You have to be clear: Which kind of Deliberately losing will be punished

BG S12 Alliance Event Milestones 17 Points Requied 12,000,000, that means On average, each member needs to earn 450,000 points. That means winning 61 matches with Elder Marks(450000÷7350≈61).

From Platinum 1 to Uru 3, it takes 25 games to win them all. So tell me how to get the extra 36 wins(61-25).I'm not saying that I will definitely win consecutively, but this is the general trend.

If you don't control the segment before reaching Uru 3 and deliberately lose a few games, how can players complete alliance event with a little ease? This is the general understanding of people on S9, and this is what they did.

Now you tell me that I can't lose on purpose, so how much more time do I need to spend in order to complete your alliance event? Because the higher the level, the lower the winning rate will definitely be.

Kabam，You have to be clear: Which kind of Deliberately losing will be punished！

We don’t want to spend too much time just to complete that stupid alliance event. Some alliances have turned it into a brass-tag indices and treated it as a job.

Comments

PT_99

Just play the matches, don't forfeit. Try to win. It's so simple I cannot understand the waterfall of tears.

Good luck trying to win 65+ times in vibranium or GC, Mr smart
Or
Good luck having those many elder marks that you can afford to win-lose-win-win-lose-win-win in GC.
Or
If you're extra smart and suggest to use energy, then you will just need to win 584 times with strict energy uses, cheers.

Higher tiers should reward more points, there's no sensible argument that Bronze wins and GC wins should give equal amount of winning points.

ItsClobberinTime

For example, if I win one more game, I will upgrade to Diamond 1. Then I deliberately consume my energy and lose several times, and deliberately do not upgrade to Diamond 1. Will I be punished for this?
That's literally farming, yes, you will get banned lol what are you even asking, did you read the post that was edited by Jax or not? Cause if you had you wouldn't be asking this, the answer is there.
You are not Jax, how about you invite him out and answer my questions clearly?

"DELIBERATELY LOSING" lol you can't read or what?

Ericson23

For example, if I win one more game, I will upgrade to Diamond 1. Then I deliberately consume my energy and lose several times, and deliberately do not upgrade to Diamond 1. Will I be punished for this?
That's literally farming, yes, you will get banned lol what are you even asking, did you read the post that was edited by Jax or not? Cause if you had you wouldn't be asking this, the answer is there.
You are not Jax, how about you invite him out and answer my questions clearly?
"DELIBERATELY LOSING" lol you can't read or what?

Do you have to be an actor to play this game, get this done, and act like you are not losing on purpose? What an irony

ChaosMax1012

Kabam is taking this too seriously smh. This suggests players not to forfeit, but instead waste the other players time while they lose the first 2 rounds anyway. No avoiding this and it’s really not unfair. Losing a match shouldn’t setback anyone if this is what they are suggesting. Such a joke

ItsClobberinTime

For example, if I win one more game, I will upgrade to Diamond 1. Then I deliberately consume my energy and lose several times, and deliberately do not upgrade to Diamond 1. Will I be punished for this?
That's literally farming, yes, you will get banned lol what are you even asking, did you read the post that was edited by Jax or not? Cause if you had you wouldn't be asking this, the answer is there.
You are not Jax, how about you invite him out and answer my questions clearly?
"DELIBERATELY LOSING" lol you can't read or what?

Do you have to be an actor to play this game, get this done, and act like you are not losing on purpose? What an irony

No, you simply have to not be a **** and play by the rules just like everyone else. If they decided farming is unfair play then it's unfair play, move on buddy.

Ericson23

For example, if I win one more game, I will upgrade to Diamond 1. Then I deliberately consume my energy and lose several times, and deliberately do not upgrade to Diamond 1. Will I be punished for this?
That's literally farming, yes, you will get banned lol what are you even asking, did you read the post that was edited by Jax or not? Cause if you had you wouldn't be asking this, the answer is there.
You are not Jax, how about you invite him out and answer my questions clearly?
"DELIBERATELY LOSING" lol you can't read or what?

