Arena Feedback [Merged Threads]

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  • DaddriedaDaddrieda Posts: 1,342 ★★★
    Well that was quick... was able to reach streak 29 starting r1 5* and upward. Sure it was hard, but it was doable as hell because the AI throw their specials more now. Yeah lots of deathsquad, but I rather have them that way with the new arena changes if it gives a player more points to finish milestones faster then zero complaining.
  • DaddriedaDaddrieda Posts: 1,342 ★★★
    I wish the game team would have give it a week to see if it may have improved or didn’t.
  • GamerGamer Posts: 9,057 ★★★★★

    I actually preferred the changes. Yes you get harder match ups in general after a certain point, but they were still easily beatable, and now if you go any lower than R3s again.. death matches will be back.. whereas with the changes I was going all the way through my 5*s and most my 4*s..

    At least AI isn't getting changed back. Roll on people crying about 4x death matches again starting next week.

    There’s stil time to improve and deadscard for me was only because there doesn’t trow sp now there will.
  • Midknight007Midknight007 Posts: 725 ★★★
    I might be in the minority, but I do like that a whole team of low PI R4 5* or R1 6*’s generates a fight which is 2x stronger. It allows people to practice fights were strength is no in their favor.

    It might be that the presence of accounts with 3+ r3 6*’s has altered the algorithm again. However, is the PI ratio of 2:1 off when the player does [email protected] r3 5*’s (IE 15k-18k VS 30k-36k)? I haven’t tried a full tilt of r3 5*’s yet.

    While the fights are harder and longer, if you are skilled to keep the streak alive, the infinite streak is not dead.
  • DaddriedaDaddrieda Posts: 1,342 ★★★
    I don’t believe it takes that much time to kill the AI. They’re throwing their powers after powers. I find the new arena change is great for two reasons.

    1: they’re throwing their powers more and I was able to start from the bottom by using r1 5* champions to the top r5 5* champions by taking the advantage of the filter button accessible to quickly start next fight.

    2: lots of deathsquad for sure, but the difference is that they no longer goes defensive mode and wait for an sp3. It raise the experience to hone your skills when they’re aggressive and even if they’re having huge armor and health pool, it doesn’t have to be that difficult as they’re still throwing their powers after powers making it manageable to take the full advantage of your whole collection.

    Are you telling me they’re too annoying with their huge armor and health pool forcing you to tap the screen more than necessary because it takes too long time when clearly they’re throwing their specials after specials while giving you lots of points to faster finish the milestones??? Come on... I find this to be good idea because it will force my skills to be more honed and in a long run they’re nothing of an difficult to defeat.
  • Midknight007Midknight007 Posts: 725 ★★★

    I actually preferred the changes. Yes you get harder match ups in general after a certain point, but they were still easily beatable, and now if you go any lower than R3s again.. death matches will be back.. whereas with the changes I was going all the way through my 5*s and most my 4*s..

    At least AI isn't getting changed back. Roll on people crying about 4x death matches again starting next week.

    I'll tell you where you're wrong.
    Going through my 6 stars and r4 or above 5 stars is 24 runs. Gets me 3 mil points per run.
    It used to be an hour of effortless grind in front of the television or at a queue or a commute.
    I really do not wish or aspire to use my 130 4 stars or my other 60 5 stars. It's tedious and time consuming. I want my milestones, 11-30% rank rewards, and that's it.

    With the changes that are now being reverted (thank you @Kabam Miike ) i had to actually pay attention and attempt perfect gameplay to finish my milestones and it took twice as much time. Also, using my top champs or just r3 and above - i never encountered x4 death matches before. So why would i complain about it when they roll back?
    The counter argument is that people who would leisurely play just for lower tier prizes wasn’t the intent of the change. You could still put in the point for 11-30% and in reasonable time.

    Your issue is more a personal one called lack of roster. I am an arena grinder that would put up 70-80 million and spend 8+ hours a day grinding all my 6*s and 5*s. Very few people put in that type of grinding.

    The change, along with the expansion of the top 300, would lower the cutoff for the top champ dramatically. You might have even seen a drop in the score needed to retain top 10%.

    Kabam was also trying to restore viability of the 4*-below r3 5* in the grind by reducing the max PI to just 2x the players team’s. I actually see what they were trying to do from a true arena grinder perspective.

    Trust me, I have 5 yrs experience grinding the arena back when the 4* basic was all the rage. The ones I see mainly upset (and with some justification) is those that were arena casuals that targeted a lower tier for awards.

