Agree with everything here. Over the last month, I play less and pay less. I've spent thousands on this game, that's the only think keeping me from moving on entirely.
The 6 star announcement was what really pushed me away from the game and devalued everything I thought I had accomplished. The fact that @Kabam Miike and team refuse to address the 6 star feedback is soul crushing.
The unraveling since then just added insult to an already very injured game and community.
I find the previously mentioned 5* arena a great idea
It would take a huge amount of load off the 4* featured and 4* basic arena cutoffs.
The heaviest grinders will spend time on that, giving mid to early players a chance of getting good 4*s.
I'm afraid that is highly unlikely, because this theory assumes players are moronic lemmings.
Only 800 people get the 4* featured. It is highly unlikely Kabam would be handing out a lot more 5* featured champions. That means the most that a 5* featured arena could do is maybe pull away the top 800 arena grinders that currently shoot for the 4* featured. You can't draw a lot more than that because the players that consistently don't break into the top ranks to get the 5* featured won't just keep trying over and over again and losing. They will go back to the 4* featured arena.
That might drop scores in the 4* featured arena, but not by enough to help you. I can imagine that dropping scores by 10%-20% maybe, but those scores are already averaging 15million+. They might drop to 12-15million.
And this will have zero impact on the basic arena. The problem is that pulling about 800 people from the 4* featured to the 5* featured might attract 800 people from the 4* basic to the 4* featured, maybe. Not much more. Probably a lot less. And when you remove the top 800 people from the basic arena, which awards the basic champ to over ten thousand grinders, that doesn't move cutoffs by much if anything. We can actually look at the Reddit data to see what removing the top 1000 players would likely do. It tends on average to reduce cutoff scores by on the over of tens of thousands to maybe a couple hundred thousand points. Out of millions.
Everyone looks at the wrong numbers. They look at cutoff score. Cutoff score is just the points the last person to get the champ happened to score at that time. Let's look at Archangel round one. His estimated cutoff was about 6.1 million. A little over 13,500 players got Archangel in round one. How many players have to be removed from the arena to lower that score? Well, if the top 800 players disappear then the cutoff score drops from 6.1 million to about 6.05 million. Not a huge jump. What if we somehow eliminate half of the top players? That's 6,750 players. Then the score drops to about 3 million. That's *still* pretty high for casual players, but more importantly that's the floor. We know that when players don't think they are going to make it they give up past a certain point. We know that because we can see it in the scoring distribution which I posted graphs about previously. Scores suddenly drop off at a certain point that is different for every champion, so we know it isn't just the limits of the playerbase. If the top 7000 grinders left the basic arena, Archangel would have gone for more than 3 million, and certainly no less. Probably over four million given the numbers.
And nothing short of a nuclear war is going to divert the attention of 7000 of the top arena grinders. Certainly not a 5* arena that is likely to only award the 5* champ to about 800 of them or less.
You simply cannot remove enough players to lower scores dramatically by dangling a different arena in front of them. That's why T4B doesn't significantly lower scores. The basic champ is worth more than the T4B to enough players that it doesn't matter if it diverts the attention of others. Enough players fill in the gap to keep cutoff scores high.
The bottom line is cutoff scores are high because the players decide that is the level of effort that is worth the champ. That's low when the champ is in low demand, and high when it is in high demand. The only way to lower featured 4* or basic 4* champs is to create a simultaneous arena that doesn't just offer something better, but is willing to give it out to a comparable number of players - tens of thousands of them. Because not enough players are going to choose to spend effort in a consistently futile arena when they have a guaranteed win in a lower one. Look at the 5* featured. 800 get it. How many seriously try? Based on the numbers, between 1000 and 1200, max. The rest of the scoring is nowhere near and clearly not a serious attempt to displace the top. You have to be that close to even try. Take a look at Kingpin round one. The 800th place player put up 15 million to get him. If you only put up 14 million you were in 900th place. Someone put up 11.8 million and ended up in 1097th place. A poor guy put up 8 million and got 1260th place. Below that you quickly get to players that are just screwing around for the milestones: five million was 2162th place.
Numbers matter, but cutoff score is not the number that matters. Placement matters. 130,000 players entered the Archangel round one event. Over 20,000 scored over three million. Over 16,000 likely scored over five million. Over 13,500 scored over 6.1 million. And those are the players that got him. You want to lower the cutoff? Give at least 2500 players something worth grinding instead, and that means at least 2000 of them have to actually win it. And then the cutoff will be 5 million. Maybe, because some of those players might try harder if 2500 players disappeared.
