Negasonic Teenage Warhead - Please tell me I'm doing some wrong or missing something

So here are 3 fights on the same Def (Cheelit Paragon Gauntlet)

All at the same ranking

NTS - Class Advantage, 5th try, and best time.

Try extra hard to keep the Incinerate on Cheelit.

Parry, 4 Medium, Medium again and then focus on Lights, rush the just under SP2. Throw an SP1, then continue with Lights, bate out Cheelit SP, by the time I get the SP2 most of the Incinerate have gone.

Venom - first try - 4* Venom Relic R1, a good source of Venom damage is his Bleed debuff, which Cheelit Cleanse
Just play normal

Silk - Class Disadvantage, and also rely on applying Debuff, which Cheelit Cleanse.
Just play normal

With this fight, in theory NTW get the most advantage, because she does not have to worry about the Unstoppable Node and can Parry freely. While both Venom and Silk can not rely of Parry and Cheelit is constantly Unblockable.

So please tell me that I got something wrong with NTW, because based on this fights result this can't be right or balance.

NTW can not be "best" at skill counter, when in a perfect fight set up for her with the right Def, an Class Disadvantage champ out do her in both speed and heath.

From testing this fight out, I came to realise something, the lack on damage (whether it is direct or DOT) have an cascading effect on the whole fights.

As while in theory NTW should be more "safe" to use, in practice she is not, because her damage output is so low, the Def take more hits, which mean more Power for the Def, which mean more SPs, and more time wasted trying to bate out SPs. The longer the fight the more chane for mistake to happen.

So out of these 3 fights NTW is the one that end up taking the most hits even though she could block/Parry all of Cheelit hits, while both Venom and Silk have to play intercept as Cheelit was constantly Unblockable.

NTW also are Bleed immune in this fight while, both Silk and Venom are not, and yet they still finish the fight with more health than NTW.

I understand that not all champ have the same "Power Budget" in design, and I'm not expecting every champs to be OP or nuke. However I would like to think that they should at least be relevant (meta).

Ironheart was not sold as a class destroyer of any kind and even then lot of the players in the community feel like she should have gotten a slight buff. While NTW sales pitch (design concept) was that she is the "best" Skill Class counter (apart maybe one or two). However a champ can't be a "best" if players would rather pick other champs (even class disadvantage one) to do the fight that this "best" champ meant to counter perfectly.

I really do hope the Kabam isn't counting how many R3 of these champs (Ironheart and NTW) as an indication how well the community like these champs. Right now both Ironheart & NTW have to be at R3 to punch down, that is never a balance champ.

Again not asking for Nuke or OP, just relevant, just so players actually want to and can use they new champs for something.

Comments

NONYABIZZ

YOU'RE NOT DOING ANYTHING WRONG. NEGASONIC is a TERRIBLE champion OFFENSIVELY and that is exactly what it is. Apart from sable, she has the lowest damage output of any champ released this year. She is mediocre at best at r3 and terrible at any rank below especially as a 6*.
The balance team most likely still won't touch her

Ourobøros

I was hyped when I got her from my second Titan, now I'm disappointed. My r2 seems like a noodle, the damage is definitely not there

gannicus0830

Yeah, I took her to r5 and ascended her immediately as a hard counter to bullseye and other annoying skill Champs, but her damage is so pathetic that it doesn't really justify it.

Emilia90

You’re not missing anything. She hits like a pillow and I only use her when I have a very stally defender (r2 7*).

The numbers from the balance team are always baffling to me because she’s a 3.5/5 in damage according to them. It’s not great but for comparison Ironheart has a 3/5 in damage and hits way harder despite her kit issues

iDestroyerZ

Watch kabam says they won't buff her because she counters a lot of skill defenders (which is great, but she still needs damage)

WednesdayLength

Watch kabam says they won't buff her because she counters a lot of skill defenders (which is great, but she still needs damage)

We don't need kabam to say that when a lot of players are still saying she's the best skill counter in the game and people are wrong for suggesting that she needs a damage buff lmao

Z3ro_ô

Maybe you try her on a node that doesn't reduce damage by 60%. Passive debuffs are not working for that.

Don't know why she gets so much hate. She is a niche champ and would be broken with kate bishop dps. She is not super fast but she handles alot of stuff.
My 6*r5 asc needs 1.50 min. with that -60% damage.

Nightheart

She's just a teenager throwing tantrums because she has niche uses

Nuclear

Nope she was purely released just to counter Bullseye

Fryday

Thanks to everyone reply, this is one of those situation where I wish I was wrong and missing out some kind of amazing rotation.

Hi @Z3ro_ô ,

If you read my post you may noticed that I never asked or expected NTW to be OP or Nuke (let alone being at Kate level, who many would consider to be the best Skill champ). I just expect a new champ that was sold as the "best" Skill counter to at least be relevant. There are many ways Kabam can better balance her than just damage, having longer Incinerate duration or pause would be helpful too. Also Incinerate immune would make sense too.

I understand the Node have 60% damage without debuff but 1 Dex also apply 3 Debuffs, which I also do with NTW. Also please note that the other 2 champs I tried out also rely on debuffs for their damages, which Cheelit Cleanse, so their damaged are also reduced quite a bit, and they doesn't have the Class advantage bonus.

My example of fight not only show how long it take for NTW to take down a fight that she should do well on, but that other champs that shouldn't do well against this fight including Class Disadvantage one still finish the fight much fast (also x2.5 faster) that NTW with more health. You clearly are a much better NTW player than me and even then as you said your fight came to 1.50, which is still slower than Venon and Silk (which with you skills I'm sure you would also finish faster than my times).

