Knull deep dive is here

2

Comments

  • K_PK_P Posts: 135 ★★
    Really impressed from what I've seen, apart from the fact the synergies are beyond disappointing.. Just gotta wait for karatemike and other youtubers to see what they think
  • BitterSteelBitterSteel Posts: 7,047 ★★★★★

    wth was kabam thinking creating knull
    awakened knull on steady buildup unblockable is like unblockable for nearly the whole fight

    Would an armour break immune get around it?
    if you let him activate corruption, and don’t take enough blocked hits to place 3 living abyss charges on you
    And as well if he’s awakened he’s gonna apply debuffs on you at the start of the fight lmao. Gonna need a pretty good skill shrug off champ
  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 19,046 ★★★★★

    Rookiie said:

    *sad @Rockypantherx noises*

    *still undecided @Rockypantherx noises*

    I’m going to sit on the deep dive for a bit before I collect my initial thoughts together. Expect them later.
    Translation: he’s gonna give himself five more minutes before writing 20k words about Knull
  • RockypantherxRockypantherx Posts: 3,742 ★★★★★

    Rookiie said:

    *sad @Rockypantherx noises*

    *still undecided @Rockypantherx noises*

    I’m going to sit on the deep dive for a bit before I collect my initial thoughts together. Expect them later.
    Translation: he’s gonna give himself five more minutes before writing 20k words about Knull
    Nah it’ll be a while. Finishing up some work first

    It was practically 1am for me before I finally got my head around anti-venom
  • SwarmOfRavensSwarmOfRavens Posts: 1,196 ★★★★★
    I can see why having light attacks be necrosword attacks is pretty necessary for his damage (pauses corruption)

    But having it be a symbiote attack would have made him one of the best evade/auto block counters. So close to greatness

    Now he's as good an evade counter as night trasher....

    Interested in seeing more gameplay with how weird he is

  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 19,046 ★★★★★

    I can see why having light attacks be necrosword attacks is pretty necessary for his damage (pauses corruption)

    But having it be a symbiote attack would have made him one of the best evade/auto block counters. So close to greatness

    Now he's as good an evade counter as night trasher....

    Interested in seeing more gameplay with how weird he is

    at least you can viably play Night Thrasher while keeping the evade counter
  • Bugmat78Bugmat78 Posts: 1,114 ★★★★
    edited October 2021

    wth was kabam thinking creating knull
    awakened knull on steady buildup unblockable is like unblockable for nearly the whole fight

    I was looking at that. The EQ will be annoying and I can see him being more useful (and mega annoyin) on defense. The reverse controls part just increased the value of Prof X and other reverse control-nullifying synergies.
  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 19,046 ★★★★★
    H3t3r said:

    I'm gonna list some pros and cons of what we know so far.

    PROS
    -Suicide friendly
    -Nice amount of degen resistance
    -Easy access to counter regen
    -Not a terrible ramp up
    -Lots of debuffs
    - A reliable evade and autoblock counter sorta
    -Half decent healing
    CONS
    -Reliant on suicides
    - Nothing to increases his attack like furys
    - Defensive abilities that make no impact on playing with knull
    - Reliant on opponents not being bleed immune
    - Synergies

    Now this is a champ We really need to see in a hands of the ccp members and our own to really tell if hes useful really anywhere.

    Even after the ccp videos, I think on hands testing will be very helpful, more so than usual. Seems to be a theme for the month
  • ShadowstrikeShadowstrike Posts: 1,685 ★★★★
    I like what I see so I'm willing to go on an act of faith..
  • H3t3rH3t3r Posts: 2,026 ★★★★★

    H3t3r said:

    I'm gonna list some pros and cons of what we know so far.

    PROS
    -Suicide friendly
    -Nice amount of degen resistance
    -Easy access to counter regen
    -Not a terrible ramp up
    -Lots of debuffs
    - A reliable evade and autoblock counter sorta
    -Half decent healing
    CONS
    -Reliant on suicides
    - Nothing to increases his attack like furys
    - Defensive abilities that make no impact on playing with knull
    - Reliant on opponents not being bleed immune
    - Synergies

    Now this is a champ We really need to see in a hands of the ccp members and our own to really tell if hes useful really anywhere.