    What you are not looking at is that everyone has the same issue you were... many players wouldn’t put in the time or the extra run to get the points needed. So, there may not have been a change to the score needed, as the tier’s points might drop naturally. You are speaking only based on the current time needed.

    11-30% should be obtainable on a score of 13-14 million. Trust me, I know... 16-17million is the cutoff for 10%. I would put in that every week there was a 5* champ I didn’t need or want.

    As for the time it takes? That is a personal choice. You either do or don’t put in the time for the rewards. However, sticking to a “score” on a limited roster, you would eventually have to increase your time as other players’ rosters improved and scores naturally increase over time. Just saying that from a true arena grinders perspective... don’t blame the game for your lack of commitment to the rewards you aspire to achieve.
  • Midknight007Midknight007 Posts: 725 ★★★
    Aziz5253 said:

    I might be in the minority, but I do like that a whole team of low PI R4 5* or R1 6*’s generates a fight which is 2x stronger. It allows people to practice fights were strength is no in their favor.

    It might be that the presence of accounts with 3+ r3 6*’s has altered the algorithm again. However, is the PI ratio of 2:1 off when the player does [email protected] r3 5*’s (IE 15k-18k VS 30k-36k)? I haven’t tried a full tilt of r3 5*’s yet.

    While the fights are harder and longer, if you are skilled to keep the streak alive, the infinite streak is not dead.

    If you do agree that the fights are harder and longer, then you should also know that's not what arenas are for. Do you know how much time consuming that becomes? For people like me who can only play for 2 hours (which while you may think is not a lot, is actually a LOT) arenas have become practically useless
    1st, yes I do know... I have been a drinker in the arenas for 5 years... I have been one of the people who put in 8+ hours for a 70-90 million score. If anyone knows it is me...

    I have no pity for your “2 hours”... you don’t want to put in the time, you do not deserve the awards. Plain and simple.
  • Aziz5253Aziz5253 Posts: 495 ★★★

    I actually preferred the changes. Yes you get harder match ups in general after a certain point, but they were still easily beatable, and now if you go any lower than R3s again.. death matches will be back.. whereas with the changes I was going all the way through my 5*s and most my 4*s..

    At least AI isn't getting changed back. Roll on people crying about 4x death matches again starting next week.

    I'll tell you where you're wrong.
    Going through my 6 stars and r4 or above 5 stars is 24 runs. Gets me 3 mil points per run.
    It used to be an hour of effortless grind in front of the television or at a queue or a commute.
    I really do not wish or aspire to use my 130 4 stars or my other 60 5 stars. It's tedious and time consuming. I want my milestones, 11-30% rank rewards, and that's it.

    With the changes that are now being reverted (thank you @Kabam Miike ) i had to actually pay attention and attempt perfect gameplay to finish my milestones and it took twice as much time. Also, using my top champs or just r3 and above - i never encountered x4 death matches before. So why would i complain about it when they roll back?
    The counter argument is that people who would leisurely play just for lower tier prizes wasn’t the intent of the change. You could still put in the point for 11-30% and in reasonable time.

    Your issue is more a personal one called lack of roster. I am an arena grinder that would put up 70-80 million and spend 8+ hours a day grinding all my 6*s and 5*s. Very few people put in that type of grinding.

    The change, along with the expansion of the top 300, would lower the cutoff for the top champ dramatically. You might have even seen a drop in the score needed to retain top 10%.

    Kabam was also trying to restore viability of the 4*-below r3 5* in the grind by reducing the max PI to just 2x the players team’s. I actually see what they were trying to do from a true arena grinder perspective.

    Trust me, I have 5 yrs experience grinding the arena back when the 4* basic was all the rage. The ones I see mainly upset (and with some justification) is those that were arena casuals that targeted a lower tier for awards.

    What you are not looking at is that everyone has the same issue you were... many players wouldn’t put in the time or the extra run to get the points needed. So, there may not have been a change to the score needed, as the tier’s points might drop naturally. You are speaking only based on the current time needed.

    11-30% should be obtainable on a score of 13-14 million. Trust me, I know... 16-17million is the cutoff for 10%. I would put in that every week there was a 5* champ I didn’t need or want.

    As for the time it takes? That is a personal choice. You either do or don’t put in the time for the rewards. However, sticking to a “score” on a limited roster, you would eventually have to increase your time as other players’ rosters improved and scores naturally increase over time. Just saying that from a true arena grinders perspective... don’t blame the game for your lack of commitment to the rewards you aspire to achieve.
    So you're saying we should grind away our life, and some people not even attempt arenas now because of lack of roster or will to put in that much time. Not even to get the basic units?