I actually really want to like NTW, I like the Mutant class and would like to have more new relevant Mutant champs, so when NTW was announced I was very excited about her, I can see her potential value, but current was she is, when players would be better off to go into a fight with class disadvantage than use NTW then in my opinion something is not balance with the champ.

EdisonLaw

Considering her amount of versatility and being able to counter most skill defenders, Kabam most likely won’t consider rebalancing her, you may never know though

Usagicassidy

Maybe you try her on a node that doesn't reduce damage by 60%. Passive debuffs are not working for that.

Don't know why she gets so much hate. She is a niche champ and would be broken with kate bishop dps. She is not super fast but she handles alot of stuff.
My 6*r5 asc needs 1.50 min. with that -60% damage.

So your argument is basically "don't use her on Nodes that reduce her damage" - in other words don't use her in challenging quest content? That doesn't sound like an argument in favor of Negasonic.

ChiefGoat

Been using my 7*r3 unawakened Nega to easily crush any skill defenders in war. Also works great against Dooms, she evades his heavy stuns

Z3ro_ô

Maybe you try her on a node that doesn't reduce damage by 60%. Passive debuffs are not working for that.

Don't know why she gets so much hate. She is a niche champ and would be broken with kate bishop dps. She is not super fast but she handles alot of stuff.
My 6*r5 asc needs 1.50 min. with that -60% damage.
So your argument is basically "don't use her on Nodes that reduce her damage" - in other words don't use her in challenging quest content? That doesn't sound like an argument in favor of Negasonic.

Weird interpretation. I was just saying that it's not the best example of a champ whose special abilities are passive debuffs. Besides, you can use her for the fights, it just takes a bit longer. The example is a bit extreme in terms of time because it doesn't seem to have been played properly.
She is just not a 30 second bg nuke more for longer fights.
I did the LOL redhulk, old man logan an elektra fights. Every fight in about 3.10 min.
It's not that bad.
I'd like it if she gets a buff and did more damage, but there's no need to pretend she's hitting like cyclops.

Viper198787

A lot of the champs released this year, including NTW, just don’t seem to be BG meta relevant. I don’t think the champs were created with BGs in mind save a few. A lot of these champs seem more designed for longer form content or just questing in general. I pulled NTW and got excited for a minute until I started watching videos and hearing what people’s thoughts on her were and I just passed. I have other champs I’d rather use to counter those skill defenders that I can use for other fights, too, whereas NTW is definitely limited to skill champs in BGs and is slow.

Z3ro_ô

@Fryday
No boosts or synergies. I just had a few shots to play around the damage reduction.

BigTuna_2054

A minute and a half is a long time.

Fryday

@Fryday
No boosts or synergies. I just had a few shots to play around the damage reduction.

Hi @Z3ro_ô ,

That is really great to see and yes, you are definitely a higher player than I'm. So firstly, I would be much appreciated if you could share of your tips on how to achieve that time, as I have tried many times and didn't get close to that.

However, secondly, as you can see, with me being a less skilled player than you, both Venom and Silk fight was still quicker than 1.26. I'm sure with your skill you could do both Venom and Silk fight even faster than my times.

So the end point is still the same. With Class Advantage and all the "niches" benefits that NTW have, she is still slower than other champs that would theoretically get hampered by the Def and Node.

So in a fight where I should be reaching out to NTW, because she meant to be the Skill class counter, I still find much more success with other champs, even class disadvantaged one. That can't be balance right?

XcyclopsX

NTS - Class Advantage, 5th try, and best time.

Try extra hard to keep the Incinerate on Cheelit.

Parry, 4 Medium, Medium again and then focus on Lights, rush the just under SP2. Throw an SP1, then continue with Lights, bate out Cheelit SP, by the time I get the SP2 most of the Incinerate have gone.

.

I don't think anyone would dare to say that her damage is great but I didn't see you mentioned to do a heavy attack to put incinerate vulnerability in the opponent.

I hope kabam gives her a little tune up because she is very safe to use against the majority of annoying skill defenders.

Darkraw346

Why did I get notifications of this thread?

Z3ro_ô

@Fryday
No boosts or synergies. I just had a few shots to play around the damage reduction.

Hi @Z3ro_ô ,

That is really great to see and yes, you are definitely a higher player than I'm. So firstly, I would be much appreciated if you could share of your tips on how to achieve that time, as I have tried many times and didn't get close to that.

However, secondly, as you can see, with me being a less skilled player than you, both Venom and Silk fight was still quicker than 1.26. I'm sure with your skill you could do both Venom and Silk fight even faster than my times.

So the end point is still the same. With Class Advantage and all the "niches" benefits that NTW have, she is still slower than other champs that would theoretically get hampered by the Def and Node.

So in a fight where I should be reaching out to NTW, because she meant to be the Skill class counter, I still find much more success with other champs, even class disadvantaged one. That can't be balance right?

First of all, this is just a special fight. I don't think there's any point in making it about whether a champ is good or not.

Apart from BG, time is irrelevant if it's only a matter of seconds. (I'll leave out Master AW)
That's why I don't understand why time is seemingly the only reason to say she is bad.
As I said, your picture is a little misleading because of the big time difference.
If there had been a korg or attuma it would have been a completely different picture.

Like i said she is more for some bigger hp pools to ramp her incinerates fully up.

Ourobøros

Maybe you try her on a node that doesn't reduce damage by 60%. Passive debuffs are not working for that.

Don't know why she gets so much hate. She is a niche champ and would be broken with kate bishop dps. She is not super fast but she handles alot of stuff.
My 6*r5 asc needs 1.50 min. with that -60% damage.

That's a nice fight time for BG