The Viv situtation.....

AverageDesi · March 2023

GroundedWisdom said:
Free speech is not a concept that applies to a public forum such as this. We have the freedom to share whatever we like, relating to the game, provided it falls in line with the rules here.
It's not a total freedom, which I'm grateful for. I'd hate to see this place turn into Twitter lately. Lol.

It's bad as it is

ItsyaboyStephy05 · March 2023

I'd say it's a glitch/placeholder till she actually gets released. One value being tremendously awful, I'd maybe buy, but all of em? Still'd be nice if @Kabam Miike or @Kabam Zibiit could shed some light on this.

pseudosane · March 2023

legalaction said:

GinjabredMonsta said:

Graves_3 said:

GinjabredMonsta said:
She ain’t event out yet for everyone to use.
I think OP made it clear that they will wait till she is released before fully judging her.
Yup read that, also read from someone in this thread she is too shelf and overrated already,

Emilia90 said:

legalaction said:
I heard on YouTube she was top shelf

I knew she was overrated
She isn’t even out yet. People in this community are always so quick to lean one way or another
Y'all are entitled to your own opinion just as I am to mine.

Get outta here with your hate on free speech.

lmao when i read this nonsense i really laughed out loud.
Stop hating on our free speech to hate your opinion.

Demonzfyre · March 2023

ItsyaboyStephy05 said:
I'd say it's a glitch/placeholder till she actually gets released. One value being tremendously awful, I'd maybe buy, but all of em? Still'd be nice if @Kabam Miike or @Kabam Zibiit could shed some light on this.

Why would she be the only champ they do that for? Why wouldn't kate Bishop be the same?

AverageDesi · March 2023

Demonzfyre said:

ItsyaboyStephy05 said:
I'd say it's a glitch/placeholder till she actually gets released. One value being tremendously awful, I'd maybe buy, but all of em? Still'd be nice if @Kabam Miike or @Kabam Zibiit could shed some light on this.
Why would she be the only champ they do that for? Why wouldn't kate Bishop be the same?

Wong was changed/glitched etc.

Demonzfyre · March 2023

AverageDesi said:

Demonzfyre said:

ItsyaboyStephy05 said:
I'd say it's a glitch/placeholder till she actually gets released. One value being tremendously awful, I'd maybe buy, but all of em? Still'd be nice if @Kabam Miike or @Kabam Zibiit could shed some light on this.
Why would she be the only champ they do that for? Why wouldn't kate Bishop be the same?
Wong was changed/glitched etc.

Sure, but it wasn't a "placeholder" for his real stats. A glitch I can understand but a placeholder, no.

Colinwhitworth69 · March 2023

Maxwell2454 said:
Viv has a whopping 10% block proficiency officially being the worst in the game by miles with modok in 2nd with 28% and Viv also has the 10th lowest health pool in the game! And as a cherry on top 4.5 crit rate.. basically she has the worst stats in the game and I get that it was kabams way of balancing her with her phasing and all, but that phase can easily be countered by ability accuracy reduction and other miss counters and one mistake and your gonna be dead due to her low health pool and the fact that you can't really block with her or else your dead could make her either a very high skill champ or just flat out unplayable, I'm gonna wait till she's fully out to completely judge her but still this is very worrying for what otherwise seems like an great addition to the game.

The designers have goals in mind for champs. Some are nukes, some are defenders, some are support champs, some are utility gods, some are hard counters for other champs.

When she is released, we'll find out.

But keep in mind that when Corvus and Proxima were released, everyone thought Corvus was useless and that Proxima was going to be the next big thing.

Magrailothos · March 2023

Maxwell2454 said:
Viv has a whopping 10% block proficiency officially being the worst in the game by miles with modok in 2nd with 28% and Viv also has the 10th lowest health pool in the game! And as a cherry on top 4.5 crit rate.. basically she has the worst stats in the game and I get that it was kabams way of balancing her with her phasing and all, but that phase can easily be countered by ability accuracy reduction and other miss counters and one mistake and your gonna be dead due to her low health pool and the fact that you can't really block with her or else your dead could make her either a very high skill champ or just flat out unplayable, I'm gonna wait till she's fully out to completely judge her but still this is very worrying for what otherwise seems like an great addition to the game.