Do you have to be an actor to play this game, get this done, and act like you are not losing on purpose? What an irony
No, you simply have to not be a **** and play by the rules just like everyone else. If they decided farming is unfair play then it's unfair play, move on buddy.

What if I don’t want to struggle to gain points and reach milestones in GC, so my only option is to give up?

Dirty_Dozz

From Platinum 1 to Uru 3, it takes 25 games to win them all. So tell me how to get the extra 36 wins(61-25).I'm not saying that I will definitely win consecutively, but this is the general trend.

If you don't control the segment before reaching Uru 3 and deliberately lose a few games, how can players complete alliance event with a little ease?

Theres two issues with this complaint.

First: You're assuming that anybody is going to have a 100% win rate, and will go right from Plat 1 to Uru 3. That's highly unlikely, except for maybe the whalest of whales. But even then, roster strength doesn't indicate skill.

Second: For the rewards they've added this season, I doubt easy was high on their list of things they wanted the milestones to be.

Ericson23

From Platinum 1 to Uru 3, it takes 25 games to win them all. So tell me how to get the extra 36 wins(61-25).I'm not saying that I will definitely win consecutively, but this is the general trend.

If you don't control the segment before reaching Uru 3 and deliberately lose a few games, how can players complete alliance event with a little ease?

Theres two issues with this complaint.

First: You're assuming that anybody is going to have a 100% win rate, and will go right from Plat 1 to Uru 3. That's highly unlikely, except for maybe the whalest of whales. But even then, roster strength doesn't indicate skill.

Second: For the rewards they've added this season, I doubt easy was high on their list of things they wanted the milestones to be.

That's just an example. Even if the winning rate is not that high, even if it's 80%, when it comes to Uru 3, you still need to play a lot of games to reach the milestone, right?

Graves_3

I mean you can get those other wins in the GC, but it won't be as easy obviously. That's what they intend, though.

Does kind of feel like seeding hurts you in that regard when you look at it that way.

Also to be clear I'm not in favor of win farming but I think it's dumb to threaten/punish people for playing within the parameters they set, rather than trying to fix why win farming exists in the first place.
Like you said, is it possible there are quite number of people who just don't want go to GC, Don't they even have this right?
No, unfortunately you don't have that right cause this is a competitive game mode and a lot of people who forfeit do it so they can get easier matchups and get to 450k points easily (which IS unfair play unless you're incredibly entitled), not because they don't want to be in GC. If you wanna blame anyone though then blame the players who abused this last time we had extra milestones, not Kabam.
But it's because of the system Kabam designed that this farming is even a thing.

To be clear, I'm not in favor of farming points in the VT but I do think it's ridiculous that they're threatening bans for people who are taking the path of least resistance to get their 450k when it's within the design of the content they created. I'd agree it's somewhat unsportsmanlike or against the spirit of the game mode, but the solution should be to fix the problem they created in the first place.

Either, as others have suggested, have wins in higher tiers contribute more points toward the milestones or some other tweak that incentives people to move on.
No it's not, I got to 450k easily last time without farming and I wasn't even Paragon yet.

It may be within the design yes, they probably have their reasons for not removing the forfeit option but if they decide it's against the rules then it's against the rules and there's a very good reason for it.

I agree though, GC should give more points for each win as it is a lot more challenging.

Once the season starts, you may notice that this is the key statement here.
You are now paragon and k assume have a decently strong account but not compare to a whale.
And with seeding you don’t have the entire VT to get those points. So let’s see how easy it is to get 450k this season.

Shadow_Shooter

Kabam, rescind this nonsense.

