Spidey buff

Kabam why do this to us
We waited atleast 7 yrs for his buff and when he finally got buffed he's a noodle
U could've made him a little better made it worth the wait
(What do y'all think his buff is good or bad?)

Comments

Chobbly

I think they spent all this time on reworking him and failed so the time could have been used for other things like bugs that are all over the place.

It would have been a different team or different developers, @Manup456 .

Is he a terrible pull? No, not as much as before. Without synergies he really benefits from a high Sig to extend those taunts.

But just a tweak or two with the numbers and he'd have been good. Not BGT, not sub-par, just good.

BigPoppaCBONE

In @TheKiryu 's video he said the exact fights and setups you would see a ton of in the videos saying how good this buff was.
"Everyone wants every buff to make champs OP", "You're comparing his damage to Hercules", and "Not every buff can be Magneto" also made solid appearances in dismissing criticisms, but I didn't see nearly as much about how old and stale his animations are even compared to every other Spider-verse champ.

Shadowstrike

I think they spent all this time on reworking him and failed so the time could have been used for other things like bugs that are all over the place.

They're not the same team. This is a dedicated team who's only job is to balance any new Champions released as well as the reworks. They have nothing to do with inputs and moving them into the inputs does not guarantee that it would fix any issues.

Manup456

Either way it was a waste of time and money that should have been directed to the real issues. We need all hands on deck because the game is performing really bad for a long time now.

Shadowstrike

Either way it was a waste of time and money that should have been directed to the real issues. We need all hands on deck because the game is performing really bad for a long time now.

That's not how that works. They've even said in the past that throwing everyone on it wouldn't change anything.

VestasCure

Either way it was a waste of time and money that should have been directed to the real issues. We need all hands on deck because the game is performing really bad for a long time now.

Tell me you don't know how a game development company works without telling me you don't know how a game development company works.

VestasCure

In @TheKiryu 's video he said the exact fights and setups you would see a ton of in the videos saying how good this buff was.
"Everyone wants every buff to make champs OP", "You're comparing his damage to Hercules", and "Not every buff can be Magneto" also made solid appearances in dismissing criticisms, but I didn't see nearly as much about how old and stale his animations are even compared to every other Spider-verse champ.

I, for the most part, agree with what KT1 was saying about the buff and how people would perceive it. However I think that goes both ways. Like, what else do people expect to hear when addressing criticism besides what you quoted? It is reality that a lot of people do expect near hercules damage or near magneto level buffs for all of these buff releases. People tend to the high end to make comparisons instead of middle ground, that's just how this community works. Go look at any of what people have considered successful buffs like chavez or hulk. Hercules and magneto still get mentioned because that's simply what people want to compare to.

And trying to spin it as people saying "how good this buff was"..

People aren't arguing that it was an incredible buff or that he's actually super good. Almost every take I've seen on people in favor of the buff have added something like "would be nice if he had x." It for sure could have been better, that doesn't mean it's a bad buff. It doesn't have to be a black/white good/bad situation. They gave spider-man classic a purpose for those without crazy rosters, which is the goal of the buff program. The accomplished the goal.

BigPoppaCBONE

In @TheKiryu 's video he said the exact fights and setups you would see a ton of in the videos saying how good this buff was.
"Everyone wants every buff to make champs OP", "You're comparing his damage to Hercules", and "Not every buff can be Magneto" also made solid appearances in dismissing criticisms, but I didn't see nearly as much about how old and stale his animations are even compared to every other Spider-verse champ.
I, for the most part, agree with what KT1 was saying about the buff and how people would perceive it. However I think that goes both ways. Like, what else do people expect to hear when addressing criticism besides what you quoted? It is reality that a lot of people do expect near hercules damage or near magneto level buffs for all of these buff releases. People tend to the high end to make comparisons instead of middle ground, that's just how this community works. Go look at any of what people have considered successful buffs like chavez or hulk. Hercules and magneto still get mentioned because that's simply what people want to compare to.

And trying to spin it as people saying "how good this buff was"..

People aren't arguing that it was an incredible buff or that he's actually super good. Almost every take I've seen on people in favor of the buff have added something like "would be nice if he had x." It for sure could have been better, that doesn't mean it's a bad buff. It doesn't have to be a black/white good/bad situation. They gave spider-man classic a purpose for those without crazy rosters, which is the goal of the buff program. The accomplished the goal.

Maybe if people's comments were "Man, this buff sucks compared to Magneto's" or "Weak. He doesn't even hit as hard as Hercules? Why'd they waste time on this useless thing," the pre-complainers might have something, but no one said that and it's being kicked around to dismiss valid and invalid concerns alike.

If that was Kabam's intention with this buff, I'd like to hear more from people in the situation where they don't have him ranked up and sigged out or a synergy team to showcase him in favorable matchups and where using precious materials on Spider-Man would be a pretty big deal. People with rankups to waste and massive accounts are weighing in pretty heavily and many of those are talking about it being good enough to make him their twenty or thirty somethingth rank 4 which doesn't mean as much to me.

Again, I really wish Kabam would walk us through the process, what they're thinking and how they're assessing, what makes them cling to or move away from class traits, how they decide how much is too much or not enough, etc. They did get torched when they brought out the graphs and numbers around Namor's piddly regen, so they might not want to do that again.

TheLightBringer

Either way it was a waste of time and money that should have been directed to the real issues. We need all hands on deck because the game is performing really bad for a long time now.

It will never be 100% fixed, get over it already. If kabam decided to stop buffs "Saying" they will work towards fixing bugs instead, I'll be leaving the game as the issues won't be fixed anyway and we just won't be getting buffs

Manup456

@Shadowstrike You can choose to believe what Kabam says that’s your right but I don’t believe anything they say.

