Pause Button in Battlegrounds

How is it a fair fight when he hit my Wiccan one time then paused the fight and timed out. There shouldn’t be a pause button in battlegrounds type content when the whole point is to be the fastest.

Comments

WhatsGoodEnglish

how about you just make the rule that you can't pause when the opponent has a sp3 active? i think that would eliminate most of the problems that people have with pausing

That doesn’t cover all uses. The person I screenshot earlier likely paused when Galan activated the harvest, which doesn’t require SP3. It also doesn’t cover people that pause on NF when they get home down to 1%. It doesn’t cover the matches that people were pausing on two weeks ago when a random parry could lead to the opponent regaining for health or the flow meta from season 1 and there was another pause meta in season 2. Every single season has had a meta where people could take advantage of the pause button to win matches they otherwise wouldn’t have. Literally, the only option is to remove the button.

CoatHang3r

First pausing to win bad.

Second, I hope something can be done that also takes into consideration legitimate crashing, although maybe that cannot be done and it’s best for the game to just take the L on a crash.

I have not seen it mentioned in this thread but it was started by what claims to be pausing against Wiccan to win a fight. Wiccan can just straight up crash your game along with Peni and Doom on the rare occasion, I’m sure there are others also.

Additionally the game can still crash on it’s own independent of champions in play, I still experience this multiple times a day when I forget to restart the app.

Why tie crashing and pausing together? Because the next “strategy” when pausing is gone will be to force close the game and reload it so you load in with next to no time left in the fight allowing similar results to pausing at the start.

They both need to be addressed or imo you’re just postponing a solution to the ultimate issue of awarding points where they are unearned. To this I would suggest something that will only factor in in the event of a non-knock out. Something like your HP will either not award points until x seconds have passed in a match; maybe 100 seconds, or a formula that modifies your HP points based on time passed; this could also be based on 100 seconds, 100 seconds could award 100% of HP points and 50 seconds could award 50% of HP points or less even.

Bottom line is, pausing isn’t the only problem present when it comes to skirting the mechanics of the game for points.

AverageDesi

First pausing to win bad.

Second, I hope something can be done that also takes into consideration legitimate crashing, although maybe that cannot be done and it’s best for the game to just take the L on a crash.

I have not seen it mentioned in this thread but it was started by what claims to be pausing against Wiccan to win a fight. Wiccan can just straight up crash your game along with Peni and Doom on the rare occasion, I’m sure there are others also.

Additionally the game can still crash on it’s own independent of champions in play, I still experience this multiple times a day when I forget to restart the app.

Why tie crashing and pausing together? Because the next “strategy” when pausing is gone will be to force close the game and reload it so you load in with next to no time left in the fight allowing similar results to pausing at the start.

They both need to be addressed or imo you’re just postponing a solution to the ultimate issue of awarding points where they are unearned. To this I would suggest something that will only factor in in the event of a non-knock out. Something like your HP will either not award points until x seconds have passed in a match; maybe 100 seconds, or a formula that modifies your HP points based on time passed; this could also be based on 100 seconds, 100 seconds could award 100% of HP points and 50 seconds could award 50% of HP points or less even.

Bottom line is, pausing isn’t the only problem present when it comes to skirting the mechanics of the game for points.

Crashing the game intentionally if you start the fight rough works already. But there there is the penalty that if your game loads back up slow you lose a lot of time possibly even worse off than if you hadn't crashed

CoatHang3r

First pausing to win bad.

Second, I hope something can be done that also takes into consideration legitimate crashing, although maybe that cannot be done and it’s best for the game to just take the L on a crash.

I have not seen it mentioned in this thread but it was started by what claims to be pausing against Wiccan to win a fight. Wiccan can just straight up crash your game along with Peni and Doom on the rare occasion, I’m sure there are others also.

Additionally the game can still crash on it’s own independent of champions in play, I still experience this multiple times a day when I forget to restart the app.

Why tie crashing and pausing together? Because the next “strategy” when pausing is gone will be to force close the game and reload it so you load in with next to no time left in the fight allowing similar results to pausing at the start.