The numbers don't look brilliant, but they're there to provide risk and balance to her Playstyle.

Quake could have the lowest block proficiency in the game and it wouldn't matter: she doesn't need to block.

Viv is designed to do the same: Don't block at all: Phase and counter. High skill/high reward.

Ability Accuracy can shut it down? The phase has a base chance to trigger of 125%, making it safe against folk like Domino. And if they're better at reducing Ability accuracy than that: just don't use Viv for that fight.

And the Miss counters? Again: why on Earth would you take her into a fight against someone who countered Miss?

Let's compare her to Quake again: she's built around her Evasion ability when the opponent is concussed.
Would you try and use Quake to fight Mole Man, Night Thrasher, Iron Man IW or Stryfe? Their medium attacks can't be Evaded. Personally, I'd just pick a different fight. Maybe use Viv...

AverageDesi · March 2023

Demonzfyre said:

AverageDesi said:

Demonzfyre said:

ItsyaboyStephy05 said:
I'd say it's a glitch/placeholder till she actually gets released. One value being tremendously awful, I'd maybe buy, but all of em? Still'd be nice if @Kabam Miike or @Kabam Zibiit could shed some light on this.
Why would she be the only champ they do that for? Why wouldn't kate Bishop be the same?
Wong was changed/glitched etc.
Sure, but it wasn't a "placeholder" for his real stats. A glitch I can understand but a placeholder, no.

It might have had a placeholder at some point. Maybe they forgot to swap it. It's not outside the realm of possibility.

Kabam Miike · March 2023

Hey all,

Viv's stats are not placeholder, and they are not a bug, but before you make up your mind on her, you should really see her in action! That might change your mind, or it might not, but at least you'll be basing your opinion off of the whole picture!

As a general rule, if a stat is low, you probably won't be using it much.

From our designer: "Viv can avoid all damage from Blocks, and can effectively Parry in almost any situation. She's also immune to Bleed and Poison, so her low HP is pretty well protected by her Armor, which can get pretty high when she has 15 stacks of it! I can't remember off the top of my head, but I think her armor rating as a 6r5 is like ~2800."

CCP videos will be out soon, and if early reviews are any indication, I think she will have her fans!

Kabam Miike · March 2023

Magrailothos said:

Maxwell2454 said:
Viv has a whopping 10% block proficiency officially being the worst in the game by miles with modok in 2nd with 28% and Viv also has the 10th lowest health pool in the game! And as a cherry on top 4.5 crit rate.. basically she has the worst stats in the game and I get that it was kabams way of balancing her with her phasing and all, but that phase can easily be countered by ability accuracy reduction and other miss counters and one mistake and your gonna be dead due to her low health pool and the fact that you can't really block with her or else your dead could make her either a very high skill champ or just flat out unplayable, I'm gonna wait till she's fully out to completely judge her but still this is very worrying for what otherwise seems like an great addition to the game.
The numbers don't look brilliant, but they're there to provide risk and balance to her Playstyle.

Quake could have the lowest block proficiency in the game and it wouldn't matter: she doesn't need to block.

Viv is designed to do the same: Don't block at all: Phase and counter. High skill/high reward.

Ability Accuracy can shut it down? The phase has a base chance to trigger of 125%, making it safe against folk like Domino. And if they're better at reducing Ability accuracy than that: just don't use Viv for that fight.

And the Miss counters? Again: why on Earth would you take her into a fight against someone who countered Miss?

Let's compare her to Quake again: she's built around her Evasion ability when the opponent is concussed.
Would you try and use Quake to fight Mole Man, Night Thrasher, Iron Man IW or Stryfe? Their medium attacks can't be Evaded. Personally, I'd just pick a different fight. Maybe use Viv...