130,000. 16,000. 13,500. These are the numbers that matter. That's how big the number of players chasing these things are. That's the number you have to change to make a dent in the cutoff scores. And those players are not going to do self-destructive things to help you out.
The fun may have gone for those who have well established accounts. I started all over again a few months ago and have enjoyed growing my junior account and not spending, obviously this is my personal experience and I wonder if the newly created accounts in the last 5-8 months would also agree.
How to make this game "fun" again for those well established accounts seems to be a rather difficult task, other than the obvious of fixing bugs, what would you like to see that is new and exciting again where you can't wait to log in, check forums, watch youtube etc etc etc?
New chars, been there done that, same same but different.
Revamped existing content, yeah nah, as above.
Time to go next level in mobile gaming, we need immersion, where I can duel a top dog with my 3* AA or SL and they physically feel my power Mwahahahahahaha.... yeah dreams are free but it would be cool.
I've done the same thing. It put a little fun back into it.. the problem is the skills.. flowing through act 4 with 2 3/30s and hardly needing to use any resources... It's still mundane and routine but the little bit of challenge it provided was a light relief. Managed to pull mephisto and medusa each as 4* with single crystal spins for both. Redoing content with new and unfamiliar champs was more fun than anything released lately.
I not exactly sure where the game went full kamikaze, can't say it was really any one defining moment... I do miss the old times, the good times. We've had 4 guys I've played with for the past 2 years retire within the last 2 weeks. It's more of a chore/job now as opposed to something fun.
First, this is a great discussion and i think the dev team should read every message here.
The game isnt too far off the tracks. A five star arena, fixing aw, and maybe even introducing new content will fix the game, as it will not only have the same reward system as four stars that everyone enjoyed but it will also have new enjoyable and playable content such as:
Alliance base (i have a post about my idea for this)
Quest editor
Online duels
Much more can be added to this list. Why only reintroduce the same content when there is so much more potential?
I also have other suggestions in my suggestion posts but the main idea here is keep the game on the tracks by fixing the main problems. You may get more money now but more content will gain much more support and player spending.
Honestly imo rewards need a rework badly. The sunday arenas are not worth the grind for someone like me im a casual player i spend big if i have the cash to but not all the time. I have 6 5* none above r3. So when it comes to the bigger arenas i run into the hard death match fights 8 fights in. I love my acct and im trying like hell to get uncollected just finished 5.1.6 a couple hours ago. I love the team work in war and aq. Not a fan of the sents. Also not a fan of map 3 crystals. The deals that appear when you open a phc and get a 2 star or a 3 star need to be reworked i think and maybe a unit drop. 2500 for a 4* crystal. Thats madness. But as the days tick on and i invest in my 4* i get disheartened because im just investing res, time, money in the new 3*. I really wish 19.0 would have worked i was excited for the changes to aq. I wish i had better luck with allis in the past cause i might be alot further in my acct. But back to the point i wish the aq rewards would be active. Same with the alli events. So there is some hope on the horizon but as a player of 3 years it would be awesome to see better rewards all over the game. Even the eq rewards arent motivating. Just my 2 cents. I love the game. Dont plan on quitting anytime. So ill deal with quite a bit. Just would be way cooler if these things would happen.
They need to stop being such Scrooge's with rank up material, veteran players who aren't in the top 1% or whales should he able to get more t5 basics and t2 alphas to rank 4 and 5 their 5*s, especially with 6*s out. Even t3 class cat quests need improvement, you can waste loads of energy running through them with no full cat to show for your efforts.
In my case, I played this game 2 years. Paid around 2-3k. Maybe small $$ compare to most of you. But I do feel this game is lesser and lesser interesting. I guess mainly due to:
1. Bugs! Bugs that make us fighting harder and harder.
2. Delay, overheat, battery power eating & emergency maintenance! It just makes me losing motivation in playing.
3. Compensation. I am not a greedy guy. But what makes me most angry is the so call “compensation”! Obviously Kabam don’t care about our feeling and upset. Understand you are a company needed earning, but do you think this kind of service and compensation for angry customers are suitable? Is it making them more angry than happy?
4. Nerfing, introducing strong new champs, nerfing again. This is understandable because Kabam wants $$. But can you at least giving some compensation or options (RDT) to those invested heavy on old new stronge champs? Stop telling us you are debugging instead of nerfing. We don’t accept this kind of low grading lie. Just tell us it is balancing and give us option to rank down him/her.
