh, you do realize that is 6.1.3... right? Lol
    @DarkEternity yeah with no Suicides. Want to see V5 and 6.3 and 6.4 videos.
  • DarkEternityDarkEternity Posts: 533 ★★★
    Sorceror Supreme

    s

    AGYAAT said:

    Bwcv is too overrated, believe me bud if don't use suicides then you will not gonna use her for most content if you do R5 her,
    She is good if you don't have strong rosters because she have some utility in one place but then her damage output it not acceptable without suicides for endgame content, I have her at r4 and I also have r5 mystic gem and overflowing t5b & t2a but still I don't consider her my r5 option until I switch to suicides,

    If you have some 6* or r4 champs for immunity then I suggest you to focus on SS because doom and SS (both versions) are best in mystic class if you need a solid nullify champ and new sorcerer supreme is the better version of symbiot supreme, I did r4 mine because of vision aarkus path in 6.4 final quest I'm really disappointed because that path has tenacity (75% chance) and she was useless if your opponent don't have bleed/poison/incinerate immunity because then her nullify ability ability completely depend on sp2 (only for 8-9 seconds), she was only useful for one fight CMM (any mystic champ is good against her)



    @AGYAAT I hate when people say Claire damage is trash without Suicides. I think this video may prove you wrong, and if it doesn't just tag me I am ready to make more videos on her to prove you wrong. And trust I believe in proving.

    So my judgement you are 100% using her Wrong if you are saying her damage is trash without Suicides. Suicides only boost claire potential, she own her own is a queen.

    So stop misguiding others that she needs Suicides.

    Without suicides Claire is the 2nd best Mystic, but with Suicides she tops the list not in just her class but overall one of the top game breaking Champions. I have Sorcerer Supreme and Claire both and trust me Sorcerer Supreme is not even close to Claire.
    @MagnaAngemon_333 Woah, uh, you do realize that is 6.1.3... right? Lol
    @DarkEternity yeah with no Suicides. Want to see V5 and 6.3 and 6.4 videos.
    Just, read my entire study of the two that I posted above. When you look at it from an unbiased angle, SorSupreme has so much more utility and damage accessibility.
  • Black widow (claire voyant)
    AGYAAT said:

    Final conclusion is if you aren't going to R5 a mystic champ for perfect control on your opponent's buffs (that's why mystic class is known for) then you can consider her for R5, Suicide user went crazy when they heard about bwcv (a mystic champ that gets more benefits from suicides) that's how she became over hyped champ in mcoc😂, don't get confused some of your beyond god/god tire champs are depended on suicides for example omega red (anyone wanna share his videos on Omega red without suicides and please don't take biohazard or caltrops path🤣)

    @Etjama @Kill_Grey Can you please Handel him, he is trolling too much.
  • AGYAATAGYAAT Posts: 208
    Sorceror Supreme

    AGYAAT said:

    AGYAAT said:

    Bwcv is too overrated, believe me bud if don't use suicides then you will not gonna use her for most content if you do R5 her,
    She is good if you don't have strong rosters because she have some utility in one place but then her damage output it not acceptable without suicides for endgame content, I have her at r4 and I also have r5 mystic gem and overflowing t5b & t2a but still I don't consider her my r5 option until I switch to suicides,

    If you have some 6* or r4 champs for immunity then I suggest you to focus on SS because doom and SS (both versions) are best in mystic class if you need a solid nullify champ and new sorcerer supreme is the better version of symbiot supreme, I did r4 mine because of vision aarkus path in 6.4 final quest I'm really disappointed because that path has tenacity (75% chance) and she was useless if your opponent don't have bleed/poison/incinerate immunity because then her nullify ability ability completely depend on sp2 (only for 8-9 seconds), she was only useful for one fight CMM (any mystic champ is good against her)



    @AGYAAT I hate when people say Claire damage is trash without Suicides. I think this video may prove you wrong, and if it doesn't just tag me I am ready to make more videos on her to prove you wrong. And trust I believe in proving.

    So my judgement you are 100% using her Wrong if you are saying her damage is trash without Suicides. Suicides only boost claire potential, she own her own is a queen.

    So stop misguiding others that she needs Suicides.

