Is Gold boost live or not yet? [MERGED THREADS]

AverageDesi · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
Before , if we pulled 10k gold, the boost increased it to 12k gold.
What the announcement made it seem was instead of 12k, we would now pull 13 k instead of the original 10k. That was what everyone or atleast most expected.
I think the goal here is that this way, if you would have pulled 100k, you're usually going to pull 130k. So it definitely works out to a boost, but not on a single crystal basis.

Why go that route instead of the usual flat method? Unnecessary complication and conversations.

TimeGenesis · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

That's understandable. I was a little vague in that post but purposely said "approximately 30%" because we did know that it will never be a 1 to 1 increase. I'm still getting more info from the Math folks on the methods to their madness, and will share what their thoughts were.

Then the 20% gold boost before still was much better than the "approximate 30%"

We were guaranteed a flat 20% increase everywhere. Meaning from arena, selling, moving node to node, etc..

With the "30% approx", it will be down to chance to get this much increase. So it will be worse than what the temporary 20% increase is. @Kabam Miike

The only benefit is permanent thing instead of temporary.

benshb · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
Before , if we pulled 10k gold, the boost increased it to 12k gold.
What the announcement made it seem was instead of 12k, we would now pull 13 k instead of the original 10k. That was what everyone or atleast most expected.
I think the goal here is that this way, if you would have pulled 100k, you're usually going to pull 130k. So it definitely works out to a boost, but not on a single crystal basis.

The problem is the unnecessary RNG element in a simple gold crystal. You COULD average out on a net 30% increase, but you may not. That shouldn't be the case

Coppin · December 2021

Wait are u guys trying to say that with this method a gold crystal has a chance to "crit" for 30% more... Thats not better than the 2x a year 20% boost...

Runavargr · December 2021

And either way it’s still rng and most of us will still get the 15k per hahahaha. You said if we were going to pull 100k we will know pull 130…… how’s tht working we continually just get the 15k lol

Jaded · December 2021

TimeGenesis said:

Kabam Miike said:

That's understandable. I was a little vague in that post but purposely said "approximately 30%" because we did know that it will never be a 1 to 1 increase. I'm still getting more info from the Math folks on the methods to their madness, and will share what their thoughts were.
Then the 20% gold boost before still was much better than the "approximate 30%"

We were guaranteed a flat 20% increase everywhere. Meaning from arena, selling, moving node to node, etc..

With the "30% approx", it will be down to chance to get this much increase.

⬆️ ⬆️ this exactly!

CrimsonBadger · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:
The Gold increase has gone live (in fact, it went live before 10). I'm not good at math, but the changes were made to give an approximate 30% boost across all crystals.

AFAIK: On a 1 to 1 crystal rate, it wouldn't look like much of an increase, but opening a bunch of them will net out to that increase.

I'm gonna get somebody much better at math to explain this though, so stay tuned on exactly how this works.

See screenshot.. this is a gold crystal.. minimum was always 2500 gold. With 30% increase, it should be at least 3250 gold…

Zeraphan · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

Zeraphan said:

Kabam Miike said:

VestasCure said:

ChriissR said:

2StarKing said:

Kabam Miike said:
The Gold increase has gone live (in fact, it went live before 10). I'm not good at math, but the changes were made to give an approximate 30% boost across all crystals.

AFAIK: On a 1 to 1 crystal rate, it wouldn't look like much of an increase, but opening a bunch of them will net out to that increase.

I'm gonna get somebody much better at math to explain this though, so stay tuned on exactly how this works.
Please do get a better explanation because the previous explaination was a 30% per crystal not over a batch of crystals.
It is 30% per crystal. 30% of 1 crystal is barely anything, that's what he in stating. If you get 10k Gold and it's a 30% boost, you'll get 13k. Opening a few hundred you will actually notice the boost. That's what Mike is talking about.

