Class and Rarity Gates - Discussion Thread

Hey All,

We've just announced the newest addition to the Contest that will be coming in Act 6 Chapter 2! Learn all about Class and Rarity gates here, and then ask any questions you may have and discuss with your fellow Summoners in this thread!

Comments

GroundedWisdom

It's really not about making it last longer, although it may take some longer to get there. It's a progress gate. The point is to make it accesible to people who have reached a certain level of progress. For some, they've reached it. For others, they'll have to work towards it.
You can’t work towards progress in the game. It’s too RNG dependent. It’s one thing to not be able to take down a boss because you haven’t mastered the skills yet (Act 4 Maestro is the best example of this with his special 1).

You can absolutely work towards having a certain number of 6*s.

Shreddnesss

Miike Can you also answer us how 5* and 6* shards became more accessible after 6.1. went out ? other than spending tons of money on cavalier crystals and other cash offers ?
I have never spend a single cent of actual cash on a Cavalier crystal. You buy Cavalier crystals with units, not cash, in general. Therefore, they are available even to free to play players that spend zero cash, and just grind units in the game. And it is possible to grind dozens of Cavalier crystals every month through arena grinding. Cavalier crystals are probably one of the best things a free to play player that grinds units can spend those units on, once they've reached Cavalier status.

yes...grind arena 12 hours a day to get 1 million battlechips in month to get 1k units, buy 5 cavalier crystals get 4x 3* and 1x 4*...not happy ? farm again...makes sense..

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Notcho59

I have 100% completed act 6.1

The biggest hurdle was overcoming not having my synergy champions on my team which definitely cost me a few extra revives. This is why we "the community" insist that this rarity gating content is bias towards the whales. The whales have all their synergy teams at the highest rarity and the non-spenders do not.

Variant 1 and 2 are great examples of how to create difficult content that did not specifically cater to the whales.

GroundedWisdom

I have 100% completed act 6.1

The biggest hurdle was overcoming not having my synergy champions on my team which definitely cost me a few extra revives. This is why we "the community" insist that this rarity gating content is bias towards the whales. The whales have all their synergy teams at the highest rarity and the non-spenders do not.

Variant 1 and 2 are great examples of how to create difficult content that did not specifically cater to the whales.

Storymode is not a competition. It's permanent content that can be done when and if we're ready.

RogerRabs

Miike Can you also answer us how 5* and 6* shards became more accessible after 6.1. went out ? other than spending tons of money on cavalier crystals and other cash offers ?
I have never spend a single cent of actual cash on a Cavalier crystal. You buy Cavalier crystals with units, not cash, in general. Therefore, they are available even to free to play players that spend zero cash, and just grind units in the game. And it is possible to grind dozens of Cavalier crystals every month through arena grinding. Cavalier crystals are probably one of the best things a free to play player that grinds units can spend those units on, once they've reached Cavalier status.

1 Million BC gets you 5-10 Cav crystals depending on luck. The 5 and 6 star odds aren't horrible, but they aren't great either. More importantly you have to remember that the odds of getting a useful 5 or 6 star are considerably lower. I've bought about 30 or 40 and gotten four 5 and 6 star pulls. They've been 5* Nebula, HtD, Vulture and 6* Juggs. Not very great.

You're way better off spending units on content and if you don't need units to beat content, spend them on offers where RNG isn't heavily involved (Vision/T5B/etc).

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NOOOOOOOOPEEEEE

Kabam why. Why you guys hinted toward this in a previous post people had greatly stated it was a bad idea. I mean the community didn't even like the restrictions on Variant 1. So why did you guys still think this was a good idea.

arsjum

Miike Can you also answer us how 5* and 6* shards became more accessible after 6.1. went out ? other than spending tons of money on cavalier crystals and other cash offers ?
I have never spend a single cent of actual cash on a Cavalier crystal. You buy Cavalier crystals with units, not cash, in general. Therefore, they are available even to free to play players that spend zero cash, and just grind units in the game. And it is possible to grind dozens of Cavalier crystals every month through arena grinding. Cavalier crystals are probably one of the best things a free to play player that grinds units can spend those units on, once they've reached Cavalier status.

You are usually on point but this right here is probably the worst suggestion you’ve made in this forum. Grinding requires tremendous amount of time. Let’s say you are above an average grinder and get around 4K-5k units a month and that gives you what? 20-25 cavalier crystals where the odds are mostly stacked against you.

Those units are better spent on exploring Endgame content or buying occasionally nice unit-based offers.

