In no competition, does one’s rank reset every season.

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Comments

  • StatureStature Member Posts: 469 ★★★

    Stature said:

    Stature said:

    Stature said:

    TyEdge said:

    NearJr said:

    In the NBA, when the season starts, everyone has the exact same chance to get into the playoffs. The reigning champs do not get a free playoff spot. You earn what you get.

    Do high school teams get put in the NBA at the start of each season?
    Here's the thing, you cannot compare 2 different levels that are competing for different prizes.
    Does a cavalier have different prizes than a paragon in BG? No.

    So when the progression/rank resets at the START of every season, it is to give everyone the same footing. Competitions usually start with teams at zero points. F1?? EPL?? FIFA?? NBA?? BG??
    It’s amazing how much wrong you crammed into one post. 1) they’re literally not competing for the same prizes. I know that because I can look at the store on my paragon, TB and Cav accounts and see that I get vastly different purchasing options with my trophies.

    The EPL? Yeah, the table starts at zero each year, but how’d those teams get there? Well, 17 (or whatever number) played well enough last season to earn a spot. 3 didn’t, and they got replaced by others from a different league who achieved at top of their competition.

    And none of this can be compared to American sports. American sports leagues exist as a closed system with no relegation or promotion. The goal of each team is a championship. The goal of each ownership group is usually profit. The goal of the league is to maximize profit while maintaining a semblance of competitive equity. That’s why the worst teams get the best draft picks. Hey…maybe Kabam can give all the uncollected players a 6r4 Galan to level the playing field!
    This awful argument has been debunked many times. Your store is tailored to progress you the same amount as higher players and everyone earns the same rewards.
    The store is the only place you can get the rewards - the trophies are meaningless without the store. If store prices (and items) are different for different progression levels, then the rewards are different. There is nothing to debunk here, these are just differing opinions based on what you consider as rewards.

    Just in your example. Either high school teams play in the NBA or not. But if they play in the NBA they get the same rewards that the top NBA teams get. If they play in a high school competition, they get the rewards of a high school competition. You don't ask high school teams to play against NBA teams and then give out NBA championship as the prize if the NBA team wins and high school championship if the high school team wins.

    If everyone plays everyone, then everyone should have access to the same store. That isn't a hard concept to understand.
    The prices don't have anything to do with the fact that everyone earns the same rewards.

    Not everyone plays everyone, so I don't get your last line.
    Everyone doesn't play everyone because everyone doesn't get the same rewards.

    Prices are what determine what rewards you get. You can't open crystals or rank up champions or do anything else in the game with trophies. You have to buy stuff with the trophies. Basketballs or shoes or gym memberships or any other thing that helps you get better at basketball, don't cost different based on if you play for a NBA team or a high school team.
    You don't have to buy stuff in the store before raising your title. Waiting for something to go on sale doesn't increase or decrease how much money you make.
    You're complaining about low progression players with weak rosters moving up in BG. Only way they can keep doing that is by not upgrading their rosters. Every season they spend doing so, they are giving up on most of the rewards in the other modes (EQ/SQ is progression gated, they are obviously not progressing in the story). So, its a trade-off.

    Then you expect them to not use the only source of rewards they have (trophies) and make a push for the highest available titles (top two specifically need champs to be ranked up). If you think they can beat GM and Act 7 with a team of 5r4s then they are extremely skilled at the game and I feel like they deserve all the rewards they can get.

    If you are complaining about UC or Cav player who already have a bunch of r3 and r4s - they are anyway getting matched with the best teams. Matching is roster based not title based. So those guys are playing the strongest players and still getting lesser rewards than you are.

    Logically, it doesn't make any sense to camp in lower titles with a weak team just to hoard BG trophies. Spending them at lower levels is sub-optimal.

    What are you upset about.
    You do realize that most people got Paragon w/o the benefits from BGs, right? It's not that hard to jump a title or two now. Hell, Seatin got TB in 2 months on a f2p account.