I don't usually quote and do the "This!" thing, but... THIS! Viv is not going to a Champ without Counters, but that's a good thing! She'll shine in some places, and not as much in others. You don't bring a knife to a gunfight, you don't bring a Mystic to a Torch fight, and you don't bring Viv to a True Strike fight.

Mauled · March 2023

Kabam Miike said:

Magrailothos said:

Maxwell2454 said:
Viv has a whopping 10% block proficiency officially being the worst in the game by miles with modok in 2nd with 28% and Viv also has the 10th lowest health pool in the game! And as a cherry on top 4.5 crit rate.. basically she has the worst stats in the game and I get that it was kabams way of balancing her with her phasing and all, but that phase can easily be countered by ability accuracy reduction and other miss counters and one mistake and your gonna be dead due to her low health pool and the fact that you can't really block with her or else your dead could make her either a very high skill champ or just flat out unplayable, I'm gonna wait till she's fully out to completely judge her but still this is very worrying for what otherwise seems like an great addition to the game.
The numbers don't look brilliant, but they're there to provide risk and balance to her Playstyle.

Quake could have the lowest block proficiency in the game and it wouldn't matter: she doesn't need to block.

Viv is designed to do the same: Don't block at all: Phase and counter. High skill/high reward.

Ability Accuracy can shut it down? The phase has a base chance to trigger of 125%, making it safe against folk like Domino. And if they're better at reducing Ability accuracy than that: just don't use Viv for that fight.

And the Miss counters? Again: why on Earth would you take her into a fight against someone who countered Miss?

Let's compare her to Quake again: she's built around her Evasion ability when the opponent is concussed.
Would you try and use Quake to fight Mole Man, Night Thrasher, Iron Man IW or Stryfe? Their medium attacks can't be Evaded. Personally, I'd just pick a different fight. Maybe use Viv...
I don't usually quote and do the "This!" thing, but... THIS! Viv is not going to a Champ without Counters, but that's a good thing! She'll shine in some places, and not as much in others. You don't bring a knife to a gunfight, you don't bring a Mystic to a Torch fight, and you don't bring Viv to a True Strike fight.

I’ll be honest, I’ve not followed this thread at all, seems premature to write something off this early.

The most important thing however is that bringing a mystic to a torch fight may be a new saying for daily usage.

Ackbar67 · March 2023

Kabam Miike said:
you don't bring a Mystic to a Torch fight

Unrelated to the thread, but my favorite example of this will forever be when there was the collaboration with that youtube show, I think it was about wrestling? Anyway, they were trying to beat the quest they helped designed and one of them brought doom into their torch fight and it went exactly how you'd expect

AverageDesi · March 2023

Ackbar67 said:

Kabam Miike said:
you don't bring a Mystic to a Torch fight
Unrelated to the thread, but my favorite example of this will forever be when there was the collaboration with that youtube show, I think it was about wrestling? Anyway, they were trying to beat the quest they helped designed and one of them brought doom into their torch fight and it went exactly how you'd expect

Yeah I remember that.

Chikel · March 2023

Kabam Miike said:
Hey all,

Viv's stats are not placeholder, and they are not a bug, but before you make up your mind on her, you should really see her in action! That might change your mind, or it might not, but at least you'll be basing your opinion off of the whole picture!

As a general rule, if a stat is low, you probably won't be using it much.

From our designer: "Viv can avoid all damage from Blocks, and can effectively Parry in almost any situation. She's also immune to Bleed and Poison, so her low HP is pretty well protected by her Armor, which can get pretty high when she has 15 stacks of it! I can't remember off the top of my head, but I think her armor rating as a 6r5 is like ~2800."

CCP videos will be out soon, and if early reviews are any indication, I think she will have her fans!

I really hope so because the one thing about this game? It forces you to play champs in unconventional ways.