    Without suicides Claire is the 2nd best Mystic, but with Suicides she tops the list not in just her class but overall one of the top game breaking Champions. I have Sorcerer Supreme and Claire both and trust me Sorcerer Supreme is not even close to Claire.
    Hey bud it's looks like you got offended😂, we all are different and we all have different opinions you definitely have 5/5 MD and most of the fight are perfect matchups for bwcv because they all have immunities or you are getting benefits from your phase immunity whenever they failed to apply in you, I don't wanna explain how you are getting almost double or more burst damage from sp2 by exploiting your opponent's immunity and after all these fight are around 120-150k health points that's not a big deal check 6.3 or 6.4 health pools and attack value (now they did adjustments in attack value) if you are gonna use her in those matchups then you can't frequently use sp2 in hailfire phase (only why to see her best damage output)

    If you wanna know what is good damage output then see some Mojo's gameplay and appreciate some underrated champs, i did that 6.4.6 quest with my r5 mojo and all fight were ended in ~50 hits (~300k health points)
    @AGYAAT first of all these fights have almost 200K health pools, 2nd thing I have shown Korg and Deadpool fights as well. 3rd thing claire have alot of hits because her Sp2 have slot of hits.Everyone can have their opinions statement is correct. But above on your previous comment you weren't giving opinion, you were throwing full shades on Claire because you have sorcerer supreme max ranked, you can check your own comment. Having an opinion and misguiding others is a different thing.

    But the way you again compared claire to mojo was also wasn't an opinion. You just don't like Claire.

    And that's what I meant Claire can take advantage from alot of things, claire don't need MD, I was not running 5/5 MD. In that video you can see Claire can take advantage of more than buffs. From IMMUNITIES, from effects and from buff and even without these factors she still wrecks the fight.Looja like you skipped the video. But if you want to see Claire can 6.3, 6.4 and Variant 5 then I am ready. And you used Mojo for 6.4.6 only one lane right, I can do more quests.

    And again I am saying if you don't like Champion leave it, just don't demoting Champions in front of others especially new players. Weather it's Elsa, kill monger, guardian or which ever class it is. Instead of trying 100% to demote Champion it's better to make videos or threads to guide new players who ask for which Champion to rank up.
    Where did I say I have max out SS but I love to max her out whenever I will get her😉 actually my weakest class is mystic, I'm not mis guiding anyone I just wrote here whatever I feel about her, just understand one thing mojo has much better damage output then bwcv even she's on suicides 😂😂🤣
  • Black widow (claire voyant)
    @DarkEternity


    I have both of them and you are Wrong. Claire buff control and utility is far more than sorcerer supreme. Claire can cycle between her specials quicker than sor Supreme and she definitetly deals more damage in less time.

    And if you think you are right then prove your statement with videos. Post Videos here to prove us wrong.
  • Agent_X_zzzAgent_X_zzz Posts: 4,247 ★★★★★
    Suicides = Claire, No suicides = Sorcerer
  • DarkSoulDLXDarkSoulDLX Posts: 676 ★★★
    Sorceror Supreme

    Have both at R5

    Claire gets used far, far more

    I think both of them are like apprentices standing side by side before Dr doom

    Both of them are amazing excluding the mystics class and both have alot of utility

    Crcrcrc said:

    She nullifies, has triple immunity, suicide friendly, healing, big damage. Anything I missed?

    Cheat death and power steal
    Though I wonder how the cheat death cones in handy
  • AGYAATAGYAAT Posts: 208
    Sorceror Supreme

    AGYAAT said:

    Final conclusion is if you aren't going to R5 a mystic champ for perfect control on your opponent's buffs (that's why mystic class is known for) then you can consider her for R5, Suicide user went crazy when they heard about bwcv (a mystic champ that gets more benefits from suicides) that's how she became over hyped champ in mcoc😂, don't get confused some of your beyond god/god tire champs are depended on suicides for example omega red (anyone wanna share his videos on Omega red without suicides and please don't take biohazard or caltrops path🤣)

    @AGYAAT You 100% hate Claire Voyant, want to see V5, Cavalier, ACT 6.3 and 6.4 videos.

    Another question are you Asian, because Asians use alot of Emojis. I am just asking in general, because you are actually using alot of Emojis.

    And stop misguiding others I have already shown you a video of her buff control. Claire vs Hyperion and BWCV go watch it. Because now you are saying Claire don't have good buff control.