    Either way, everyone earns the same rewards. That is a fact. What they choose to spend them on and when to spent them is up to them.
    So what? Everyone who will make Paragon from now on will do so with benefits from BG. I'm sure people got Cavelier with hardly any 5 stars and reached UC with 3 stars or 4 stars. The game has moved on and will continue to do so. There is no compulsion for new players to trace the exact same path as someone who has played the game before did.

    You are hardly complaining that Seatin has an easy path to GC or doesn't deserve to be there. You are complaining about people you think are not as good as you or didn't have the same game experience as you did. They don't have a choice on what they spend because the game restricts what they get for their spends. So it isn't the same rewards.
  • Standardman1989Standardman1989 Member Posts: 555 ★★★
    Starting again at 0 for me it's logical I would like before a season starts or the first day a little dean to have stock because personally I don't put units in the deans just the shields when the end approaches and I can't get up
  • Ironman3000Ironman3000 Member Posts: 1,958 ★★★★★
    Stature said:

    Stature said:

    Stature said:

    Stature said:

    TyEdge said:

    NearJr said:

    In the NBA, when the season starts, everyone has the exact same chance to get into the playoffs. The reigning champs do not get a free playoff spot. You earn what you get.

    Do high school teams get put in the NBA at the start of each season?
    Here's the thing, you cannot compare 2 different levels that are competing for different prizes.
    Does a cavalier have different prizes than a paragon in BG? No.

    So when the progression/rank resets at the START of every season, it is to give everyone the same footing. Competitions usually start with teams at zero points. F1?? EPL?? FIFA?? NBA?? BG??
    It’s amazing how much wrong you crammed into one post. 1) they’re literally not competing for the same prizes. I know that because I can look at the store on my paragon, TB and Cav accounts and see that I get vastly different purchasing options with my trophies.

    The EPL? Yeah, the table starts at zero each year, but how’d those teams get there? Well, 17 (or whatever number) played well enough last season to earn a spot. 3 didn’t, and they got replaced by others from a different league who achieved at top of their competition.

    And none of this can be compared to American sports. American sports leagues exist as a closed system with no relegation or promotion. The goal of each team is a championship. The goal of each ownership group is usually profit. The goal of the league is to maximize profit while maintaining a semblance of competitive equity. That’s why the worst teams get the best draft picks. Hey…maybe Kabam can give all the uncollected players a 6r4 Galan to level the playing field!
    This awful argument has been debunked many times. Your store is tailored to progress you the same amount as higher players and everyone earns the same rewards.
    The store is the only place you can get the rewards - the trophies are meaningless without the store. If store prices (and items) are different for different progression levels, then the rewards are different. There is nothing to debunk here, these are just differing opinions based on what you consider as rewards.

    Just in your example. Either high school teams play in the NBA or not. But if they play in the NBA they get the same rewards that the top NBA teams get. If they play in a high school competition, they get the rewards of a high school competition. You don't ask high school teams to play against NBA teams and then give out NBA championship as the prize if the NBA team wins and high school championship if the high school team wins.

    If everyone plays everyone, then everyone should have access to the same store. That isn't a hard concept to understand.
    The prices don't have anything to do with the fact that everyone earns the same rewards.

    Not everyone plays everyone, so I don't get your last line.
    Everyone doesn't play everyone because everyone doesn't get the same rewards.

    Prices are what determine what rewards you get. You can't open crystals or rank up champions or do anything else in the game with trophies. You have to buy stuff with the trophies. Basketballs or shoes or gym memberships or any other thing that helps you get better at basketball, don't cost different based on if you play for a NBA team or a high school team.
    You don't have to buy stuff in the store before raising your title. Waiting for something to go on sale doesn't increase or decrease how much money you make.
    You're complaining about low progression players with weak rosters moving up in BG. Only way they can keep doing that is by not upgrading their rosters. Every season they spend doing so, they are giving up on most of the rewards in the other modes (EQ/SQ is progression gated, they are obviously not progressing in the story). So, its a trade-off.