There's lots of nodes that force you to parry or block without parry. I imagine we'll see more in 8.2.

But I'm holding off on final conclusions till we get her.

Ortoun · March 2023

Kabam Miike said:

Magrailothos said:

Maxwell2454 said:
Viv has a whopping 10% block proficiency officially being the worst in the game by miles with modok in 2nd with 28% and Viv also has the 10th lowest health pool in the game! And as a cherry on top 4.5 crit rate.. basically she has the worst stats in the game and I get that it was kabams way of balancing her with her phasing and all, but that phase can easily be countered by ability accuracy reduction and other miss counters and one mistake and your gonna be dead due to her low health pool and the fact that you can't really block with her or else your dead could make her either a very high skill champ or just flat out unplayable, I'm gonna wait till she's fully out to completely judge her but still this is very worrying for what otherwise seems like an great addition to the game.
The numbers don't look brilliant, but they're there to provide risk and balance to her Playstyle.

Quake could have the lowest block proficiency in the game and it wouldn't matter: she doesn't need to block.

Viv is designed to do the same: Don't block at all: Phase and counter. High skill/high reward.

Ability Accuracy can shut it down? The phase has a base chance to trigger of 125%, making it safe against folk like Domino. And if they're better at reducing Ability accuracy than that: just don't use Viv for that fight.

And the Miss counters? Again: why on Earth would you take her into a fight against someone who countered Miss?

Let's compare her to Quake again: she's built around her Evasion ability when the opponent is concussed.
Would you try and use Quake to fight Mole Man, Night Thrasher, Iron Man IW or Stryfe? Their medium attacks can't be Evaded. Personally, I'd just pick a different fight. Maybe use Viv...
I don't usually quote and do the "This!" thing, but... THIS! Viv is not going to a Champ without Counters, but that's a good thing! She'll shine in some places, and not as much in others. You don't bring a knife to a gunfight, you don't bring a Mystic to a Torch fight, and you don't bring Viv to a True Strike fight.

Absorbing man in magma form actually is a fairly decent torch counter, but yeah, as a general rule...

Beewee · March 2023

Kabam Miike said:

Magrailothos said:

Maxwell2454 said:
Viv has a whopping 10% block proficiency officially being the worst in the game by miles with modok in 2nd with 28% and Viv also has the 10th lowest health pool in the game! And as a cherry on top 4.5 crit rate.. basically she has the worst stats in the game and I get that it was kabams way of balancing her with her phasing and all, but that phase can easily be countered by ability accuracy reduction and other miss counters and one mistake and your gonna be dead due to her low health pool and the fact that you can't really block with her or else your dead could make her either a very high skill champ or just flat out unplayable, I'm gonna wait till she's fully out to completely judge her but still this is very worrying for what otherwise seems like an great addition to the game.
The numbers don't look brilliant, but they're there to provide risk and balance to her Playstyle.

Quake could have the lowest block proficiency in the game and it wouldn't matter: she doesn't need to block.

Viv is designed to do the same: Don't block at all: Phase and counter. High skill/high reward.

Ability Accuracy can shut it down? The phase has a base chance to trigger of 125%, making it safe against folk like Domino. And if they're better at reducing Ability accuracy than that: just don't use Viv for that fight.

And the Miss counters? Again: why on Earth would you take her into a fight against someone who countered Miss?

Let's compare her to Quake again: she's built around her Evasion ability when the opponent is concussed.
Would you try and use Quake to fight Mole Man, Night Thrasher, Iron Man IW or Stryfe? Their medium attacks can't be Evaded. Personally, I'd just pick a different fight. Maybe use Viv...
I don't usually quote and do the "This!" thing, but... THIS! Viv is not going to a Champ without Counters, but that's a good thing! She'll shine in some places, and not as much in others. You don't bring a knife to a gunfight, you don't bring a Mystic to a Torch fight, and you don't bring Viv to a True Strike fight.