They both need to be addressed or imo you’re just postponing a solution to the ultimate issue of awarding points where they are unearned. To this I would suggest something that will only factor in in the event of a non-knock out. Something like your HP will either not award points until x seconds have passed in a match; maybe 100 seconds, or a formula that modifies your HP points based on time passed; this could also be based on 100 seconds, 100 seconds could award 100% of HP points and 50 seconds could award 50% of HP points or less even.

Bottom line is, pausing isn’t the only problem present when it comes to skirting the mechanics of the game for points.
Crashing the game intentionally if you start the fight rough works already. But there there is the penalty that if your game loads back up slow you lose a lot of time possibly even worse off than if you hadn't crashed

I think you’ve missed the point of why it was brought up. If pausing is taken out or disabled you can get the same results by force quitting and reloading which will consume a significant portion of the fight clock just like pause is being used for in many instances. Also a lot of what people are describing as pausing is actually force closes or game crashes.

*edit
Ultimately I suppose the problem is that if you have taken less than 51% HP from the opponent and are going to die you are better off force quitting and just running down the clock.

unknown

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CoatHang3r

They both need to be addressed or imo you’re just postponing a solution to the ultimate issue of awarding points where they are unearned. To this I would suggest something that will only factor in in the event of a non-knock out. Something like your HP will either not award points until x seconds have passed in a match; maybe 100 seconds, or a formula that modifies your HP points based on time passed; this could also be based on 100 seconds, 100 seconds could award 100% of HP points and 50 seconds could award 50% of HP points or less even.

Bottom line is, pausing isn’t the only problem present when it comes to skirting the mechanics of the game for points.
what happens to people who legitimately kill opponents with AA,CGR,Ghost in 30 seconds or less

The attack HP points remain unchanged because the health modifier is only for when the opponent is not knocked out.

If defender hp remaining <30k modify attacker hp remaining by x% of fight duration.

Roflmao123C

How is it a fair fight when he hit my Wiccan one time then paused the fight and timed out. There shouldn’t be a pause button in battlegrounds type content when the whole point is to be the fastest.

Each game has different tactics that can lead to victory or defeat. Imagine you are playing football and you have won the first match and the second draw. The situation is that you would reach the next round if you win or draw the last game. If you lose, there is the option of being kicked out of the tournament. Why should you risk getting kicked out by playing too offensively? So you play defensively and hope that that's enough to reach next round. But by playing defensively you have not a big chance of scoring and you have the risk to lose when your opponent attacks better than you defend.

So when people do that, they are also taking a big risk. That's why I personally see no reason why this should be changed. It's my opinion. I don't say It's the right one. Ultimately, Kabam decides how they want this mode to work.

ps: sorry for my english

tusharNair

Why are people saying its not sportsmanship like. This game is not meant to be fair and sportsmanship. People can just whale out and beat up pips who don't spend.

AverageDesi

Why are people saying its not sportsmanship like. This game is not meant to be fair and sportsmanship. People can just whale out and beat up pips who don't spend.

That's the game that's designed to be that way. That's what you're getting into. This is not. That's the dify

tusharNair

Why are people saying its not sportsmanship like. This game is not meant to be fair and sportsmanship. People can just whale out and beat up pips who don't spend.
That's the game that's designed to be that way. That's what you're getting into. This is not. That's the dify

Yup, so words like "fair" and "sportsmanship" should not have any value in this game as its designed to be not fair...lol

Furrymoosen

Why are people saying its not sportsmanship like. This game is not meant to be fair and sportsmanship. People can just whale out and beat up pips who don't spend.
That's the game that's designed to be that way. That's what you're getting into. This is not. That's the dify
Yup, so words like "fair" and "sportsmanship" should not have any value in this game as its designed to be not fair...lol

You’re confusing the very definition of what fair is. When it comes to this game, fair is an even playing field, but that even playing field isn’t comparing one account to another, it’s everyone having fair access. Yes, whales spend a ton of money and get ahead, but what they spend money on is accessible for all players whether they are willing to spend or not. Whales have chosen to put money into the game to give themselves an advantage and players that don’t spend money have rightfully rejected (whether by choice or by lack of funds) their fair access to that advantage.
When we are specifically talking about this game mode we can agree that both players have fair access to the pause button and can both use this tactic. But fairness and sportsmanship are two different things. It is not sportsmanlike to play a game by not playing a game. In any other scenario inside and outside the game that would qualify as a forfeit. If the opponent is allowed to not play and in turn is also not required to forfeit, then it is in fact not fair that someone completely unwilling to play the game maintains a fair chance at winning against someone that is actually playing. It’s not okay.