    Can you please send me your roster, I just want to see if you actually have these Champions or you are just trolling.
    I'm not the hater of bwcv but you are clearly a bwcv lover, if you read my first comment then you will realize why I'm saying that (tenacity gave me really hard time against that vision aarkus on that path) but if I have doom or ss (any version) then I can get much easier time, I also said that I don't want max her out because I don't need her immunity and sp2 based burst damage because I have well devolved rosters (13+ R5 or r2 and overflowing resources) and I also said that she will be more helpful if you don't have strong roster because she can manage some matchups where you need different champs, This is why bwcv is good because she has access some different utility in one place if you don't have better options for those utility/requirements...not best damage output or buff control
  • DarkEternityDarkEternity Posts: 533 ★★★
    Sorceror Supreme

    @DarkEternity


    I have both of them and you are Wrong. Claire buff control and utility is far more than sorcerer supreme. Claire can cycle between her specials quicker than sor Supreme and she definitetly deals more damage in less time.

    And if you think you are right then prove your statement with videos. Post Videos here to prove us wrong.

    @MagnaAngemon_333





    Both are pretty equal on damage terms when BWCV is in a fight that she is good against, as you can tell from youtube no one uses BWCV against Winter Soldier. Why? Because she's practically useless in damage terms when against an opponent that IS NOT immune to her debuffs. SorSupreme pretty reliably hits hard specials against opponents that she is not extremely great against, such as Winter Soldier.

    There's also this video that was generously posted by KT1...



    If you want to contest their buff control and utility... which I didn't even think could be discussed when SorSupreme is in the mix. Then just watch a few videos of them in 6.4... like damn dude chill.



    This guy also does a good job showcasing SorSupreme



    Then we can compare their solos on GM as well.




  • PolygonPolygon Posts: 1,923 ★★★★
    Sorceror Supreme

    I have Claire and I don’t have sorcerer. Claire is 6* rank 2, she’s done so much for me as my first main mystic. Absolutely fantastic utility.

    However even with that said, I would much rather heal immensely through block, and not have to worry about dexing those pesky specials (like p99 /bishop etc) then I would constantly having to regen it back with claires curses , and what If i need to be in a different curse with claire?

    Claire with suicides, Sorcerer without (general matchups) for things where immunity or diss track or maybe also maso/regen nodes Claire would take it
    Crcrcrc said:

    Imran said:

    If you got both, believe me you will sorcerer Supreme. She is a leaving potion. She kinda remind me of perfect block team. Also, she don't need any synergy. She fit in any team. Just wait and watch, after many people get her, she will contest with doom not with black widow.

    I have both, and sorcerer is really not that impressive
    You must not know how to play her then
  • Kill_GreyKill_Grey Posts: 8,666 ★★★★★
    Black widow (claire voyant)

    AGYAAT said:

    Final conclusion is if you aren't going to R5 a mystic champ for perfect control on your opponent's buffs (that's why mystic class is known for) then you can consider her for R5, Suicide user went crazy when they heard about bwcv (a mystic champ that gets more benefits from suicides) that's how she became over hyped champ in mcoc😂, don't get confused some of your beyond god/god tire champs are depended on suicides for example omega red (anyone wanna share his videos on Omega red without suicides and please don't take biohazard or caltrops path🤣)

    @Etjama @Kill_Grey Can you please Handel him, he is trolling too much.
    Lol
  • CrcrcrcCrcrcrc Posts: 7,521 ★★★★★
    Black widow (claire voyant)
    GagoH said:


    I have Claire and I don’t have sorcerer. Claire is 6* rank 2, she’s done so much for me as my first main mystic. Absolutely fantastic utility.

    However even with that said, I would much rather heal immensely through block, and not have to worry about dexing those pesky specials (like p99 /bishop etc) then I would constantly having to regen it back with claires curses , and what If i need to be in a different curse with claire?

    Claire with suicides, Sorcerer without (general matchups) for things where immunity or diss track or maybe also maso/regen nodes Claire would take it

    Crcrcrc said:

    Imran said:

    If you got both, believe me you will sorcerer Supreme. She is a leaving potion. She kinda remind me of perfect block team. Also, she don't need any synergy. She fit in any team. Just wait and watch, after many people get her, she will contest with doom not with black widow.

    I have both, and sorcerer is really not that impressive
    You must not know how to play her then
    I understand her, but CV is so much better with her phases not being timed and easy access regen and nullify
  • MagnaAngemon_333MagnaAngemon_333 Posts: 131
    edited September 2020
    Black widow (claire voyant)
    @DarkEternity Have you seen people using Corvus in Realm of legends or Labrynth. Claire does Act 6, Cavaliers and day to day stuff better. You showing Realm of legends fight doesn't make sense, let's do Act 6 and Cavalier and see who can do it quicker. I will only use Claire and you only use Sorcerer Supreme and we both will make videos on it as well as a proof. I have tested sorcerer supreme in labrynth, I know how exactly she works.

