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The hardest champs to master are all women .../raiseeyebrow

EtherealityEthereality Posts: 685 ★★★
edited February 2021 in General Discussion
I am not saying that Kabam purposely is trying to hint towards a sexist mindset nor that the Kabam designers are sexist but....


Quake, Ghost, Tigra and Invisible Woman are for sure the champs that require the most skill to master in the game. Phrases like " hard to handle" , "high maintenance", "difficult to deal with" , "stressful to play", etc. definetely apply to them.

Yes there are some other male champs that require skill too (For example Aegon) but their mechanics are nowhere near as intricate as the four above.

I am not saying that Kabam should change them make them "easy" to play. They are fine as they are as they all sport a very unique gameplay mechanic, which is actually a good thing. What I am saying is that Kabam should design at least one male champ with as intricate playstyle as the girls I mentioned. They can also do a gender neutral too one, whatever, I dont care who. Otherwise what Kabam is asking for is for some feminist magazine to get ahold of the story and have a field day and blow everything out of proportion.... I can see the headline already:

Major Mobile Gaming Company Portrays Women as Difficult to Play With!
(Oh the horror!!!)


So c'mon Kabam. I am sure you can come up with a non-female "difficult to master" champion, I believe in ya!

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Comments

  • Options
    EtherealityEthereality Posts: 685 ★★★
    Lol, you guys don't seem to see that I too, LIKE that Quake and Ghost are the way the are. Well, Quake I gave up learning how to use, Ghost though I am slowly getting there, definitely easier and more fun to learn that Quake that's for sure. Tigra and IW I have only as 3* 4* so have only messed around with, but can see already how complex they are.

    Anyway my point is that I, particularly ME, am fine with the matriarchy, I really dont mind it. I just dont wanna have to hear some exaggeratedly woke reporter starting to pick on Kabam for their oversight. I am from the school of thought that Political Correcteness has a purpose and a place in today's world, except only when it's exaggerated to the point that it becomes PI just for the sake of PI.

    Now, arguably of course, talking about how a game portrays the gameplay of a few women might indeed qualify as "PI just for the sake of PI". And that is a valid point too. But at least the conversation needs to happen.
  • Options
    odishika123odishika123 Posts: 5,385 ★★★★★

    It’s these posts that make me lose my hope in humanity

    You still have hope in humanity when posts calling Quake, ghost and Warlock trash exist?
  • Options
    SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 21,859 ★★★★★

    Lol, you guys don't seem to see that I too, LIKE that Quake and Ghost are the way the are. Well, Quake I gave up learning how to use, Ghost though I am slowly getting there, definitely easier and more fun to learn that Quake that's for sure. Tigra and IW I have only as 3* 4* so have only messed around with, but can see already how complex they are.

    Anyway my point is that I, particularly ME, am fine with the matriarchy, I really dont mind it. I just dont wanna have to hear some exaggeratedly woke reporter starting to pick on Kabam for their oversight. I am from the school of thought that Political Correcteness has a purpose and a place in today's world, except only when it's exaggerated to the point that it becomes PI just for the sake of PI.

    Now, arguably of course, talking about how a game portrays the gameplay of a few women might indeed qualify as "PI just for the sake of PI". And that is a valid point too. But at least the conversation needs to happen.

    But does it? I feel like the fact the two of them are the top two champs in this game would massively overshadow they fact they require lots of skill to play.
  • Options
    EtherealityEthereality Posts: 685 ★★★

    Lol, you guys don't seem to see that I too, LIKE that Quake and Ghost are the way the are. Well, Quake I gave up learning how to use, Ghost though I am slowly getting there, definitely easier and more fun to learn that Quake that's for sure. Tigra and IW I have only as 3* 4* so have only messed around with, but can see already how complex they are.

    Anyway my point is that I, particularly ME, am fine with the matriarchy, I really dont mind it. I just dont wanna have to hear some exaggeratedly woke reporter starting to pick on Kabam for their oversight. I am from the school of thought that Political Correcteness has a purpose and a place in today's world, except only when it's exaggerated to the point that it becomes PI just for the sake of PI.