    You're not the only one who's been grinding for years, and while you say that the changes reduces the cutoff for the points, that doesn't make a difference in the slightest because people nevertheless will be aiming just as high for the champ.

    I swear because of some people this game is starting to feel like full time work shifts rather than a time to enjoy in between breaks now.
  • Midknight007Midknight007 Posts: 725 ★★★
    Everyone keeps saying “death squads”. These are not true death squads... a team of below r3 5*’s would pull an opponent R2-R3 6*’s.... meaning 15k and below PI was pulling a match of 45-55k... this was 3x or greater the PI and was a death squad.

    This was a byproduct of the algorithm... I did a video on this back in Jan last year on YouTube. I foresaw the lift of the death squad when R3 6*s were released and foretold it back then.

    These aren’t even remotely close to death squads. Kabam limited them to 2x the PI as players complained about not being able to use 4*’s and low ranking 5’s... in fixing the death squad issue, the also fixed the bug that was causing them and allowing an easy infinite streak at the higher rankings. Basically, they made 4* and low rank 5* viable again by lowering the max difficulty of the fight. However, in doing this, it broadened the ability for the algorithm to find matches within scope of the 2x maximum at a team pi of 25-28k as with the number of players with 3+ R3 6*’s means there are qualifying matches.

    It is still not a “death match” as the skill to beat them is not that much greater. Just my opinion.
  • Midknight007Midknight007 Posts: 725 ★★★
    Aziz5253 said:

    I actually preferred the changes. Yes you get harder match ups in general after a certain point, but they were still easily beatable, and now if you go any lower than R3s again.. death matches will be back.. whereas with the changes I was going all the way through my 5*s and most my 4*s..

    At least AI isn't getting changed back. Roll on people crying about 4x death matches again starting next week.

    I'll tell you where you're wrong.
    Going through my 6 stars and r4 or above 5 stars is 24 runs. Gets me 3 mil points per run.
    It used to be an hour of effortless grind in front of the television or at a queue or a commute.
    I really do not wish or aspire to use my 130 4 stars or my other 60 5 stars. It's tedious and time consuming. I want my milestones, 11-30% rank rewards, and that's it.

    With the changes that are now being reverted (thank you @Kabam Miike ) i had to actually pay attention and attempt perfect gameplay to finish my milestones and it took twice as much time. Also, using my top champs or just r3 and above - i never encountered x4 death matches before. So why would i complain about it when they roll back?
    The counter argument is that people who would leisurely play just for lower tier prizes wasn’t the intent of the change. You could still put in the point for 11-30% and in reasonable time.

    Your issue is more a personal one called lack of roster. I am an arena grinder that would put up 70-80 million and spend 8+ hours a day grinding all my 6*s and 5*s. Very few people put in that type of grinding.

    The change, along with the expansion of the top 300, would lower the cutoff for the top champ dramatically. You might have even seen a drop in the score needed to retain top 10%.

    Kabam was also trying to restore viability of the 4*-below r3 5* in the grind by reducing the max PI to just 2x the players team’s. I actually see what they were trying to do from a true arena grinder perspective.

    Trust me, I have 5 yrs experience grinding the arena back when the 4* basic was all the rage. The ones I see mainly upset (and with some justification) is those that were arena casuals that targeted a lower tier for awards.

    What you are not looking at is that everyone has the same issue you were... many players wouldn’t put in the time or the extra run to get the points needed. So, there may not have been a change to the score needed, as the tier’s points might drop naturally. You are speaking only based on the current time needed.

    11-30% should be obtainable on a score of 13-14 million. Trust me, I know... 16-17million is the cutoff for 10%. I would put in that every week there was a 5* champ I didn’t need or want.

    As for the time it takes? That is a personal choice. You either do or don’t put in the time for the rewards. However, sticking to a “score” on a limited roster, you would eventually have to increase your time as other players’ rosters improved and scores naturally increase over time. Just saying that from a true arena grinders perspective... don’t blame the game for your lack of commitment to the rewards you aspire to achieve.
    So you're saying we should grind away our life, and some people not even attempt arenas now because of lack of roster or will to put in that much time. Not even to get the basic units?

    You're not the only one who's been grinding for years, and while you say that the changes reduces the cutoff for the points, that doesn't make a difference in the slightest because people nevertheless will be aiming just as high for the champ.