    Then you expect them to not use the only source of rewards they have (trophies) and make a push for the highest available titles (top two specifically need champs to be ranked up). If you think they can beat GM and Act 7 with a team of 5r4s then they are extremely skilled at the game and I feel like they deserve all the rewards they can get.

    If you are complaining about UC or Cav player who already have a bunch of r3 and r4s - they are anyway getting matched with the best teams. Matching is roster based not title based. So those guys are playing the strongest players and still getting lesser rewards than you are.

    Logically, it doesn't make any sense to camp in lower titles with a weak team just to hoard BG trophies. Spending them at lower levels is sub-optimal.

    What are you upset about.
    You do realize that most people got Paragon w/o the benefits from BGs, right? It's not that hard to jump a title or two now. Hell, Seatin got TB in 2 months on a f2p account.

    Either way, everyone earns the same rewards. That is a fact. What they choose to spend them on and when to spent them is up to them.
    So what? Everyone who will make Paragon from now on will do so with benefits from BG. I'm sure people got Cavelier with hardly any 5 stars and reached UC with 3 stars or 4 stars. The game has moved on and will continue to do so. There is no compulsion for new players to trace the exact same path as someone who has played the game before did.

    You are hardly complaining that Seatin has an easy path to GC or doesn't deserve to be there. You are complaining about people you think are not as good as you or didn't have the same game experience as you did. They don't have a choice on what they spend because the game restricts what they get for their spends. So it isn't the same rewards.
    You can try to spin it in your mind all you want but it's an actual fact that the REWARDS are exactly the same for everyone. That is an indisputable fact.
  • o_oo_o Member Posts: 835 ★★★★
    the comma in the title of this thread hurts my eyes
  • SkyLord7000SkyLord7000 Member Posts: 4,000 ★★★★★
    edited March 2023
    o_o said:

    the comma in the title of this thread hurts my eyes

    It doesn’t bug, me two, much. Maybe you’re eyes can’t handle the perfectest grammar youv ever sean.
  • o_oo_o Member Posts: 835 ★★★★

    o_o said:

    the comma in the title of this thread hurts my eyes

    It doesn’t bug, me two, much. Maybe you’re eyes can’t handle the perfectest grammar youv ever sean.

  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,677 Guardian

    DNA3000 said:

    NearJr said:

    In the NBA, when the season starts, everyone has the exact same chance to get into the playoffs. The reigning champs do not get a free playoff spot. You earn what you get.

    Do high school teams get put in the NBA at the start of each season?
    I want to address this head on. Yes, they do, *if* they satisfy the qualifications for being an NBA team.

    The NBA is a closed sport, where competitors must mean the requirements of competition. If they do, they will compete against everyone equally. If they don't they are not allowed to compete at all.

    High school teams do not compete against NBA teams not because it is not fair, and not because we rank them identically. High school teams do not compete against the NBA because no high school team is in the NBA. High school teams do not compete against NBA teams for the same reason Injustice players do not compete against MCOC players in Battlegrounds.
    You totally missed the point.
    Actually, I'm pretty sure I didn't. I was simply refuting it, which is not the same thing as missing it.
  • This content has been removed.
  • SpaecSpaec Member Posts: 16

    Stature said:

    Stature said:

    Stature said:

    Stature said:

    TyEdge said:

    NearJr said:

    In the NBA, when the season starts, everyone has the exact same chance to get into the playoffs. The reigning champs do not get a free playoff spot. You earn what you get.

    Do high school teams get put in the NBA at the start of each season?
    Here's the thing, you cannot compare 2 different levels that are competing for different prizes.
    Does a cavalier have different prizes than a paragon in BG? No.

    So when the progression/rank resets at the START of every season, it is to give everyone the same footing. Competitions usually start with teams at zero points. F1?? EPL?? FIFA?? NBA?? BG??
    It’s amazing how much wrong you crammed into one post. 1) they’re literally not competing for the same prizes. I know that because I can look at the store on my paragon, TB and Cav accounts and see that I get vastly different purchasing options with my trophies.