Chatterofforums

To be clear here, we do not think this is a fair strategy, and will be taking action to stop it. The answer to playing a game should never be "Don't play the game". The game team is already aware and exploring options.

Kabam has gone on record and said sandbagging and "pause" button isn't in the spirit of the game. Fair enough and thank you for confirming those as forums has many opinions on that. However one thing I've never seen Kabam confirm yet on BG is what is the actual purpose/goal?

You will see hundreds upon hundreds of posts on this and generally lower rank players say the purpose of BG is for most skilled to advance and matchups should be equalish based on roster. You then have stronger players saying battle of the fittest and strongest should thrive.

I haven't seen Kabam take a stance on this but it would really help settle a lot of conflict in forums on the topic.

Also, I know Kabam doesnt think not fighting in a fighting game should be a strategy in MCOC, but does Kabam think that motivating players to slow down their growth, avoid putting aig into champs and avoid high prestige rankups should be that goal in BG, which conflicts directly with every other part of MCOC?

Because slowly but surely that is what Kabams matchmaking is doing, it's motivating players, to include myself, to avoid prestige rankups, avoid putting sig into champs with high prestige, etc as the current BG matchmkaing pits high prestige/pi against each other at every tier while lower prestige get a much easier path to the rewards. Is this seriously what Kabam intended with the current matchmaking process?

Graves_3

To be clear here, we do not think this is a fair strategy, and will be taking action to stop it. The answer to playing a game should never be "Don't play the game". The game team is already aware and exploring options.
Kabam has gone on record and said sandbagging and "pause" button isn't in the spirit of the game. Fair enough and thank you for confirming those as forums has many opinions on that. However one thing I've never seen Kabam confirm yet on BG is what is the actual purpose/goal?

You will see hundreds upon hundreds of posts on this and generally lower rank players say the purpose of BG is for most skilled to advance and matchups should be equalish based on roster. You then have stronger players saying battle of the fittest and strongest should thrive.

I haven't seen Kabam take a stance on this but it would really help settle a lot of conflict in forums on the topic.

Also, I know Kabam doesnt think not fighting in a fighting game should be a strategy in MCOC, but does Kabam think that motivating players to slow down their growth, avoid putting aig into champs and avoid high prestige rankups should be that goal in BG, which conflicts directly with every other part of MCOC?

Because slowly but surely that is what Kabams matchmaking is doing, it's motivating players, to include myself, to avoid prestige rankups, avoid putting sig into champs with high prestige, etc as the current BG matchmkaing pits high prestige/pi against each other at every tier while lower prestige get a much easier path to the rewards. Is this seriously what Kabam intended with the current matchmaking process?

I asked the same question in another thread a few days back and never got a response. It would be really helpful if a mod could chime in on what the actual matchmaking philosophy is so this debate about fair/unfair matchups can be put to rest once and for all.

unknown

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WhatsGoodEnglish

How is it a fair fight when he hit my Wiccan one time then paused the fight and timed out. There shouldn’t be a pause button in battlegrounds type content when the whole point is to be the fastest.

Each game has different tactics that can lead to victory or defeat. Imagine you are playing football and you have won the first match and the second draw. The situation is that you would reach the next round if you win or draw the last game. If you lose, there is the option of being kicked out of the tournament. Why should you risk getting kicked out by playing too offensively? So you play defensively and hope that that's enough to reach next round. But by playing defensively you have not a big chance of scoring and you have the risk to lose when your opponent attacks better than you defend.

