The problem is casual players want the same rewards as the ones who really sweat it... There is a sense of entitlement.. since the reward is showing i should be able to get it...
People want a more rewarding experience for their effort. In this unforgiving format, BGs is a nightmare because you have to get a winning streak to progress. Sometimes you're lucky and can get those 3 wins, but more often than not you're going to win 2, and depending on your account size, you could be matched against dudes you literally stand no chance again for the next 2 matches putting you back at 0. Or even worse, you're put in a match that's practically a guaranteed win and the disconnect bug causes you to lose the match. This is a main cause of frustration that needs to be remedied unless you want to deal with 2+ minute matchmaking times in bgs since no one is playing them.
No I think people want the rewards more than the experience.. And or course you are going to face account biggers than you.. its a compentition... This is not arena where u lose a streak and get a chance to get it back.. its not a quest where u die and call unit man to revive and keep going... Its the mcoc format of PVP, sure they toss around a few rewards to keep it interesting and incentive playing.. but as the OP stated.. IF "you are casual and don't compete" why worry about climbing up and collecting the rewards? Is it really about the game mode or the rewards that they can't reach? He even mentions modders and hackers and in his own way justifies them... I doubt modders mod for the "experience of the game mode"
You said pretty much exactly what I was thinking when I read OP post. But then again as soon as he started justifying why players mod, he completely lost me as I will never take anyone serious who tries to justify that.
First of all Battlegrounds CAN be a lot of fun when things go right, however that is very rare.
Way back when BG was in early beta everyone loved it. Then they added the tracks. The victory track is an okay idea with a horribly bad execution. “Lets take the sweatest players, mixed them with the casuals, and have them fight it out for rewards. “
Idk, doesnt sound like much fun for anyone other than the try hards. But thats not the big problem.
Arguably, those two groups would separate after the 1st week or so, so not a major issue. The issue is the design. Having to win 3 matches + or - is ok but having people lose “wins” is a major design flaw for casual players.
Sure the try hards dont care, but the ppl only playing 3 matches a day it becomes bad.
Lets count the feel bads. 1. You lose the match. Ok it happens to everyone but it is a fee bad.
2. Now the awesome win you just got is take away. Hope you enjoyed it while it was there!
3. God help you if the game glitched for some reason between defenders going unblockable to parry not working to abilities not triggering, ive seen it all.
Ohh, and lets not forget about matchmaking.
So why should anyone who is not competitive play this format???
All you do is make ppl feel bad every third match.
Can you can really blame ppl for hacking it when kabam can make it fair and enjoyable from the start.
Obviously, dont hack but if someone just did it for the milestones and didnt affect the competitive players would you blame them???
Kabam has locked the best store in the game behind the most painful experience in the game. All to make an extra few dollars on victory shield.
Its shameful,
I encourage ppl to play it as little as possible
Thank you
Yeah I got some experience also I just became cav I have only 1 R2 6* and 14 6* But battleground gives me thronebreaker players only I was impossible to play with them Now a days this game is for only top up players Others didn't get the thing for which they worked
I judge a game mode based on how I feel when I'm finished playing it. I tend to feel stressed after a round of BG's (win or lose), and have decided that despite the rewards, it's not the experience that I'm looking for. While there are some nice rewards in the BG store that I wish I could have, I don't expect Kabam to change the game mode to suit my wants/needs. There are plenty of other game modes to play, and other ways to get rewards.
I don’t like losing but I play anyway. Just a video game.
I would never cheat.
The mode needs change, for sure, if they want less sweaty players to keep playing.
Maybe have two tiers with different reward structure and each season/cycle players could choose which tier they want to compete in? Paragons would be forced into the harder tier?
So Kabam has put the "best" rewards behind work... 🤔
No they put it behind system deliberately designed to set you back.
If you lose the boss fight in eop do you have to start the quest over?
If you lose in 6.4.6 do you have to complete 6.4.5 again b4 being allowed to do 6.4.6?
The work is their either way, but making ppl redo what they have already accomplished for 0 rewards is just dumb.
U even justify modders cause of the level of frustration.. yeah i'm pretty sure people beat 6.4.6 with mods just for the gaming experience...
This is deliberately out of context and you know it. I said dont mod but i cant cant blame them for what they do when kabam cant fix their game.
And that comment was made about bg, 6.4.6 wad not even mentioned in that post.
Obviously you diagree which is fine, but argue the points, don’t misquote me or quote w/o context because you disagree but cant make a reasonable argument. It sad.
So Kabam has put the "best" rewards behind work... 🤔
No they put it behind system deliberately designed to set you back.
If you lose the boss fight in eop do you have to start the quest over?
If you lose in 6.4.6 do you have to complete 6.4.5 again b4 being allowed to do 6.4.6?
The work is their either way, but making ppl redo what they have already accomplished for 0 rewards is just dumb.
U even justify modders cause of the level of frustration.. yeah i'm pretty sure people beat 6.4.6 with mods just for the gaming experience...
This is deliberately out of context and you know it. I said dont mod but i cant cant blame them for what they do when kabam cant fix their game.
And that comment was made about bg, 6.4.6 wad not even mentioned in that post.