True Strike? I didnt know viv could evade. I thought she phased

Kappa2g · March 2023

True strike also ignores armor, so I assume he meant that her 16 armor ups won't help her in that case

GinjabredMonsta · March 2023

Beewee said:

Kabam Miike said:

Magrailothos said:

Maxwell2454 said:
Viv has a whopping 10% block proficiency officially being the worst in the game by miles with modok in 2nd with 28% and Viv also has the 10th lowest health pool in the game! And as a cherry on top 4.5 crit rate.. basically she has the worst stats in the game and I get that it was kabams way of balancing her with her phasing and all, but that phase can easily be countered by ability accuracy reduction and other miss counters and one mistake and your gonna be dead due to her low health pool and the fact that you can't really block with her or else your dead could make her either a very high skill champ or just flat out unplayable, I'm gonna wait till she's fully out to completely judge her but still this is very worrying for what otherwise seems like an great addition to the game.
The numbers don't look brilliant, but they're there to provide risk and balance to her Playstyle.

Quake could have the lowest block proficiency in the game and it wouldn't matter: she doesn't need to block.

Viv is designed to do the same: Don't block at all: Phase and counter. High skill/high reward.

Ability Accuracy can shut it down? The phase has a base chance to trigger of 125%, making it safe against folk like Domino. And if they're better at reducing Ability accuracy than that: just don't use Viv for that fight.

And the Miss counters? Again: why on Earth would you take her into a fight against someone who countered Miss?

Let's compare her to Quake again: she's built around her Evasion ability when the opponent is concussed.
Would you try and use Quake to fight Mole Man, Night Thrasher, Iron Man IW or Stryfe? Their medium attacks can't be Evaded. Personally, I'd just pick a different fight. Maybe use Viv...
I don't usually quote and do the "This!" thing, but... THIS! Viv is not going to a Champ without Counters, but that's a good thing! She'll shine in some places, and not as much in others. You don't bring a knife to a gunfight, you don't bring a Mystic to a Torch fight, and you don't bring Viv to a True Strike fight.
True Strike? I didnt know viv could evade. I thought she phased

She evades with a synergy

AMS94 · March 2023

Kabam Miike said:

Magrailothos said:

Maxwell2454 said:
Viv has a whopping 10% block proficiency officially being the worst in the game by miles with modok in 2nd with 28% and Viv also has the 10th lowest health pool in the game! And as a cherry on top 4.5 crit rate.. basically she has the worst stats in the game and I get that it was kabams way of balancing her with her phasing and all, but that phase can easily be countered by ability accuracy reduction and other miss counters and one mistake and your gonna be dead due to her low health pool and the fact that you can't really block with her or else your dead could make her either a very high skill champ or just flat out unplayable, I'm gonna wait till she's fully out to completely judge her but still this is very worrying for what otherwise seems like an great addition to the game.
The numbers don't look brilliant, but they're there to provide risk and balance to her Playstyle.

Quake could have the lowest block proficiency in the game and it wouldn't matter: she doesn't need to block.

Viv is designed to do the same: Don't block at all: Phase and counter. High skill/high reward.

Ability Accuracy can shut it down? The phase has a base chance to trigger of 125%, making it safe against folk like Domino. And if they're better at reducing Ability accuracy than that: just don't use Viv for that fight.

And the Miss counters? Again: why on Earth would you take her into a fight against someone who countered Miss?

Let's compare her to Quake again: she's built around her Evasion ability when the opponent is concussed.
Would you try and use Quake to fight Mole Man, Night Thrasher, Iron Man IW or Stryfe? Their medium attacks can't be Evaded. Personally, I'd just pick a different fight. Maybe use Viv...
I don't usually quote and do the "This!" thing, but... THIS! Viv is not going to a Champ without Counters, but that's a good thing! She'll shine in some places, and not as much in others. You don't bring a knife to a gunfight, you don't bring a Mystic to a Torch fight, and you don't bring Viv to a True Strike fight.