    I swear because of some people this game is starting to feel like full time work shifts rather than a time to enjoy in between breaks now.
    No, you are being hyperbolic and antidotal with your position. Take the “personal” out of your argument and reread.

    You are literally complaining it will take you 20-30 minutes more. If that is too much, don’t do it. Then in kind, if you don’t get the rewards, that is your choice.

    You choose your quality of “life” over a game. Good for you, but a fake shouldn’t have to be made to fit in your life when there are those having to put in 8+ hours to compete.

    I am sorry, but the increase in the top pool and the difficulty of matches would drop the score to where you wouldn’t need to put in 8+ hours a day to get a featured champ. It might be able to be done in 4-6...

    Thus allowing others to have more of a life and increase the number of people willing to grind for a champ, expand the pool and lower the score needed for 11-30%.

    Your argument is about your little corner of the game and your life... not the overall mechanics of how the game works or how the changes would impact arena over time. Sorry, just my opinion.
  • zaspacerzaspacer Posts: 76
    edited October 2020

    Alright everybody, thanks for your patience. I come with news!

    After a bunch of testing and conversations, we're going to be reverting the changes to Matchmaking. The goal is to have that ready for the next run of Red Goblin on Monday. This will not affect the changes to AI, which have been pretty popular.

    There is a chance that the changes will not be ready for Monday, though those chances are slim.

    Once again, thank you for your patience as we worked to address this.

    MCOC Team said:


    Summoners,

    This week, we rolled a change to matchmaking in Arenas with the intention of making Arenas more manageable by reducing the number of deathmatches that Summoners ran into. This had the unfortunate knock-on of killing the "Infinite Streak" that players have come to rely on. This was not our intention.

    We will be reverting the changes to matchmaking on Sunday, October 11th before the second run of the Red Goblin arena. The changes to AI will remain.

    Thank you all for your patience as we worked to fix this issue.

    MCOC Team,

    Sorry the change became an issue. Thank you for your efforts in reviewing Arena mode, thinking about possible changes to improve it, communicating your thoughts, and the work you put into trying to make the improvements happen. This spirit, ideas, and effort are really great to see, and I hope you continue with this outlook for the game and the community.

    I also really appreciate your process toward reacting to input from the community reaction. And your work to try to figure what solution would work for the game and community.

    Even if this recent change is not going to stay, I think it's really neat to see and be able to try these changes as a player. Thank you. And maybe this change was just "too fast, too soon" for some players to really get familiar with and feel out if they prefer it or not (I know I have not fully tested it out).

    Hopefully we'll see you explore more custom Arena types in the future. Maybe as alternate (additional) Arenas like the "Punishing Arena" currently is. This type of "mode variation sampling" (and testing) option can be interesting for players and devs (as long as you don't put any big rewards on them that player flip out over).
  • Midknight007Midknight007 Posts: 725 ★★★

    I actually preferred the changes. Yes you get harder match ups in general after a certain point, but they were still easily beatable, and now if you go any lower than R3s again.. death matches will be back.. whereas with the changes I was going all the way through my 5*s and most my 4*s..

    At least AI isn't getting changed back. Roll on people crying about 4x death matches again starting next week.

    I'll tell you where you're wrong.
    Going through my 6 stars and r4 or above 5 stars is 24 runs. Gets me 3 mil points per run.
    It used to be an hour of effortless grind in front of the television or at a queue or a commute.
    I really do not wish or aspire to use my 130 4 stars or my other 60 5 stars. It's tedious and time consuming. I want my milestones, 11-30% rank rewards, and that's it.

    With the changes that are now being reverted (thank you @Kabam Miike ) i had to actually pay attention and attempt perfect gameplay to finish my milestones and it took twice as much time. Also, using my top champs or just r3 and above - i never encountered x4 death matches before. So why would i complain about it when they roll back?
    The counter argument is that people who would leisurely play just for lower tier prizes wasn’t the intent of the change. You could still put in the point for 11-30% and in reasonable time.

    Your issue is more a personal one called lack of roster. I am an arena grinder that would put up 70-80 million and spend 8+ hours a day grinding all my 6*s and 5*s. Very few people put in that type of grinding.

    The change, along with the expansion of the top 300, would lower the cutoff for the top champ dramatically. You might have even seen a drop in the score needed to retain top 10%.