Obviously you diagree which is fine, but argue the points, don’t misquote me or quote w/o context because you disagree but cant make a reasonable argument. It sad.
Your whole post is all about getting the rewards that you want in a easier matter.. Its a 100% about rewards and not about the game mode and its experience... Otherwise why would you say "i understand why modders mod"... Modders mod for rewards not to have the satisfaction of a win
Bg is a competitive mode, so the competitive modes in all games are hard, stressful and you need the skill, knowledge and the roster to do it more enjoyable, do you have it? If the answer is no, you can't play in a competitive game mode.
I have a good account, 1 6*r5, 16 6*r4, 6*r3 for the rest, the whale accounts are so far from me, accounts from TCN, GT40, 4Loki, NY718, JA, etc. many times I defeated them and I have enjoyed it when that happens.
Every season my rank have been Celestial VI, hard? yes, impossible? no.
Maybe, many people think that their skills are better than what they really are.
I think battlegrounds is best part of the game. Yeah it sucks losing, but it would be 0 challenge if you just kept the wins everytime. You guys complaining, man up. I just hit platinum. You have a whole month. Everytime I've gotten into Vibranium. You get rewards every Tier you get. It would kinda suck blasting through on 2 days cause loses aren't removed. No reward tiers in Vibranium. @Rav514 you seem to want it nerfed. They would probably decrease rewards, put in some effort. Usually in at least 5 or 6 rounds I can jump a tier, most most the time I'll lose then go on a winning streak. Vibranium no more Tier rewards, probably never made Vibranium, but I think they should leave it alone
Your whole post is all about getting the rewards that you want in a easier matter.. Its a 100% about rewards and not about the game mode and its experience... Otherwise why would you say "i understand why modders mod"... Modders mod for rewards not to have the satisfaction of a win Ok, this is misunderstanding of my position, which i am happy to clarify.
Its not about the rewards, its about the design flaws which lead to multiple feel bad moments back to back to back. This things dont exist in other parts of the game.
Yes, i do breifly mention rewards but only as what would motivate most casual players to play and why they “may” feel bad. This is why i dont get into specifics. The rewards are only relevant from a motivation standpoint, not a specific one.
The modders comment was made from the idea that they have the power i and the most of us dont have, to circumvent those bad design choices by modding. Obviously, dont cheat. But I personally am not raising a pick fork over modders that only really affect the top what 1 or 2 % when the bottom 30 of 50 dont enjoy the mode and are only playing because the feel obligated to in order to keep up with everyone else?
The token system in VT needs to change. It is very stressful and punishing right now. Together with the bugs and other issues it becomes a nightmare.
I haven't played Hearthstone in a minute but there are striking similarities between how that ranked mode functions compared to the BG Victory Track and Gladiator's Circuit. Hearthstone has a few differences which I think are all more positive.
At the lowest ranks, you simply cannot lose any tokens. Just play until you win enough total matches to progress. Eventually you get to a spot where you can lose tokens. If you progress through all the ranks, you reach Legend (basically GC). The coolest part about Legend though is it isn't actually entirely separate from the other part. It immediately converts your rank to a Rating that its been keeping track of the entire time. After you reach Legend your matchups are then rating dependent. This helps continue to keep matches fair for the entire season even if a typical legend is too much for you to compete with. Furthermore, a really helpful part about progressing is that you get extra tokens if you can string wins together. This causes the people who are winning 90% of their matches to get sprung to the top a lot faster than those winning 60%. There's no free ride to the top but the mode can recognize that maybe you aren't being challenged enough and try to address that as quickly as possible.
I think battlegrounds is best part of the game. Yeah it sucks losing, but it would be 0 challenge if you just kept the wins everytime. You guys complaining, man up. I just hit platinum. You have a whole month. Everytime I've gotten into Vibranium. You get rewards every Tier you get. It would kinda suck blasting through on 2 days cause loses aren't removed. No reward tiers in Vibranium. @Rav514 you seem to want it nerfed. They would probably decrease rewards, put in some effort. Usually in at least 5 or 6 rounds I can jump a tier, most most the time I'll lose then go on a winning streak. Vibranium no more Tier rewards, probably never made Vibranium, but I think they should leave it alone
Respect your opinion, i do think it can be the best part of the game, but i dont want it “nerf” though admittedly dont know the fall of would be.
I have completed the teirs the last few times but dont think i will this time, its not fun to me and that where this comes from
Maybe, many people think that their skills are better than what they really are.
This is inevitable when at no point in the Contest has "Perfection" been the expectation. Are you bad at the game because you can get out of every fight relatively quickly with most of your health? No, you are good at the game. But other people are coming out of every fight with max or almost max health and just about as fast as possible, adding on to that their champs could be higher rank/rarity/sig level. Also adding that some people have been planning War Defense for years and playing TCGs and other turn based strategy games for even longer than that. I'm sure some of the best actual fighters in this game had put barely a lick of thought into thinking about how to utilize defenders in a way to screw up someone else and have only been thinking this way for a few months.
The token system in VT needs to change. It is very stressful and punishing right now. Together with the bugs and other issues it becomes a nightmare.