Except it’s not 30% per crystal. If that were the case, the minimum would have increased by 30%. We can clearly see it hasn’t. They seemingly did something with the odds to “average out to a 30% increase” which is why people are mad. They made it seem as if they’d do a flat 30% increase to all crystals, just like the old boost did at 20%.
Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
If I open a gold crystal right now I will get 2500 gold (instead of the previous 2400) gold.
With the "gold event" I would have gotten 2880 because it had a 20% boost.

This change doesn't guarantee 30% more gold and requires RNG to get more gold because some crystals still have the same amount at the lower levels of the rewards (which we all know happens more often than higher levels).

The implication of your original announcement was a flat 30% increase to all values of gold in crystals.
That's understandable. I was a little vague in that post but purposely said "approximately 30%" because we did know that it will never be a 1 to 1 increase. I'm still getting more info from the Math folks on the methods to their madness, and will share what their thoughts were.

While talking with them, can you convey that RNG should not be a factor when removing the Gold Event. The Gold Event was a 100% guaranteed 20% increase in gold. This new system as I understand it requires on RNG and so it is possible to open crystals and not see any gold increase at all.

Kabam Miike · December 2021

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
Before , if we pulled 10k gold, the boost increased it to 12k gold.
What the announcement made it seem was instead of 12k, we would now pull 13 k instead of the original 10k. That was what everyone or atleast most expected.
I think the goal here is that this way, if you would have pulled 100k, you're usually going to pull 130k. So it definitely works out to a boost, but not on a single crystal basis.
Why go that route instead of the usual flat method? Unnecessary complication and conversations.

Because we can't ever make things easy on ourselves

Coppin said:
Wait are u guys trying to say that with this method a gold crystal has a chance to "crit" for 30% more... Thats not better than the 2x a year 20% boost...

Not at all, and this is why I need somebody who understands this better to explain. This is not about a chance to get 30%, it's about everything averaging out to 30% on average when opening your crystals. This is taking things like Drop Rates and amount into account. There is no world in which a temporary 20% boost is better here.

CrimsonBadger · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

VestasCure said:

ChriissR said:

2StarKing said:

Kabam Miike said:
The Gold increase has gone live (in fact, it went live before 10). I'm not good at math, but the changes were made to give an approximate 30% boost across all crystals.

AFAIK: On a 1 to 1 crystal rate, it wouldn't look like much of an increase, but opening a bunch of them will net out to that increase.

I'm gonna get somebody much better at math to explain this though, so stay tuned on exactly how this works.
Please do get a better explanation because the previous explaination was a 30% per crystal not over a batch of crystals.
It is 30% per crystal. 30% of 1 crystal is barely anything, that's what he in stating. If you get 10k Gold and it's a 30% boost, you'll get 13k. Opening a few hundred you will actually notice the boost. That's what Mike is talking about.

Except it’s not 30% per crystal. If that were the case, the minimum would have increased by 30%. We can clearly see it hasn’t. They seemingly did something with the odds to “average out to a 30% increase” which is why people are mad. They made it seem as if they’d do a flat 30% increase to all crystals, just like the old boost did at 20%.
Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.

Wasn’t the purpose of this to replace the summoner gold boost that is given out periodically?

Coppin · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
Before , if we pulled 10k gold, the boost increased it to 12k gold.
What the announcement made it seem was instead of 12k, we would now pull 13 k instead of the original 10k. That was what everyone or atleast most expected.
I think the goal here is that this way, if you would have pulled 100k, you're usually going to pull 130k. So it definitely works out to a boost, but not on a single crystal basis.
Why go that route instead of the usual flat method? Unnecessary complication and conversations.
Because we can't ever make things easy on ourselves
Coppin said:
Wait are u guys trying to say that with this method a gold crystal has a chance to "crit" for 30% more... Thats not better than the 2x a year 20% boost...
Not at all, and this is why I need somebody who understands this better to explain. This is not about a chance to get 30%, it's about everything averaging out to 30% on average when opening your crystals. This is taking things like Drop Rates and amount into account. There is no world in which a temporary 20% boost is better here.

