Are you happy with how the OG Spiderman buff turned out?

Granted, he *could* slap, but he’s synergy-reliant. And his utility doesn’t really do anything.

This is a champ in a 7-star pool, endgame, so I’m not sure what this kit is designed to do.

Please vote and leave your thoughts.

Comments

Rookiie

I don’t doubt that OG Spiderman is useful. I’m asking whether or not you are happy with the buff.
So I don’t want this comment to come across like I’m trying to call you out, I just am curious and want to understand your opinion.

The way I read most of what you said, it feels like you *do* doubt that Spidey is useful.

Things like:
“ he *could* slap, but he’s synergy-reliant. And his utility doesn’t really do anything.”

“I’m not sure what this kit is designed to do.”

“ I hope Kabam analyzes the data because he’s neither here nor there.”

Then inviting us to share our thoughts. That’s why I personally framed what I was saying in the way I did, because what you were saying seemed to say “I don’t like Spider-Man, he doesn’t have good utility or use in the game”. So I wanted to share why his utility is good, and what his uses are - because there seems to be a fair bit you haven’t considered about why Spidey could actually be good.

No it’s okay I appreciate the detail you put into your responses, and for following up on this thread. I also appreciate the videos you’ve put together to educate the community about Spiderman.

You’ve shown us that a thing or two in his kit that myself and some others may not have been aware of before.

But that’s it.

The bottom line is that the kit is boring. It feels like it was put together on a Friday afternoon. It’s not so much about what the kit does as much as it is about the experience you have playing with Marvel’s flagship character.

I mean think about how the design went down:

Let’s design a new mechanic, call it something relevant to Spiderman, let it stack up and add debuffs, then let’s lock its potency behind a dupe and high sig.

The outcome was lame, Bittersteel, and the design was lazy. Let the numbers and comments in the thread speak for themselves.

I opened this thread hoping that there was more to learn about the champion than what I had seen on YouTube, and I wanted to see if I was the only one left wanting more or if others felt the same way.

That was the thought process.

DarkestDestroyer

I’m not sure that his utility does nothing, he is an extremely reliant taunt champion (the best in the game imo) and has great evade/unstoppable countering, he also ignores the mastery limber and the node limber, which is unique utility and very nice when it comes up.

Is he the best science? No, but in the future when our 7*s become higher sig he’s going to really come into his own. He’s not great unduped, he’s a ton better duped, and even better high sig.

He’s also got seriously good damage for BGs level health pools

https://youtu.be/n2O7roLo5l0

Just adding that yes, this is backblast, but without the extra crit damage, the combo after the stun on the sp2 would have KOd, the damage during that stun is huge.

Here he is countering two of the more difficult EoP fights

https://youtu.be/_TengCFOwQQ

https://youtu.be/tdZkPqBBWDk

All I’m saying is give him a chance if you dupe him

It feels like you are for some reason, very hesitant or reluctant to criticise kabam for anything these days.

You seem to defend things almost like another user who just cannot be reasoned with.

Wether this is because you sort of have a role/position with them now, I don’t know, but don’t be a yes man. The buff is really weak, let’s be honest, it’s no hate aimed at anyone, it’s just a question, which the answer is yes.

Maybe it’s just your opinion, but don’t be scared to show your real opinion, sometimes that can actually help, it’s constructive criticism.

Rookiie

I don’t doubt that OG Spiderman is useful. I’m asking whether or not you are happy with the buff.
So I don’t want this comment to come across like I’m trying to call you out, I just am curious and want to understand your opinion.

The way I read most of what you said, it feels like you *do* doubt that Spidey is useful.

Things like:
“ he *could* slap, but he’s synergy-reliant. And his utility doesn’t really do anything.”

“I’m not sure what this kit is designed to do.”

“ I hope Kabam analyzes the data because he’s neither here nor there.”

Then inviting us to share our thoughts. That’s why I personally framed what I was saying in the way I did, because what you were saying seemed to say “I don’t like Spider-Man, he doesn’t have good utility or use in the game”. So I wanted to share why his utility is good, and what his uses are - because there seems to be a fair bit you haven’t considered about why Spidey could actually be good.