    The EPL? Yeah, the table starts at zero each year, but how’d those teams get there? Well, 17 (or whatever number) played well enough last season to earn a spot. 3 didn’t, and they got replaced by others from a different league who achieved at top of their competition.

    And none of this can be compared to American sports. American sports leagues exist as a closed system with no relegation or promotion. The goal of each team is a championship. The goal of each ownership group is usually profit. The goal of the league is to maximize profit while maintaining a semblance of competitive equity. That’s why the worst teams get the best draft picks. Hey…maybe Kabam can give all the uncollected players a 6r4 Galan to level the playing field!
    This awful argument has been debunked many times. Your store is tailored to progress you the same amount as higher players and everyone earns the same rewards.
    The store is the only place you can get the rewards - the trophies are meaningless without the store. If store prices (and items) are different for different progression levels, then the rewards are different. There is nothing to debunk here, these are just differing opinions based on what you consider as rewards.

    Just in your example. Either high school teams play in the NBA or not. But if they play in the NBA they get the same rewards that the top NBA teams get. If they play in a high school competition, they get the rewards of a high school competition. You don't ask high school teams to play against NBA teams and then give out NBA championship as the prize if the NBA team wins and high school championship if the high school team wins.

    If everyone plays everyone, then everyone should have access to the same store. That isn't a hard concept to understand.
    The prices don't have anything to do with the fact that everyone earns the same rewards.

    Not everyone plays everyone, so I don't get your last line.
    Everyone doesn't play everyone because everyone doesn't get the same rewards.

    Prices are what determine what rewards you get. You can't open crystals or rank up champions or do anything else in the game with trophies. You have to buy stuff with the trophies. Basketballs or shoes or gym memberships or any other thing that helps you get better at basketball, don't cost different based on if you play for a NBA team or a high school team.
    You don't have to buy stuff in the store before raising your title. Waiting for something to go on sale doesn't increase or decrease how much money you make.
    You're complaining about low progression players with weak rosters moving up in BG. Only way they can keep doing that is by not upgrading their rosters. Every season they spend doing so, they are giving up on most of the rewards in the other modes (EQ/SQ is progression gated, they are obviously not progressing in the story). So, its a trade-off.

    Then you expect them to not use the only source of rewards they have (trophies) and make a push for the highest available titles (top two specifically need champs to be ranked up). If you think they can beat GM and Act 7 with a team of 5r4s then they are extremely skilled at the game and I feel like they deserve all the rewards they can get.

    If you are complaining about UC or Cav player who already have a bunch of r3 and r4s - they are anyway getting matched with the best teams. Matching is roster based not title based. So those guys are playing the strongest players and still getting lesser rewards than you are.

    Logically, it doesn't make any sense to camp in lower titles with a weak team just to hoard BG trophies. Spending them at lower levels is sub-optimal.

    What are you upset about.
    You do realize that most people got Paragon w/o the benefits from BGs, right? It's not that hard to jump a title or two now. Hell, Seatin got TB in 2 months on a f2p account.

    Either way, everyone earns the same rewards. That is a fact. What they choose to spend them on and when to spent them is up to them.
    So what? Everyone who will make Paragon from now on will do so with benefits from BG. I'm sure people got Cavelier with hardly any 5 stars and reached UC with 3 stars or 4 stars. The game has moved on and will continue to do so. There is no compulsion for new players to trace the exact same path as someone who has played the game before did.