GroundedWisdom

Miike Can you also answer us how 5* and 6* shards became more accessible after 6.1. went out ? other than spending tons of money on cavalier crystals and other cash offers ?
I have never spend a single cent of actual cash on a Cavalier crystal. You buy Cavalier crystals with units, not cash, in general. Therefore, they are available even to free to play players that spend zero cash, and just grind units in the game. And it is possible to grind dozens of Cavalier crystals every month through arena grinding. Cavalier crystals are probably one of the best things a free to play player that grinds units can spend those units on, once they've reached Cavalier status.
You are usually on point but this right here is probably the worst suggestion you’ve made in this forum. Grinding requires tremendous amount of time. Let’s say you are above an average grinder and get around 4K-5k units a month and that gives you what? 20-25 cavalier crystals where the odds are mostly stacked against you.

Those units are better spent on exploring Endgame content or buying occasionally nice unit-based offers.

I believe he meant that under the premise that Cavalier Crystals is what you're after.

Longtimegamer

Miike Can you also answer us how 5* and 6* shards became more accessible after 6.1. went out ? other than spending tons of money on cavalier crystals and other cash offers ?
I have never spend a single cent of actual cash on a Cavalier crystal. You buy Cavalier crystals with units, not cash, in general. Therefore, they are available even to free to play players that spend zero cash, and just grind units in the game. And it is possible to grind dozens of Cavalier crystals every month through arena grinding. Cavalier crystals are probably one of the best things a free to play player that grinds units can spend those units on, once they've reached Cavalier status.

With all due respect, most players don't have time to have a 300k+ PVP score and even if they did you expect them to spend all their units on a crystal that include 3 and 4 star champion and if they get a 5 star that it's most likely arena fodder, and if they happen to pull a good one once in a blue moon what happens when they need units to run variant, or act 6 or running war where it can cost 800 units to heal a champion?

"Well...technically you can grind for cav crystal"...lol..

You can say as many technicalities as you like, but you know nothing DNA Snow

Helicopter_dugdugdug

Why r the devs so repulsed by using skill gates rather than these cheap tactics? Put a infinity Thanos or LoL Maestro in each path but stop with these cheapskate gates

DNA3000

Miike Can you also answer us how 5* and 6* shards became more accessible after 6.1. went out ? other than spending tons of money on cavalier crystals and other cash offers ?
I have never spend a single cent of actual cash on a Cavalier crystal. You buy Cavalier crystals with units, not cash, in general. Therefore, they are available even to free to play players that spend zero cash, and just grind units in the game. And it is possible to grind dozens of Cavalier crystals every month through arena grinding. Cavalier crystals are probably one of the best things a free to play player that grinds units can spend those units on, once they've reached Cavalier status.
yes...grind arena 12 hours a day to get 1 million battlechips in month to get 1k units, buy 5 cavalier crystals get 4x 3* and 1x 4*...not happy ? farm again...makes sense..

Those numbers make no sense. I consider myself a pretty heavy grinder and I only grind maybe three hours a day on average. I don't expect everyone to do even that, but I average about 350 BC per round and 20-25 rounds per hour depending on what else I'm doing at the time. The average is about 7800 BC per hour, 23400 per day, 163800 per week. Call that 650k per month just from BC per round, add in BC from other random sources and you're probably at 700k per month at least. The average units from a million BC is in my experience closer to 2k than 1k units; conservatively I'd say the average is at least 1800 units. Which means 700k should generate about 1260 units per month.

But that doesn't count units from milestones, which any arena grinder will also get. Different players will grind different arenas, but for me I get at least all the milestones in the 5* featured, plus milestones in other arenas. On average, I get at least 300-400 units from milestones per event, which on average is 350 units x 8 events per month = 2800 units.

This doesn't count units from other parts of the game, the calendar, the monthly quest, alliance events, all of which add up to at least 500-1000 units a month.

Very conservatively, that's over 4000 units in a month. Even if you take the strategy of spending half your units on Cavs and saving half for future offers, that's ten standard Cavs a month, which will average another 5* champion per month at least. And while this is above average gameplay numbers, it isn't remotely ridiculous levels of gameplay. When I ran Act 6.1 I stopped at 6.1.5 to grind out the 12k units necessary for the completion offer. It took me less than two months to do that starting from about 1k units. And even *that* wasn't twelve hours a day grinding. I upped my gameplay to four to five hours a day and a little more on weekends.

The point is not for everyone to play like me. The point is that this opportunity is open to anyone who can devote some extra time to the game, just at different levels. If you don't think it is worth it, don't do it. But don't say it doesn't exist just because you don't like it or frankly don't understand it and have to make up hyperbolic numbers to justify your not liking it.

DrFreaky

Everytime theres a specific quest we have top Spend our gold to rank up a certain champs. We are all short on gold, We have been saying but no listening.

SDP

Really? Just scroll to the bottom and look at all the gates.

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DrFreaky

SO TRUE

No 4s!
Can bring only certain classes!
Can only bring 1 5 star!
Only certain sizes!