5. Most Most Most upset is this forum. Our opinions are not respected. Admin are freely warn, ban, combine our threads, by using whatever reasons and rules. It simply push us to mcoc Facebook page and complaining there with more dirty languages. Why not open an area to let us release our angry, and send someone response us in more “constructive” and “positive” way?
I personally made decision that stop spending a penny until I feel Kabam has “heart” to treat us as customers again.
They are claiming that 5 stars will become more available. Well, where are the shards then? I was hoping this month would have some shards in the calendar, but nothing. Typical. Act 5 is a joke in terms of 5 star shards. They are willing to give out a 5 star awakening gem, but hardly any shards. Makes no sense. Let's face it, as of now the best way to get 5 stars quicker is through the store. I remember when Kabam sent us 5 star shards in a summoner appreciation mail. Those don't exist anymore, all you see now is offer after offer being pushed in our faces.
5 star shards were way rarer. They might not be where you’d like them to be, but other than t2a, 5 Star shards, t4c, t4cc and 5 star sig stones are all way more available than they were. Glory store, basic 4 star arena, and increase monthly quest rewards have definitely made a difference. 5/50 four stars used to be an accomplishment now it’s the baseline.
Unfortunately, Kabam can’t quite figure out the balance between profit and player satisfaction.. as seen with the bad “deals” and bad “compensation”, as well as, the poorly tested and buggy updates and long standing player-affected bugs, increasing in AW difficulty, poor communication with the playerbase. This is turning off a lot of the players... but Kabam apparently doesn’t care about customer satisfaction and eventually that catches up to companies...
Comments
The 6 star announcement was what really pushed me away from the game and devalued everything I thought I had accomplished. The fact that @Kabam Miike and team refuse to address the 6 star feedback is soul crushing.
The unraveling since then just added insult to an already very injured game and community.
It would take a huge amount of load off the 4* featured and 4* basic arena cutoffs.
The heaviest grinders will spend time on that, giving mid to early players a chance of getting good 4*s.
Admit it, with the coming of 6*s, 3*s will become quite useless,
Thus the 3* arena could eventually give mid or new players a chance to experience new characters too, without having to play 12 hours a day.
Many of us are school kids, we cannot grind all day, please keep us in mind kabam.
I'm afraid that is highly unlikely, because this theory assumes players are moronic lemmings.
Only 800 people get the 4* featured. It is highly unlikely Kabam would be handing out a lot more 5* featured champions. That means the most that a 5* featured arena could do is maybe pull away the top 800 arena grinders that currently shoot for the 4* featured. You can't draw a lot more than that because the players that consistently don't break into the top ranks to get the 5* featured won't just keep trying over and over again and losing. They will go back to the 4* featured arena.
That might drop scores in the 4* featured arena, but not by enough to help you. I can imagine that dropping scores by 10%-20% maybe, but those scores are already averaging 15million+. They might drop to 12-15million.
And this will have zero impact on the basic arena. The problem is that pulling about 800 people from the 4* featured to the 5* featured might attract 800 people from the 4* basic to the 4* featured, maybe. Not much more. Probably a lot less. And when you remove the top 800 people from the basic arena, which awards the basic champ to over ten thousand grinders, that doesn't move cutoffs by much if anything. We can actually look at the Reddit data to see what removing the top 1000 players would likely do. It tends on average to reduce cutoff scores by on the over of tens of thousands to maybe a couple hundred thousand points. Out of millions.
Everyone looks at the wrong numbers. They look at cutoff score. Cutoff score is just the points the last person to get the champ happened to score at that time. Let's look at Archangel round one. His estimated cutoff was about 6.1 million. A little over 13,500 players got Archangel in round one. How many players have to be removed from the arena to lower that score? Well, if the top 800 players disappear then the cutoff score drops from 6.1 million to about 6.05 million. Not a huge jump. What if we somehow eliminate half of the top players? That's 6,750 players. Then the score drops to about 3 million. That's *still* pretty high for casual players, but more importantly that's the floor. We know that when players don't think they are going to make it they give up past a certain point. We know that because we can see it in the scoring distribution which I posted graphs about previously. Scores suddenly drop off at a certain point that is different for every champion, so we know it isn't just the limits of the playerbase. If the top 7000 grinders left the basic arena, Archangel would have gone for more than 3 million, and certainly no less. Probably over four million given the numbers.