    You are hardly complaining that Seatin has an easy path to GC or doesn't deserve to be there. You are complaining about people you think are not as good as you or didn't have the same game experience as you did. They don't have a choice on what they spend because the game restricts what they get for their spends. So it isn't the same rewards.
    You can try to spin it in your mind all you want but it's an actual fact that the REWARDS are exactly the same for everyone. That is an indisputable fact.
    You're wrong. If we both get a piece of paper that says "the bearer gets five gold bars from their prize shop" and your prize shop has much smaller gold bars than mine does, would you say we got the same prize? Because we both got five tickets? Or did you get less than me, because your gold bars are smaller than mine? It's indisputable.
  • SpaecSpaec Member Posts: 16
    Like, what do you think the purpose is of having the store be different for different progression levels? It's so Kabam can hand out the same number of tokens and they are worth more if you are a higher progression level and less if you are a lower one, that is why it is in the game.
  • Ironman3000Ironman3000 Member Posts: 1,958 ★★★★★
    What they are worth doesn't change the number you get. It's really not hard to understand. You're also conveniently ignoring the Relic shards and Elder's Marks which lead to the same number of rank rewards regardless of title. One of the many rewards that one can get from BGs having a different store as your whole argument is pretty weak.
  • SpaecSpaec Member Posts: 16

    What they are worth doesn't change the number you get.

    When people say "the rewards are different based on progression levels" what they mean is that what the rewards are worth is different, based on progression levels. Which it seems you agree with.
  • GreekhitGreekhit Member Posts: 2,820 ★★★★★
    Spaec said:

    What they are worth doesn't change the number you get.

    When people say "the rewards are different based on progression levels" what they mean is that what the rewards are worth is different, based on progression levels. Which it seems you agree with.
    The Trophy tokens store is designed to have similar value rewards for each progression tier.
    So your argument is invalid, unless the store designer has missed the mark.
    Rewards are EXACTLY the same for everyone.
    An UC and a Paragon player will get the EXACT same Trophy tokens, Relic shards and Elder Marks throughout VT.
    The Paragon won’t get more nor the UC will get less.
    Enough with this BS arguments.
    I can understand people don’t want to lose their easy rewards, but they need stronger arguments than those, to defend that.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,575 ★★★★★
    The argument has nothing to do with anyone losing "easy" Rewards. It's the fact that it's not accurate. The Store is designed to have SOME of the same Rewards, in an amount limited by progression. Not all of them, and not at the same cost.
    Relic Shards are not even something the majority of Players care about on here, from what I've seen. Elder's Marks are for anyone, sure. They're also in the Store if anyone wants to buy them.
  • This content has been removed.
  • RiderofHellRiderofHell Member Posts: 4,659 ★★★★★

  • GogiGogi Member Posts: 478 ★★★

    Football leagues have everyone in different leagues at the start of a new season, like AW does.
    A football cup competition is a free for all, everyone can be drawn against anyone. Battlegrounds is like this.

    Well it's not exactly like that, I have mentioned this in an earlier post. Here they have divided us Paragon players only meets Paragon players instead of being matched against let's say cavalier or TB. It's like saying the 4 best teams in the league should only play each other for 38 games while those in the middle should only play each other etc. Reset needs to happen, same goes in your terms after a league is finished the teams does not keep their points, it resets to 0.
  • StatureStature Member Posts: 469 ★★★
    Greekhit said:

    Spaec said:

    What they are worth doesn't change the number you get.

    When people say "the rewards are different based on progression levels" what they mean is that what the rewards are worth is different, based on progression levels. Which it seems you agree with.
    The Trophy tokens store is designed to have similar value rewards for each progression tier.
    So your argument is invalid, unless the store designer has missed the mark.
    Rewards are EXACTLY the same for everyone.
    An UC and a Paragon player will get the EXACT same Trophy tokens, Relic shards and Elder Marks throughout VT.
    The Paragon won’t get more nor the UC will get less.
    Enough with this BS arguments.
    I can understand people don’t want to lose their easy rewards, but they need stronger arguments than those, to defend that.
    So, rewards should be designed to suit progression levels but matches should be random? UCs should beat Paragons to be able to access 5-star shards and T4B, while Paragons should be given 6-star shards and R4 materials for beating 8-10K PI 5-star champs?

    I can understand that people want easy rewards, by beating opponents who have no chance of competing against them, but they need stronger arguments than these to defend that.
  • Graves_3Graves_3 Member Posts: 1,541 ★★★★★
    Stature said:

    Greekhit said:

    Spaec said:

    What they are worth doesn't change the number you get.