But.. but.. i opened 1 and got 15k the minimum.. i would have gotten 18k from a 20% boost..
RNG is never better than a flat increase...

Runavargr · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
Before , if we pulled 10k gold, the boost increased it to 12k gold.
What the announcement made it seem was instead of 12k, we would now pull 13 k instead of the original 10k. That was what everyone or atleast most expected.
I think the goal here is that this way, if you would have pulled 100k, you're usually going to pull 130k. So it definitely works out to a boost, but not on a single crystal basis.
Why go that route instead of the usual flat method? Unnecessary complication and conversations.
Because we can't ever make things easy on ourselves
Coppin said:
Wait are u guys trying to say that with this method a gold crystal has a chance to "crit" for 30% more... Thats not better than the 2x a year 20% boost...
Not at all, and this is why I need somebody who understands this better to explain. This is not about a chance to get 30%, it's about everything averaging out to 30% on average when opening your crystals. This is taking things like Drop Rates and amount into account. There is no world in which a temporary 20% boost is better here.

I know your trying to explain, but if you can still pull the minimum then absolute is a world where the 20% event is better. You can’t advertise a 30% boost and leave out the fact tht it’s still rng. O wait my bad you can advertise tht but it’s pretty disappointing, when we feel mislead.

Panda3375904 · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
Before , if we pulled 10k gold, the boost increased it to 12k gold.
What the announcement made it seem was instead of 12k, we would now pull 13 k instead of the original 10k. That was what everyone or atleast most expected.
I think the goal here is that this way, if you would have pulled 100k, you're usually going to pull 130k. So it definitely works out to a boost, but not on a single crystal basis.
Why go that route instead of the usual flat method? Unnecessary complication and conversations.
Because we can't ever make things easy on ourselves
Coppin said:
Wait are u guys trying to say that with this method a gold crystal has a chance to "crit" for 30% more... Thats not better than the 2x a year 20% boost...
Not at all, and this is why I need somebody who understands this better to explain. This is not about a chance to get 30%, it's about everything averaging out to 30% on average when opening your crystals. This is taking things like Drop Rates and amount into account. There is no world in which a temporary 20% boost is better here.

Except in a world where someone opens 1 Crystal

Zeraphan · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
Before , if we pulled 10k gold, the boost increased it to 12k gold.
What the announcement made it seem was instead of 12k, we would now pull 13 k instead of the original 10k. That was what everyone or atleast most expected.
I think the goal here is that this way, if you would have pulled 100k, you're usually going to pull 130k. So it definitely works out to a boost, but not on a single crystal basis.
Why go that route instead of the usual flat method? Unnecessary complication and conversations.
Because we can't ever make things easy on ourselves
Coppin said:
Wait are u guys trying to say that with this method a gold crystal has a chance to "crit" for 30% more... Thats not better than the 2x a year 20% boost...
Not at all, and this is why I need somebody who understands this better to explain. This is not about a chance to get 30%, it's about everything averaging out to 30% on average when opening your crystals. This is taking things like Drop Rates and amount into account. There is no world in which a temporary 20% boost is better here.

That flat isn't true.

If I open normal crystals and get the lowest amount, the Gold Event made it guaranteed that I would get 20% more. It was worth hording crystals for that.

This new system relies on RNG so you can't guarantee that for every 10 crystals I open I will see roughly 30% more gold than I would have previously. The old Gold Event did guarantee that no matter what those 10 crystals would give me 20% more gold even at the lowest value of the crystal.

So yes, a 20% boost is definitely better in the long run than this.

CosmicGuardian · December 2021

For a change that was marketed as being better than the 20% boost event, it was certainly misleading. Boosting the odds that the RNG will give you an extra 30% gold over a stack of crystals is nowhere near being better than a 20% boost. How many crystals constitute a stack that will see a 30% increase? Will the odds actually play out that players will see 30% more, or will many players continue to roll lower amounts? A 30% increase to the gold should have been applied to the actual gold amounts, not the RNG drop rates. Ultimately, I’d much rather have an actual 20% boost on each crystal than have a chance of getting 30% more over a stack of who knows how many crystals.