    Answer me right now.
  • Black widow (claire voyant)
    @AGYAAT then stop spamming and show your roster. Either war your disagrees proves you wrong pretty much.
  • MagnaAngemon_333MagnaAngemon_333 Posts: 131
    edited September 2020
    Black widow (claire voyant)
    HI_guys said:

    So I like to look into 2 different aspects of a champ when I figure out which is the overall better champ. These two are: In Class Comparison and Overall Viability.

    In Class Comparison: Taking a look at SorSupreme we can see that she has a combination of utility that we see in the class overall. She, first, has a nullification field that acts similar to Doom’s aura of hazareth. Additionally, she has access to slow in order to completely shutdown unstoppable even if you are directly nullifying which is pretty unique to the mystic class overall. She has easy access to armor break which is quite valuable in multiple scenarios and for overall damage output. Her regen on block and passive regen basically make her block into a stronger one than Doom and then her passive heal allows her to basically just regen any sort of chip damage left over. She also can be reliable in certain power control scenarios, though that’s not what she was made for. Her in class weaknesses are basically no immunities, lack of power control (when compared to the top power controllers in class), etc

    BWCV has quite a bit of utility herself. Her most redeeming feature being the ability to shrug off suicides and heal back recoil damage using her L2. She has very very good regen that can allow you to make a few mistakes and still regen to full. She also has a burst phase for damage on her Sp2 that can amp up her damage quite a bit. Her other sp2 utility is power control which isn’t super good power control but it’s alright as well as buff immunity which makes her opponents unable to gain buffs. Her Sp3 also allows her to gain an attack boost only during the Sp3 based her charges, death touch which improves her curse potencies, and (when duped) very very niche death immunity. Her in class weaknesses is that for her to get her nullify she requires the opponent to be immune to one of her debuffs. She also doesn’t have very many ways to counter unstoppable making her lackluster in that regard. Along with all of that, without suicides her damage compared to many other in-class champs like Doom, SorSupreme, Longshot, SymSupreme, Mojo, etc is horrendous.

    Overall Viability: This is really where I believe SorSupreme shines and Claire fails. Claire’s main niche is her great regen, immunities and her buff immunity (sometimes). Her power steal is about as good as SorSupreme’s so they tie it up there. While Claire tries to do most others things well she completely fails. Her damage isn’t even comparable to SorSupreme’s or even one of the best regen champs in the game: Omega Red.

    Claire’s Strengths: She has one of the most potent healing abilities in the game, allowing her to go from around 50% to 100% when she has good crit RNG. This regen is a bit better than Omega’s who, with 30 spores, can regen 30-40% of his max health. She also has amazing buff control and power gain when against a champion immune to her debuffs as well as a large Sp3 she can fire off. Her Sp3 also gets her the next strength she has, death immunity which keeps her from dying and heals her. She’s also an overall simple champion to use with good animations.

    Claire’s Weaknesses: Oh my, where to begin. She essentially requires suicides in order to do any sort of damage as well as a lack of any real mystic based utility to make up for it. Her power and buff control are not strong at all, her buff control only being good if the target is immune to her debuffs or she has just used a sp2 to get the buff immunity debuff. She has no real utility over many champions used in endgame. If I want survivability I use Ghost or Quake, if I want power control I use Doom or Magik (or even Quake, Ghost w/ Hood, or warlock!), if I want nullify for something I’ll use SymSupreme or Longshot (among the other choices like Doom or slow champions for unstoppable like Stealthy, Shulk or SorSupreme). She basically takes everything and does it worse besides immunities and regeneration.

    SorSupreme Strengths: Utility access at any time. She can literally store bits and pieces of utility and activate them whenever. If you need an armor break she can store that, if you need regen on block and passive regen she can store that, if you need slow she can store that. She can also permanently earn a rune using a very powerful Sp3 which makes certain that she will have either armor break, slow, or regen on block the entire fight. Unlike Shulk or Spidergwen who rely on heavies for slow, SorSupreme can access it on special attacks and unlike stealthy she never has to run out of said slow. Her regen on block is invaluable as it can fully block 6.4 No Retreat Annihilus’ sp2, GM’s Sp2, 6.2.6 Champion’s specials, etc without a worry in the world. Her nullification aura is also very useful in the right circumstances. She also has great damage output without suicides using her Fury phase and armor break rune which enhances her damage quite a bit after some ramp up. Her Sp3 can also hit quite hard after you build up her runes. Her power gain mechanics are also very strong as they allow her to benefit from MD, gain power through hitting, and gain power passively without hitting or taking hits.

