Aw synergies update and further discussion.
Riegel
Member Posts: 1,088 ★★★★
We have recently received a huge update on the Aw defense synergies.
From what I can gather is Kabam wants to player to have a way to tell what synergies the defender will have active BEFORE going into the fight.
I don't personally think it is necessary to know exactly what is active, I like being prepared for all synergies, and then discovering which are and are not active as I go. Then, I can communicate that to my BG so they can better prepare for their fights.
Same with masteries. I could join a fight and tell who has Limber or Will Power and let my team know. Many synergies translate the same way like Dark Empowerment or Inhuman Royal Family.
I don't mind knowing ahead of time either, but I am very happy to finally have an update on the issue.
Kabam Miike wrote: »The short answer is yes. But this is not going to be a quick or easy fix. Aside from having to fix the issue that we're having with synergies not working, there is a bigger issue at hand that needs to be addressed as well. With new Unique synergies that supply enhanced abilities, there could be some unexpected surprises when you're fighting a Defender that you didn't know had a Synergy active.
You could be part way through a fight against Hulk (Ragnarok) when suddenly, his SMASH attack becomes Unblockable because he has a synergy with Thor (Ragnarok) that you didn't know was active. Now, we're not saying that this is a bad thing, but we want to give players the chance to be prepared for these kinds of things. We're currently exploring ways that we can do this.
So, yes, we are working on fixing this, but unfortunately, there is more to this issue than just what it seems like on the surface.
From what I can gather is Kabam wants to player to have a way to tell what synergies the defender will have active BEFORE going into the fight.
I don't personally think it is necessary to know exactly what is active, I like being prepared for all synergies, and then discovering which are and are not active as I go. Then, I can communicate that to my BG so they can better prepare for their fights.
Same with masteries. I could join a fight and tell who has Limber or Will Power and let my team know. Many synergies translate the same way like Dark Empowerment or Inhuman Royal Family.
I don't mind knowing ahead of time either, but I am very happy to finally have an update on the issue.
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Comments
We're nowhere near ready to discuss the specifics just yet, but we do have to look at it from the perspectives of The Attacker, The Defender, and from all experience levels as well.
In arena I’ve seen a “inhuman royal family” little tag when I’ve gone in and fought Karnak, Medusa black bolt team. Isn’t that a solution for Aw? So you don’t know it before the fight starts, but you know it when you go into the fight.
That's perfectly ok. I don't mean to come off as assuming what will or wont happen. I'm just excited to have some news on it, and to further discuss what people would like in regards to how they think it should work.
Obviously, Kabam will decide what will or wont happen, but with this type of discussion you feel out what the community wants. The community input may or may not change decision made by Kabam, but at least you can have that info by us discussing it.
I'm excited to see the update and the communication.
It could be. Seems like they want something, but they don't know what that something is.
There are synergies that don't have the Inhuman Royal Family pop up.
I want to keep this discussion open, so please understand everything is speculation. (Not dirrected at you Bitter, but just a general statement)
They'll probably do something like forced to fight where pausing the game shows you a description of all buffs currently active on the bots. In case of MCoC, it'll show the active synergies and buffs. Although if they do it this way, they'd have to change how timers work in AW so that they get paused as the game is paused. I wouldn't want the timer to run out because I was busy reading 3-4 different synergies active on a champ (an extreme case, but very likely to happen in the future with the rate the game is expanding).
Even then it wouldn't help much against hidden champs since we can't prepare for the synergies before the fight/joining attack, in this scenario. If my attacker doesn't counter any specific synergy the defender has, I'm screwed anyway and knowing the synergy won't make any difference
If say synergies were to be displayed before the fight the synergies could reveal who the opponent is which would be bad for the defense.
Obviously, from mikes comment:
It sounds like they are well aware of this.
I just posted the same in the other thread. Seems like a logical and easy fix to the issue.
Right I think if they just posted on screen the name of the unique synergy it would be enough.
Non-unique synergies don't really change the way you play as drastically as unique ones do.
Yeah, if you vs. a Karnak, and see the Inhuman Royal Family pop up then you can be sure that person has Medusa somewhere, but you have to communicate that to the guy who is about to go up vs. his cosmic champ. Also, that cosmic champ might be his Black Bolt instead.
IDK I like it. Adds to the strategy and need to communicate.
I think a lot of valuable champions with unique synergies have popped up. I'm much happier having them now than having to wait for them for something like this.
I do think this could have been communicated to us much sooner, but better late than never I guess.
Nowhere near ready to discuss the specifics... so you’re not even close for this update...???
I know you've got a team working on this - I just find it unacceptable that the community wasn't notified that synergies were not functioning in what's a core game mode. This impacted strategy, champ selection, resource collection/allocation/spend - and the lack of recognition of this and the lack of transparency further distances Kabam from its player base. There's way more to this than just what's on the surface to us too - this is a big freaking deal, not a minor inconvenience that "we're working on it" resolves. Especially when taking in conjunction with other questionable decisions made by Kabam.
Of key importance to understanding this: were synergies disabled by the team for war without notifying the player base? Or did some synergies not work because they were designed to benefit individual champs and the mode didn't support it? Or did NO synergies ever work and the player base wasn't notified?
Miike, Kabam's facing a tipping point. The level of rancor and resentment in the community toward the company's attitude and actions toward their customers continues to build, and if it hasn't been felt by your team financially yet, it will soon.