BeastDad

Coming up next in BGs:
Giving away on purpose the first round, in order to burn opponent's best drafts and win round two and three, is not intented and now a behaviour worthy a ban 😂
Since you know, losing on purpose is prohibited 😂
Braindead joke
Let's hope it remains a joke, because you never know 😉
For obvious reasons, something like that would make absolutely no sense lol this however does make a lot of sense and it's a healthy change for the most part. I say for the most part because I do think wins in GC should give more points to compensate for the lower leagues we don't get to play in, other than that though, good news
This healthy change (removing farming), could have become by setting escalating point multipliers through VT and GC tier (similar to war tier based scoring), not by threatening the community with bans.
You see there is a big difference on these two ways of approaching the same issue.

Yep but that would be far too fair and balanced.

Vanitelia

Award more points for higher tiers? Good concept, but without this change, people would exploit that as well. Instead of farming in VT, they'd do it in GC instead. Then those stuck in VT will complain because people are earning more points for playing the same game mode.

The issue is the alliance events. They shouldn't be present whatsoever since it's not a team competitive mode. Alliance has nothing to do with BG's. It causes these minimums to be set and that forces people who have no desire to play the mode to play. These players probably account for some of the complaints we see. The rest feel justified because they don't feel the rewards meet the grind needed to get there.

Crazy thing is it takes about 2 wins per day over the course of the season (using EMs) to get to 450k. When looking at it that way, it's not grindy at all. So for those, the real problem is that they want all the rewards yesterday instead of pacing themselves over the course of the season.

GroundedWisdom

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.

Lovejoy72

If I stay in Bronze 3 all season because I afk every match, I'm going to get banned?

That’s exactly what I asked in another thread. The rule as stated is that this game is meant to be played to win. And the spirit behind it is apparently that point farming to maintain a strategic advantage is punishing to lower players.

But if I lose in bronze three, eternally, just because I don’t care to play, then I’m in violation of the first half of that. But not the second half. Which means the entire stated intent around this is incoherent. And they need to clarify it immediately.

ChaosMax1012

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.

The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all

GroundedWisdom

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all

Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.

ItsClobberinTime

I mean you can get those other wins in the GC, but it won't be as easy obviously. That's what they intend, though.

Does kind of feel like seeding hurts you in that regard when you look at it that way.

Also to be clear I'm not in favor of win farming but I think it's dumb to threaten/punish people for playing within the parameters they set, rather than trying to fix why win farming exists in the first place.
Like you said, is it possible there are quite number of people who just don't want go to GC, Don't they even have this right?
No, unfortunately you don't have that right cause this is a competitive game mode and a lot of people who forfeit do it so they can get easier matchups and get to 450k points easily (which IS unfair play unless you're incredibly entitled), not because they don't want to be in GC. If you wanna blame anyone though then blame the players who abused this last time we had extra milestones, not Kabam.
But it's because of the system Kabam designed that this farming is even a thing.

To be clear, I'm not in favor of farming points in the VT but I do think it's ridiculous that they're threatening bans for people who are taking the path of least resistance to get their 450k when it's within the design of the content they created. I'd agree it's somewhat unsportsmanlike or against the spirit of the game mode, but the solution should be to fix the problem they created in the first place.

Either, as others have suggested, have wins in higher tiers contribute more points toward the milestones or some other tweak that incentives people to move on.
No it's not, I got to 450k easily last time without farming and I wasn't even Paragon yet.

It may be within the design yes, they probably have their reasons for not removing the forfeit option but if they decide it's against the rules then it's against the rules and there's a very good reason for it.

I agree though, GC should give more points for each win as it is a lot more challenging.
Once the season starts, you may notice that this is the key statement here.
You are now paragon and k assume have a decently strong account but not compare to a whale.
And with seeding you don’t have the entire VT to get those points. So let’s see how easy it is to get 450k this season.

Last season I got 300k points simply by doing the objectives, ended up in Uru 1 but I definitely could've got more points if I played more (yes, I started in Plat 1 last season because of seeding).
Suggesting that we can't get to 450k if we have to fight whales is just ridiculous cause most of those whales suck, if you're one of those whales however I don't know what to tell you.