I haven't played Hearthstone in a minute but there are striking similarities between how that ranked mode functions compared to the BG Victory Track and Gladiator's Circuit. Hearthstone has a few differences which I think are all more positive.
At the lowest ranks, you simply cannot lose any tokens. Just play until you win enough total matches to progress. Eventually you get to a spot where you can lose tokens. If you progress through all the ranks, you reach Legend (basically GC). The coolest part about Legend though is it isn't actually entirely separate from the other part. It immediately converts your rank to a Rating that its been keeping track of the entire time. After you reach Legend your matchups are then rating dependent. This helps continue to keep matches fair for the entire season even if a typical legend is too much for you to compete with. Furthermore, a really helpful part about progressing is that you get extra tokens if you can string wins together. This causes the people who are winning 90% of their matches to get sprung to the top a lot faster than those winning 60%. There's no free ride to the top but the mode can recognize that maybe you aren't being challenged enough and try to address that as quickly as possible.
This is almost exactly how EA Madden Overdrive was set up (not sure what there is now on that game). Anyway, you could basically progress to a point just by grinding. Then the losses started to hurt until you fell to that threshold again. Win streaks let you move up faster, etc. Would like to see a similar format for BG’s
Your whole post is all about getting the rewards that you want in a easier matter.. Its a 100% about rewards and not about the game mode and its experience... Otherwise why would you say "i understand why modders mod"... Modders mod for rewards not to have the satisfaction of a win Ok, this is misunderstanding of my position, which i am happy to clarify.
Its not about the rewards, its about the design flaws which lead to multiple feel bad moments back to back to back. This things dont exist in other parts of the game.
Yes, i do breifly mention rewards but only as what would motivate most casual players to play and why they “may” feel bad. This is why i dont get into specifics. The rewards are only relevant from a motivation standpoint, not a specific one.
The modders comment was made from the idea that they have the power i and the most of us dont have, to circumvent those bad design choices by modding. Obviously, dont cheat. But I personally am not raising a pick fork over modders that only really affect the top what 1 or 2 % when the bottom 30 of 50 dont enjoy the mode and are only playing because the feel obligated to in order to keep up with everyone else?
I casually play golf... 2x a month ... Should i be complaining about the structure of the PGA tour cause my casual playing doesnt allow me to compete in it?
The problem is casual players want the same rewards as the ones who really sweat it... There is a sense of entitlement.. since the reward is showing i should be able to get it...
People want a more rewarding experience for their effort. In this unforgiving format, BGs is a nightmare because you have to get a winning streak to progress. Sometimes you're lucky and can get those 3 wins, but more often than not you're going to win 2, and depending on your account size, you could be matched against dudes you literally stand no chance again for the next 2 matches putting you back at 0. Or even worse, you're put in a match that's practically a guaranteed win and the disconnect bug causes you to lose the match. This is a main cause of frustration that needs to be remedied unless you want to deal with 2+ minute matchmaking times in bgs since no one is playing them.
No I think people want the rewards more than the experience.. And or course you are going to face account biggers than you.. its a compentition... This is not arena where u lose a streak and get a chance to get it back.. its not a quest where u die and call unit man to revive and keep going... Its the mcoc format of PVP, sure they toss around a few rewards to keep it interesting and incentive playing.. but as the OP stated.. IF "you are casual and don't compete" why worry about climbing up and collecting the rewards? Is it really about the game mode or the rewards that they can't reach? He even mentions modders and hackers and in his own way justifies them... I doubt modders mod for the "experience of the game mode"
Yes we want rewards, but we also want to have fun. If you're not enjoying the gamemode, you're not going to play the gamemode or you'll hate yourself as you force yourself into the gamemode to get rewards.
I, for one, enjoy battlegrounds. It is a fun gamemode and I'm glad I finally have a use for my wide roster, but something you have to understand is Victory Track isn't the competitive gamemode. The true competition starts in GC and it SUCKED to get through this VT with such a vanilla nuke meta that punished making any mistakes at all.
In my opinion, Victory track should be a more casual and fun experience and keep gladiator circuit as the cutthroat competitive mode to play in. DNA3000 already has stated great ideas to make Victory Track more forgiving and more fun to play in.
The problem is casual players want the same rewards as the ones who really sweat it... There is a sense of entitlement.. since the reward is showing i should be able to get it...
People want a more rewarding experience for their effort. In this unforgiving format, BGs is a nightmare because you have to get a winning streak to progress. Sometimes you're lucky and can get those 3 wins, but more often than not you're going to win 2, and depending on your account size, you could be matched against dudes you literally stand no chance again for the next 2 matches putting you back at 0. Or even worse, you're put in a match that's practically a guaranteed win and the disconnect bug causes you to lose the match. This is a main cause of frustration that needs to be remedied unless you want to deal with 2+ minute matchmaking times in bgs since no one is playing them.