    When people say "the rewards are different based on progression levels" what they mean is that what the rewards are worth is different, based on progression levels. Which it seems you agree with.
    The Trophy tokens store is designed to have similar value rewards for each progression tier.
    So your argument is invalid, unless the store designer has missed the mark.
    Rewards are EXACTLY the same for everyone.
    An UC and a Paragon player will get the EXACT same Trophy tokens, Relic shards and Elder Marks throughout VT.
    The Paragon won’t get more nor the UC will get less.
    Enough with this BS arguments.
    I can understand people don’t want to lose their easy rewards, but they need stronger arguments than those, to defend that.
    So, rewards should be designed to suit progression levels but matches should be random? UCs should beat Paragons to be able to access 5-star shards and T4B, while Paragons should be given 6-star shards and R4 materials for beating 8-10K PI 5-star champs?

    I can understand that people want easy rewards, by beating opponents who have no chance of competing against them, but they need stronger arguments than these to defend that.
    Would you accept a matchmaking system which goes to complete random matches with the same store for all progression levels? So even UC can buy r4 materials and 6 star shards but they get to face accounts with any progression level/difficulty without any protections built in?
  • StatureStature Member Posts: 469 ★★★
    edited March 2023
    Graves_3 said:

    Would you accept a matchmaking system which goes to complete random matches with the same store for all progression levels? So even UC can buy r4 materials and 6 star shards but they get to face accounts with any progression level/difficulty without any protections built in?

    Yes.

    To be clear, I accept the current system too. And I get the frustrations with the matchmaking as it is but accept it as growing pangs. It is an iterative process and I'm sure some middle ground will be found.

    In the end, it's a game and I play within whatever rules it is bound by, as arbitrary as they are. I'm also ok with smaller accounts getting more avenues to progress without going all "back in my days...." about it.
  • altavistaaltavista Member Posts: 1,456 ★★★★
    Stature said:

    Graves_3 said:

    Would you accept a matchmaking system which goes to complete random matches with the same store for all progression levels? So even UC can buy r4 materials and 6 star shards but they get to face accounts with any progression level/difficulty without any protections built in?

    Yes.
    To me, that would completely ruin BG for more people while even less players benefit.

    Obviously benefit from that hypothetical matchmaking system:
    Top end Paragons who can win any fight benefits since it gets even easier. These players have no issues with the current system either.
    A theoretically skilled UC who can win any fight benefits, since now they have access to top end materials (and are essentially equivalent to Top end Paragons). These players have no issues with the current system either.

    Possibly benefit:
    The average Paragon might benefit since they may get some easier fights but also maybe tougher fights. These players may have problems with the current system, but they would likely be fine with matchmaking being either way.

    Neutral:
    It is unclear whether TB would benefit or not from the hypothetical vs current matchmaking system.

    Likely wouldn't benefit:
    The remainder (UC, Cav) likely wouldn't benefit, since their 'easy' matchups now consist of easy+hard matchups. And that presumably is a larger pool of players than the pool of players that would benefit.

    The current model, unfair as it feels, is beneficial to most players while not being beneficial to high TB/average Paragon players.

  • StatureStature Member Posts: 469 ★★★
    altavista said:

    Stature said:

    Graves_3 said:

    Would you accept a matchmaking system which goes to complete random matches with the same store for all progression levels? So even UC can buy r4 materials and 6 star shards but they get to face accounts with any progression level/difficulty without any protections built in?

    Yes.
    To me, that would completely ruin BG for more people while even less players benefit.

    Obviously benefit from that hypothetical matchmaking system:
    Top end Paragons who can win any fight benefits since it gets even easier. These players have no issues with the current system either.
    A theoretically skilled UC who can win any fight benefits, since now they have access to top end materials (and are essentially equivalent to Top end Paragons). These players have no issues with the current system either.

    Possibly benefit:
    The average Paragon might benefit since they may get some easier fights but also maybe tougher fights. These players may have problems with the current system, but they would likely be fine with matchmaking being either way.

