Is BG participation really that bad?

I just got into GC and won a match, at 17 points I'm all the way up in Gamma II with 3 days to go in the season. This was the case last time too. Has participation dropped that much?

Comments

SpyderFam

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948794#Comment_2948794

Kabam will never get rid of BGs. A good percentage of the rosters I face have all the top new ascended champions from the featured valiants, not to mention many more than the normal 3 R5s. I see so many shiny ascended Rank 5 Madeline Pryors and now Ruby Tuesdays, as well as all of the desirable ascended champions from the base pool, which given the bad RNG means they purchased countless of the empowered crystals. In other words, these are people who spend thousands of dollars on this game every month, and they do it to gain an advantage in BGs, which is funny in itself because they obviously do not need the radiance rewards, but I suppose they just like the feeling of beating other players and do not care if it comes as a result of paid-for advantages. But without BGs many of these mega whales would not have a platform to flex their purchased "skills", so the system is working just fine for both them and Kabam.

altavista

I am not sure if its always been the case, but the whole "Unranked matches still qualifying for solo essentia objectives" has the side effect of making Ranked GC matches only for the people who are trying hard. Rather than having a matchup spread of noobs, casuals, and PVP players, now the matchup spread is mainly PVP players.

Although it is player friendly on the individual level (it makes sense to park and not risk your ranking), on a community level it makes BGs less "fun".

hungryhungrybbq

Idk what the answer is, but I can only give my personal reason for light participation

It's the volume of VT matches I have to do at the beginning of each season just to play GC

It feels similar to the concept of being forced to run through Classic EQ to access Elder (which we did away with now).. except even more effort and time lol.. it's honestly what makes me procrastinate and not play BGs very much - the thought of grinding through that many VT fights.. sure, while I will win most of them.. each one is still 10 minutes plus.. or whatever it is, and there is a lot of them.. so ultimately I procrastinate playing the mode cause I'm dreading the initial VT grind

And, as a consequence of this.. I end up being one of the "whale accounts" (I'm not actually a whale) that smaller accounts have to face in VT lol.. sorry guys, it's not because I'm doing it on purpose, I'm just playing when I have time or finally decided to buckle down and knock it out before season ends lol

If there is a way to expedite repeat GC players through VT faster, it should be win/win for those accounts and the smaller accounts in VT as we can get the bigger accounts out of there sooner?

Sambob

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948880#Comment_2948880

This. This is why I hate the gladiators circuit. I actually still enjoy the victory track a lot but despise the GC. In GC you can play for 3 hours and not only have nothing to show for it, but actually lose all your progress. In VT, there is a limit to how much losing can set you back. It makes the mode (nearly) stress free for me.

This might be a stupid idea, but I think it might help bring interest back if they made it so you had to make a choice when you finished VT:

Take a lump sum of 65k to 80k radiance
Enter the GC, where you could potentially earn less, but also potentially earn a lot more

Now, this needs to be balanced right, because if the lump sum is too low it becomes a pointless choice, since this season just entering GC with a score of 0 already ensures 45k. So it obviously would have to be enough over 45k to motivate GC haters like myself to take the "buyout" and make it feel like an actual benefit.

This would provide a sense of accomplishment and finality for those who enjoy and complete the VT, instead of being "rewarded" with a far more stressful mode to achieve the meaningful rewards. Yes this would be a bit of a buff to the VT, but I think that is what is needed. Most players clearly do not enjoy GC.

Sambob

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948900#Comment_2948900

To go with my above comment, yours gave me an idea.

At the beginning of each season you could choose which mode you want to play: VT or GC and you are locked to your choice until the next season.

Put a lump sum of radiance at the end of VT around 65 to 80k. People who hate GC like me still get a decent chunk of radiance from VT, but it is hard capped and probably less than what you will earn in GC.

For people who hate VT like you, you get to skip it and essentially play earn rewards as normal.

I see this as a win win no matter which kind of BG player you are.