No I think people want the rewards more than the experience.. And or course you are going to face account biggers than you.. its a compentition... This is not arena where u lose a streak and get a chance to get it back.. its not a quest where u die and call unit man to revive and keep going... Its the mcoc format of PVP, sure they toss around a few rewards to keep it interesting and incentive playing.. but as the OP stated.. IF "you are casual and don't compete" why worry about climbing up and collecting the rewards? Is it really about the game mode or the rewards that they can't reach? He even mentions modders and hackers and in his own way justifies them... I doubt modders mod for the "experience of the game mode"
Yes we want rewards, but we also want to have fun. If you're not enjoying the gamemode, you're not going to play the gamemode or you'll hate yourself as you force yourself into the gamemode to get rewards.
I, for one, enjoy battlegrounds. It is a fun gamemode and I'm glad I finally have a use for my wide roster, but something you have to understand is Victory Track isn't the competitive gamemode. The true competition starts in GC and it SUCKED to get through this VT with such a vanilla nuke meta that punished making any mistakes at all.
In my opinion, Victory track should be a more casual and fun experience and keep gladiator circuit as the cutthroat competitive mode to play in. DNA3000 already has stated great ideas to make Victory Track more forgiving and more fun to play in.
If u don't enjoy it u don't play it.. I don't enjoy AQ.. feels like a 5 day chore.. so i picked an alliance with minimal participation on it...and i made my peace with it and play the game knowing i won't maximize my mats to rank up... But what's the real problem with BGs?.. before bgs a player would be able to open 2 maybe 3 6* crystals per month, with BGs u can do 9-10... and that's the reason why people who don't enjoy it are forcing themselves... It's the 5th season with the same VT structure.. and this month had the most complaints.. could it be cause the accounts of non casual players are getting way bigger? Why are casual players so hurt that they can't compete?.. they are casual player!!!.. U can't expect to be casual and get all the perks . Its the way the world works.
I'm going to collect a lot of comments from various other conversations we've had in the forums over the last little while to address a lot of this thread, so forgive me if you've heard this before.
"If you die to a boss in any fight, you can say “ well i took iff “x”% of his health let me buy a revive and continue... In bg, if you die, you can’t continue for where you were at so you a set back... No other part of this game has this effect." We have chatted in past about how Battlegrounds is the first true competitive PVP mode in MCOC. Previously, every challenge could/would end in success, with enough time, energy and resources. Naturally, this means BGs is going to be a departure for players and is bound to cause some discomfort. Every single matchup between two players means 50% of that matchup is receiving a loss; this is inevitable.
"Can you can really blame ppl for hacking it when kabam can make it fair and enjoyable from the start." Yes. Yes we can blame people for hacking. In no way does frustration justify cheating. The game mode is fair insofar as everyone is dealing with the same system, and trying to circumnavigate that system out of frustration, or any other motivation, is not tolerated.
Why not create a casual mode, too? A casual would not operate in the fashion laid out in this thread. We are not looking to give the same rewards for less work. We understand that the lens many Summoners view the game through is one of: "Where can I get the best rewards; that's where I'm going to dedicate my time." But simply putting time into BGs does not result in rewards, as previously mentioned; the PVP nature of the mode requires you to overcome other Summoners. We have largely found the highest rewards from this game mode are going to the players who are putting in the most time.
Are you suggesting that nothing about Battlegrounds needs to change? Not at all. And we've talked about it repeatedly on the forums. Changes are coming to Battlegrounds structure and matchmaking, some that may have been suggested in this thread... It won't happen all at once and needs to be changed over time to avoid too many moving parts, but the team is constantly evaluating the game mode and are looking for opportunities to make improvements; they have some good ideas.
We have chatted a lot, and seen a lot of conversations, about how this game is growing to a point where you cannot reasonably expect to do everything in a given month. We have seen the growing pains for Summoners who don't want to prioritize or make choices about what to play and what to let slip. MCOC is growing to a point where you should play the game modes you enjoy most. There's something for everyone, even if you're not looking for a competitive mode.
I casually play golf... 2x a month ... Should i be complaining about the structure of the PGA tour cause my casual playing doesnt allow me to compete in it?
No of-coarse not, but thats no a fair comparison.
The pga is a closed invitation only event,
Bg is open to everyone and encourages everyone to play.
The fair comparison is your local muni puts on a father son events and says everyone pays after based on your placement. Then tiger woods and a bunch of pros show up.
So your choice is now dont play and miss out, (cause playing with pros would be cool)
Or play and dont miss out but get your but kicked and pay an unknown amount more.
Many ppl feel obligated to play to get some rewards to keep up.
Why not create a casual mode, too? A casual would not operate in the fashion laid out in this thread. We are not looking to give the same rewards for less work. We understand that the lens many Summoners view the game through is one of: "Where can I get the best rewards; that's where I'm going to dedicate my time." But simply putting time into BGs does not result in rewards, as previously mentioned; the PVP nature of the mode requires you to overcome other Summoners. We have largely found the highest rewards from this game mode are going to the players who are putting in the most time.
Why wouldn't a casual version of the mode work? You already have one called Friendlies. Why can't it be expanded so that you can 'queue' into a friendly match instead of specifically having to have that person as a friend and invite them? Obviously less or no rewards would be offered but if you want the mode to succeed, you can't only design it for the sweatiest of tryhards. Some people still like to compete but just not in an ultra competitive environment. No different than people with Masters level rosters not participating in Masters War. That is a choice that they can make for themselves but no alternative is currently available with this game mode.