    Neutral:
    It is unclear whether TB would benefit or not from the hypothetical vs current matchmaking system.

    Likely wouldn't benefit:
    The remainder (UC, Cav) likely wouldn't benefit, since their 'easy' matchups now consist of easy+hard matchups. And that presumably is a larger pool of players than the pool of players that would benefit.

    The current model, unfair as it feels, is beneficial to most players while not being beneficial to high TB/average Paragon players.

    Feels like exactly what higher progression players have been demanding. To be given the easy matches against UC/Cav players, since asking them to beat similar strength players for higher rewards is unfair.

    They've already put the effort to be Paragon, now they should be allowed to beat UC/Cavs to get bigger and better champs. They didn't need BG rewards to get to their progression, why should it be any easier for current UC/Cav players. I am paraphrasing here.

    I agree it will make things worse for a lot more people. But it will be even more worse, if matchmaking was random and rewards were also tiered.
  • StatureStature Member Posts: 469 ★★★
    altavista said:

    Stature said:

    Graves_3 said:

    Would you accept a matchmaking system which goes to complete random matches with the same store for all progression levels? So even UC can buy r4 materials and 6 star shards but they get to face accounts with any progression level/difficulty without any protections built in?

    Yes.
    To me, that would completely ruin BG for more people while even less players benefit.

    Obviously benefit from that hypothetical matchmaking system:
    Top end Paragons who can win any fight benefits since it gets even easier. These players have no issues with the current system either.
    A theoretically skilled UC who can win any fight benefits, since now they have access to top end materials (and are essentially equivalent to Top end Paragons). These players have no issues with the current system either.

    Possibly benefit:
    The average Paragon might benefit since they may get some easier fights but also maybe tougher fights. These players may have problems with the current system, but they would likely be fine with matchmaking being either way.

    Neutral:
    It is unclear whether TB would benefit or not from the hypothetical vs current matchmaking system.

    Likely wouldn't benefit:
    The remainder (UC, Cav) likely wouldn't benefit, since their 'easy' matchups now consist of easy+hard matchups. And that presumably is a larger pool of players than the pool of players that would benefit.

    The current model, unfair as it feels, is beneficial to most players while not being beneficial to high TB/average Paragon players.

    Isn't this exactly what higher progression level players are demanding? To be given easier matches against UC/Cav players, since requiring them to win against similar strength players for higher rewards is unfair.

    They have already put in the effort to be Paragon. Now then should be allowed to beat up UC/Cavs with inadequate rosters to get access to bigger and better champs. They did not need any BG rewards to get their titles, why should current UC/Cavs have any easier path. I am paraphrasing here.

    I agree, it would make the BG experience much worse for many players, especially at the lower end. But that is the demand on the forums, that the experience be worsened for lower accounts and improved for higher ones. It would be even worse if the matches were random and the rewards were tiered.
  • Ironman3000Ironman3000 Member Posts: 1,958 ★★★★★
    Spaec said:

    What they are worth doesn't change the number you get.

    When people say "the rewards are different based on progression levels" what they mean is that what the rewards are worth is different, based on progression levels. Which it seems you agree with.
    lol, why did you cut out the part of my post that talked about not addressing all of the rewards people get?
  • Graves_3Graves_3 Member Posts: 1,541 ★★★★★
    edited March 2023

    Spaec said:

    What they are worth doesn't change the number you get.

    When people say "the rewards are different based on progression levels" what they mean is that what the rewards are worth is different, based on progression levels. Which it seems you agree with.
    lol, why did you cut out the part of my post that talked about not addressing all of the rewards people get?
    How can they fit their narrative that everyone is not getting the same rewards otherwise? People are just picking and choosing what they want to justify their stance without looking at the complete picture.
  • Ayden_noah1Ayden_noah1 Member Posts: 1,861 ★★★★
    Vanitelia said:

    Something that would be fair would be to set up BG's like Incursions. If matchmaking is truly based on roster size and everyone wants a fair shake, then clearly state what a summoner can expect when entering whatever tier of BG's they choose to enter. We have it in incursions and we also have it when entering quests. It's basically play at your own risk knowing that the harder the content, the more resources you'll need to use to complete it.