    Now, arguably of course, talking about how a game portrays the gameplay of a few women might indeed qualify as "PI just for the sake of PI". And that is a valid point too. But at least the conversation needs to happen.

    But does it? I feel like the fact the two of them are the top two champs in this game would massively overshadow they fact they require lots of skill to play.
    Valid point, hadn't thought about that angle.
    Qacob said:

    Dude it's a game. Literally no one could care less what gender the champions are in the first place.

    Ooooh dude, I move within academic circles and you have NO IDEA how many people I know that would have a field day with the fact the the hardest champs to master are women.

  • Options
    QacobQacob Posts: 2,253 ★★★★★

    Lol, you guys don't seem to see that I too, LIKE that Quake and Ghost are the way the are. Well, Quake I gave up learning how to use, Ghost though I am slowly getting there, definitely easier and more fun to learn that Quake that's for sure. Tigra and IW I have only as 3* 4* so have only messed around with, but can see already how complex they are.

    Anyway my point is that I, particularly ME, am fine with the matriarchy, I really dont mind it. I just dont wanna have to hear some exaggeratedly woke reporter starting to pick on Kabam for their oversight. I am from the school of thought that Political Correcteness has a purpose and a place in today's world, except only when it's exaggerated to the point that it becomes PI just for the sake of PI.

    Now, arguably of course, talking about how a game portrays the gameplay of a few women might indeed qualify as "PI just for the sake of PI". And that is a valid point too. But at least the conversation needs to happen.

    But does it? I feel like the fact the two of them are the top two champs in this game would massively overshadow they fact they require lots of skill to play.
    Valid point, hadn't thought about that angle.
    Qacob said:

    Dude it's a game. Literally no one could care less what gender the champions are in the first place.

    Ooooh dude, I move within academic circles and you have NO IDEA how many people I know that would have a field day with the fact the the hardest champs to master are women.


    Okay, sure. I'm going to take my own advice and not engage any further.
  • Options
    EtherealityEthereality Posts: 685 ★★★

    Air walker

    I don't know anything about Air Walker, don't have him in any rarity, all I have heard is that he's not that good of a champ.. Is he also difficult to master though? As difficult as the other the foursome girls? If so then that's good, Kabam can say then that there is equality in their design.
  • Options
    Prakhar_82Prakhar_82 Posts: 713 ★★★
    I mean, so?
  • Options
    BlackTuranBlackTuran Posts: 642 ★★★
    If anything they would say that it’s cool that the best champions in the game are women
  • Options
    RockypantherxRockypantherx Posts: 3,902 ★★★★★
    HI_guys said:

    Plot twist: OP is actually from Buzzfeed or Daily mail.

    Nah this is more the kind of thing you would find in ‘The Sun’
  • Options
    TheMailmannTheMailmann Posts: 120 ★★

    Lol, you guys don't seem to see that I too, LIKE that Quake and Ghost are the way the are. Well, Quake I gave up learning how to use, Ghost though I am slowly getting there, definitely easier and more fun to learn that Quake that's for sure. Tigra and IW I have only as 3* 4* so have only messed around with, but can see already how complex they are.

    Anyway my point is that I, particularly ME, am fine with the matriarchy, I really dont mind it. I just dont wanna have to hear some exaggeratedly woke reporter starting to pick on Kabam for their oversight. I am from the school of thought that Political Correcteness has a purpose and a place in today's world, except only when it's exaggerated to the point that it becomes PI just for the sake of PI.

    Now, arguably of course, talking about how a game portrays the gameplay of a few women might indeed qualify as "PI just for the sake of PI". And that is a valid point too. But at least the conversation needs to happen.

    But does it? I feel like the fact the two of them are the top two champs in this game would massively overshadow they fact they require lots of skill to play.
    Valid point, hadn't thought about that angle.
    Qacob said:

    Dude it's a game. Literally no one could care less what gender the champions are in the first place.