SpyderFam

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948901#Comment_2948901

I think a buyout such as you propose would result in even fewer people participating in Bgs after reaching GC.

But I agree that more radiance is the solution for more participation.

For example, if I was tasked with improving participation, I would propose increasing the radiance rewards.

Currently, we receive 10k radiance for each of the following three milestones: reaching GC, reaching 100 points, reaching 200 points.

I would propose increasing this to the following:

Reaching GC: 10k radiance

Reaching 50 points: 10k radiance

Reaching 100 points: 10k radiance

Reaching 150 points: 15k radiance

Reaching 200 points: 15k radiance

Reaching 250 points: 20k radiance

Reaching 300 points: 20k radiance

I would also increase the final placement radiance rewards by at least 20%.

And lastly, I would institute what Kabam said they would but never did: point decay for parking.

ahmynuts

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948904#Comment_2948904

Reward budget. They cant give out more items than they sell

Sambob

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948904#Comment_2948904

Yes my buyout idea would not increase GC participation, but it would significantly increase VT participation. Why should Kabam care which mode is getting more participation as long at battlegrounds as a whole IS getting more participation instead of less, as is the trend?

I think battlegrounds is dying because people that like VT don't feel rewarded when they finish it, so they just don't bother at all.

SpyderFam

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948905#Comment_2948905

Magik and the other limbo bundles cost around a million radiance, and many players including me have spent the last two months using most of our radiance on those, and not buying the normal things we usually buy from the radiance store.

I think adding new bundles a couple of times a year to the radiance store would justify the increased radiance rewards from BGs, especially when you consider this will still be a very small percentage of players obtaining those milestones and rewards.

Also, Kabam currently gives better rewards via Twitch drops than for finishing Quantum. Rewards budget is flexible, and if BG participation truly is down, it is easy to fix with more rewards and more items to purchase, which is exactly what they did with the limbo bundles.

DrZola

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948891#Comment_2948891

This. It’s hard to assess what went wrong when you can’t take a peek at fight stats.

Dr. Zola

Flavyjay

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948911#Comment_2948911

I 100% agree with you but Kabam will still tell you "Reward Budget"

Flavyjay

Double post some how 😑

O_Deadpool_O

So many people in comments are afraid of others, forum trolls, who turn every complain about BGs state into "skill issue"…
This shows how demoralized and toxic the community has become. And, the huge reason for that is Kabam itself. They never adjusted fairness and appreciation for playing well, they wanted the mode to be toxic and they got it.

I beleive, that if person finishes round with >50k points, it should be appreciated. I think, even finishing with >48k points should be appreciated. Doing great match to finally see that you lost by less than 100 points demotivates a lot. Doing good job at putting down defender to which you did not have a counter should be appreciated as well.
None of the non-win efforts are really valued and appreciated by the current system. I think this is the biggest reason why BGs are dying.
I would play it a lot more if I wasn't so afraid to finish my evening in worth condition I started my run. I would play it a lot more if I had more "enjoyment" points except just "winning". I don't feel any satisfaction winning the match, because I know how it feels losing the match. This mode is played better with cold heart, there is no spirit in the mode.

O_Deadpool_O

Just another thought.. Spending hours in the mode should be appreciated as well.
If person with weak roster spends 2 hours in GC tyring to win some matches, his time should be appreciated. Each hour spent or each match played in the game mode should be appreciated. Currently participation objective for 3 matches (which can take 20-30 minutes) provides 120 essentia, which is even less than required to buy one shuffle signet.

DrZola

Participation has ticked up somewhat (Gamma 3 with 16 points)—I would guess a lot of players are (1) burned out on the mode and (2) have been spending time on things like 9.4 and Carinas.

This is fairly consistent with the final push that occurs in the last week—and precisely what I did this week.

But that doesn’t say anything about the specifics of the mode itself. It’s sometimes fun, often grindy and occasionally just painful. Head to head matchups with doppelgänger accounts to see who gets better draft & AI and can speed run to a KO doesn’t appeal to me.