ItsClobberinTime

For example, if I win one more game, I will upgrade to Diamond 1. Then I deliberately consume my energy and lose several times, and deliberately do not upgrade to Diamond 1. Will I be punished for this?
That's literally farming, yes, you will get banned lol what are you even asking, did you read the post that was edited by Jax or not? Cause if you had you wouldn't be asking this, the answer is there.
You are not Jax, how about you invite him out and answer my questions clearly?
"DELIBERATELY LOSING" lol you can't read or what?

Do you have to be an actor to play this game, get this done, and act like you are not losing on purpose? What an irony
No, you simply have to not be a **** and play by the rules just like everyone else. If they decided farming is unfair play then it's unfair play, move on buddy.
What if I don’t want to struggle to gain points and reach milestones in GC, so my only option is to give up?

Yes absolutely, get good or give up. It's ridiculous how much entitlement the handholding from Kabam has caused, you have to earn those rewards like everyone else, it's that simple.

Dukenpuke

If I stay in Bronze 3 all season because I afk every match, I'm going to get banned?
That’s exactly what I asked in another thread. The rule as stated is that this game is meant to be played to win. And the spirit behind it is apparently that point farming to maintain a strategic advantage is punishing to lower players.

But if I lose in bronze three, eternally, just because I don’t care to play, then I’m in violation of the first half of that. But not the second half. Which means the entire stated intent around this is incoherent. And they need to clarify it immediately.

I'll probably just keep doing it anyway. If I get banned for it, then I guess it's probably time to find a new game to play.

Lovejoy72

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.

In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.

TribalChief

If kabam will be clear !! In telling what will be punished

Ain't u guys able to found the other ways for keep running exploit.
So kabam is smart.

GroundedWisdom

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.
In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.

If people have reached their plateau, that's very clear in the data. If people are throwing Matches to farm Points, that's also clear in the data.
While it's true that they can't police effort, they can certainly police the effort to cheat the system.

Lovejoy72

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.
In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.
If people have reached their plateau, that's very clear in the data. If people are throwing Matches to farm Points, that's also clear in the data.
While it's true that they can't police effort, they can certainly police the effort to cheat the system.

I don’t disagree. The problem is in the transparency. I do generally intentionally drop most of my matches, but I also intentionally do it in bronze, where it hurts me in terms of resource efficiency, but maximize efficiency in my life. I hit some buttons on my back up phone. And it gives a great deal of advantage to other players. So it as well within the bounds of most of their rules. But not within the stated propaganda of competitiveness, and playing the game mode to win. So all in all I should be banned for it. To assume that I will not be means we have to read between the lines to what they are accomplishing, when they should just state what they are accomplishing.

If they found a specific exploit in the system, and they don’t want people using it anymore, be frank in that. Don’t take time out of your day to also impugn how I play, and somehow imply that it is not in the spirit of the game. Taking the moral high ground to cover up the fact you can’t make your game mode fair? These folks aren’t cheating, they just aren’t playing the game the way kabam wants them to. I use the exact same principle, I just don’t apply at the same way.

And if, in fact, the way that I play is not in the spirit of the game, and they do want me to stop? I can certainly drop out of battlegrounds entirely, which will take me out of my competitive ally, which will probably push me into at least partial retirement.

GroundedWisdom

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.
In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.
If people have reached their plateau, that's very clear in the data. If people are throwing Matches to farm Points, that's also clear in the data.
While it's true that they can't police effort, they can certainly police the effort to cheat the system.
I don’t disagree. The problem is in the transparency. I do generally intentionally drop most of my matches, but I also intentionally do it in bronze, where it hurts me in terms of resource efficiency, but maximize efficiency in my life. I hit some buttons on my back up phone. And it gives a great deal of advantage to other players. So it as well within the bounds of most of their rules. But not within the stated propaganda of competitiveness, and playing the game mode to win. So all in all I should be banned for it. To assume that I will not be means we have to read between the lines to what they are accomplishing, when they should just state what they are accomplishing.