Why wouldn't a casual version of the mode work? You already have one called Friendlies. Why can't it be expanded so that you can 'queue' into a friendly match instead of specifically having to have that person as a friend and invite them? Obviously less or no rewards would be offered but if you want the mode to succeed, you can't only design it for the sweatiest of tryhards. Some people still like to compete but just not in an ultra competitive environment. No different than people with Masters level rosters not participating in Masters War. That is a choice that they can make for themselves but no alternative is currently available with this game mode.
Apologies, I appear to have misunderstood, or maybe picked up on someone else's suggestion. Yeah, the only drawback I wanted to mention was that there wouldn't be rewards attached to it. But a "friendlies" with matchmaking instead of having to privately invite someone, could be fun.
Why wouldn't a casual version of the mode work? You already have one called Friendlies. Why can't it be expanded so that you can 'queue' into a friendly match instead of specifically having to have that person as a friend and invite them? Obviously less or no rewards would be offered but if you want the mode to succeed, you can't only design it for the sweatiest of tryhards. Some people still like to compete but just not in an ultra competitive environment. No different than people with Masters level rosters not participating in Masters War. That is a choice that they can make for themselves but no alternative is currently available with this game mode.
Apologies, I appear to have misunderstood, or maybe picked up on someone else's suggestion. Yeah, the only drawback I wanted to mention was that there wouldn't be rewards attached to it. But a "friendlies" with matchmaking instead of having to privately invite someone, could be fun.
No worries and thank for clarifying. I think having it contribute to 48 Hour objectives as well as Alliance 1 Day and 3 Day events is totally fine. Having it contribute to the 28 Day Solo and Alliance Event is a maybe for me. Potentially if it offered less contribution it could be ok. Obviously no Victory Track or Gladiator's Circuit type rewards though.
I'm going to collect a lot of comments from various other conversations we've had in the forums over the last little while to address a lot of this thread, so forgive me if you've heard this before.
"If you die to a boss in any fight, you can say “ well i took iff “x”% of his health let me buy a revive and continue... In bg, if you die, you can’t continue for where you were at so you a set back... No other part of this game has this effect." We have chatted in past about how Battlegrounds is the first true competitive PVP mode in MCOC. Previously, every challenge could/would end in success, with enough time, energy and resources. Naturally, this means BGs is going to be a departure for players and is bound to cause some discomfort. Every single matchup between two players means 50% of that matchup is receiving a loss; this is inevitable.
"Can you can really blame ppl for hacking it when kabam can make it fair and enjoyable from the start." Yes. Yes we can blame people for hacking. In no way does frustration justify cheating. The game mode is fair insofar as everyone is dealing with the same system, and trying to circumnavigate that system out of frustration, or any other motivation, is not tolerated.
Why not create a casual mode, too? A casual would not operate in the fashion laid out in this thread. We are not looking to give the same rewards for less work. We understand that the lens many Summoners view the game through is one of: "Where can I get the best rewards; that's where I'm going to dedicate my time." But simply putting time into BGs does not result in rewards, as previously mentioned; the PVP nature of the mode requires you to overcome other Summoners. We have largely found the highest rewards from this game mode are going to the players who are putting in the most time.
Are you suggesting that nothing about Battlegrounds needs to change? Not at all. And we've talked about it repeatedly on the forums. Changes are coming to Battlegrounds structure and matchmaking, some that may have been suggested in this thread... It won't happen all at once and needs to be changed over time to avoid too many moving parts, but the team is constantly evaluating the game mode and are looking for opportunities to make improvements; they have some good ideas.
We have chatted a lot, and seen a lot of conversations, about how this game is growing to a point where you cannot reasonably expect to do everything in a given month. We have seen the growing pains for Summoners who don't want to prioritize or make choices about what to play and what to let slip. MCOC is growing to a point where you should play the game modes you enjoy most. There's something for everyone, even if you're not looking for a competitive mode.
I would like to add something to this.. I would dare anyone to give an example of ANY competitive mode, professional sport or anything at all... Where losing a match just slows u down instead of punishing u... The idea of losses not taking coins allows for brute force... Who cares if i lose.. i just gotta win 3 later... Does it matter if i lose 20 rounds in a row?.. winning 1 out of 10 will keep me climbing.. and that is not competition!
I'm going to collect a lot of comments from various other conversations we've had in the forums over the last little while to address a lot of this thread, so forgive me if you've heard this before.
"If you die to a boss in any fight, you can say “ well i took iff “x”% of his health let me buy a revive and continue... In bg, if you die, you can’t continue for where you were at so you a set back... No other part of this game has this effect." We have chatted in past about how Battlegrounds is the first true competitive PVP mode in MCOC. Previously, every challenge could/would end in success, with enough time, energy and resources. Naturally, this means BGs is going to be a departure for players and is bound to cause some discomfort. Every single matchup between two players means 50% of that matchup is receiving a loss; this is inevitable.
So are you saying that BG was INTENTIONALLY DESIGNED for only the top 50% or 30% of the most motivated players?