The bottom line is that the kit is boring. It feels like it was put together on a Friday afternoon. It’s not so much about what the kit does as much as it is about the experience you have playing with Marvel’s flagship character.
.
Can we compare this to the OG Hulk buff that you described as “an OG champ that got buffed and turned out great.”

Because the way I see it, Spider Man’s buff attempted far, far more than OG Hulk’s did. You yourself admit a new mechanic for Spidey with webbing, he has a rotation involving different specials, specific things to do.

OG Hulk is just a very, very simple kit. It’s a counter, then a damage mode, and.. that’s kinda it. Not much utility at all, just damage. It’s a great buff don’t get me wrong, he’s extremely useful and I ban a lot of Hulk’s in BGs

But his buff is “boring” when applied to your definition given here. But why do you like that, but not Spidey? It’s because of the damage and no sig reliance right? That’s why we love Hulk, and why people love him as a 7*.

But I don’t think it’s *just* being locked behind the sig, we’ve had buffs for champions where damage or utility is locked behind sig - Joe fixit quite needs the sig, rocket has a ton of utility behind his sig, so does Hawkeye. We have many champions each year that very much need their sig, and there are many 7*s that need their sig like Killmonger, Korg, Domino etc. So why is it bad for Spidey? It can’t be only this.

For the record, I don’t think it’s ok to say a buff is bad because it relies on high sig, part of this game is investment, and one part is sig levels. Does it feel bad to have a 7* champion that benefits from higher sig, yeah maybe, but can that champ still do stuff at lower sig? Yes, Spidey still has all his utility at sig 20, and while he loses some taunt duration, it doesn’t neuter him, he just has more room to grow.

I’ve tested a low sig 7* rank 1 spider man, and honestly, I’m not joking when I say I’m scared of what he could do at R2. And I would R2 a duped Spidey in a heartbeat

I’ve got 30 second takedowns of 200k healthpools, that is insane BG scores. 1 minute 15 takedowns of 600k healthpools. Even quicker if sp2s crit - which stat focus helps with.

I can share videos of this if needed, if you need some extra ammunition to feel hyped about your 7*.

I don’t mean what I’m about to say to be accusatory at all, but I’m worried that you’ve fallen a little bit for “if the damage isn’t insane, it’s bad”. Spider man has very, very good damage, but no, it’s not OG Hulk level.

I worry about that, because you’ve said OG Hulk is an example of a good buff, when he’s objectively had less changed or added than Spidey, but Spidey is a bad buff because he’s not had enough added - the real difference in my view is OG Hulk had YTers seriously hyping him because his damage is more obviously there. And when Spidey came out, people didn’t see the damage immediately, and it wasn’t as much as Hulk, so he was written off

As “how a kit feels” I actually love how it feels as spider man, it feels like you’re webbing them up then throwing a huge kick at them. Sp1 into sp2. The parry LLLM combo back off, and repeat is satisfying to pull off, the taunts are insanely powerful - anyone who complains about AI not throwing specials (me included) just needs to try Spidey with his 100% uptime on taunt. And when you cash out with Sp2, it’s scary to see the damage

How much have you played with Spidey and tested his damage, because try him in some 200-300k healthpools, try him with crit stat focus, and try the techniques I’ve suggested. See how it feels with an open mind. I’d be happy for you to PM some gameplay and give tips on it.

I’d love to have some tips and gameplay. Thanks for offering.

But it does feel a bit dreary. They could have given him some animations like they did with Spider-Ham, that comic-style ‘BANG’, ‘POW’ and ‘THWIP’. Some web animations when opponents are webbed.

Also, the rotation and gameplay just isn’t satisfying. Compare it to Spider-Gwen for example, where you’re consistently weaving Heavy attacks between SP1s, to keep up the at excellent Slow debuff while you’re building up your Trap-Spider passives. And maybe the difference is that as you’re building up your Trap-Spiders your damage is slowly going up, then you reach max count and you move on to your SP2. We don’t get that with Spiderman. There isn’t that buildup, and even when you do get there sure the damage is great but it doesn’t feel like the damage loop is as rewarding as the buildup.