So when people do that, they are also taking a big risk. That's why I personally see no reason why this should be changed. It's my opinion. I don't say It's the right one. Ultimately, Kabam decides how they want this mode to work.

ps: sorry for my english

A similar scenario to what you described happened a few years ago in the Olympics. The people that designed the badminton tournament made a double elimination bracket that gave some teams much more favorable matches if they were to lose. It meant they would then go against weaker teams that had already been beaten. That led to strong teams who were matched against each other intentionally trying to lose their match so they could have an easier time in the losers bracket, and still make it to the finals and possibly win the whole tournament. Teams were literally hitting the birdie into the net and intentionally knocking it out of bounds. Strong teams that would have put on a great show ended up in a competition with each other to see who could lose better. The people in charge began punishing the teams. Why? Because it went against the spirit of a competition. It’s the same for pausing and that football scenario you just mentioned. It goes against the spirit of the competition and therefore should not be allowed. Kabam even said in this thread they do not intend for this to be a strategy. Every single BG tournament has banned the use of pausing. We all deal with the same annoying AI & RNG. Trying to subvert the system and take advantage of the way it’s scores of match is cheating, plain and simple.

RonSwanson

How is it a fair fight when he hit my Wiccan one time then paused the fight and timed out. There shouldn’t be a pause button in battlegrounds type content when the whole point is to be the fastest.

Each game has different tactics that can lead to victory or defeat. Imagine you are playing football and you have won the first match and the second draw. The situation is that you would reach the next round if you win or draw the last game. If you lose, there is the option of being kicked out of the tournament. Why should you risk getting kicked out by playing too offensively? So you play defensively and hope that that's enough to reach next round. But by playing defensively you have not a big chance of scoring and you have the risk to lose when your opponent attacks better than you defend.

So when people do that, they are also taking a big risk. That's why I personally see no reason why this should be changed. It's my opinion. I don't say It's the right one. Ultimately, Kabam decides how they want this mode to work.

ps: sorry for my english

Landing a hit then hitting pause for the rest of the fight is hardly playing defensively. It doesn't even qualify as playing at all.

SummonerNR

A similar scenario to what you described happened a few years ago in the Olympics. The people that designed the badminton tournament made a double elimination bracket that gave some teams much more favorable matches if they were to lose. It meant they would then go against weaker teams that had already been beaten. That led to strong teams who were matched against each other intentionally trying to lose their match so they could have an easier time in the losers bracket, and still make it to the finals and possibly win the whole tournament. Teams were literally hitting the birdie into the net and intentionally knocking it out of bounds. Strong teams that would have put on a great show ended up in a competition with each other to see who could lose better. The people in charge began punishing the teams. Why? Because it went against the spirit of a competition. It’s the same for pausing and that football scenario you just mentioned. It goes against the spirit of the competition and therefore should not be allowed. Kabam even said in this thread they do not intend for this to be a strategy. Every single BG tournament has banned the use of pausing. We all deal with the same annoying AI & RNG. Trying to subvert the system and take advantage of the way it’s scores of match is cheating, plain and simple.

I vaguely recall seeing that.
Although must have been a very poor (and incorrect) version of drawing up a double-elimination tournament.

The last team to have lost from the winners bracket side (except the final team on that side) should still have been put into the losers side and still be able to continue over there. No matter at what point they have lost their first match, they would continue playing until they lost 2 matches.

ie, the final 2 on the winners side bracket would not automatically knock someone out of the tournament, the loser would just go over to losers side and potentially continue onto a rematch with that winners side team that gave them their 1st defeat.
No reason to lose earlier, unless the tournament was a complete failure from a configuration standpoint.

Wicket329

I feel like we’re overcomplicating this.

Just make it so you can only pause for 15 seconds in a fight. That’s enough time to deal with most genuine, real-world problems that may pop up during your two minute window (like, for example, your dog jumping on you), but not so long that it could be abused in most situations.

I know it’s not foolproof, there are certainly edge cases where a player could push the opponent to their sp3 with a couple seconds on the clock and then pause or something of that nature. But overall I think it’s a safe middle ground and would solve situations like OP is talking about.

Andremlopes

To be clear here, we do not think this is a fair strategy, and will be taking action to stop it. The answer to playing a game should never be "Don't play the game". The game team is already aware and exploring options.

There is a simple thing that should have been done from start... timeout should reward zero points for remaining health of the attacker

Dukenpuke

How is it a fair fight when he hit my Wiccan one time then paused the fight and timed out. There shouldn’t be a pause button in battlegrounds type content when the whole point is to be the fastest.

Each game has different tactics that can lead to victory or defeat. Imagine you are playing football and you have won the first match and the second draw. The situation is that you would reach the next round if you win or draw the last game. If you lose, there is the option of being kicked out of the tournament. Why should you risk getting kicked out by playing too offensively? So you play defensively and hope that that's enough to reach next round. But by playing defensively you have not a big chance of scoring and you have the risk to lose when your opponent attacks better than you defend.