LibertyPrimeV1 · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

Zeraphan said:

Kabam Miike said:

VestasCure said:

ChriissR said:

2StarKing said:

Kabam Miike said:
The Gold increase has gone live (in fact, it went live before 10). I'm not good at math, but the changes were made to give an approximate 30% boost across all crystals.

AFAIK: On a 1 to 1 crystal rate, it wouldn't look like much of an increase, but opening a bunch of them will net out to that increase.

I'm gonna get somebody much better at math to explain this though, so stay tuned on exactly how this works.
Please do get a better explanation because the previous explaination was a 30% per crystal not over a batch of crystals.
It is 30% per crystal. 30% of 1 crystal is barely anything, that's what he in stating. If you get 10k Gold and it's a 30% boost, you'll get 13k. Opening a few hundred you will actually notice the boost. That's what Mike is talking about.

Except it’s not 30% per crystal. If that were the case, the minimum would have increased by 30%. We can clearly see it hasn’t. They seemingly did something with the odds to “average out to a 30% increase” which is why people are mad. They made it seem as if they’d do a flat 30% increase to all crystals, just like the old boost did at 20%.
Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
If I open a gold crystal right now I will get 2500 gold (instead of the previous 2400) gold.
With the "gold event" I would have gotten 2880 because it had a 20% boost.

This change doesn't guarantee 30% more gold and requires RNG to get more gold because some crystals still have the same amount at the lower levels of the rewards (which we all know happens more often than higher levels).

The implication of your original announcement was a flat 30% increase to all values of gold in crystals.
That's understandable. I was a little vague in that post but purposely said "approximately 30%" because we did know that it will never be a 1 to 1 increase. I'm still getting more info from the Math folks on the methods to their madness, and will share what their thoughts were.

If you knew it wasn't gonna be 1 To 1 then why would you compare to the Original Gold Boost's 20% then say it'd be an Additional 10% on top of that, that was Extremely Poorly Explained Especially if you Knew from the beginning it wasn't gonna be a 1 to 1 Flat Increase!

babymetalmonkey · December 2021

gazbea said:
Looks to me like it’s live but with wrong values

The basic gold crystal was previously a minimum of 2400 and new minimum is 2500… not a 30% increase so I would hold off popping those gold crystals

If I’m wrong about the values then apologies in advance lol

A 30% increase on 2400 totals to 3120. In which you are correct. We are getting skimped

luka777777 · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

AverageDesi said:

Kabam Miike said:

Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.
Before , if we pulled 10k gold, the boost increased it to 12k gold.
What the announcement made it seem was instead of 12k, we would now pull 13 k instead of the original 10k. That was what everyone or atleast most expected.
I think the goal here is that this way, if you would have pulled 100k, you're usually going to pull 130k. So it definitely works out to a boost, but not on a single crystal basis.

That still doesn't make sense. If the goal is not to hoard crystals then whenever I open one as soon as I get one i don't get boosted gold amount I am at a loss. This is not a boost. Boost should be on 1 crystal bassis so I can open one if I need one.

AverageDesi · December 2021

A comparison. This definitely is not xx% boost by any standards

Edit: some miscalculations

Also, top is with 20% boost active

Llessur · December 2021

Kabam Miike said:

VestasCure said:

ChriissR said:

2StarKing said:

Kabam Miike said:
The Gold increase has gone live (in fact, it went live before 10). I'm not good at math, but the changes were made to give an approximate 30% boost across all crystals.

AFAIK: On a 1 to 1 crystal rate, it wouldn't look like much of an increase, but opening a bunch of them will net out to that increase.