So it’s a lot of things. Don’t doubt me, he’s got the baseline, but reliance on dupe, sigs and synergies is not the way to design a champ.

It doesn’t feel rewarding or exciting, though it’s clear you’re making the most out of him and kudos to you.

Dab_west

I don’t doubt that OG Spiderman is useful. I’m asking whether or not you are happy with the buff.
So I don’t want this comment to come across like I’m trying to call you out, I just am curious and want to understand your opinion.

The way I read most of what you said, it feels like you *do* doubt that Spidey is useful.

Things like:
“ he *could* slap, but he’s synergy-reliant. And his utility doesn’t really do anything.”

“I’m not sure what this kit is designed to do.”

“ I hope Kabam analyzes the data because he’s neither here nor there.”

Then inviting us to share our thoughts. That’s why I personally framed what I was saying in the way I did, because what you were saying seemed to say “I don’t like Spider-Man, he doesn’t have good utility or use in the game”. So I wanted to share why his utility is good, and what his uses are - because there seems to be a fair bit you haven’t considered about why Spidey could actually be good.

The bottom line is that the kit is boring. It feels like it was put together on a Friday afternoon. It’s not so much about what the kit does as much as it is about the experience you have playing with Marvel’s flagship character.
.
Can we compare this to the OG Hulk buff that you described as “an OG champ that got buffed and turned out great.”

Because the way I see it, Spider Man’s buff attempted far, far more than OG Hulk’s did. You yourself admit a new mechanic for Spidey with webbing, he has a rotation involving different specials, specific things to do.

OG Hulk is just a very, very simple kit. It’s a counter, then a damage mode, and.. that’s kinda it. Not much utility at all, just damage. It’s a great buff don’t get me wrong, he’s extremely useful and I ban a lot of Hulk’s in BGs

But his buff is “boring” when applied to your definition given here. But why do you like that, but not Spidey? It’s because of the damage and no sig reliance right? That’s why we love Hulk, and why people love him as a 7*.

But I don’t think it’s *just* being locked behind the sig, we’ve had buffs for champions where damage or utility is locked behind sig - Joe fixit quite needs the sig, rocket has a ton of utility behind his sig, so does Hawkeye. We have many champions each year that very much need their sig, and there are many 7*s that need their sig like Killmonger, Korg, Domino etc. So why is it bad for Spidey? It can’t be only this.

For the record, I don’t think it’s ok to say a buff is bad because it relies on high sig, part of this game is investment, and one part is sig levels. Does it feel bad to have a 7* champion that benefits from higher sig, yeah maybe, but can that champ still do stuff at lower sig? Yes, Spidey still has all his utility at sig 20, and while he loses some taunt duration, it doesn’t neuter him, he just has more room to grow.

I’ve tested a low sig 7* rank 1 spider man, and honestly, I’m not joking when I say I’m scared of what he could do at R2. And I would R2 a duped Spidey in a heartbeat

I’ve got 30 second takedowns of 200k healthpools, that is insane BG scores. 1 minute 15 takedowns of 600k healthpools. Even quicker if sp2s crit - which stat focus helps with.

I can share videos of this if needed, if you need some extra ammunition to feel hyped about your 7*.

I don’t mean what I’m about to say to be accusatory at all, but I’m worried that you’ve fallen a little bit for “if the damage isn’t insane, it’s bad”. Spider man has very, very good damage, but no, it’s not OG Hulk level.

I worry about that, because you’ve said OG Hulk is an example of a good buff, when he’s objectively had less changed or added than Spidey, but Spidey is a bad buff because he’s not had enough added - the real difference in my view is OG Hulk had YTers seriously hyping him because his damage is more obviously there. And when Spidey came out, people didn’t see the damage immediately, and it wasn’t as much as Hulk, so he was written off

As “how a kit feels” I actually love how it feels as spider man, it feels like you’re webbing them up then throwing a huge kick at them. Sp1 into sp2. The parry LLLM combo back off, and repeat is satisfying to pull off, the taunts are insanely powerful - anyone who complains about AI not throwing specials (me included) just needs to try Spidey with his 100% uptime on taunt. And when you cash out with Sp2, it’s scary to see the damage

How much have you played with Spidey and tested his damage, because try him in some 200-300k healthpools, try him with crit stat focus, and try the techniques I’ve suggested. See how it feels with an open mind. I’d be happy for you to PM some gameplay and give tips on it.

og hulk is a good buff because he is actually used by people at the top levels of the game, like bgs and high tier war. It doesnt matter that his buff is mostly an increase of damage or whatever, it just works well and people like it.

og spidey is still mid and doesnt get used as much or at all in high tier bgs or masters war, so its a bad buff no matter how much effort or new mechanics are put in.