    Kabam was also trying to restore viability of the 4*-below r3 5* in the grind by reducing the max PI to just 2x the players team’s. I actually see what they were trying to do from a true arena grinder perspective.

    Trust me, I have 5 yrs experience grinding the arena back when the 4* basic was all the rage. The ones I see mainly upset (and with some justification) is those that were arena casuals that targeted a lower tier for awards.

    What you are not looking at is that everyone has the same issue you were... many players wouldn’t put in the time or the extra run to get the points needed. So, there may not have been a change to the score needed, as the tier’s points might drop naturally. You are speaking only based on the current time needed.

    11-30% should be obtainable on a score of 13-14 million. Trust me, I know... 16-17million is the cutoff for 10%. I would put in that every week there was a 5* champ I didn’t need or want.

    As for the time it takes? That is a personal choice. You either do or don’t put in the time for the rewards. However, sticking to a “score” on a limited roster, you would eventually have to increase your time as other players’ rosters improved and scores naturally increase over time. Just saying that from a true arena grinders perspective... don’t blame the game for your lack of commitment to the rewards you aspire to achieve.
    I actually have a robust 30 r5/r2 roster and a total of 30 6 stars.
    My problem is actually called 'time' which needs to be kept at a minimum due to work and family.
    With the previous arena, 1h per day to get my milestones and decent rank was within reason. I have 0 intention to use my entire lower tier roster. I sometimes even neglect my r4 5 stars for lack of time. So, anything above 1h a day was not worth my time.
    I believe i represent the majority of dedicated players. The 1% who grind through their entire teams for rank rewards do not represent the majority of players.and perhaps, they are the only ones who might enjoy the change that is about to be rolled back.
    Stop bringing the antidotal when you really need are facts and an overall understanding of what the changes are intended to do and how the arena works by in large.

    Your argument is “time”... but you are talking to someone who knows what it means to juggle family, a full time job and arena... I also know what it takes to put up scores to get a champ, or skate at 1-10% or 11-30%



    I will put 4-5 hrs of work just get too 10% with a score of 17 million... your problem is more roster related and less time related to be honest.

    Welcome to the big leagues, kid! You are talking with someone who knows all to well what it takes to rank and has been doing it for 5+ years in the game. Got most all of my 4* from the featured and basic when that was all we had. Been grinding ever since.
  • Arena is a grind for people who want the units, BCs and crystal shards to improve their resources stash. So to achieve their goals it means putting up a couple hundred, to a few hundred fights or so. That’s takes a fair few hours each day over 3 days for each round. We don’t need arena to be anymore of a lengthier grind than it already is. The quality of life differences these latest changes bring to the table, for the player, means our fights are taking a lot longer than before the changes we made. Yes some elements of the changes are better, the defender AI for example, but the matchmaking function has been screwed up. pitting my r4 5*s and r1 6*s against the same 12 or so r3 6*s makes for very boring and long winded fights once you’re at around 18-20+ streak. When people want to just smash out their grind as quickly as possible, this system now prevents that and making the arena more laborious. Not exactly a ‘fun game mode’ at the moment.
    Hopefully the proposed changes will address the matchmaking element to prevent players spending way too much time in the arena than is necessary.
  • DaddriedaDaddrieda Posts: 1,342 ★★★


    So disappointed in the community. Decided to see if I could use r1 without streak formula affecting and it works wonder. Now I can fully rack in more points to finish the milestones faster and go back to my life. Because of you folks that cry because of the “death squad” is too much for you too handle because the amount of times it takes to kill it is a joke when they are throwing their powers after powers. Shame on you community for not being willing to adapt and learn. Kabam just wanted to do that would be great for us and that is testing our skills and evolve it more.
  • DaddriedaDaddrieda Posts: 1,342 ★★★

    I didn't say anything because it wouldn't have added anything new to what the majority was already saying, but thanks for reverting the decision Kabam :) Fighting series after series some 5/65 Dr Doom, Nick Fury or Silver Surfer with twice my PI wasn't my idea of fun.

    Wouldn’t mind it as it gives more points to faster reach milestones and call it a day.
  • DaddriedaDaddrieda Posts: 1,342 ★★★

    It is complete ****. Starting from 13 series there are always 6* 3/45 best champions. It is always doom or thing here. Kabam, I hate you. You give me unusable 6* roster and want me to fight against best champions in the game. The fights are not good, they are too hard. Just a few screenshots of the easiest enemies from my arena:







    you' be fine... they are throwing their powers after powers so you get used to it as well racking up points to faster finish milestones.
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