I realize this mode is perfect for some players, and I’m okay with that.

I play it because it seems like a necessity for my account and, apart from the first season (and one season I forgot to play a match in GC), I’ve hit GC every time. It can be sometimes be fun.

But long term I’m convinced it needs a lot more fine tuning. More strategy would be welcome; more counters and counter-counters would be welcome; more ways to mitigate the randomness of drafts would be welcome. Forcing play by placing desirable, unique prizes into GC really isn’t welcome.

Dr. Zola

JRX80

They need to get rid of the penalty for losing in VT. It makes it way too much of a time sink. All in all, the radiance isn't worth it. I'm someone that has reached gladiator circuit just to get there, but haven't had the desire to push for it the past two seasons.

Anotherconcernplayer

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2948905#Comment_2948905

BBut...but they are selling a lot more now, so could we have a few crumbs please 🙏 🤣

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2949100#Comment_2949100

You want people to appreciate and recognize a 50K+ score in a meta that takes no skill at all... Next season it will be even worse.

2 seasons of **** meta + 1 season coming.
**** amounts of radiance for a radiance store that is not that appealing.
Bad roll out of Essentia store that doesn't make it clear if the rewards are good or not based on amount earned and cost

Those points only are enough to just pass on the whole game mode.

altavista

Another reason I care even less about BGs is the Essentia currency.

Before: Collect x number of BG Trophys, and I can buy some rank up or top off materials that can't be purchased without playing BGs..

Now: Collect x number of Essentia from BGs objectives, that joins the gumbo of Essentia that are earned from other sources, and things can be purchased without playing BGs.

I'm not a big numbers guy, so I'm not gonna break down how much more Essentia I can get from BGs compared to other sources and what that means for my purchasing power. The store prices are unclear in terms of whether things are still worth it or not based on my effort.

I'm simply gonna default to "Oh, its all one currency now? Now I will just drop BGs and still have access to the Essentia store from other game modes."

JRX80

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2949146#Comment_2949146

Exactly this. Once I got the mastery point, there's nothing I really have to get from the radiance store. I can either farm it elsewhere or its so expensive it will take me months of bgs to get. With 350 champs in the game, its not like Magik is a must have for me.

Osborne

After banq 25, i stopped pushing

Herbal_Taxman

there are good insights and suggestions in this thread @Kabam (Osaurus) Rex

ahmynuts

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2949187#Comment_2949187

They dont care bruh. The community has been trying to help them for years and they dont want to hear it

NARWH4L

I kinda miss the days when BGs wasn't an uninspiring, uncreative, unrewarding and boring time suck and the only problem we had was an absurd amount of modders. At least it felt like you could accomplish something then.

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2949206#Comment_2949206

But but... They always say that they hear us....

Maybe they are all in a retreat or something…

There are things that don't need an immediate response; but there were so many issues on this update they are ignoring its actually kinda funny.

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2949209#Comment_2949209

Remember when the mode was exciting, they did rotating metas, used bit of imagination to at least try to make it entertaining. Now we get some horrible boring once a month metas.

They are getting lazy af....

NARWH4L

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2949213#Comment_2949213

Yes, back when we had metas that would enhance some champs abilities on both sides instead of having the game flooded with defenders that transcend nodes. The good old days.

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2949218#Comment_2949218

Yeah back in the time where reworks periodically were a thing, buffs, occasional nerfs, where it actually looked like they were doing something... Now its all recycled content, 2 new champs a month and champs finally making it into the 7* pool...

Lazy....

JRX80

They could even go to a system where its +1 for a win vs 0 for a loss. No they wouldn't sell victory shields, but would make that up by costing more energy / rerolls. Just don't have a game mode where you can grind for hours and actually lose progress.

JRX80

Heck they could move to a +1/0 then sell a boost that makes a win in the vc worth 2.