CosmicGuardian

While I wouldn’t call the buff a failure, I’m personally not a fan of it. While I’m general, I think he has some nice utility and decent damage, I just don’t like the way he plays. The best comparison I can think of is eating a meal that’s only half cooked; there’s some alright stuff there, but it’s not fully realized or satisfying.

I think my main gripe is his reliance on not just being awakened, but being at a high sig level. If you have an awakened Spider-Man, then you have the ability to stack his web debuffs, giving you access to a -100% decelerate, a -30% suppression, and a +70% debilitate. If you don’t have him awakened, however, then you are unable to stack his web debuffs and the above values get halved. Ideally, this is something that should’ve been in his base kit, since going into a fight against unstoppable or evade with just a 50% chance to counter those mechanics just isn’t great.

Additionally, this also impacts his damage burst, since the debilitate is only 35% instead of 70%, resulting in decreased stun duration (meaning less hits with the physical vulnerability bonus) and decreased taunt duration (leading to decreased physical vulnerability during the stun). He also gets additional taunt duration based on sig level, so in order to really get the most damage out of him during that burst, he should ideally be at a high sig.

Don’t get me wrong, just because a champ relies heavily on sig ability and level doesn’t mean they’re a bad champ. It’s just that in this case it feels like a detriment. To me, the science class already has a lot of competition for awakening gems and sig stones, and Spider-Man just doesn’t feel like he’s more deserving of those resources than the other champs that need them.

This buff just felt like a disappointment, since there are clearly some really good ideas and concepts present in his kit. It just feels like they either were executed properly, or weren’t fully followed through to completion. My hope is that this acts similarly to the original Gamora buff, in that the groundwork has been laid, all that needs to be done now is to just make some minor tweaks and additions to polish up his kit.

Rookiie

I don’t doubt that OG Spiderman is useful. I’m asking whether or not you are happy with the buff.
So I don’t want this comment to come across like I’m trying to call you out, I just am curious and want to understand your opinion.

The way I read most of what you said, it feels like you *do* doubt that Spidey is useful.

Things like:
“ he *could* slap, but he’s synergy-reliant. And his utility doesn’t really do anything.”

“I’m not sure what this kit is designed to do.”

“ I hope Kabam analyzes the data because he’s neither here nor there.”

Then inviting us to share our thoughts. That’s why I personally framed what I was saying in the way I did, because what you were saying seemed to say “I don’t like Spider-Man, he doesn’t have good utility or use in the game”. So I wanted to share why his utility is good, and what his uses are - because there seems to be a fair bit you haven’t considered about why Spidey could actually be good.

The bottom line is that the kit is boring. It feels like it was put together on a Friday afternoon. It’s not so much about what the kit does as much as it is about the experience you have playing with Marvel’s flagship character.
.
Can we compare this to the OG Hulk buff that you described as “an OG champ that got buffed and turned out great.”

Because the way I see it, Spider Man’s buff attempted far, far more than OG Hulk’s did. You yourself admit a new mechanic for Spidey with webbing, he has a rotation involving different specials, specific things to do.

OG Hulk is just a very, very simple kit. It’s a counter, then a damage mode, and.. that’s kinda it. Not much utility at all, just damage. It’s a great buff don’t get me wrong, he’s extremely useful and I ban a lot of Hulk’s in BGs

But his buff is “boring” when applied to your definition given here. But why do you like that, but not Spidey? It’s because of the damage and no sig reliance right? That’s why we love Hulk, and why people love him as a 7*.