@VestasCure You know how Kabam works and other gaming companies work because you work for them? If not you don’t know either. If you do work for Kabam then explain how it works.

@TheLightBringer The game always had bugs just like any other and that’s normal but this game has never been this broken and I have been playing pretty much since release. But what’s the point of buffs or anything if the basic game mechanics are not working?

VestasCure

@Shadowstrike You can choose to believe what Kabam says that’s your right but I don’t believe anything they say.

@VestasCure You know how Kabam works and other gaming companies work because you work for them? If not you don’t know either. If you do work for Kabam then explain how it works.

@TheLightBringer The game always had bugs just like any other and that’s normal but this game has never been this broken and I have been playing pretty much since release. But what’s the point of buffs or anything if the basic game mechanics are not working?

No, I don't work for Kabam so I can't in detail tell you how they work. But I understand how other businesses in the industries work, as well as just businesses in general. There are allocated teams and departments that do different things and have different skill sets. This isn't a complicated thing to process.

Imagine walking into a best buy and wanting to talk to someone about a computer, but everyone in that department is busy so you go up to someone that works for appliances and focuses on fridges or something and expecting that person to talk in detail to you about a computer. How do you think that's going to work out for you? That's essentially what you're doing here - you're expecting someone that works in a completely different department, under a different team, with likely an entirely different skillset within computer science as a whole, to go in and do something they've never been trained to properly do (debug code within a mobile game).

There's always some kid or random low iq person that has zero corporate business knowledge, or realistically just common sense in general, that wants to come in trying to tell these companies how to run their business like they have experience as a C level employee in a fortune 500 company. The only experience you people ever have are experience flaring your ego on the internet.

Manup456

@VestasCure I own my own company and have worked for plenty of companies and when we are either short staffed or have a major issues in a specific department or on a job we either hire more people to get the situation under control or the people in those positions have to work overtime until the situation is under control. I’m no kid I’m a grown man and if you worked in the corporate world you would know that’s how it works.

VestasCure

@VestasCure I own my own company and have worked for plenty of companies and when we are either short staffed or have a major issues in a specific department or on a job we either hire more people to get the situation under control or the people in those positions have to work overtime until the situation is under control. I’m no kid I’m a grown man and if you worked in the corporate world you would know that’s how it works.

Yes, because a simple "throw money at it" can solve every problem that's ever existed. I'm guessing you have no concept of how coding or software dev works, so until you research that some maybe step away from telling them how to do that.

VestasCure

@VestasCure I own my own company and have worked for plenty of companies and when we are either short staffed or have a major issues in a specific department or on a job we either hire more people to get the situation under control or the people in those positions have to work overtime until the situation is under control. I’m no kid I’m a grown man and if you worked in the corporate world you would know that’s how it works.

Lets pretend for a moment that you're right. Hiring a few extra people in that department or having people work OT on it might be a good idea. Can you now give me evidence that shows you they haven't tried that? Outside of a generic "it's not fixed yet so obviously they haven't."

ESF

I agree with Vestas here that this buff is getting a lot more hate than it deserves. I’m seeing three points get brought up to dunk on Spidey: Damage, Utility, and Opponent Willpower.

First point, Damage. It is absolutely correct that Spidey, unsynergized, has weak basic combo hits. However, that can be said about champions like CGR and Apoc, champions who nobody knocks as having bad damage. That is because people have taken the time to learn and use proper rotations with them, as they will here.

If Spidey is used optimally, an sp2 crit will hit for approximately 54k, and combo crits will hit for approximately 10k medium and 7k light (numbers based on 6*, r3, no recoil masteries). Those are good numbers, and the only requirement is building to an sp1 and then an sp2. Very easily accessible. Does he hit harder than Herc or CGR? Absolutely not. But he’ll carve through a BG matchup well.

On the note of Battlegrounds, what about your opponent’s willpower healing? Stacking all those debuffs on your opponent is surely going to cause a problem. Too bad there isn’t an easily accessible way for literally every debuff heavy champion in the game to counter that. Oh wait! The Despair mastery that has been here the whole time and synergizes exceptionally well with science champions!

Sorry for being sassy on this one, but Willpower healing on the opponent is a silly complaint. So many high quality champions load up the opponent with debuffs and we don’t hear people complaining about giving defenders willpower healing. And that’s because it’s not really a problem. I’ve run Despair nonstop for years. It’s wildly useful. If you aren’t running it and you’re trying to compete in higher end PVP content, I’d recommend fixing that. Willpower healing isn’t a concern.

Finally, his utility. First off, that taunt is wildly helpful. We always complain about how passive the AI can get, just sitting back with nearly three bars of power and ruining your day. Spidey counters that.

I always hear about how obnoxious the prevalence of unstoppable in high end content is. Spidey counters that with his decelerate. And he counters it across every class, no carve out for skill class defenders.

Finally, his stun durations cannot be decreased. That is absolutely *massive.* Yes, it’s fairly niche, but how many times have we seen a Brute Force/Limber node combination? It’s been a miniboss node in war for what feels like forever. Spidey is the perfect counter for it because his stun duration can’t be shortened. Parry to your heart’s content. Shuts down unstoppable and evade too, so you don’t have those issues making the fight trickier. Plus the enemy will be spamming sp1, giving you plenty of openings to do what you need to do.

In short, Spider-Man (Classic) is not going to be your answer to every problem in the game. He’s not Hercules and he’s not Magneto. But he’s genuinely quite useful and good in his own right. I’ll likely be taking mine up once I have the materials on hand.

This is accurate.