    Ooooh dude, I move within academic circles and you have NO IDEA how many people I know that would have a field day with the fact the the hardest champs to master are women.

    how about the strongest champs in the game are women? you’re reaching way too far you cant even see your toes
  • Options
    Sarvanga1_Sarvanga1_ Posts: 4,139 ★★★★★
    Lol. So much thinking in the wrong direction. These are game characters and their genders and hardness to use have nothing to do with each other.
  • Options
    EtherealityEthereality Posts: 685 ★★★

    I think the real problem here is how OP interprets the game. If I say Quake, Ghost and Tigra are really, really good champs, but hard to play, there are a number of opinions you can form. I personally think, 'Oh! They're great! I need to practice using them!"
    Someone else may think that it's great that they belong to different classes, for variety.

    Believe me, I am all of political correctness (much to the annoyance of everyone around me), but sometimes the fault lies in with the thinking pattern.

    If a person sees these three champs and thinks "They're women! They're hard to use" and they stick with this narrow minded approach, that is wrong, and hands down sexist.

    The two most game-breaking champs, who can single handedly cheese almost all content, who the forum collectively agrees are #1 and #2 best champs, are difficult to master. You have a problem with the best things being difficult to perfect/acquire?

    If anyone tries to say that Kabam are sexist, then they oughta know that the best two champs are female, and if they think that good things come easy, then they have fundamental flaws in their logic as is.

    On a side note, people often say that they don't discriminate gender or race or whatever. But they often fail to realise that the discrimination is in-built. The fact that you saw these champs and you thought "They are female, and hard to use. There's an issue here. People can use this as an argument" that itself is discriminatory. Feminism is about giving females the same respect that men get, not saying "Kabam should make male champs hard to use so they don't seem sexist." That's the same as looking at a female CEO who works 12 hours a day, and thinking "The company should hire a male CEO, so it doesn't seem like the females work too hard", while completely disrespecting the capability of the female.

    Well put, you do have a point. Yes when I wrote the OP I overlooked the fact that two out of the four champs in the game are indeed widely regarded as the #1 and #2 most sought after champs in the game, and that counterbalances the whole issue. I was only concentrating on the top "hardest to learn" champs irrespective of their overall ranking. Regardless, point taken, you do make anlot of sense in the way you counter argued my OP.

    Lol, you guys don't seem to see that I too, LIKE that Quake and Ghost are the way the are. Well, Quake I gave up learning how to use, Ghost though I am slowly getting there, definitely easier and more fun to learn that Quake that's for sure. Tigra and IW I have only as 3* 4* so have only messed around with, but can see already how complex they are.

    Anyway my point is that I, particularly ME, am fine with the matriarchy, I really dont mind it. I just dont wanna have to hear some exaggeratedly woke reporter starting to pick on Kabam for their oversight. I am from the school of thought that Political Correcteness has a purpose and a place in today's world, except only when it's exaggerated to the point that it becomes PI just for the sake of PI.

    Now, arguably of course, talking about how a game portrays the gameplay of a few women might indeed qualify as "PI just for the sake of PI". And that is a valid point too. But at least the conversation needs to happen.

    But does it? I feel like the fact the two of them are the top two champs in this game would massively overshadow they fact they require lots of skill to play.
    Valid point, hadn't thought about that angle.
    Qacob said:

    Dude it's a game. Literally no one could care less what gender the champions are in the first place.

    Ooooh dude, I move within academic circles and you have NO IDEA how many people I know that would have a field day with the fact the the hardest champs to master are women.

    I’ve graduated from undergrad and doing grad school now. Not a single person I know would give a **** about what you’re talking about
    Dude, I have a Ph.D, I work in universities and I am video game scholar, researching about video games ( yes, such thing does exist). Trust me when I say that there's a whole lotta people thirsty for openings like these to have a field day on picking how major companies such as Kabam are so terrible because this or that. Again I agree with some political correctness, but you wont believe the overblown heights I've seen it taken to.

    On one end, games are regarded as a form of media. Media has a lot of responsibility in how they portray people, because usually media is among the top culprits when it comes to fostering negative stereotypes. On the other hand though, how can you prove/be certain that the way Kabam portrays Ghost, Quake, Tigra and IW will unconsciously influence a young mind's perception of female superheroes/villains? That is how I would probably deconstrue the exaggeratedly woke argument that "hard to play" equals negative .

    ... and I have @Scarcity27 to thank for that! This is precisely the type of constructive conversation I was hoping for!