But I don’t think it’s *just* being locked behind the sig, we’ve had buffs for champions where damage or utility is locked behind sig - Joe fixit quite needs the sig, rocket has a ton of utility behind his sig, so does Hawkeye. We have many champions each year that very much need their sig, and there are many 7*s that need their sig like Killmonger, Korg, Domino etc. So why is it bad for Spidey? It can’t be only this.

For the record, I don’t think it’s ok to say a buff is bad because it relies on high sig, part of this game is investment, and one part is sig levels. Does it feel bad to have a 7* champion that benefits from higher sig, yeah maybe, but can that champ still do stuff at lower sig? Yes, Spidey still has all his utility at sig 20, and while he loses some taunt duration, it doesn’t neuter him, he just has more room to grow.

I’ve tested a low sig 7* rank 1 spider man, and honestly, I’m not joking when I say I’m scared of what he could do at R2. And I would R2 a duped Spidey in a heartbeat

I’ve got 30 second takedowns of 200k healthpools, that is insane BG scores. 1 minute 15 takedowns of 600k healthpools. Even quicker if sp2s crit - which stat focus helps with.

I can share videos of this if needed, if you need some extra ammunition to feel hyped about your 7*.

I don’t mean what I’m about to say to be accusatory at all, but I’m worried that you’ve fallen a little bit for “if the damage isn’t insane, it’s bad”. Spider man has very, very good damage, but no, it’s not OG Hulk level.

I worry about that, because you’ve said OG Hulk is an example of a good buff, when he’s objectively had less changed or added than Spidey, but Spidey is a bad buff because he’s not had enough added - the real difference in my view is OG Hulk had YTers seriously hyping him because his damage is more obviously there. And when Spidey came out, people didn’t see the damage immediately, and it wasn’t as much as Hulk, so he was written off

As “how a kit feels” I actually love how it feels as spider man, it feels like you’re webbing them up then throwing a huge kick at them. Sp1 into sp2. The parry LLLM combo back off, and repeat is satisfying to pull off, the taunts are insanely powerful - anyone who complains about AI not throwing specials (me included) just needs to try Spidey with his 100% uptime on taunt. And when you cash out with Sp2, it’s scary to see the damage

How much have you played with Spidey and tested his damage, because try him in some 200-300k healthpools, try him with crit stat focus, and try the techniques I’ve suggested. See how it feels with an open mind. I’d be happy for you to PM some gameplay and give tips on it.

I’d love to have some tips and gameplay. Thanks for offering.

But it does feel a bit dreary. They could have given him some animations like they did with Spider-Ham, that comic-style ‘BANG’, ‘POW’ and ‘THWIP’. Some web animations when opponents are webbed.

Also, the rotation and gameplay just isn’t satisfying. Compare it to Spider-Gwen for example, where you’re consistently weaving Heavy attacks between SP1s, to keep up the at excellent Slow debuff while you’re building up your Trap-Spider passives. And maybe the difference is that as you’re building up your Trap-Spiders your damage is slowly going up, then you reach max count and you move on to your SP2. We don’t get that with Spiderman. There isn’t that buildup, and even when you do get there sure the damage is great but it doesn’t feel like the damage loop is as rewarding as the buildup.

So it’s a lot of things. Don’t doubt me, he’s got the baseline, but reliance on dupe, sigs and synergies is not the way to design a champ.

It doesn’t feel rewarding or exciting, though it’s clear you’re making the most out of him and kudos to you.
I’ll put some things together, looking at his damage in 200k and 5-600k healthpools and compare him to OG Hulk, so you have a baseline of how well he performs. (I’m not trying to say Spidey has more damage than Hulk, just as a comparison)

Out of curiosity, what sort of time for each healthpool would get you impressed? Like, say Hulk gets 30 seconds for 200k, and 1min 15 on average for 5-600k. What would it take for Spidey to feel like he has damage? I’ll do it with both crits and non crits on sp2 for fairness. In terms of BGs, what sort of scores do you consider good? I’d really appreciate answers to these questions, I think it’ll provide an objective way to figure out whether you “feel” bad about the damage of the buff, or whether you have some measure to back it up.

