Sable disorient doesn’t stop Void debuffs?

I was testing Sable against Void in practice mode. In the first screenshot, you can see the disorient from her heavy is active ( right at the start of the fight). Second screenshot, his timer has ticked down for the first time and he applied the debuff even though disorient is still up.

I re-read his description, there’s nothing about ability accuracy protection or anything like that.

Comments

Pikolu

Did you hit him the exact frame he applied the debuff? Disorient only lowers defensive ability accuracy which means it affects only things that trigger the frame you hit an opponent. These are typically linked to thorns and evade or others things that trigger when you hit the opponent

Vendemiaire

Silver Sable's Disorient applies a 100% (vs Science) Disorient Passive. Disorient is Defensive Ability Reduction effect. Emphasis on the 'Defensive'.

When you are using Sable against Science champs, all of their 'Defensive' abilities are shutoff when they have this Disorient. So if you hit them, they will not trigger their 'Defensive' abilities.

Examples:

- Immortal Abomination's Poison if you 'hit' him.
- Spider-Man's evade if you 'hit' him.
- Photon's application of debuff if you 'hit' her.
- Spot's phasing if you 'hit' him.

Back to your question, Void's application of debuff is not a 'defensive' ability. It is an offensive ability. It applies when the debuff application timer is up, not when you hit him.

Average_Desi

Silver Sable's Disorient applies a 100% (vs Science) Disorient Passive. Disorient is Defensive Ability Reduction effect. Emphasis on the 'Defensive'.

When you are using Sable against Science champs, all of their 'Defensive' abilities are shutoff when they have this Disorient. So if you hit them, they will not trigger their 'Defensive' abilities.

Examples:

- Immortal Abomination's Poison if you 'hit' him.
- Spider-Man's evade if you 'hit' him.
- Photon's application of debuff if you 'hit' her.
- Spot's phasing if you 'hit' him.

Back to your question, Void's application of debuff is not a 'defensive' ability. It is an offensive ability. It applies when the debuff application timer is up, not when you hit him.

It's the other way around. If any ability tries to trigger while I'm hitting the opponent, and not just because in hitting then,then it is a defensive ability

If void triggers the debuffs exactly on s hit, then it can be prevented with Daar

Vendemiaire

To remove debuffs from Sable, you can purify 1 debuff if you pass your Sable mine.

Herbal_Taxman

Thanks folks, super helpful.

Vendemiaire

Silver Sable's Disorient applies a 100% (vs Science) Disorient Passive. Disorient is Defensive Ability Reduction effect. Emphasis on the 'Defensive'.

When you are using Sable against Science champs, all of their 'Defensive' abilities are shutoff when they have this Disorient. So if you hit them, they will not trigger their 'Defensive' abilities.

Examples:

- Immortal Abomination's Poison if you 'hit' him.
- Spider-Man's evade if you 'hit' him.
- Photon's application of debuff if you 'hit' her.
- Spot's phasing if you 'hit' him.

Back to your question, Void's application of debuff is not a 'defensive' ability. It is an offensive ability. It applies when the debuff application timer is up, not when you hit him.
It's the other way around. If any ability tries to trigger while I'm hitting the opponent, and not just because in hitting then,then it is a defensive ability

If void triggers the debuffs exactly on s hit, then it can be prevented with Daar

That only works with Concussion. Pure Ability Accuracy reduction.

Average_Desi

Silver Sable's Disorient applies a 100% (vs Science) Disorient Passive. Disorient is Defensive Ability Reduction effect. Emphasis on the 'Defensive'.

When you are using Sable against Science champs, all of their 'Defensive' abilities are shutoff when they have this Disorient. So if you hit them, they will not trigger their 'Defensive' abilities.

Examples:

- Immortal Abomination's Poison if you 'hit' him.
- Spider-Man's evade if you 'hit' him.
- Photon's application of debuff if you 'hit' her.
- Spot's phasing if you 'hit' him.

Back to your question, Void's application of debuff is not a 'defensive' ability. It is an offensive ability. It applies when the debuff application timer is up, not when you hit him.
It's the other way around. If any ability tries to trigger while I'm hitting the opponent, and not just because in hitting then,then it is a defensive ability

If void triggers the debuffs exactly on s hit, then it can be prevented with Daar
That only works with Concussion. Pure Ability Accuracy reduction.

The way DAAR and OAAR effectively works is by putting an "invisible" concussion on the opponent while hitting them and while being hit, respectively

SirGamesBond

Silver Sable's Disorient applies a 100% (vs Science) Disorient Passive. Disorient is Defensive Ability Reduction effect. Emphasis on the 'Defensive'.

When you are using Sable against Science champs, all of their 'Defensive' abilities are shutoff when they have this Disorient. So if you hit them, they will not trigger their 'Defensive' abilities.

Examples:

- Immortal Abomination's Poison if you 'hit' him.
- Spider-Man's evade if you 'hit' him.
- Photon's application of debuff if you 'hit' her.
- Spot's phasing if you 'hit' him.

Back to your question, Void's application of debuff is not a 'defensive' ability. It is an offensive ability. It applies when the debuff application timer is up, not when you hit him.
It's the other way around. If any ability tries to trigger while I'm hitting the opponent, and not just because in hitting then,then it is a defensive ability

If void triggers the debuffs exactly on a hit, then it can be prevented with Daar
That only works with Concussion. Pure Ability Accuracy reduction.

That's the point. Only if we time it at the exact second... hard to time it anyway.

phillgreen

This kind of thing always confuses me but if void can apply the debuff while you both dance around and not actually hit each other, how is it considered a defensive ability?

And if its a defensive ability, why does the same thing happen if void is the attacker?