U don't bring Viv to fights where the defender has
- true strike
- projectile special attacks that aren't easy to dex & last longer than a second
- ability to bypass miss
- high energy resistance
- incinerate immunity, except mutants
- power drain immunity....can be overlooked but not the optimum matchup
- chance to evade
- a big enough healthpool that doesn't go down in 1 damage rotation unless u want to unnecessarily prolong the fight

Also in fights where u can use her, u need to make sure that ur parry game is on point bcoz u won't phase if u miss a parry.....definitely a great part of her kit, specially with the game running so smoothly for last couple of years

AmaadAkira · March 2023

Kabam Miike said:
Hey all,

Viv's stats are not placeholder, and they are not a bug, but before you make up your mind on her, you should really see her in action! That might change your mind, or it might not, but at least you'll be basing your opinion off of the whole picture!

As a general rule, if a stat is low, you probably won't be using it much.

From our designer: "Viv can avoid all damage from Blocks, and can effectively Parry in almost any situation. She's also immune to Bleed and Poison, so her low HP is pretty well protected by her Armor, which can get pretty high when she has 15 stacks of it! I can't remember off the top of my head, but I think her armor rating as a 6r5 is like ~2800."

CCP videos will be out soon, and if early reviews are any indication, I think she will have her fans!

What about against champions with specials that are difficult to dex? It'll be like getting hit in the face constantly. So add that to the list of fights you cannot bring her against I suppose.

Ercarret · March 2023

I strongly suspect that there is a reason for why her stats are the way they are. Kabam wants to make good champions that people are excited to hunt for, and they wouldn't just dump her stats into the abyss for no good reason. Her low block proficiency probably just means that she won't ever have to block if played right. Her low health probably means that you won't ever get hit (even in the block) if played right.

Let's take a step back and have her come out before we jump to any needless conclusions.

Cassy · March 2023

So Like "does it take Glock Mags"

"Yeah, but can Mags shut her down"?

Deacon · March 2023

Kabam Miike said:
Hey all,

Viv's stats are not placeholder, and they are not a bug, but before you make up your mind on her, you should really see her in action! That might change your mind, or it might not, but at least you'll be basing your opinion off of the whole picture!

As a general rule, if a stat is low, you probably won't be using it much.

From our designer: "Viv can avoid all damage from Blocks, and can effectively Parry in almost any situation. She's also immune to Bleed and Poison, so her low HP is pretty well protected by her Armor, which can get pretty high when she has 15 stacks of it! I can't remember off the top of my head, but I think her armor rating as a 6r5 is like ~2800."

CCP videos will be out soon, and if early reviews are any indication, I think she will have her fans!

Figured I'd try ... mind gifting me one to try??

#porfavor

ege999men · March 2023

Another thing is that 5* doesn't seem to have the pre fight synergy. is that a bug at least?

Shadowstrike · March 2023

Ercarret said:
I strongly suspect that there is a reason for why her stats are the way they are. Kabam wants to make good champions that people are excited to hunt for, and they wouldn't just dump her stats into the abyss for no good reason. Her low block proficiency probably just means that she won't ever have to block if played right. Her low health probably means that you won't ever get hit (even in the block) if played right.

Let's take a step back and have her come out before we jump to any needless conclusions.

People always compare stats without thinking of the playstyle and assume it's supposed to be the same as Doom or something and we need to break that habit.

altavista · March 2023

I never pay attention to stats on champion spotlights. I never knew that Modok had among the lowest block proficiency. This never affected my use of the champions.

Mobile_P0tat0 · March 2023

Could this be the new "Apoc is a dud" thread?

Pin_the_AvengerPGT17 · March 2023

I'd definitely say her stats suck, but I have some confidence because of the stats of one specifica champ that is really good. that champ I'm referring to is Wiccan as he has low health pool, and I'm sure there are some other stats that're lackluster.

DON'T JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER!!!

The Viv situtation.....

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