If so, i retract my criticisms. However, if it was designed for the Victory track to be a taste and the Gladiator circuit to be the real competition, i think my point still stands
"Can you can really blame ppl for hacking it when kabam can make it fair and enjoyable from the start." Yes. Yes we can blame people for hacking. In no way does frustration justify cheating. The game mode is fair insofar as everyone is dealing with the same system, and trying to circumnavigate that system out of frustration, or any other motivation, is not tolerated.
I really dont like being taken out of context. In every one of my post i said dont hack/mod/cheat.
However, because i expressed sympathy for those who feel like the game is unfair and this their method of balancing the scales, i get quoted. Some one who steals bread to eat is still a thief and is still wrong, but i can feel sorry for them but understand their motives. Modder are wrong but i can understand theirs also. Most of them probably just lazy to put in the work.
I would like to add something to this.. I would dare anyone to give an example of ANY competitive mode, professional sport or anything at all... Where losing a match just slows u down instead of punishing u... The idea of losses not taking coins allows for brute force... Who cares if i lose.. i just gotta win 3 later... Does it matter if i lose 20 rounds in a row?.. winning 1 out of 10 will keep me climbing.. and that is not competition!
Think this get to the heart of it, and why we have different opinions
What part is the competitive mode and what part is the trail or just for the fun section?
My interpretation is that the VT is the fun section and GT is the competitive mode.
Your seem to believe the whole thing is the competitive mode.
If the intent was really that all of BG was only for what the top 30% most motivated players, And the other 70% should stay out,
Then i retract my criticisms, how ever if the vt is supposed to be the trial and GC is the competitive mode then i think they missed the mark
Why are casual players so hurt that they can't compete?.. they are casual player!!!.. U can't expect to be casual and get all the perks . Its the way the world works.
I'm a casual and I'm not hurt about the fact that I can't compete. In fact, I DON'T want to compete. I'm not expecting to get all the perks and I'm not disillusioned to how the world works either. Why can't some people just understand the fact that others may not enjoy the competitive aspect of video games.
This guy acts like we're gunning for gc rewards and crying cuz we can't make it. That's not the case, at least it isn't for me. I just want vt to have fair matchmaking and a system that doesn't punish losing as harshly as it is currently. That just takes the fun out of the game making it a toxic environment.
The objectives reward you for playing 3 matches in total regardless of whether you win or lose. That's great, but after u complete it, you only stand to lose time and resources if you lose a match. All the time/effort/energy/tokens u spend will be meaningless until you manage ~2 or 3 wins in a row. Should my efforts not be vindicated cuz I'm playing casually/for leisure? Or am I only supposed to play 3 bg matches in 2 days cuz I'm a casual and don't want to sweat my ass off trying to win every game?
I'm going to collect a lot of comments from various other conversations we've had in the forums over the last little while to address a lot of this thread, so forgive me if you've heard this before.
"If you die to a boss in any fight, you can say “ well i took iff “x”% of his health let me buy a revive and continue... In bg, if you die, you can’t continue for where you were at so you a set back... No other part of this game has this effect." We have chatted in past about how Battlegrounds is the first true competitive PVP mode in MCOC. Previously, every challenge could/would end in success, with enough time, energy and resources. Naturally, this means BGs is going to be a departure for players and is bound to cause some discomfort. Every single matchup between two players means 50% of that matchup is receiving a loss; this is inevitable.
"Can you can really blame ppl for hacking it when kabam can make it fair and enjoyable from the start." Yes. Yes we can blame people for hacking. In no way does frustration justify cheating. The game mode is fair insofar as everyone is dealing with the same system, and trying to circumnavigate that system out of frustration, or any other motivation, is not tolerated.
Why not create a casual mode, too? A casual would not operate in the fashion laid out in this thread. We are not looking to give the same rewards for less work. We understand that the lens many Summoners view the game through is one of: "Where can I get the best rewards; that's where I'm going to dedicate my time." But simply putting time into BGs does not result in rewards, as previously mentioned; the PVP nature of the mode requires you to overcome other Summoners. We have largely found the highest rewards from this game mode are going to the players who are putting in the most time.
Are you suggesting that nothing about Battlegrounds needs to change? Not at all. And we've talked about it repeatedly on the forums. Changes are coming to Battlegrounds structure and matchmaking, some that may have been suggested in this thread... It won't happen all at once and needs to be changed over time to avoid too many moving parts, but the team is constantly evaluating the game mode and are looking for opportunities to make improvements; they have some good ideas.
We have chatted a lot, and seen a lot of conversations, about how this game is growing to a point where you cannot reasonably expect to do everything in a given month. We have seen the growing pains for Summoners who don't want to prioritize or make choices about what to play and what to let slip. MCOC is growing to a point where you should play the game modes you enjoy most. There's something for everyone, even if you're not looking for a competitive mode.
I would like to add something to this.. I would dare anyone to give an example of ANY competitive mode, professional sport or anything at all... Where losing a match just slows u down instead of punishing u... The idea of losses not taking coins allows for brute force... Who cares if i lose.. i just gotta win 3 later... Does it matter if i lose 20 rounds in a row?.. winning 1 out of 10 will keep me climbing.. and that is not competition!