If they found a specific exploit in the system, and they don’t want people using it anymore, be frank in that. Don’t take time out of your day to also impugn how I play, and somehow imply that it is not in the spirit of the game. Taking the moral high ground to cover up the fact you can’t make your game mode fair? These folks aren’t cheating, they just aren’t playing the game the way kabam wants them to. I use the exact same principle, I just don’t apply at the same way.

And if, in fact, the way that I play is not in the spirit of the game, and they do want me to stop? I can certainly drop out of battlegrounds entirely, which will take me out of my competitive ally, which will probably push me into at least partial retirement.

They are cheating, actually. They're not just taking it easy. They're deliberately monopolizing a position in the rankings to cherry pick lower Matches for Points.
Quite frankly, if people don't want to actually compete, then it stands to reason they shouldn't be running a competition.

Lovejoy72

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.
In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.
If people have reached their plateau, that's very clear in the data. If people are throwing Matches to farm Points, that's also clear in the data.
While it's true that they can't police effort, they can certainly police the effort to cheat the system.
I don’t disagree. The problem is in the transparency. I do generally intentionally drop most of my matches, but I also intentionally do it in bronze, where it hurts me in terms of resource efficiency, but maximize efficiency in my life. I hit some buttons on my back up phone. And it gives a great deal of advantage to other players. So it as well within the bounds of most of their rules. But not within the stated propaganda of competitiveness, and playing the game mode to win. So all in all I should be banned for it. To assume that I will not be means we have to read between the lines to what they are accomplishing, when they should just state what they are accomplishing.

If they found a specific exploit in the system, and they don’t want people using it anymore, be frank in that. Don’t take time out of your day to also impugn how I play, and somehow imply that it is not in the spirit of the game. Taking the moral high ground to cover up the fact you can’t make your game mode fair? These folks aren’t cheating, they just aren’t playing the game the way kabam wants them to. I use the exact same principle, I just don’t apply at the same way.

And if, in fact, the way that I play is not in the spirit of the game, and they do want me to stop? I can certainly drop out of battlegrounds entirely, which will take me out of my competitive ally, which will probably push me into at least partial retirement.
They are cheating, actually. They're not just taking it easy. They're deliberately monopolizing a position in the rankings to cherry pick lower Matches for Points.
Quite frankly, if people don't want to actually compete, then it stands to reason they shouldn't be running a competition.

Is it is your position that based on the way kabam is presenting this, and my preferred means of play and how I approach battlegrounds, that I simply shouldn’t play it at all?

klobberintyme

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.
In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.
If people have reached their plateau, that's very clear in the data. If people are throwing Matches to farm Points, that's also clear in the data.
While it's true that they can't police effort, they can certainly police the effort to cheat the system.

If someone's idea of fun is using a 3* robot to clear ROL, that's rewarded. If it's someone's idea to use a 3* deck in bgs, which i plan on doing, I'm gonna have me some fun, which is my reward for engaging in this nonsense. Don't tell me how to have fun with your game mode!

Just kidding, i don't touch this mode. Seems to bring out the worst in the community, and that's saying something.

Graves_3

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.
In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.
If people have reached their plateau, that's very clear in the data. If people are throwing Matches to farm Points, that's also clear in the data.
While it's true that they can't police effort, they can certainly police the effort to cheat the system.
I don’t disagree. The problem is in the transparency. I do generally intentionally drop most of my matches, but I also intentionally do it in bronze, where it hurts me in terms of resource efficiency, but maximize efficiency in my life. I hit some buttons on my back up phone. And it gives a great deal of advantage to other players. So it as well within the bounds of most of their rules. But not within the stated propaganda of competitiveness, and playing the game mode to win. So all in all I should be banned for it. To assume that I will not be means we have to read between the lines to what they are accomplishing, when they should just state what they are accomplishing.