Give me a break. What's next....class, rarity, tag, and rank restrictions all in one?

"For act 6.3 only 6* hero science champs at r2 with a size matter global node in this lane!"

We get it, you want us to spend $10 000 a week on cav crystals like COW. Great, see how the game survives when you've restricted players so hard that there's no one left to play. I spent $6000 in a month a few months back on this game, and I'm not doing that anymore.

End game players are getting rid of their accounts like the plague. Master level teams can't find decent players for war anymore cause all the vets got tired of where the game's headed and sold off their accounts to noobs who can barely play.

What is the point of spending several mortgage payments getting a champ, duping them, ranking them up to r5 , and taking them to max sig when you can come in and render them utterly worthless with an arbitrary gate?

Why do I have to bring my sig 20 6* deadpool xforce to act 6.2 when I can use a r5 sig 200 omega red? It's not fun, or fresh, or interactive. It just pisses me and everyone else off. Don't design powerful champs if you can't make proper content. Better yet, don't create problems, sell us solutions, then make those solutions utterly worthless so you can sell more solutions later down the road.

I don't care for 6 stars. They were released for no reason and my 6* RNG has been atrocious. Don't tell me who I can and can't use for content, I was the one that spent 10s of thousands of dollars on this game, not you! If our purchases can't keep their value then there's no point in spending.

TheTalents

I never comment, in fact this is my first post. Kabam you're really wrong about this one. I understand you want a simple way to make the content harder but requirements of more than 2 or more 6 stars is utterly ridiculous. You need to tell your content designers to dial it back before you really turn long standing players like myself who been playing since 2015 to retirement.

Stave

Man this is gonna be cool when I can play it in 5 years. Wish I had the time to be in an active alliance group so I could get the rewards to build a roster suitable for solo story content

Could have sworn kabam said alliance play wouldn't be a requirement to continue within story

VanillaCoke

It's really not about making it last longer, although it may take some longer to get there. It's a progress gate. The point is to make it accesible to people who have reached a certain level of progress. For some, they've reached it. For others, they'll have to work towards it.
You can’t work towards progress in the game. It’s too RNG dependent. It’s one thing to not be able to take down a boss because you haven’t mastered the skills yet (Act 4 Maestro is the best example of this with his special 1).
You can absolutely work towards having a certain number of 6*s.

No you can’t... especially if you’re gettibg multiple dupes which can happen because of RNG.

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GroundedWisdom

It's really not about making it last longer, although it may take some longer to get there. It's a progress gate. The point is to make it accesible to people who have reached a certain level of progress. For some, they've reached it. For others, they'll have to work towards it.
You can’t work towards progress in the game. It’s too RNG dependent. It’s one thing to not be able to take down a boss because you haven’t mastered the skills yet (Act 4 Maestro is the best example of this with his special 1).
You can absolutely work towards having a certain number of 6*s.
No you can’t... especially if you’re gettibg multiple dupes which can happen because of RNG.

If you're telling me that having a certain number of 6*s is not a goal you can make, work towards, and attain, I'm going to have to disagree. That's literally the objective of accumulating them.

Longtimegamer

Very conservatively, that's over 4000 units in a month.

Which is actually nothing.

Spending your entire unit net worth each month on 20 cav crystals to maybe get 2 arena fodder 5 stars is hardly worth getting excited about.

You're right on most things and you're smart than I am, but you're very wrong on this. "Good access" to 5s and 6s through the cav crystal is wrong on so many levels even if you run this game like a full time job and have a giant roster capable of said grinds and you don't do war or any content.

Trust me, I've seen it all. I'm in masters, place very high in AQ, so I know what people spend. Having the cavalier title doesn't give us better access to 5s and 6s unless we spend and spend a lot. This game is more pay2win more than ever and getting worse and worse.

GroundedWisdom

Very conservatively, that's over 4000 units in a month.
Which is actually nothing.

Spending your entire unit net worth each month on 20 cav crystals to maybe get 2 arena fodder 5 stars is hardly worth getting excited about.

You're right on most things and you're smart than I am, but you're very wrong on this. "Good access" to 5s and 6s through the cav crystal is wrong on so many levels even if you run this game like a full time job and have a giant roster capable of said grinds and you don't do war or any content.

Trust me, I've seen it all. I'm in masters, place very high in AQ, so I know what people spend. Having the cavalier title doesn't give us better access to 5s and 6s unless we spend and spend a lot. This game is more pay2win more than ever and getting worse and worse.

The Cavalier Crystals are not the only access to 6*s and 5*s that we have. Overall, they've become more available than when they were introduced. This is not only some random statement. They have the data to back up that claim. They're not widely available for everyone in the game, but neither is this content.