    Even after the ccp videos, I think on hands testing will be very helpful, more so than usual. Seems to be a theme for the month
    Yeah. Its just I'm fine with what utilities he has. But just his damage seems so low for a r4 6* running suicides. From what the video shows he definitely needs like a increase to 5%attack for every armor break on opponent. Right now. He seems like he needs a attack synergy team.
  • ShadowstrikeShadowstrike Posts: 1,685 ★★★★
    H3t3r said:

    H3t3r said:

    I'm gonna list some pros and cons of what we know so far.

    PROS
    -Suicide friendly
    -Nice amount of degen resistance
    -Easy access to counter regen
    -Not a terrible ramp up
    -Lots of debuffs
    - A reliable evade and autoblock counter sorta
    -Half decent healing
    CONS
    -Reliant on suicides
    - Nothing to increases his attack like furys
    - Defensive abilities that make no impact on playing with knull
    - Reliant on opponents not being bleed immune
    - Synergies

    Now this is a champ We really need to see in a hands of the ccp members and our own to really tell if hes useful really anywhere.

    Even after the ccp videos, I think on hands testing will be very helpful, more so than usual. Seems to be a theme for the month
    Yeah. Its just I'm fine with what utilities he has. But just his damage seems so low for a r4 6* running suicides. From what the video shows he definitely needs like a increase to 5%attack for every armor break on opponent. Right now. He seems like he needs a attack synergy team.
    Well we don't know what kind of synergies they were using, obviously they use suicides just to show off the resistance but we don't know where they had any other setup
  • BendyBendy Posts: 2,042 ★★★★

    The bug where physical resistance paired with armour breaks lead to less damage is definitely present in the red hulk fight. No way a 6r4 with more armour breaks should be dealing less damage than a 5/65 with significantly less armour breaks.



    Thats been like it since the start so unfortunately the red hulk fight should of been the starlord fight so we could see what that many armor breaks in lab would do
  • H3t3rH3t3r Posts: 2,026 ★★★★★

    The bug where physical resistance paired with armour breaks lead to less damage is definitely present in the red hulk fight. No way a 6r4 with more armour breaks should be dealing less damage than a 5/65 with significantly less armour breaks.



    Hmm. Also has 28 more armor breaks which would be an additional 6500 reduced armor. As well the what 50% increased base attack between a r5 5* and r4 6*. So the crit in the red hulk fight should be nearly 10k with everything factored in.
  • H3t3rH3t3r Posts: 2,026 ★★★★★

    H3t3r said:

    H3t3r said:

    I'm gonna list some pros and cons of what we know so far.

    PROS
    -Suicide friendly
    -Nice amount of degen resistance
    -Easy access to counter regen
    -Not a terrible ramp up
    -Lots of debuffs
    - A reliable evade and autoblock counter sorta
    -Half decent healing
    CONS
    -Reliant on suicides
    - Nothing to increases his attack like furys
    - Defensive abilities that make no impact on playing with knull
    - Reliant on opponents not being bleed immune
    - Synergies

    Now this is a champ We really need to see in a hands of the ccp members and our own to really tell if hes useful really anywhere.

    Even after the ccp videos, I think on hands testing will be very helpful, more so than usual. Seems to be a theme for the month
    Yeah. Its just I'm fine with what utilities he has. But just his damage seems so low for a r4 6* running suicides. From what the video shows he definitely needs like a increase to 5%attack for every armor break on opponent. Right now. He seems like he needs a attack synergy team.
    Well we don't know what kind of synergies they were using, obviously they use suicides just to show off the resistance but we don't know where they had any other setup
    Guess we also don't know how many points were in suicides. If it was 3/3 for both or just 1/3.
  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 14,726 ★★★★★
    Rohit_316 said:

    All i am gonna say after watching Deep Dive is...

    He doesn't lives upto the hype. But let's see if content creators can bring the best outta him.

    What hype? From who?
  • Kappa2gKappa2g Posts: 135 ★★★
    Looks like a lot of effort went into making him an AQ boss (or boss in general) but those part of his kit translates into nothing when using him.. (the darkness passive based on opponent combo, reversed controls)
  • Bugmat78Bugmat78 Posts: 1,114 ★★★★
    edited October 2021
    With those reversed controls, combo passive debuff, armor breaks, instant heals, unblockable & unstoppable buffs, and degen I think we know who's going to be the next AQ boss when map 8 comes out...
  • slackerslacker Posts: 751 ★★★
    edited October 2021

    The bug where physical resistance paired with armour breaks lead to less damage is definitely present in the red hulk fight. No way a 6r4 with more armour breaks should be dealing less damage than a 5/65 with significantly less armour breaks.