And nothing short of a nuclear war is going to divert the attention of 7000 of the top arena grinders. Certainly not a 5* arena that is likely to only award the 5* champ to about 800 of them or less.
You simply cannot remove enough players to lower scores dramatically by dangling a different arena in front of them. That's why T4B doesn't significantly lower scores. The basic champ is worth more than the T4B to enough players that it doesn't matter if it diverts the attention of others. Enough players fill in the gap to keep cutoff scores high.
The bottom line is cutoff scores are high because the players decide that is the level of effort that is worth the champ. That's low when the champ is in low demand, and high when it is in high demand. The only way to lower featured 4* or basic 4* champs is to create a simultaneous arena that doesn't just offer something better, but is willing to give it out to a comparable number of players - tens of thousands of them. Because not enough players are going to choose to spend effort in a consistently futile arena when they have a guaranteed win in a lower one. Look at the 5* featured. 800 get it. How many seriously try? Based on the numbers, between 1000 and 1200, max. The rest of the scoring is nowhere near and clearly not a serious attempt to displace the top. You have to be that close to even try. Take a look at Kingpin round one. The 800th place player put up 15 million to get him. If you only put up 14 million you were in 900th place. Someone put up 11.8 million and ended up in 1097th place. A poor guy put up 8 million and got 1260th place. Below that you quickly get to players that are just screwing around for the milestones: five million was 2162th place.
Numbers matter, but cutoff score is not the number that matters. Placement matters. 130,000 players entered the Archangel round one event. Over 20,000 scored over three million. Over 16,000 likely scored over five million. Over 13,500 scored over 6.1 million. And those are the players that got him. You want to lower the cutoff? Give at least 2500 players something worth grinding instead, and that means at least 2000 of them have to actually win it. And then the cutoff will be 5 million. Maybe, because some of those players might try harder if 2500 players disappeared.
130,000. 16,000. 13,500. These are the numbers that matter. That's how big the number of players chasing these things are. That's the number you have to change to make a dent in the cutoff scores. And those players are not going to do self-destructive things to help you out.
I've done the same thing. It put a little fun back into it.. the problem is the skills.. flowing through act 4 with 2 3/30s and hardly needing to use any resources... It's still mundane and routine but the little bit of challenge it provided was a light relief. Managed to pull mephisto and medusa each as 4* with single crystal spins for both. Redoing content with new and unfamiliar champs was more fun than anything released lately.
I not exactly sure where the game went full kamikaze, can't say it was really any one defining moment... I do miss the old times, the good times. We've had 4 guys I've played with for the past 2 years retire within the last 2 weeks. It's more of a chore/job now as opposed to something fun.
The game isnt too far off the tracks. A five star arena, fixing aw, and maybe even introducing new content will fix the game, as it will not only have the same reward system as four stars that everyone enjoyed but it will also have new enjoyable and playable content such as:
Alliance base (i have a post about my idea for this)
Quest editor
Online duels
Much more can be added to this list. Why only reintroduce the same content when there is so much more potential?
I also have other suggestions in my suggestion posts but the main idea here is keep the game on the tracks by fixing the main problems. You may get more money now but more content will gain much more support and player spending.
what has happened to this game! I'm surprised they didn't close this thread
1. Bugs! Bugs that make us fighting harder and harder.
2. Delay, overheat, battery power eating & emergency maintenance! It just makes me losing motivation in playing.
3. Compensation. I am not a greedy guy. But what makes me most angry is the so call “compensation”! Obviously Kabam don’t care about our feeling and upset. Understand you are a company needed earning, but do you think this kind of service and compensation for angry customers are suitable? Is it making them more angry than happy?
4. Nerfing, introducing strong new champs, nerfing again. This is understandable because Kabam wants $$. But can you at least giving some compensation or options (RDT) to those invested heavy on old new stronge champs? Stop telling us you are debugging instead of nerfing. We don’t accept this kind of low grading lie. Just tell us it is balancing and give us option to rank down him/her.
5. Most Most Most upset is this forum. Our opinions are not respected. Admin are freely warn, ban, combine our threads, by using whatever reasons and rules. It simply push us to mcoc Facebook page and complaining there with more dirty languages. Why not open an area to let us release our angry, and send someone response us in more “constructive” and “positive” way?
I personally made decision that stop spending a penny until I feel Kabam has “heart” to treat us as customers again.