So when people do that, they are also taking a big risk. That's why I personally see no reason why this should be changed. It's my opinion. I don't say It's the right one. Ultimately, Kabam decides how they want this mode to work.

ps: sorry for my english

The only way this is an apt analogy is if the football team is allowed to earn a draw by not showing up to the game at all.

Angryneeson52

You should have hit ibom 3 times and then paused. You would have won.

Mackey

I feel like we’re overcomplicating this.

Just make it so you can only pause for 15 seconds in a fight. That’s enough time to deal with most genuine, real-world problems that may pop up during your two minute window (like, for example, your dog jumping on you), but not so long that it could be abused in most situations.

I know it’s not foolproof, there are certainly edge cases where a player could push the opponent to their sp3 with a couple seconds on the clock and then pause or something of that nature. But overall I think it’s a safe middle ground and would solve situations like OP is talking about.

I agree, 15 seconds seems like a fair amount of time but put a limit on it, like 1 pause per fight (so potentially 3 pauses over 1 full match). And on said pause screen have a forfeit button that takes you out of the whole match up not just that fight.

Greekhit

To be clear here, we do not think this is a fair strategy, and will be taking action to stop it. The answer to playing a game should never be "Don't play the game". The game team is already aware and exploring options.
Kabam has gone on record and said sandbagging and "pause" button isn't in the spirit of the game. Fair enough and thank you for confirming those as forums has many opinions on that. However one thing I've never seen Kabam confirm yet on BG is what is the actual purpose/goal?

You will see hundreds upon hundreds of posts on this and generally lower rank players say the purpose of BG is for most skilled to advance and matchups should be equalish based on roster. You then have stronger players saying battle of the fittest and strongest should thrive.

I haven't seen Kabam take a stance on this but it would really help settle a lot of conflict in forums on the topic.

Also, I know Kabam doesnt think not fighting in a fighting game should be a strategy in MCOC, but does Kabam think that motivating players to slow down their growth, avoid putting aig into champs and avoid high prestige rankups should be that goal in BG, which conflicts directly with every other part of MCOC?

Because slowly but surely that is what Kabams matchmaking is doing, it's motivating players, to include myself, to avoid prestige rankups, avoid putting sig into champs with high prestige, etc as the current BG matchmkaing pits high prestige/pi against each other at every tier while lower prestige get a much easier path to the rewards. Is this seriously what Kabam intended with the current matchmaking process?

I’ll double that.
Current prestige matchmaking is demoralising people from hunting and raising their prestige.
I’m one of them. I don’t open neither upgrade relics, and I use my 6* signature stones only on r3s to avoid raising prestige.
As a relatively high prestige account (15,5k) for only six r4s, I was matching people with a min of 10 r4s, an average of 15 r4s and sometimes nearly full r4 decks at Victory Track.
Today I reached Gladiator Circuit after huge effort against big accounts at VT, just to see that URU III is full of 200-500k 10k prestige UC/Cav accounts, while at the same time many big Paragon accounts will remain stuck at some VT bracket.
There is no need to refer that most of them instantly forfeited when they saw my deck 😂
The problem is, these small accounts will get ranked rewards by only fighting each other and avoiding competition at VT, while the big accounts who didn’t managed to get to GC, will take the L.
Kabam needs to address this ASAP.
You can’t punish progression, in a progress based game.
It will backlash to the company sooner or later.
@Kabam Miike are you aware, what is Prestige matchmaking causing long term to the game? 🤔
You did it last year at AW and you saw how unfair it was.
Why you chose to solve the sandbagging problem, the worst way possible creating a worse and more unfair matchmaking?
You could have just gone the top15 average PI deck matchmaking, or even better, a total random matchmaking (within same VT bracket of course) and give a head start to higher brackets of VT, based on Prestige or last season placing, to stronger players.
Hope you guys realise soon what’s happening at the moment, and give a good solution 😉

unknown

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unknown

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AverageDesi

How is it a fair fight when he hit my Wiccan one time then paused the fight and timed out. There shouldn’t be a pause button in battlegrounds type content when the whole point is to be the fastest.