Comments
I just became cav
I have only 1 R2 6* and 14 6*
But battleground gives me thronebreaker
players only
I was impossible to play with them
Now a days this game is for only top up
players
Others didn't get the thing for which they worked
I would never cheat.
The mode needs change, for sure, if they want less sweaty players to keep playing.
Maybe have two tiers with different reward structure and each season/cycle players could choose which tier they want to compete in? Paragons would be forced into the harder tier?
This is deliberately out of context and you know it. I said dont mod but i cant cant blame them for what they do when kabam cant fix their game.
And that comment was made about bg, 6.4.6 wad not even mentioned in that post.
Obviously you diagree which is fine, but argue the points, don’t misquote me or quote w/o context because you disagree but cant make a reasonable argument. It sad.
And that comment was made about bg, 6.4.6 wad not even mentioned in that post.
Obviously you diagree which is fine, but argue the points, don’t misquote me or quote w/o context because you disagree but cant make a reasonable argument. It sad.
Your whole post is all about getting the rewards that you want in a easier matter..
Its a 100% about rewards and not about the game mode and its experience... Otherwise why would you say "i understand why modders mod"... Modders mod for rewards not to have the satisfaction of a win
I have a good account, 1 6*r5, 16 6*r4, 6*r3 for the rest, the whale accounts are so far from me, accounts from TCN, GT40, 4Loki, NY718, JA, etc. many times I defeated them and I have enjoyed it when that happens.
Every season my rank have been Celestial VI, hard? yes, impossible? no.
Maybe, many people think that their skills are better than what they really are.
Your whole post is all about getting the rewards that you want in a easier matter..
Its a 100% about rewards and not about the game mode and its experience... Otherwise why would you say "i understand why modders mod"... Modders mod for rewards not to have the satisfaction of a win
Ok, this is misunderstanding of my position, which i am happy to clarify.
Its not about the rewards, its about the design flaws which lead to multiple feel bad moments back to back to back. This things dont exist in other parts of the game.
Yes, i do breifly mention rewards but only as what would motivate most casual players to play and why they “may” feel bad. This is why i dont get into specifics. The rewards are only relevant from a motivation standpoint, not a specific one.
The modders comment was made from the idea that they have the power i and the most of us dont have, to circumvent those bad design choices by modding. Obviously, dont cheat. But I personally am not raising a pick fork over modders that only really affect the top what 1 or 2 % when the bottom 30 of 50 dont enjoy the mode and are only playing because the feel obligated to in order to keep up with everyone else?
At the lowest ranks, you simply cannot lose any tokens. Just play until you win enough total matches to progress. Eventually you get to a spot where you can lose tokens. If you progress through all the ranks, you reach Legend (basically GC). The coolest part about Legend though is it isn't actually entirely separate from the other part. It immediately converts your rank to a Rating that its been keeping track of the entire time. After you reach Legend your matchups are then rating dependent. This helps continue to keep matches fair for the entire season even if a typical legend is too much for you to compete with. Furthermore, a really helpful part about progressing is that you get extra tokens if you can string wins together. This causes the people who are winning 90% of their matches to get sprung to the top a lot faster than those winning 60%. There's no free ride to the top but the mode can recognize that maybe you aren't being challenged enough and try to address that as quickly as possible.
I have completed the teirs the last few times but dont think i will this time, its not fun to me and that where this comes from
Its a 100% about rewards and not about the game mode and its experience... Otherwise why would you say "i understand why modders mod"... Modders mod for rewards not to have the satisfaction of a win
Ok, this is misunderstanding of my position, which i am happy to clarify.
Its not about the rewards, its about the design flaws which lead to multiple feel bad moments back to back to back. This things dont exist in other parts of the game.
Yes, i do breifly mention rewards but only as what would motivate most casual players to play and why they “may” feel bad. This is why i dont get into specifics. The rewards are only relevant from a motivation standpoint, not a specific one.
The modders comment was made from the idea that they have the power i and the most of us dont have, to circumvent those bad design choices by modding. Obviously, dont cheat. But I personally am not raising a pick fork over modders that only really affect the top what 1 or 2 % when the bottom 30 of 50 dont enjoy the mode and are only playing because the feel obligated to in order to keep up with everyone else?
I casually play golf... 2x a month ... Should i be complaining about the structure of the PGA tour cause my casual playing doesnt allow me to compete in it?
I, for one, enjoy battlegrounds. It is a fun gamemode and I'm glad I finally have a use for my wide roster, but something you have to understand is Victory Track isn't the competitive gamemode. The true competition starts in GC and it SUCKED to get through this VT with such a vanilla nuke meta that punished making any mistakes at all.
In my opinion, Victory track should be a more casual and fun experience and keep gladiator circuit as the cutthroat competitive mode to play in. DNA3000 already has stated great ideas to make Victory Track more forgiving and more fun to play in.
I don't enjoy AQ.. feels like a 5 day chore.. so i picked an alliance with minimal participation on it...and i made my peace with it and play the game knowing i won't maximize my mats to rank up...