I'm gonna get somebody much better at math to explain this though, so stay tuned on exactly how this works.
Please do get a better explanation because the previous explaination was a 30% per crystal not over a batch of crystals.
It is 30% per crystal. 30% of 1 crystal is barely anything, that's what he in stating. If you get 10k Gold and it's a 30% boost, you'll get 13k. Opening a few hundred you will actually notice the boost. That's what Mike is talking about.

Except it’s not 30% per crystal. If that were the case, the minimum would have increased by 30%. We can clearly see it hasn’t. They seemingly did something with the odds to “average out to a 30% increase” which is why people are mad. They made it seem as if they’d do a flat 30% increase to all crystals, just like the old boost did at 20%.
Can you explain why this is worse? I'd like to take that to the team. If the increase is to odds to give you more gold, I'm not sure why that's worse than just a plain boost to gold if it averages out to the same thing.

It’s worse because I’m going to be that one guy that RNG craps on and gets less then the 30% increase whereas if all values are raised the rng crapping on me would still be 30% better then it is when it craps on me now

Paulr2011 · December 2021

Unbelievable… probably the worst year in the history of the game and you guys still want to keep coming with the verbal gymnastics instead of just giving what was promised. People complain daily about being screwed over by RNG already and then you can’t seem to understand why people would be upset with you making a promised change also reliant on RNG? And no verifiable way for anyone to know whether we’re actually getting 30% more gold? I know, I know, just shut up and deal with it… but personally, I’ll take the guaranteed 20% boost over your odds for 30% any day.

Runavargr · December 2021

@Kabam Miike
So I went ahead and opened 10 uncollected and as you can tell even when doing stacks it’s still not 30% 175k on 10 uncollected is bad and doesn’t even equal a 20% increase if I were to originality get the lowest amount in each crystal

MBogusz · December 2021

30% increase means exactly that. Every possible drop out of a crystal (1k, 5k, 10k) should increase by 30%. Anything else is blatant lies and I want the crystals I opened restored to my account

SpagNidus · December 2021

Because a flat 20%boost that we can focus on that affects all of our gold gain is better than a 30%chance at increased gold. If this 30% extended to all gold gains that would be true. But a 20% guarantee on all, that is predictable and able to be targeted, is more than a severely limited chance at 30%. This is why we hoard, crystals and content.

Barca3bar3 · December 2021

What they are claiming to have done is change the drop rates in gold crystals so that they average out to 30% more gold received by summoners. This is absolutely something that could plausibly be done.

Unfortunately, all of the gold crystals have never allowed summoners to see the drop rates (merely 100% chance of gold) which leaves things completely unverifiable for summoners and therefore a distrustful and bad taste in all of our mouths.

An explanation of how the 30% increase was going to be achieved and some transparency on how drop rates and values were being changed before this went live would’ve gone a long way.

Benberry · December 2021

I just opened 10x uncollected crystals and got 150K. That is not a 30% increase @Kabam Miike Also where was the in game notification like it was mentioned here.

DrDrill · December 2021

if you open 10 crystals, one by one, you will always get 15k gold, the chances of pulling anything higher is super slim, even a 30% increase of that percentage is close to non-existence, (I bet you will get 150k gold total 99% of the time)
when I usually open the crystals, I add 10% more gold to the minimum amount, then multiply it by how many crystals I got, it is always on point, so all those fancy 30k-50k-100k from one crystal is just a lie, or has 0.1 chance to get,
so a flat increase is much better than this, btw, this is not how EVERYBODY understood from the announcement, I sense last second change of plan.

AnArChY · December 2021

@Kabam Miike it's amazing how you guys turn simple math into trigonometry.

A permanent 30% increase was approved (and also compared to the annual temporary 20% increase which was 1:1) so the community didn't have to hoard gold crystals anymore yet you're saying the 30% was never meant to be 1:1 but for it to be when opened in bulk.

Bulk which would require hoarding?!?!

Is Gold boost live or not yet? [MERGED THREADS]

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