Each game has different tactics that can lead to victory or defeat. Imagine you are playing football and you have won the first match and the second draw. The situation is that you would reach the next round if you win or draw the last game. If you lose, there is the option of being kicked out of the tournament. Why should you risk getting kicked out by playing too offensively? So you play defensively and hope that that's enough to reach next round. But by playing defensively you have not a big chance of scoring and you have the risk to lose when your opponent attacks better than you defend.

So when people do that, they are also taking a big risk. That's why I personally see no reason why this should be changed. It's my opinion. I don't say It's the right one. Ultimately, Kabam decides how they want this mode to work.

ps: sorry for my english

Then what you should do is dance around in the game itself instead of pausing

BigBlueOx

Lol since this post, the pause strategy is even more in use lol. Love this community 😂

Mackey

I feel like we’re overcomplicating this.

Just make it so you can only pause for 15 seconds in a fight. That’s enough time to deal with most genuine, real-world problems that may pop up during your two minute window (like, for example, your dog jumping on you), but not so long that it could be abused in most situations.

I know it’s not foolproof, there are certainly edge cases where a player could push the opponent to their sp3 with a couple seconds on the clock and then pause or something of that nature. But overall I think it’s a safe middle ground and would solve situations like OP is talking about.
I agree, 15 seconds seems like a fair amount of time but put a limit on it, like 1 pause per fight (so potentially 3 pauses over 1 full match). And on said pause screen have a forfeit button that takes you out of the whole match up not just that fight.
why do you so desperately need a forfeit button?
whats the point of that

just force close the game. i read up above that you didn't know if your opponent will have to wait. Believe me if you forfeit no matter the long wait your opponent will be happy so just force close the game.

Because its illogical to not have one. Literally every game I have ever played has an option for forfeit the match. Can't understand why people don't want one 🤦‍♂️.

So here's an example where forfeit would be used .... " you start a match, just as you begin your first fight you need to do something in the house, OK so you force close the app, fine I don't care about my result at this point. You tend to whatever needs tending to then you decide I'll jump back in game and do some EQ .... but it's only been 60 seconds since you force closed the app and therefore loads you back into the BGs match as youre starting your 2nd fight, now you have to ride out your second fight before you're able to do what you want in game ... because guess what? They removed the quit button 🤦‍♂️

Mackey

Not only that but I've had numerous people force close the app on me ... at least that what I think it was. Where I've been sat waiting out each timer from each screen for the match to finish. Yes I'm happy I get a free win but I'm more annoyed that I had to sit and wait for that long knowing that a forfeit option would of just ended the game there and then

Pikolu

I feel like we’re overcomplicating this.

Just make it so you can only pause for 15 seconds in a fight. That’s enough time to deal with most genuine, real-world problems that may pop up during your two minute window (like, for example, your dog jumping on you), but not so long that it could be abused in most situations.

I know it’s not foolproof, there are certainly edge cases where a player could push the opponent to their sp3 with a couple seconds on the clock and then pause or something of that nature. But overall I think it’s a safe middle ground and would solve situations like OP is talking about.
I agree, 15 seconds seems like a fair amount of time but put a limit on it, like 1 pause per fight (so potentially 3 pauses over 1 full match). And on said pause screen have a forfeit button that takes you out of the whole match up not just that fight.
why do you so desperately need a forfeit button?
whats the point of that

just force close the game. i read up above that you didn't know if your opponent will have to wait. Believe me if you forfeit no matter the long wait your opponent will be happy so just force close the game.
Because its illogical to not have one. Literally every game I have ever played has an option for forfeit the match. Can't understand why people don't want one 🤦‍♂️.

So here's an example where forfeit would be used .... " you start a match, just as you begin your first fight you need to do something in the house, OK so you force close the app, fine I don't care about my result at this point. You tend to whatever needs tending to then you decide I'll jump back in game and do some EQ .... but it's only been 60 seconds since you force closed the app and therefore loads you back into the BGs match as youre starting your 2nd fight, now you have to ride out your second fight before you're able to do what you want in game ... because guess what? They removed the quit button 🤦‍♂️

If your game isn't open when the round ends, then the game just forfeits for you. Also an easy forfeit button is just letting the enemy kill you while you go and so something else.