Kaspy

I see this as bad move given Apple’s upcoming release of Apple arcade....Kabam needs to find a way to find common ground with the player base. Their competition for players is about to see a huge increase with games that won’t cater to whales and won’t be so RNG/loot box dependent.

Nothing good will come of these continued rarity bans.

Longtimegamer

Very conservatively, that's over 4000 units in a month.
Which is actually nothing.

Spending your entire unit net worth each month on 20 cav crystals to maybe get 2 arena fodder 5 stars is hardly worth getting excited about.

You're right on most things and you're smart than I am, but you're very wrong on this. "Good access" to 5s and 6s through the cav crystal is wrong on so many levels even if you run this game like a full time job and have a giant roster capable of said grinds and you don't do war or any content.

Trust me, I've seen it all. I'm in masters, place very high in AQ, so I know what people spend. Having the cavalier title doesn't give us better access to 5s and 6s unless we spend and spend a lot. This game is more pay2win more than ever and getting worse and worse.
The Cavalier Crystals are not the only access to 6*s and 5*s that we have. Overall, they've become more available than when they were introduced. This is not only some random statement. They have the data to back up that claim. They're not widely available for everyone in the game, but neither is this content.

We're being told that we have more access to 5*s and 6*s after being cavalier. True technically but a dishonest statement in practice unless we spend. All the grinding in the world for cavalier crystals won't put a dent in our progression.

GroundedWisdom

Very conservatively, that's over 4000 units in a month.
Which is actually nothing.

Spending your entire unit net worth each month on 20 cav crystals to maybe get 2 arena fodder 5 stars is hardly worth getting excited about.

You're right on most things and you're smart than I am, but you're very wrong on this. "Good access" to 5s and 6s through the cav crystal is wrong on so many levels even if you run this game like a full time job and have a giant roster capable of said grinds and you don't do war or any content.

Trust me, I've seen it all. I'm in masters, place very high in AQ, so I know what people spend. Having the cavalier title doesn't give us better access to 5s and 6s unless we spend and spend a lot. This game is more pay2win more than ever and getting worse and worse.
The Cavalier Crystals are not the only access to 6*s and 5*s that we have. Overall, they've become more available than when they were introduced. This is not only some random statement. They have the data to back up that claim. They're not widely available for everyone in the game, but neither is this content.
We're being told that we have more access to 5*s and 6*s after being cavalier. True technically but a dishonest statement in practice unless we spend. All the grinding in the world for cavalier crystals won't put a dent in our progression.

That depends on the RNG. It's not necessary to spend thousands. As DNA pointed out, Grinding provides Units to try. Also worth pointing out that those who are Cavalier have access to 5*s and 6*s in other areas of the game, naturally through UC.

TheTalents

No 4s!
Can bring only certain classes!
Can only bring 1 5 star!
Only certain sizes!

Give me a break. What's next....class, rarity, tag, and rank restrictions all in one?

"For act 6.3 only 6* hero science champs at r2 with a size matter global node in this lane!"

We get it, you want us to spend $10 000 a week on cav crystals like COW. Great, see how the game survives when you've restricted players so hard that there's no one left to play. I spent $6000 in a month a few months back on this game, and I'm not doing that anymore.

End game players are getting rid of their accounts like the plague. Master level teams can't find decent players for war anymore cause all the vets got tired of where the game's headed and sold off their accounts to noobs who can barely play.

What is the point of spending several mortgage payments getting a champ, duping them, ranking them up to r5 , and taking them to max sig when you can come in and render them utterly worthless with an arbitrary gate?

Why do I have to bring my sig 20 6* deadpool xforce to act 6.2 when I can use a r5 sig 200 omega red? It's not fun, or fresh, or interactive. It just pisses me and everyone else off. Don't design powerful champs if you can't make proper content. Better yet, don't create problems, sell us solutions, then make those solutions utterly worthless so you can sell more solutions later down the road.

I don't care for 6 stars. They were released for no reason and my 6* RNG has been atrocious. Don't tell me who I can and can't use for content, I was the one that spent 10s of thousands of dollars on this game, not you! If our purchases can't keep their value then there's no point in spending.

You analysis is spot on. Why would we spend when you can't use those champs to complete the hardest content?

TheTalents

ok everyone complaining needs to chill...a little.
6/10 paths per quest are UNGATED. so you can still do completion without worrying about the restrictions.
but lets get serious about the whole 6*’s being more available.
they are if you wanna pay for the RNG based crystals.

so that to me is just bogus and infuriating.

Who wants to wait to complete 6 star content when you have r5 5 stars more powerful ready to go that you spend time and invested in?

Stellar

it sounds good and was pretty logical if we look back at the Act 5.

Could make alpha 2 a little bit easier to gain ? not everyone has 4 5 stars Rank 4 in each class so doing 100% of this chapter will be really hard for the majority of us