    No need to change the resources earned because the stores are already tailored to progression level. My rewards are weighted differently than a TB or Cavalier player. Also, if participation in the game mode is the desired outcome, the system would make it enjoyable for everyone since they are matched with accounts similar to theirs as long as they choose the tier that fits their roster level.

    If a summoner wants to test the deep end, then they'll face larger accounts. People enjoy challenges and if they want to do it, then that's great. Given the parameters of BG's, it would be a huge undertaking, but at least they have the choice. In order to prevent Paragons from being a big fish in a little pond, they'd be locked at the highest tier. TB would have the option of staying in TB or moving up to Paragon. Cavalier can stay at Cav level or fight up to TB.

    I think this would also encourage roster development instead of accounts staying at their current level to get better matchmaking options. Jut my thought

    I have said many times BG should be like incursions in terms of prizes and who can play which tier. This way UC, Cav, TB and Paragon can play against each other only and have a top tier for those that want the challenge and the best rewards. Just like March's incursion side event. You can play in any level you like but it gets harder and the prices are better if you move up from tier 1 to tier 6. I keep hearing that UC, Cav, TP and Paragon want a fair match, this would make it happen and the argument can be shift to something else.
  • Ayden_noah1Ayden_noah1 Member Posts: 1,861 ★★★★
    About you argument that no competition resets each season - most competitive sports reset to zero every season. The Olympics is a good example. You still have to compete every time to qualify for the Olympics. If you don't win a certain qualification meet then you don't make the Olympics at all. All the major sports don't care if you won't the title the previous year, you start at zero wins and have to win enough game or get enough points just to qualify for the playoffs. Car racing is the same idea, they don't give you a head start if you won the championship the year before. I think you are referring to MMA or Boxing where the champ retains his belt unless he loses and the rankings don't change much unless you lose. Individual sports like Tennis and golf have rankings that will maintain from previous year that allows you to instantly qualify for certain events but you still have to play every round. They don't give the number 1 rank player the ability to skip the first few rounds since they are rank at the top. They still have to play form day one on.
  • TyEdgeTyEdge Member Posts: 3,116 ★★★★★

    About you argument that no competition resets each season - most competitive sports reset to zero every season. The Olympics is a good example. You still have to compete every time to qualify for the Olympics. If you don't win a certain qualification meet then you don't make the Olympics at all. All the major sports don't care if you won't the title the previous year, you start at zero wins and have to win enough game or get enough points just to qualify for the playoffs. Car racing is the same idea, they don't give you a head start if you won the championship the year before. I think you are referring to MMA or Boxing where the champ retains his belt unless he loses and the rankings don't change much unless you lose. Individual sports like Tennis and golf have rankings that will maintain from previous year that allows you to instantly qualify for certain events but you still have to play every round. They don't give the number 1 rank player the ability to skip the first few rounds since they are rank at the top. They still have to play form day one on.

    So these tennis players that “instantly qualify,” as you put it…you’re saying they have counterparts who don’t “instantly qualify” who then have to (gasp) play additional rounds to reach the same point in the event? Hmm…how bout that.

    All the “major sports” you’re referencing are largely closed competitions. NBA teams only compete against each other. They don’t play college teams or high school teams.

    You know what’s a bad plan? Putting a bunch of high school teams in a pool with NBA teams, then having NBA teams only play each other and high school teams only play each other. You end up with the best high school team at 10-0 while an NBA team sputters along at 3-7.
  • Longshot_33Longshot_33 Member Posts: 374 ★★★
    All I know is my full deck of 2 stars has been getting me some of the easiest rewards ever. Can play while driving to work and my 2 stars are earning me 6* shards 😅 Let me know in a few years when kabam have sorted this fiasco out. Probably when we get bases.
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