In regards to your “feeling” on his loop, that’s fair, each champion is very subjective on damage loops. I personally find Galan extremely boring to play, and don’t like his loop. But I know people who love it. (As it happens, I don’t enjoy Gwen’s play style either - maybe there’s our disconnect lol)

I’ll agree on animations, it would have been awesome to get more. But obviously hulk didn’t get those either, so double sad

I will however disagree on reliance on dupe, sigs and synergies. I agree on 1/3, he does need the dupe. But he definitely doesn’t need high sig, it’s just very nice for him. Like I said, I’ve been testing low sig, no synergies 7* and he’s still crazily good.

Thanks. I think the timestamps you proposed for each healthpool is extremely good. So maybe add about 50% to each just to be fair.

1) 45 seconds for a 200k healthpool is still really good, over a minute and you start to scratch your head.

Considering larger healthpools, it also depends on the nodes. It wouldn’t be fair to compare a 500k HP Winter Soldier with an 8.2 Hyperion for example.

2) Winter Soldier: anything above 90 seconds and you begin to scratch your head at R4 or 7-star R1/25.

3) 8.2: anything above 135 seconds and again, you might start scratching your head.

Regarding BGs, I don’t play it at all. That sort of game mode is not my cup of tea, so I don’t think I’m qualified to provide an opinion on it.

Again, I appreciate all the thought & gameplay you put into this.

Rookiie

So cool to learn more about these testing realms in CCP.
On gameplay, very insightful stuff @BitterSteel and thanks for all this gameplay.
Would you mind telling us more about your play style? I can’t seem to understand what you were trying to do

Rookiie

Also, if you could give Spiderman ONE change, what would it be? @BitterSteel @Karatemike415
Out of curiosity.

Rookiie

Out of interest @Rookiie , has any of this inspired you to take another look at Spidey. Obviously you had your opinion on it being a bad buff going in, and I'm not expecting to have persuaded you instantly, but if you duped your 7* would you feel quite as bad as you do now?

I ask because there were a few bits of utility you didn't know spidey had going in, and now you can see the damage potential of a 7* and it fit your description of impressive for the health pools we've spoken about. Has anything changed in your mind?

Yeah for sure. It’s always good to talk to somebody who has so much experience with a particular character, because you learn a lot of things that you might not have known previously. And in my case, I have. For starters, it’s good to know that I don’t need as many SP1s as I initially thought I did. Second of all, the stress on having Spidey duped and giving him a second chance then leaves me with an open mind. Third of all, you’re right, the damage isn’t so bad. Dupe and sig only leaves room for more.

Having said that, you’ve inspired me to go on a ROL run with Crit Damage as the stat focus.

I noticed that Spidey performs especially poorly against Winter Soldier and Black Panther, probably due to class disadvantage, or high movement. The average duration of the fights was 2:45 and the average hit count was 172.

Spidey performed especially well against Black Bolt and Wolverine, because Black Bolt is suicidal and he reverses Wolverine’s regen. The average duration of the fights was 1:26 and the average hit count was 97.

In the other 7 matchups, Spidey posted a minimum fight duration of 1:44 against Captain Marvel, a maximum fight duration of 2:30 against Scarlet Witch, at an average fight duration of 2:04 minutes. Spidey posted a his lowest hit count against Vision and Scarlet Witch at 142 hits, and his lowest hit count against Juggernaut with 107 hits at an average hit count of 129.

I suppose, this is why it’s confusing. He doesn’t particularly excel against Mystics. If you look at Black Bolt and Wolverine, you might say Spidey excels against champs with many or potent buffs. But then again, this is not extensive testing.

One thing is for sure though, he sucks without his dupe.

Rookiie

Btw when I say sucks - I mean I’d like to get more out of his utility as well and see how it fuses into his rotation. For example, without his dupe, he doesn’t do anything against Unstoppable. And I’m sure that stacked Debilitate contributes to his damage loop.

I do think he could use a small buff and some sweet animations. Maybe a trade off for fixing the Cassie Lang bug?

Real_Madrid_76_2

The 🐐 version himself is the worst one among his verse characters, does is satisfy anyone at all

Vegeta9001

He is usable now, is he great? No, is he good? Meh. But hey, at least I can use the 7* for reasonable damage and taunts when I fancy a change.