Average_Desi

This kind of thing always confuses me but if void can apply the debuff while you both dance around and not actually hit each other, how is it considered a defensive ability?

And if its a defensive ability, why does the same thing happen if void is the attacker?

Because there is no such thing as a defensive ability as far as the game mechanics is concerned. It's just something we use to describe the mechnic in common terms

BuggyDClown

Void for a reason.

Simple explanation is that Her disorient is DAAR which lower abilities tied to defender's natural occurring ability/abilities while they are defending or abilities triggers to save defender from attacker which can potentially trigger other affect in same range with simple DOT effects OR non dot effect or instant damage capabilities.

But here is the catch which many players miss. DAAR doesn't mean that your champ will prevent any abilities just cuz one of your abilities state that while hitting opponent defending abilities won't trigger. Abilities should be mentioned as defensive but HERE COMES THE TWIST that barely any champ have that kind of thing mentioned clearly. Usually it's vague definitions. For example of starky, after certain HP Loss, he can evade beam attacks or other attacks as well which usually considered as defensive but as attacker, it still triggers as defensive. But other champ kits are not properly defined as such like parry on blade or Striking AA while having bleed on.

Void is also unique case. First of all no champ in game is immune to his damage imo as of now. As his debuff are NON DOT in nature but still deal damage like DOT which makes him only champ in game. Now, it's nowhere written that it's defensive ability or offensive ability. Its time gated ability which is never defined as attack or defense. AND I WANT KABAM TO LEAVE IT AS IT IS CUZ THAT MAKES VOID "THE VOID" WHICH WE KNOW.

Now another aspect with Void that this ability easily can be easily shut down by OAAR by attackers. Best example would be AA and Blade(with GR Synergy). You don't need to attack or time the attack but once their attack abilities kick in VOID gets shut down. Tho I earlier said thar VOID's ability is neutral but still get affected by OAAR by champ, now trace back to my above comment that GAME DON'T DEFINE DEFENSIVE ABILITIES CLEARLY AND THEIR CONNECTIONS TO DAAR. That's why game might not register it as natural AR while attacking the defender and requiring to time it to match the definition which is already running on old algorithm of AAR definitions, And those can be anything. Only Dev can tell that.

Forgotten2

Void applying debuffs on you is not a defensive ability. Those are effects that activate when opponent is hit. Void being hit does not cause his debuffs to land on opponent

Feuerschwer

Okay, let me try to summarize this in a clear way.
Disorient is Defensive Ability Accuracy Reduction - it only reduces AA when the victim is being struck. In most cases, this means it affects abilities that would trigger when the victim is struck. Void’s debuffs are not an on-hit trigger, they’re just on a timer, so disorient won’t cause them to fail normally.

HOWEVER - the fiddly details of how AA is actually calculated means that if you strike your opponent on the exact frame(s) they would trigger a time-based ability, like void’s debuffs or Medusa’s furies, the AA is applied and the ability can/will fail. Essentially, disorient doesn’t reduce the AA of specifically defined “defensive abilities,” it just reduces the opponent’s AA in general, but ONLY when they are being struck.
This is not a reliable way to shut down these timer-based abilities, because the timing is so tight you basically only ever manage it by accident.

Magrailothos

Okay, let me try to summarize this in a clear way.
Disorient is Defensive Ability Accuracy Reduction - it only reduces AA when the victim is being struck. In most cases, this means it affects abilities that would trigger when the victim is struck. Void’s debuffs are not an on-hit trigger, they’re just on a timer, so disorient won’t cause them to fail normally.

HOWEVER - the fiddly details of how AA is actually calculated means that if you strike your opponent on the exact frame(s) they would trigger a time-based ability, like void’s debuffs or Medusa’s furies, the AA is applied and the ability can/will fail. Essentially, disorient doesn’t reduce the AA of specifically defined “defensive abilities,” it just reduces the opponent’s AA in general, but ONLY when they are being struck.
This is not a reliable way to shut down these timer-based abilities, because the timing is so tight you basically only ever manage it by accident.

This is pretty much it.

I sometimes see the same happening with offensive abilities in AQ; as I quite like using Deathless King Groot there. If I use him for Psycho-man or Overseer, and the Malice timer expires during a Special Attack, the Malice abilities get impacted by their Special concussion abilities.

You can see all kinds of abilities failing if they try to trigger just when you're Glanced, or hit into block against Proxima/Ironheart.

Average_Desi

Okay, let me try to summarize this in a clear way.
Disorient is Defensive Ability Accuracy Reduction - it only reduces AA when the victim is being struck. In most cases, this means it affects abilities that would trigger when the victim is struck. Void’s debuffs are not an on-hit trigger, they’re just on a timer, so disorient won’t cause them to fail normally.

HOWEVER - the fiddly details of how AA is actually calculated means that if you strike your opponent on the exact frame(s) they would trigger a time-based ability, like void’s debuffs or Medusa’s furies, the AA is applied and the ability can/will fail. Essentially, disorient doesn’t reduce the AA of specifically defined “defensive abilities,” it just reduces the opponent’s AA in general, but ONLY when they are being struck.
This is not a reliable way to shut down these timer-based abilities, because the timing is so tight you basically only ever manage it by accident.
This is pretty much it.

I sometimes see the same happening with offensive abilities in AQ; as I quite like using Deathless King Groot there. If I use him for Psycho-man or Overseer, and the Malice timer expires during a Special Attack, the Malice abilities get impacted by their Special concussion abilities.

You can see all kinds of abilities failing if they try to trigger just when you're Glanced, or hit into block against Proxima/Ironheart.

The most relevant imo is the ability to prevent parry shrugs. Although it's very inconsistent