    Yup, it's really a bug, no wonder his dmg feel the same even at different rank.


  • LibertyPrimeV1LibertyPrimeV1 Posts: 4,118 ★★★★★

    Alright, I’m concerned for Knull. With Anti-Venom he got better the more I sat on it but with Knull, the feeling of dread just keeps growing.

    And like @BitterSteel said, I’m particularly worried about his utility.

    It’s not only that he doesn’t have a lot of it, it’s that a lot of what he does he doesn’t seem to do very well.

    I want to start off with something positive. Dealing with Armour Up. Knull could easily be the best champ in the game at dealing with armour up, he stripping them away on basic attacks, heavy attacks and completely shutting them down during corruption. That’s excellent.

    If armour ups were actually kind of threatening. It’s useful, but pretty much every cosmic champ can reliably armour break enough to deal with most armour up situations.

    I know I said positive but, you know…I’m a pessimist

    The next major piece of utility he has is true accuracy on mediums, heavies and SP1’s. Couldn’t even be as good as night thrashers. Especially when the SP2 seems integral to his damage loop. And lights also seem important to his damage loop. I just really wish all attacks had this during corruption.

    This piece of utility is going to live and die on whether his degens are potent enough to have good damage output in these matchups.

    I’m not hopeful, but I’m very open to being wrong (just…generally on this champ)

    40% degen resistance isn’t enough, plain and simple. Unless this ability gets tuned up to 80-90% its existence is quite literally pointless.

    60% bleed and poison resistance is…um…it is, I guess? It’s going to make him very sustainable with suicides, I love that. And if you run max coagulate he might just be able to deal with bleed matchups. I don’t love the fact he can’t do that on his own but let’s squeeze everything we can here

    His life steal is equivalent Purgatory’s. Thankfully he hits much harder and more frequently, so I actually think this will make him pretty sustainable. I like that

    The other significant piece of utility I think he has is the ability to permanently and completely shut down healing with pretty much any level of despair, and with a safety net via the sig. Is he going to be used over other options for it? Maybe, if his damage output is high enough to edge him out over other options

    And obviously stacking upwards of 50 debuffs is great for nodes that require a lot of debuffs or that reward you for a lot of them. The defensive combat power rate reduction off of living abyss is great in corruption

    In a lot of ways he’s reminding me of Prof X in terms of having a really aggressive, high damage burst phase.

    The synergies are the biggest misses opportunity since, ironically, sentry.

    I remember saying a while back, can’t rennet if it was here or discord, that I almost didn’t want Knull to come out this year because for the most part, this years champs have been mediocre, underwhelming, or in some cases, outright failures (looking at you Super Skrull and Purgatory)

    I really don’t want to write Knull off based on this deep dive, hell I’m saving all my 6* shards for his featured crystal in January. Or, at least, I was.

    Knull, if he does end up falling where I expect him to, is not an outright failure. In fact, he isn’t even a bad champion. His damage looks very, very good, and I think he’s going to be sustainable

    But between the buffs this month and the new champs, 75% of the time I’ve been sitting here on this forum asking where the utility is. This isn’t as bad as Guillotine or Thor in that regard but it still feels…lacking

    If that degen resistance was bumped up to an actually impactful amount, and he gained true accuracy during corruption, I would be liking Knull significantly more

    In this stage it feels like up until a week ago he literally had the corruption mechanic, and his utility has been rushed, and his synergies have been completely disregarded

    Not a bad champion, but not as good as the God of Symbiotes should be in 2021.

    Thank you for coming to my Tedtalk, I’m now going to leave and hope against hope I am utterly and entirely wrong

    Approval Limbo after a Single Edit strikes again...

    I love how the Community Collectively Always has a Strikingly Similar List of Tiny Things that could make a new champion Exponentially Better, that the Design Team manages to somehow not think of during their Early Brainstorming and Final Touch-up Phases, in a perfect world the Deep Dive would be released a Month in advance with a Suggestions Board on things the Community Thinks could Improve the Champion with the Design Team choosing 10 of those Realistic Changes putting them into a Poll and having the Top 5 Voted Choices added into the Champion Kit over that last month before the Actual Release.
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