If they found a specific exploit in the system, and they don’t want people using it anymore, be frank in that. Don’t take time out of your day to also impugn how I play, and somehow imply that it is not in the spirit of the game. Taking the moral high ground to cover up the fact you can’t make your game mode fair? These folks aren’t cheating, they just aren’t playing the game the way kabam wants them to. I use the exact same principle, I just don’t apply at the same way.

And if, in fact, the way that I play is not in the spirit of the game, and they do want me to stop? I can certainly drop out of battlegrounds entirely, which will take me out of my competitive ally, which will probably push me into at least partial retirement.
They are cheating, actually. They're not just taking it easy. They're deliberately monopolizing a position in the rankings to cherry pick lower Matches for Points.
Quite frankly, if people don't want to actually compete, then it stands to reason they shouldn't be running a competition.
Is it is your position that based on the way kabam is presenting this, and my preferred means of play and how I approach battlegrounds, that I simply shouldn’t play it at all?

No matter how you sugar coat it, this is a purely monetary decision which will drive sales of elder marks up. The people here getting into knots about how this is to uphold the spirit of the game are just trying to claim moral high ground. You deserve to play the game as you see fit as long as you follow the terms of use. When the game developers start to base decisions not on objective data but on your intent, things are already on a slippery slope.

GroundedWisdom

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.
In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.
If people have reached their plateau, that's very clear in the data. If people are throwing Matches to farm Points, that's also clear in the data.
While it's true that they can't police effort, they can certainly police the effort to cheat the system.
I don’t disagree. The problem is in the transparency. I do generally intentionally drop most of my matches, but I also intentionally do it in bronze, where it hurts me in terms of resource efficiency, but maximize efficiency in my life. I hit some buttons on my back up phone. And it gives a great deal of advantage to other players. So it as well within the bounds of most of their rules. But not within the stated propaganda of competitiveness, and playing the game mode to win. So all in all I should be banned for it. To assume that I will not be means we have to read between the lines to what they are accomplishing, when they should just state what they are accomplishing.

If they found a specific exploit in the system, and they don’t want people using it anymore, be frank in that. Don’t take time out of your day to also impugn how I play, and somehow imply that it is not in the spirit of the game. Taking the moral high ground to cover up the fact you can’t make your game mode fair? These folks aren’t cheating, they just aren’t playing the game the way kabam wants them to. I use the exact same principle, I just don’t apply at the same way.

And if, in fact, the way that I play is not in the spirit of the game, and they do want me to stop? I can certainly drop out of battlegrounds entirely, which will take me out of my competitive ally, which will probably push me into at least partial retirement.
They are cheating, actually. They're not just taking it easy. They're deliberately monopolizing a position in the rankings to cherry pick lower Matches for Points.
Quite frankly, if people don't want to actually compete, then it stands to reason they shouldn't be running a competition.
Is it is your position that based on the way kabam is presenting this, and my preferred means of play and how I approach battlegrounds, that I simply shouldn’t play it at all?

What I said was, if someone isn't interested in competing at all, then they probably shouldn't be running a competition. If that's how you want to interpret it, then sure.
I felt the same way about Alliances that are stacked and hanging out in lower War Tiers "taking it easy". That's a separate issue, although I feel the same issue is presented.
In any case, that's not what we're talking about here. We're talking about Players who will either throw Matches or Forfeit, take advantage of the easy opponents, and then make their final push after. This is a clear manipulation of the system.
If you're hanging out in Bronze because you don't like to go hard, there are mitigated Matches from Bronze to Plat, so that doesn't even fall in the same category.