  • Options
    Scarcity27Scarcity27 Posts: 1,906 ★★★★★

    I think the real problem here is how OP interprets the game. If I say Quake, Ghost and Tigra are really, really good champs, but hard to play, there are a number of opinions you can form. I personally think, 'Oh! They're great! I need to practice using them!"
    Someone else may think that it's great that they belong to different classes, for variety.

    Believe me, I am all of political correctness (much to the annoyance of everyone around me), but sometimes the fault lies in with the thinking pattern.

    If a person sees these three champs and thinks "They're women! They're hard to use" and they stick with this narrow minded approach, that is wrong, and hands down sexist.

    The two most game-breaking champs, who can single handedly cheese almost all content, who the forum collectively agrees are #1 and #2 best champs, are difficult to master. You have a problem with the best things being difficult to perfect/acquire?

    If anyone tries to say that Kabam are sexist, then they oughta know that the best two champs are female, and if they think that good things come easy, then they have fundamental flaws in their logic as is.

    On a side note, people often say that they don't discriminate gender or race or whatever. But they often fail to realise that the discrimination is in-built. The fact that you saw these champs and you thought "They are female, and hard to use. There's an issue here. People can use this as an argument" that itself is discriminatory. Feminism is about giving females the same respect that men get, not saying "Kabam should make male champs hard to use so they don't seem sexist." That's the same as looking at a female CEO who works 12 hours a day, and thinking "The company should hire a male CEO, so it doesn't seem like the females work too hard", while completely disrespecting the capability of the female.

    Well put, you do have a point. Yes when I wrote the OP I overlooked the fact that two out of the four champs in the game are indeed widely regarded as the #1 and #2 most sought after champs in the game, and that counterbalances the whole issue. I was only concentrating on the top "hardest to learn" champs irrespective of their overall ranking. Regardless, point taken, you do make anlot of sense in the way you counter argued my OP.

    Lol, you guys don't seem to see that I too, LIKE that Quake and Ghost are the way the are. Well, Quake I gave up learning how to use, Ghost though I am slowly getting there, definitely easier and more fun to learn that Quake that's for sure. Tigra and IW I have only as 3* 4* so have only messed around with, but can see already how complex they are.

    Anyway my point is that I, particularly ME, am fine with the matriarchy, I really dont mind it. I just dont wanna have to hear some exaggeratedly woke reporter starting to pick on Kabam for their oversight. I am from the school of thought that Political Correcteness has a purpose and a place in today's world, except only when it's exaggerated to the point that it becomes PI just for the sake of PI.

    Now, arguably of course, talking about how a game portrays the gameplay of a few women might indeed qualify as "PI just for the sake of PI". And that is a valid point too. But at least the conversation needs to happen.

    But does it? I feel like the fact the two of them are the top two champs in this game would massively overshadow they fact they require lots of skill to play.
    Valid point, hadn't thought about that angle.
    Qacob said:

    Dude it's a game. Literally no one could care less what gender the champions are in the first place.

    Ooooh dude, I move within academic circles and you have NO IDEA how many people I know that would have a field day with the fact the the hardest champs to master are women.

    I’ve graduated from undergrad and doing grad school now. Not a single person I know would give a **** about what you’re talking about
    Dude, I have a Ph.D, I work in universities and I am video game scholar, researching about video games ( yes, such thing does exist). Trust me when I say that there's a whole lotta people thirsty for openings like these to have a field day on picking how major companies such as Kabam are so terrible because this or that. Again I agree with some political correctness, but you wont believe the overblown heights I've seen it taken to.

    On one end, games are regarded as a form of media. Media has a lot of responsibility in how they portray people, because usually media is among the top culprits when it comes to fostering negative stereotypes. On the other hand though, how can you prove/be certain that the way Kabam portrays Ghost, Quake, Tigra and IW will unconsciously influence a young mind's perception of female superheroes/villains? That is how I would probably deconstrue the exaggeratedly woke argument that "hard to play" equals negative .

    ... and I have @Scarcity27 to thank for that! This is precisely the type of constructive conversation I was hoping for!

    I'm glad you think that! Really appreciate the fact that you were willing to hear what we had to say, and see the situation from another angle!
This discussion has been closed.