But what's the real problem with BGs?.. before bgs a player would be able to open 2 maybe 3 6* crystals per month, with BGs u can do 9-10... and that's the reason why people who don't enjoy it are forcing themselves... It's the 5th season with the same VT structure.. and this month had the most complaints.. could it be cause the accounts of non casual players are getting way bigger?
Why are casual players so hurt that they can't compete?.. they are casual player!!!.. U can't expect to be casual and get all the perks . Its the way the world works.
I'm going to collect a lot of comments from various other conversations we've had in the forums over the last little while to address a lot of this thread, so forgive me if you've heard this before.
"If you die to a boss in any fight, you can say “ well i took iff “x”% of his health let me buy a revive and continue...
In bg, if you die, you can’t continue for where you were at so you a set back...
No other part of this game has this effect."
We have chatted in past about how Battlegrounds is the first true competitive PVP mode in MCOC. Previously, every challenge could/would end in success, with enough time, energy and resources. Naturally, this means BGs is going to be a departure for players and is bound to cause some discomfort. Every single matchup between two players means 50% of that matchup is receiving a loss; this is inevitable.
"Can you can really blame ppl for hacking it when kabam can make it fair and enjoyable from the start."
Yes. Yes we can blame people for hacking. In no way does frustration justify cheating. The game mode is fair insofar as everyone is dealing with the same system, and trying to circumnavigate that system out of frustration, or any other motivation, is not tolerated.
Why not create a casual mode, too?
A casual would not operate in the fashion laid out in this thread. We are not looking to give the same rewards for less work. We understand that the lens many Summoners view the game through is one of: "Where can I get the best rewards; that's where I'm going to dedicate my time." But simply putting time into BGs does not result in rewards, as previously mentioned; the PVP nature of the mode requires you to overcome other Summoners. We have largely found the highest rewards from this game mode are going to the players who are putting in the most time.
Are you suggesting that nothing about Battlegrounds needs to change?
Not at all. And we've talked about it repeatedly on the forums. Changes are coming to Battlegrounds structure and matchmaking, some that may have been suggested in this thread...
It won't happen all at once and needs to be changed over time to avoid too many moving parts, but the team is constantly evaluating the game mode and are looking for opportunities to make improvements; they have some good ideas.
We have chatted a lot, and seen a lot of conversations, about how this game is growing to a point where you cannot reasonably expect to do everything in a given month. We have seen the growing pains for Summoners who don't want to prioritize or make choices about what to play and what to let slip. MCOC is growing to a point where you should play the game modes you enjoy most. There's something for everyone, even if you're not looking for a competitive mode.
I casually play golf... 2x a month ... Should i be complaining about the structure of the PGA tour cause my casual playing doesnt allow me to compete in it?
No of-coarse not, but thats no a fair comparison.
The pga is a closed invitation only event,
Bg is open to everyone and encourages everyone to play.
The fair comparison is your local muni puts on a father son events and says everyone pays after based on your placement. Then tiger woods and a bunch of pros show up.
So your choice is now dont play and miss out, (cause playing with pros would be cool)
Or play and dont miss out but get your but kicked and pay an unknown amount more.
Many ppl feel obligated to play to get some rewards to keep up.
Dude! You're so right!
I would dare anyone to give an example of ANY competitive mode, professional sport or anything at all... Where losing a match just slows u down instead of punishing u...
The idea of losses not taking coins allows for brute force... Who cares if i lose.. i just gotta win 3 later... Does it matter if i lose 20 rounds in a row?.. winning 1 out of 10 will keep me climbing.. and that is not competition!
I would dare anyone to give an example of ANY competitive mode, professional sport or anything at all... Where losing a match just slows u down instead of punishing u...
The idea of losses not taking coins allows for brute force... Who cares if i lose.. i just gotta win 3 later... Does it matter if i lose 20 rounds in a row?.. winning 1 out of 10 will keep me climbing.. and that is not competition!
Think this get to the heart of it, and why we have different opinions
What part is the competitive mode and what part is the trail or just for the fun section?
My interpretation is that the VT is the fun section and GT is the competitive mode.
Your seem to believe the whole thing is the competitive mode.
If the intent was really that all of BG was only for what the top 30% most motivated players,
And the other 70% should stay out,
Then i retract my criticisms, how ever if the vt is supposed to be the trial and GC is the competitive mode then i think they missed the mark
Paragon level player with legend title
Look me up
This guy acts like we're gunning for gc rewards and crying cuz we can't make it. That's not the case, at least it isn't for me. I just want vt to have fair matchmaking and a system that doesn't punish losing as harshly as it is currently. That just takes the fun out of the game making it a toxic environment.
The objectives reward you for playing 3 matches in total regardless of whether you win or lose. That's great, but after u complete it, you only stand to lose time and resources if you lose a match. All the time/effort/energy/tokens u spend will be meaningless until you manage ~2 or 3 wins in a row. Should my efforts not be vindicated cuz I'm playing casually/for leisure? Or am I only supposed to play 3 bg matches in 2 days cuz I'm a casual and don't want to sweat my ass off trying to win every game?