Dukenpuke

The fact that people are complaining that they need to earn their Wins honestly is mind-boggling to me.
The forfeit buttons literal existence contradicts the idea of trying to win, so its mot that mind boggling at all
Yes, if something comes up that you need to leave, or you're most certainly outmatched, that's there to use.
If you're faking the system out to believe your skill level is lower so you can camp out for easy Points, that's not what it's there for.
In just a hypothetical, if I do make it into the circuit, and find that I am literally under skilled and overmatched to win… the only difference between constantly forfeiting and playing and getting murdered is just effort. And one thing I won’t be policed on in a game is effort. My alliance leader may attempt to do so in war, but the game devs do not have my permission. If in that situation, it is more time beneficial to me to just pull out my back up phone and occasionally plunk some buttons. That’s what I’m doing.

Now again, that is not the apparent intent of this rule. The intent, it seems, is to protect these players they have weirdly stuck in diamond with us. But part of the propaganda they are using to make this seem noble than it is, is to imply that this is all about the spirit of competition, the game is played to be won. But in the situation in which I am wildly overmatched in the circuit, and I still have tens of thousands of points to accrue to earn the rewards they have placed before us, that all seems pretty hollow. They need to go back, and re-brand this entire thing to be blunt about what they are trying to achieve: we don’t know how to protect the smaller accounts we have stuck in diamond without overtly punishing the larger accounts, and it threatens to undermine the growth of the game. So we are asking the larger accounts to kind of punish themselves.
If people have reached their plateau, that's very clear in the data. If people are throwing Matches to farm Points, that's also clear in the data.
While it's true that they can't police effort, they can certainly police the effort to cheat the system.
I don’t disagree. The problem is in the transparency. I do generally intentionally drop most of my matches, but I also intentionally do it in bronze, where it hurts me in terms of resource efficiency, but maximize efficiency in my life. I hit some buttons on my back up phone. And it gives a great deal of advantage to other players. So it as well within the bounds of most of their rules. But not within the stated propaganda of competitiveness, and playing the game mode to win. So all in all I should be banned for it. To assume that I will not be means we have to read between the lines to what they are accomplishing, when they should just state what they are accomplishing.

If they found a specific exploit in the system, and they don’t want people using it anymore, be frank in that. Don’t take time out of your day to also impugn how I play, and somehow imply that it is not in the spirit of the game. Taking the moral high ground to cover up the fact you can’t make your game mode fair? These folks aren’t cheating, they just aren’t playing the game the way kabam wants them to. I use the exact same principle, I just don’t apply at the same way.

And if, in fact, the way that I play is not in the spirit of the game, and they do want me to stop? I can certainly drop out of battlegrounds entirely, which will take me out of my competitive ally, which will probably push me into at least partial retirement.
They are cheating, actually. They're not just taking it easy. They're deliberately monopolizing a position in the rankings to cherry pick lower Matches for Points.
Quite frankly, if people don't want to actually compete, then it stands to reason they shouldn't be running a competition.
Is it is your position that based on the way kabam is presenting this, and my preferred means of play and how I approach battlegrounds, that I simply shouldn’t play it at all?
What I said was, if someone isn't interested in competing at all, then they probably shouldn't be running a competition. If that's how you want to interpret it, then sure.
I felt the same way about Alliances that are stacked and hanging out in lower War Tiers "taking it easy". That's a separate issue, although I feel the same issue is presented.
In any case, that's not what we're talking about here. We're talking about Players who will either throw Matches or Forfeit, take advantage of the easy opponents, and then make their final push after. This is a clear manipulation of the system.
If you're hanging out in Bronze because you don't like to go hard, there are mitigated Matches from Bronze to Plat, so that doesn't even fall in the same category.

So it seems like a good solution would be to come out and say that losing on purpose will only be punished if it occurs at Platinum 2 or higher, no? People (like me) that are doing it in Gold and below aren't doing it for a competitive advantage and shouldn't be punished for it.

phillgreen

I lost my first match in plat 1. I'm too scared to play again in case I lose again and get accused of points farming.