Amir447

@Kabam Miike check out this poll. Maybe he could be rebuffed like gamora? (Who is now awesome btw)

Rookiie

@Rookiie i don’t think I’ve ever had a crystal pull with such good timing lol

Now just to dupe him then he goes R2

I’m glad! Guess you manifested him through this poll 😄 looking forward to more gameplay 🕷️

CyborgNinja135

The 🐐 version himself is the worst one among his verse characters, does is satisfy anyone at all

The title of worst Spider-Verse hero goes to Symbiote Spider-Man

Rookiie

WOW and look what I manifested @BitterSteel

Chobbly

Got to say I'm a bit jealous of anyone who got him as a 7*. Not that I should really complain about my 7* crystal luck, even if they aren't champions I normally use, but I was hoping for a 7* Spider-Man.

I think it's great that there are differing views, and this thread has been worth reading end to end because of the nature of the comments.

But anyway, back to the buff. I think the fact that it requires awakening and arguably a decent or high Sig is a problem that affects the ability for more players to appreciate the buff fully. And it was right to call out RoL as not the best place to showcase him - taking my 6* R3 Sig 40 against WS was incredibly disappointing.

I just wish that his base Taunts lasted just a little longer. Or if he paused his Taunt Debuffs for one second on a Well-Timed Block, or something. It would make him so much nicer to use unawakened or at low Sig. Maybe we'll get a relic that will help, just like I keep saying about DDHK.

I think a small and subtle change could make a big difference to many people's perceptions of the buff and his ease of use.

Harryatomix

@BitterSteel Which of the recent buffs do u consider bad ?

BeastDad

He is certainly better, but if you have any of the top 5 science champs, you are not wasting a roster spot on Spidey...

BeastDad

He is certainly better, but if you have any of the top 5 science champs, you are not wasting a roster spot on Spidey...
Eh, I have an alliance mate and a buddy in 4Loki who have R2s and have been absolutely crushing with him. Check out BMcG's channel here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0RZ8-ExP7E

and I've done my own showcase in Bgs here

https://youtu.be/5oPgvi-9ntc

I consistently run BG decks with 6-8 science champs, so he really does make my deck (for context I'm usually C6/5). Maybe for some they wouldn't want to use him over other science champs, but depending on roster you may have him as a 7* duped and he'd be worth R2 in my mind easily. Mystic champs are such a threat you want people who can handle them perfectly. So Spidey is super useful to me, and gets great scores.

If you have og hulk and Titania at 7* rank 2, I’m not wasting a spot on spidey.

Bulmkt

SpiderMan OG should have gotten a significant critical rating upgrade. He’s critical hits are weak

Harryatomix

@BitterSteel Let me rephrase, which of the reworks do u think are bad, or which rework does not make the champ viable. What I am saying is spidey buff is one that fell short they could have done so much better but did not. It is OG spidey and they did him dirty. Since he is available as 7 star most ppl wont rank up their 6 star and by the time ppl get him to decent sig many more 7 star science champs will come into contest and everyone will forget about their spidey let alone use him. Spidey will just be another psychoman who noone cares because he needs high sig

Harryatomix

@BitterSteel R2 resources are very rare, wont be using them on a champ who needs high sig when I can do hulk or tit or even joe is better at low sig, please don't picture him as an op champ and waste people's resources. By time R2 resources become more viable spidey will be a goner more champs would have entered 7 star pool.

Harryatomix

He is the weakest science champ in 7 star pool rn, maybe better than gwen if awakened. Do u disagree?

Chobbly

As said elsewhere, I don't think it's a bad buff per se, just not a great one. While it's not and was never going to be a Red Mags level, I think it's fair to say that it's not on the Hulk level either. I hope that I pull a 7* at some point, partly for collecting but also because I'd like him in my roster.

Instead, I think Classic Spidey is on a DDHK level. Consider the following:

This champion benefits from being awakened and high Sig. He benefits greatly from certain synergies to support his average damage output. This champion does have some specific utility but wouldn't be considered an all-rounder or a 'go to' champion in most circumstances as there are many better options, including in his own class. To unlock his potential he requires a specific rotation. The champion is a fan favourite character with a rich Marvel backstory.

Who am I talking about? Could be either.