Now we have a response, let’s hope this is the start of a solid comms approach on the subject. As long as we know what’s going on and when we can expect stuff to happen, we can adjust. Just keep keeping us in the loop, basically.
100% agree.
Why not just tag a node with "This champion is empowered by a unique synergy." I don't see any reason to tag champs with regular synergies as they just boost stats and don't give champs unique advantages.
Sure... it COULD give away the champ, but there are enough champs with unique synergies, both old and new, to keep it a pretty good guessing game.
Besides, at the current state of AW, I can pretty much guess the defender with an 80% accuracy.
Edit: and if you're concerned with giving away the champ, then you also need to remove the ability of the attacker to see persistent charges.
a little icon to show a synergy is active should suffice without having to do a huge overhaul.
also, can we expect on update like this on the ever-present evade, dex, blocks dropping and controls bug still in this game?
this game would be so much better of these things were fixed right away mr.sir
As an example, Doctor Octopus' Synergy with Ant-Man allows Ant-Man to gain a Thorns like bonus for his Glancing when attacked. This isn't a practical Synergy for players, as their goal is to avoid being attacked, but this obviously would be useful on defense. So the Unique Synergy was crafted, implemented, but then not anticipated? It's being presented like Unique Synergies were rushed.
Similarly, some Unique Synergies have no practical use. Electro's Synergy with Green Goblin is so specific, requiring Electro to take an attack and an uncommon debuff to gain a minor benefit.
Compare that to something like Blade's Synergy with Ghost Rider or Spider-Man (Stark Enhanced), where the benefits to both champions are superior and make them far more powerful, and you can see how unbalanced the design is. Along with that Synergy of the 'Holy Trinity' as those 3 are called by some in the community, and you have a greater problem for defenders.
The redesign to Alliance War encourages points for Diversity, yet ideal Diversity would be using champions that have great Unique Synergies that make them more of a challenge to the attackers. We're now being told that seems unfair to players being ambushed by surprise synergy effects. But that's the point. It's the same as having hidden attackers, or having something like Coldsnap with Iceman, or Limbo with Magik. The players are caught off guard by surprise damage, or they brought the wrong fighter for a certain fight, expecting someone else. That's the whole point of players designing a defense.
I just don't understand how it's fair that Defenders lose their Synergies in that mode, because something wasn't conceptualized correctly, yet Attackers kept their overpowered Synergies. Blade+Ghost Rider+Stark Spider-Man allows Blade to rip through Villains and Mystics (or worse Villains who are Mystics), Ghost Rider to place Judgments easily on defenders, and allows Spider-Man early access to 3 Taunts/Power Forces and/or greater attack bonuses for fights. That doesn't seem balanced.
I'm in no way looking forward to surprises due to Synergies, but I also just don't see how it's fair that Defenders are crippled by losing out on Synergies, that would in effect create more Diversity, but Attackers are allowed to keep their overpowered Synergies that players placing defense equally cannot anticipate.
There is a difference between using skill to overcome difficulty vs overcoming BS fights. Using the In-Human Royaln Family example... Is there skill placing a 5* r4 Medusa as Boss or immune mini with these synergies Medusa/Bolt/Karnak/Ronan/KK. So for 80% of.the fight she has living stands, auto block and Parry. 6.fury at 90% longer duration. Got test it on WS....
I know the answer,.. I should bring the right champ. I better buy some 5* features and hope for the new buffed Sentry...
We all know they keep releasing Garbage on top of Garbage and more bugs than fixes.... So Why encourage them to rush to this? Come on and think about it... If kabam is putting the brakes on something that will make us use more resources than in must be an epic disaster.
I had the time to type this in between timing out of AQ.
I feel like we've been cheated out of this for a long time. If it had been addressed and implemented before seasons started we would have been more prepared.
Bottom line is they need to be implemented as per the original war posting when it was in beta. Get this fixed, **** the torpedoes just do it, if it proves to be to much then implement something else, do it during the break between seasons, asap, and gather your data. This is ridiculous
This actually clears a lot for me now
But this statement of @Kabam Miike makes a lot of sense to me.
With the number of whiners rising in the game, they need to be anticipate the amount of backlash or support tickets they will get from the community because of this. And they need to be proactive in addressing that potential issue, even before it becomes an issue.
It may not even be a game change. It may be a game announcement in the forum and in your in game mail emphasizing on that. But honestly, how many people actually read?
If that is the case, @Kabam Miike , maybe consider having the ability to play videos on the game itself (actual videos and not moving comic strips). That way, in your in game announcement, you can present both video and text. Personally, I probably wont watch the video (i like text over video because i read way faster than I watch videos). But most people would rather consume video over text though
I bet if Kabam were to open up defensive synergy right now, we gonna get countless threads of people demanding for compensation and RDTs because they are not aware Hulk Ragnarok has a synergy with Thor Ragnarok or Killmonger has a synergy with BPCW.
I agree wholeheartedly this needs to be thought through. Take as much time as you need and give us something that is fair to all players when you’re done thinking it thru Kabam.
Guys are being critical of this because these AWD geared synergies have been around for a long time and they are suddenly just now realizing the potential repercussions. Not sure why but at this stage of the game we would like to expect better.
Its Kabam that deserves to be “slammed” and it is deserved. Apart from confirmation here on the forums, has an in game message been sent to the playerbase that these unique synergies aren’t working? To my knowledge, no, that hasn’t been done.
And how long have these unique synergies been in game? A year? 6-9months ? That they’re just now thinking of the best way to implement it in AW is pretty absurd.