    SorSupreme Weaknesses: Her damage without armor breaks is quite lackluster. In situations where it’s hard to use her heavy she can’t rotate her phases as quickly. Her slow, unlike basically every other slow champ, cannot he used to counter Rhino or any other science champ that happens to be unstoppable. She can handle being capped at a sp1 but it hinders her damage quite a bit as well, and can take away utility because she needs her Sp3 for a permanent rune. Her power control is also lackluster but not terrible. Still doesn’t compare to the top power control options.

    Using this it would seem like, overall, SorSupreme is better. She has better utility, damage, and accessibility.

    I agree almost. But you said both Power control is on same level. That is absolutely not true. Claire can manage 200% power gain opponents with ease. But SS will struggle there.also you said for power control you'll take doom, survival quake, nullification Symbiote supreme. But Claire does all that. Alone
    @HI_guys And don't forget Claire buff immunity debuff can even bupass that nullification reduction node. And she is also not dependent on her opponent buff too much.
  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 18,296 ★★★★★
    Sorceror Supreme
    I prefer Sorcerer Supreme. Really enjoy her animations, and has some nice utility. Nothing against Claire, but I’d take Sorcerer Supreme any day.
  • DarkSoulDLXDarkSoulDLX Posts: 676 ★★★
    Sorceror Supreme

    @DarkEternity


    I have both of them and you are Wrong. Claire buff control and utility is far more than sorcerer supreme. Claire can cycle between her specials quicker than sor Supreme and she definitetly deals more damage in less time.

    And if you think you are right then prove your statement with videos. Post Videos here to prove us wrong.

    @MagnaAngemon_333





    Both are pretty equal on damage terms when BWCV is in a fight that she is good against, as you can tell from youtube no one uses BWCV against Winter Soldier. Why? Because she's practically useless in damage terms when against an opponent that IS NOT immune to her debuffs. SorSupreme pretty reliably hits hard specials against opponents that she is not extremely great against, such as Winter Soldier.

    There's also this video that was generously posted by KT1...



    If you want to contest their buff control and utility... which I didn't even think could be discussed when SorSupreme is in the mix. Then just watch a few videos of them in 6.4... like damn dude chill.



    This guy also does a good job showcasing SorSupreme



    Then we can compare their solos on GM as well.




    When she came out it was speculated that she was trash and had no damage but now we know that is not true - the only thing that is bothersome about her is that she has a low critical damage rating
  • MagnaAngemon_333MagnaAngemon_333 Posts: 131
    edited September 2020
    Black widow (claire voyant)
    @DarkSoulDLX like I said I have both of them, there is a reason I took sorcerer supreme to rank 5. What I don't like when people trash one Champion to promote their favourite one like Agyaat. And again I am saying you should only take that Champion to rank 5 that you love playing and Champion that you are good with.

    Everyone is giving advices but he is just what should I say, let's just not say.....
  • DarkSoulDLXDarkSoulDLX Posts: 676 ★★★
    Sorceror Supreme

    @DarkSoulDLX like I said I have both of them, there is a reason I took sorcerer supreme to rank 5. What I don't like when people trash one Champion to promote their favourite one like Agyaat. And again I am saying you should only take that Champion to rank 5 that you love playing and Champion that you are good with.

    Everyone is giving advices but he is just what should I say, let's just not say.....

    👍 Sounds fair
  • MagonusMagonus Posts: 211
    @DarkSoulDLX thanks to last nights 5000 6* shards here was my latest 6* pull! Right on topic!

  • None. I only have a longshot, so longshot.
  • DarkSoulDLXDarkSoulDLX Posts: 676 ★★★
    Sorceror Supreme
    Magonus said:

    @DarkSoulDLX thanks to last nights 5000 6* shards here was my latest 6* pull! Right on topic!

    How is she as a 6 star?
  • spiderknight616spiderknight616 Posts: 356 ★★
    Black widow (claire voyant)
    With or without suicides, Claire is extremely badass. That said, I do have Sorc Supreme at R2 and will take her up to R4 as soon as I have the Mystic cats.
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